Weekly Character Discussion: Link

[Lucrece]

Look Deva and Shade are probably 2 of the best link players I know out there. If they say he sucks balls I am almost forced to agree. Yet at the same time I feel the mods are right. Once people begin to learn the AT's being the technical character Link is, I think he will get off of bottom tier and make low tier.

What I am trying to say is that I understand the potential but for now it doesn't look good for link players if you want to win a tourney.

I think link is a counter pick character but you will need another character to main to win tourneys in my opinion.

I personally picked marth as my main and link as my counter pick because they are 2 completely different sword styles and I like swords. It comes down to match ups and counter play in the end...I think..

Link is bad, but nowhere near the level of Jigglypuff, C Falcon, Bowser, Peach, and Yoshi.

I think that the review here clearly places him in mid tier.

Those saying that Link outranks TL's moveset, however.....LOL.

 

[Kyari]

Link is bad, but nowhere near the level of Jigglypuff, C Falcon, Bowser, Peach, and Yoshi.

I think that the review here clearly places him in mid tier.

Those saying that Link outranks TL's moveset, however.....LOL.

Overall tournaments are only showing TL to be mid tier as well. If you agree with what you believe the review to suggest, then you can't argue that Link could possibly be better than TL, even if by just a hair, unless you also think that TL has more potential than where he's been standing.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Overall tournaments are only showing TL to be mid tier as well. If you agree with what you believe the review to suggest, then you can't argue that Link could possibly be better than TL, even if by just a hair, unless you also think that TL has more potential than where he's been standing.

Well, the fact is that Toon Link also is an extremely technical character with a steep learning curve. For that reason, similar to Link you can expect that he'll be better as time goes on. This holds, if only because a great deal of Link's techs will hold for Toon Link, if only because of character similarity. Also, there are certain.... issues that Link has that Toon Link doesn't.


Remember, this is still quite early in the game's lifetime, the tournaments now should be considered preliminary simply because people haven't had the raw time to devote to it like in melee. As time goes on, tournaments rankings will be more reflective of true character power, especially the initially neglected characters and the tech-heavy characters.

 

[Lucrece]

Overall tournaments are only showing TL to be mid tier as well. If you agree with what you believe the review to suggest, then you can't argue that Link could possibly be better than TL, even if by just a hair, unless you also think that TL has more potential than where he's been standing.

I never argued that Link could possibly be better, thus the "LOL".

TL only lacks range in comparison to Link, but the difference is not that big. Additionally, his aerials are more practical, have more maneuverability, and can actually combo into more aerials (dreaded bair and whatnot). Link's biggest weakness, his recovery, is no weakness to TL. TL's recovery is outstanding.

TL's only possible weakness is his weight, which is more than made up by his nimbleness.

As for what I think of his placings? He's a fairly underused character with far steeper learning curve. Metaknight and Snake, however, are straightforward enough to pick up and go smash some tournaments. Not so for TL. I have a firm belief that TL is one of the obscure top tiers, much like Luigi, and pre-Futile Wario.

 

[Lotsa_Spaghetti]

Link is bad, but nowhere near the level of Jigglypuff, C Falcon, Bowser, Peach, and Yoshi.

I think that the review here clearly places him in mid tier.

Those saying that Link outranks TL's moveset, however.....LOL.

Lol, actually Peach and Yoshi can be used quite effectivly and I can easily see them getting into mid to high tier, but this argument is for another discussion.

 

[Lucrece]

Lol, actually Peach and Yoshi can be used quite effectivly and I can easily see them getting into mid to high tier, but this argument is for another discussion.

Perhaps. I think I should have included Samus in there.

 

[regorris]

Bombs 8, no kill

It does take a long time to kill a Mario from the center of FD with bombs... but that's not the only measure of a kill move.

Many of the attacks in this game hit you up and away, or just up. If you chuck a bomb at someone who's way up in the air, they're dead at a little over 100%.
(depending on the character and stage [Luigi's Mansion and Pictochat(e) have vert kill zones that are way too high])

I have gotten kills this way. Link has an inconceivably awesome arm when it comes to tossing those bombs up.

Granted, it's no mortar... but what is?

 

[Swordplay]

For the most part Link and TL are going to be on both the same tech level. TL will always be better because of his better recovery and projictiles ( arguably)

Link will have some tech advantages over TL but they will be very little. Links zair is better so hes spacing game will ultimately be better ( I think) It should give him a slight advantage in zairing with bomb. (can this be confirmed as i have not tested TL out enough on this.)

Certain techs like DAC which have become essential in my approach game. (I know they work for link so they should for toon link) give link a tech advantage. I think Links DAC is better because it is 3 swings instead of 1. It will pull them in on the slide and because it is more swings it can apply an enormous amount of shield pressure.



Virtually they will be the same but it tech i would give a small edge to link. ( VERY SMALL ) due to similar characteristics of the character.

I think Link will catch up but mid tier???? maybe high low tier which is okay for a counterplay character.

 

[Deva]

I think you don't quite understand...

Link would be a good char if not for a few weaknesses (biggest of which is the recovery). Like with all the chars, they're discussing how to make the most of what he has.

Saying, "he's useless, play a different char" doesn't help much for the people who play or are interested in playing Link.

No trust me, I understand perfectly. The fact is he has those weaknesses, and no matter what you do, they're glaring weaknesses that will never allow him to surpass anything more than low tier. And I never said "he's useless, play a different char." I'm saying no matter what you do, he will be low tier just based on the physics and overall advatages and disadvantages compared to other characters. Link isn't necessarily bad. For example, in melee, Link did good against the majority of the cast. He just got severely ***** by the top tiers, which is why he was low tier. If the top tier didn't exist, he actually would have been a decent character in melee, with Y.Link and C.Falcon being even difficult matchups. In Brawl it's a lil different. He doesn't get ***** by top tiers, in fact he can hold his own for the most part, but he's still at a disadvantage. And for most of the cast of Brawl, that's how it is. Except for a few select matchups, no one has a glaring advantage over other characters where the other character doesn't stand a chance, it's just that they'd be at a disadvantage. Link compared to most characters, does fine, but is at a slight disadvantage, which overall, leads to him being extremely low on the tier list. Obviously, no matter how bad a character is, they can still do well in tournaments depending on the player. I'm tired right now, so I'll stop here, but if you guys want details on specific matchups and situations, I'd be happy to explain how to make Link "NOT" suck.


edit: BTW, TL is really good, lol. Easily better than Link, just based on overall matchups. I'd almost consider him top tier, or at least High tier. I'll go into detail on that as well if you need.

 

[adumbrodeus]

No trust me, I understand perfectly. The fact is he has those weaknesses, and no matter what you do, they're glaring weaknesses that will never allow him to surpass anything more than low tier. And I never said "he's useless, play a different char." I'm saying no matter what you do, he will be low tier just based on the physics and overall advatages and disadvantages compared to other characters. Link isn't necessarily bad. For example, in melee, Link did good against the majority of the cast. He just got severely ***** by the top tiers, which is why he was low tier. If the top tier didn't exist, he actually would have been a decent character in melee, with Y.Link and C.Falcon being even difficult matchups. In Brawl it's a lil different. He doesn't get ***** by top tiers, in fact he can hold his own for the most part, but he's still at a disadvantage. And for most of the cast of Brawl, that's how it is. Except for a few select matchups, no one has a glaring advantage over other characters where the other character doesn't stand a chance, it's just that they'd be at a disadvantage. Link compared to most characters, does fine, but is at a slight disadvantage, which overall, leads to him being extremely low on the tier list. Obviously, no matter how bad a character is, they can still do well in tournaments depending on the player. I'm tired right now, so I'll stop here, but if you guys want details on specific matchups and situations, I'd be happy to explain how to make Link "NOT" suck.

Nah, I get that you know Link, but it makes little sense to harp on a character's weaknesses on a character discussion like this. Sure, it's great for match-ups, but if you can't do anything about it, there's little point in doing anything other then just pointing out that it's there and moving on. How does endlessly harping on how much Link's recovery sucks actually improve a Link player's game?

So weaknesses are generally pointed out and ignored from then on, which gives the impression that in such discussions the people doing the discussion have an inflated opinion of the character when the reality is, they know the char has issues, and we can't change that, so lets talk about what he/she/it/potato can do. This was especially noticeable in the Ganondorf discussion.


Of course, I agree. Any character can beat any character if there is a great enough skill gap in your favor.


And making Link not suck, go for it. That's what this entire thread is for. Personally I'm in favor of lots of ATs.

edit: BTW, TL is really good, lol. Easily better than Link, just based on overall matchups. I'd almost consider him top tier, or at least High tier. I'll go into detail on that as well if you need.

Yeah, if only because of that awesome back-air and a much better recovery, Toon Link is a far better character. Still he needs a lot of tech skill to really be useful and his current rankings bear that out. People haven't even scratched the surface of his game.

I expect that ISJR'ed bairs are going to improve his rankings drastically once people master the tech.

 

[goukakyuu]

Link ownz. But zelda ownz more

 

[Aurashade]

Nah, I get that you know Link, but it makes little sense to harp on a character's weaknesses on a character discussion like this. Sure, it's great for match-ups, but if you can't do anything about it, there's little point in doing anything other then just pointing out that it's there and moving on. How does endlessly harping on how much Link's recovery sucks actually improve a Link player's game?

So weaknesses are generally pointed out and ignored from then on, which gives the impression that in such discussions the people doing the discussion have an inflated opinion of the character when the reality is, they know the char has issues, and we can't change that, so lets talk about what he/she/it/potato can do. This was especially noticeable in the Ganondorf discussion.


Of course, I agree. Any character can beat any character if there is a great enough skill gap in your favor.


And making Link not suck, go for it. That's what this entire thread is for. Personally I'm in favor of lots of ATs.



Yeah, if only because of that awesome back-air and a much better recovery, Toon Link is a far better character. Still he needs a lot of tech skill to really be useful and his current rankings bear that out. People haven't even scratched the surface of his game.

I expect that ISJR'ed bairs are going to improve his rankings drastically once people master the tech.

I've never seen you post here, stop acting like an arbitrary inquisitor telling us how our characters work. From what I've gathered you don't play link, and probably never have, so it'd be wise to not look like a fool when I tell you that everything you've just said is wrong about link. For you to say that "people haven't really scratched the surface of his game" is really hyper-critical and pretty contradictory.

Link's recovery isn't his only major downfall, his lack of killing moves bla whatever I'll finish this debate with you later I have more important things to do

 

[adumbrodeus]

I've never seen you post here, stop acting like an arbitrary inquisitor telling us how our characters work. From what I've gathered you don't play link, and probably never have, so it'd be wise to not look like a fool when I tell you that everything you've just said is wrong about link. For you to say that "people haven't really scratched the surface of his game" is really hyper-critical and pretty contradictory.

I'm not acting like an arbitrary inquisitor, but I am pointing out a misunderstanding.

I play Link... I stated before that he's one of my secondaries.

So there you have it, my general opinions on Link as a char. He's only my secondary so I'm not a perfect source but.. I think it's pretty fair.

Furthermore, the "haven't scratched the surface of his game" comment was in regards to Toon Link. But both characters are highly technical, which makes a steep learning curve, meaning that there's a lot of improvement that can be made in general.

PS. You haven't seen me around here because I generally lurk on my secondaries' boards, but I have been here quite a bit.

Link's recovery isn't his only major downfall, his lack of killing moves bla whatever I'll finish this debate with you later I have more important things to do

He has 4 major kill moves, up-smash (granted, this one is around 120), down-smash, f-smash, and dair. Not a lot, but enough when used properly.

 

[Metro Knight]

Well, his ftilt and utilt can also kill if they are fresh, the trick is hitting them with whats fresh. The spin can kill, the fair's second hit can kill, the dair can kill, the nair can kill (you have to hit them with Link's ***) that does 10% dmg normally, doesn't really go stale, all of these kill around 150-175%, so if you have spent your dsmash, and don't want to leave yourself open with a dair or a fsmash, these are good options. I think the spin is one of his most worthless moves, so I generally do not use it unless I manage to get a jab cancel off, that is the only time that spin is worth a ****., imo.

Link's biggest problem would be his recovery, but he still has pretty good recovery, I generally always die around 100-200%, unless I do something stupid and accidentally kill myself with his fast fall. Example: I pull a bomb when I am trying to recovery and accidentally force a fast fall. I think if you avoid things like this, you should be alright. And Airdodging can really own you, b/c it disables you for way too long, a bad airdodge is more likely to kill you than other things. I think a well placed projectile is a better defense than an air dodge most of the times, unless you are nowhere near the edge, than you should just airdodge. The other problems I have are, if I am at 120% or so, and wolf hits me with that ******* dsmash, I can't make it back on the stage. But, I generally only get hit by that when I make a mistake, so don't make mistakes ... Buy a different controller for tournaments, your normal controller is probably worn out, and doesn't compliment your playing level.

 

[Deva]

Nah, I get that you know Link, but it makes little sense to harp on a character's weaknesses on a character discussion like this. Sure, it's great for match-ups, but if you can't do anything about it, there's little point in doing anything other then just pointing out that it's there and moving on. How does endlessly harping on how much Link's recovery sucks actually improve a Link player's game?

So weaknesses are generally pointed out and ignored from then on, which gives the impression that in such discussions the people doing the discussion have an inflated opinion of the character when the reality is, they know the char has issues, and we can't change that, so lets talk about what he/she/it/potato can do. This was especially noticeable in the Ganondorf discussion.


Of course, I agree. Any character can beat any character if there is a great enough skill gap in your favor.


And making Link not suck, go for it. That's what this entire thread is for. Personally I'm in favor of lots of ATs.



Yeah, if only because of that awesome back-air and a much better recovery, Toon Link is a far better character. Still he needs a lot of tech skill to really be useful and his current rankings bear that out. People haven't even scratched the surface of his game.

I expect that ISJR'ed bairs are going to improve his rankings drastically once people master the tech.

First and foremost, you need to understand your characters weeknesses. Without that, you can never improve. From there, the next step is to work around those weakesses, which I have'nt really seen anyone go very in depth about yet. Finally, after all that has been covered, you can discuss variations in playing styles and tricks that can give Link an upper hand in his matchups.

BTW, like I said before, ask me a question and I'll answer it. I don't feel like writing out a guide lol. I noticed you mentioned recovery. Well, here's one to chew on. Link has a horrible up-b, but one of the better recoveries in the game. this is coming from someone who Uses Link and only Link in tournament and has generally placed top 5 at every local, state, and regional tournament he's been to. If anything, my word's reliable on this subject lol. I say this because I've rarely, if ever gotten gimped for Link's poor recovery. One simple trick to begin with, always DI. The DI in this game is broken and probably better than the smash DI of melee, and as long as you're DIing properly, recovery shouldn't be an issue even with such a horrible up-b. In a worst case scenario, the opponent will edge hog you, but there are tricks to even that. Now, once you have DI down, this is where I believe Link to have one of the better recoveries in the game. He's one of the most difficult to edge guard. After the DI, pull a bomb with your second jump to avoid fast falling. Then, throw a rang at your opponent to prevent an edge hog, before you up-b. It'll either hit them, or pull them off the edge, both turning out in your favor. If by some chance they still hit you, either after being hit by the rang or while being pulled off the edge, or through their edgeguarding process, and you wont be able to make your recovery, you can still recover due to Link's more floaty physics in this game. If you get hit while recovering with the bomb you pulled earlier, it will almost always explode before you die, which with proper DI and an extra jump, will almost always allow you to recover since though Link has horrible movement range on his up-b, it acts as a nice shield with the range of the attack. This is basically my version of Link's bomb jump for Brawl. Overall, with proper DI, Link has a lot of tricks at his disposal for his recovery, and overall is one of the more difficult characters to edgeguard.

Also, Link's advanced tech's aren't as important as most players make them out to be. They can help in certain situations, yes, but compared to say Fox in melee, they're almost completely useless. With Fox, unless you had a certain level of tech skill, you couldn't even be good with him at the competetive level. With Link, it's much more focused on the meta game and overall playstyle and mindgames. His advanced techniques can help in select situations, but are by no means necessary to his overall gameplay.

Any other questions?

 

[henrytran]

Also, Link's advanced tech's aren't as important as most players make them out to be. They can help in certain situations, yes, but compared to say Fox in melee, they're almost completely useless. With Fox, unless you had a certain level of tech skill, you couldn't even be good with him at the competetive level. With Link, it's much more focused on the meta game and overall playstyle and mindgames. His advanced techniques can help in select situations, but are by no means necessary to his overall gameplay.

Quote for truth.

I've been playing a lot of Link's online and in some tourneys (yes, online maeks things weird, but bear with me), and they use ATs so much more than I do. Yet in Link dittos, I almost always win because I try to read the player a lot more and play to the person rather than the character so much. I think the only Link I've lost to was Legan, and that was because it was the first time I played online and I had so much trouble trying to spam up-B to even get back onto the ledge (I failed). I have actually not lost to a Link player when I play any of my other mains (Pit, DK), despite it being not too uneven matchups. Now I wish I could post some videos, but I just don't have any recording supplies, and my digicam is just too terrible for recording matches.

I still do think Link can be mid-tier, but that's because of his overall floatiness. In Melee, he was mid-tier for most of the tier life, and finally low-tier towards the end. Yet he had more mindgames with his recovery, and was mostly just as strong. Despite having abusive matchups against him (Falco, Sheik, the like), he did have some good combo-ability that kept him in the game for great players like Aniki. I don't think even such skilled players can do that with Link in Brawl because of the new engine.

Now in Brawl, Link can probably take off 2 stock and 50% off most of his matchups, but he'll get gheighed by the better recovery people. It is SO easy for people to quickly react and footstool Link. I don't care how much you want to say you can try to mindgame/trick/adjust with your recovery. Seriously, there is basically nothing you can do when you're trying to recover from the bottom, and his air dodge leaves him with few options when people start timing AGAINST your airdodge on your way back. Against Metaknight, you'll trick him 5 times, but the 6th time he'll know what to do and you're dead. And the rest of the time, he'll just keep poking you out. A lot of people say you can try to adjust in your recovery with DI, and you can make it a lot of the time. But trust me, if you play against somebody who has a LOT of experience against Link, you will get gimped or footstooled so often it is not funny. You know its really true, no matter how good you are, if your Link can get footstooled by a level 9 CPU.

We've recently seen Izaw's combo video. He shows some good ways to rack up damage with Link, but that all involve moves that are part of Link's kill list. Unused "kills" are good fresh, but its so often not really that its actually sad. Unfortunately, it seems that most of Izaw's opponents were kind of weaksauce, but the principles behind his combos are still good. But despite that, the only true Link favored maps would be like, Eldin Bridge or something, but that is banned because of the chaingrabbers (do not play Falco or DDD there if you can somehow counterpick that stage!).

THe thing about Link's ATs is that none of them help with preventing him from getting *****. He will do some more damage and whatnot, but no ATs related to recovery, and no ATs related to true mindgame spacing.

 

[MiraiGen]

This was especially noticeable in the Ganondorf discussion.

GOD was it. Thank Samurai Panda for his discussion thread so that way people could get down to discussing **** that was actually important.

Anyway.

Link's problems, to me, are due to the same problem that hit Kirby back in the 64/Melee conversion - he didn't advance at all. Ganondorf may be pretty bad but he's got great potential with the Thunderstomp and Bair and Choke combos. Link, Captain Falcon, and Samus all seemed to be plagued with the immediate problem of "Not enough KO to kill, not enough speed to combo". Attacks that were great before seem to have been left alone with the theory that it'll remain the same (or worse, they got actually modified) such as the Knee Smash or in the later instance Samus' bombs.

Link's got great priority with his sword hitbox but he's too sluggish to make any decent footwork. To compare, if Ike has a greatsword and Marth has a longsword/rapier, Link has a bast-ard sword, putting him firmly in between. (God**** word filter)

I also have a huge problem with his Spin Attack. It was one of his best KO moves in Melee, and it even had a weird horizontal spike trick on the tip. Now it has to be charged to kill at 90% and up, else it takes to like 160%. That and it's awful use as recovery bump it down on the list of things to use in a match. With how far it reaches I can kind of see it being used in edgeguarding but not much.

Having said thus, his strengths: He doesn't have the KO of Ganondorf or the combo of Metaknight, but lots of his moves are still pretty beefy. They're very middle-of-the-road but it doesn't stop them from being pretty lethal, his Fair/Dair/Uair having almost no startup lag at all. You need to make sure you keep your attacks timed correctly and (as was mentioned) his spacing is really important.

He's got lots of good attacks but he's laggy as hell and his projectiles just don't have the 'oomph' like they used to. Originally it was all about making them run the Gauntlet every time they tried to approach, now the new shielding and Powershielding techs make his special attacks significantly less useful.

I think that the transition of changing Link to his Twilight Princess model hurt him the most - the charge on the SA, Gale Boomerang, Bombs, and new catching/shielding mechanics really crippled him. And he was already pretty bad.

The users are getting rabid for the summary/update. As fun as it is to tease them, we should probably move the thread soon ^_^

Oh you son of a *****, SP....

 

[Metro Knight]

Well, I racked up some damage, not too long ago versus my brother's Wolf, and I think Izaw's video is good for giving a general idea of what moves combo well. Like, I didn't really think to use the fsmash after, say a nair. If you fast fall one of your air moves, without the landing lag, than immediately do a fsmash, its really good. At low percentages, you will get the 2 hit combo in, and you get a 40% dmg combo off. Another great video though.

 

[TwinTurbo]

Link to me was one of those characters that I picked up, saw the obvious potential, and immediately knew he had way too much going against him. His recovery makes me very sad and in this game where most characters can survive for years on end, I can't help be think of this Link as SSB64 Link.

Pivot Sliding when you get it down does help Link develop some Melee mindgames, so that's something to keep in mind I guess. The least they could've done though was allow Link to charge his Up-B in the air in order to get more out of it. v_v Link's recovery his been terrible in all three games now. He's Nintendo's biggest selling point now-a-days and gets not Smash lov'n.

i saw the video that samuraipanda posted, and i couldnt figure out how to pivot slide. its the only thing in the video i couldnt do...can someone give a more detailed explaination?

 

[KratosAurion192]

GOD was it. Thank Samurai Panda for his discussion thread so that way people could get down to discussing **** that was actually important.

Anyway.

Link's problems, to me, are due to the same problem that hit Kirby back in the 64/Melee conversion - he didn't advance at all. Ganondorf may be pretty bad but he's got great potential with the Thunderstomp and Bair and Choke combos. Link, Captain Falcon, and Samus all seemed to be plagued with the immediate problem of "Not enough KO to kill, not enough speed to combo". Attacks that were great before seem to have been left alone with the theory that it'll remain the same (or worse, they got actually modified) such as the Knee Smash or in the later instance Samus' bombs.

Link's got great priority with his sword hitbox but he's too sluggish to make any decent footwork. To compare, if Ike has a greatsword and Marth has a longsword/rapier, Link has a bast-ard sword, putting him firmly in between. (God**** word filter)

I also have a huge problem with his Spin Attack. It was one of his best KO moves in Melee, and it even had a weird horizontal spike trick on the tip. Now it has to be charged to kill at 90% and up, else it takes to like 160%. That and it's awful use as recovery bump it down on the list of things to use in a match. With how far it reaches I can kind of see it being used in edgeguarding but not much.

Having said thus, his strengths: He doesn't have the KO of Ganondorf or the combo of Metaknight, but lots of his moves are still pretty beefy. They're very middle-of-the-road but it doesn't stop them from being pretty lethal, his Fair/Dair/Uair having almost no startup lag at all. You need to make sure you keep your attacks timed correctly and (as was mentioned) his spacing is really important.

He's got lots of good attacks but he's laggy as hell and his projectiles just don't have the 'oomph' like they used to. Originally it was all about making them run the Gauntlet every time they tried to approach, now the new shielding and Powershielding techs make his special attacks significantly less useful.

I think that the transition of changing Link to his Twilight Princess model hurt him the most - the charge on the SA, Gale Boomerang, Bombs, and new catching/shielding mechanics really crippled him. And he was already pretty bad.


Oh you son of a *****, SP....

Link not being able to KO is a lie. There are many ways to rack damage and he has a decent amount of kill moves.

And as for his recovery:
DEVA:

BTW, like I said before, ask me a question and I'll answer it. I don't feel like writing out a guide lol. I noticed you mentioned recovery. Well, here's one to chew on. Link has a horrible up-b, but one of the better recoveries in the game. this is coming from someone who Uses Link and only Link in tournament and has generally placed top 5 at every local, state, and regional tournament he's been to. If anything, my word's reliable on this subject lol. I say this because I've rarely, if ever gotten gimped for Link's poor recovery. One simple trick to begin with, always DI. The DI in this game is broken and probably better than the smash DI of melee, and as long as you're DIing properly, recovery shouldn't be an issue even with such a horrible up-b. In a worst case scenario, the opponent will edge hog you, but there are tricks to even that. Now, once you have DI down, this is where I believe Link to have one of the better recoveries in the game. He's one of the most difficult to edge guard. After the DI, pull a bomb with your second jump to avoid fast falling. Then, throw a rang at your opponent to prevent an edge hog, before you up-b. It'll either hit them, or pull them off the edge, both turning out in your favor. If by some chance they still hit you, either after being hit by the rang or while being pulled off the edge, or through their edgeguarding process, and you wont be able to make your recovery, you can still recover due to Link's more floaty physics in this game. If you get hit while recovering with the bomb you pulled earlier, it will almost always explode before you die, which with proper DI and an extra jump, will almost always allow you to recover since though Link has horrible movement range on his up-b, it acts as a nice shield with the range of the attack. This is basically my version of Link's bomb jump for Brawl. Overall, with proper DI, Link has a lot of tricks at his disposal for his recovery, and overall is one of the more difficult characters to edgeguard.

I also believe that while the use of the bombs is less effective, I'm happy that arows and zair are now a usable attack and that adding more projectiles to the list makes spamming just as good.

 

[MiraiGen]

Link not being able to KO is a lie.

Didn't say that. Read it again.

I said his KO overall was very middle-of-the-road, since lots of his startup laggy attacks are slower than some of the harder hitters yet don't KO as much. I suppose a better way to put my point was "Isn't fast enough to be a comboer like Metaknight, isn't slow enough to be a powerhouse like Ganondorf or DK."

Yeah I think that fits a bit better since "power" and "KO" are pretty different things.

 

[KratosAurion192]

Didn't say that. Read it again.

I said his KO overall was very middle-of-the-road, since lots of his startup laggy attacks are slower than some of the harder hitters yet don't KO as much. I suppose a better way to put my point was "Isn't fast enough to be a comboer like Metaknight, isn't slow enough to be a powerhouse like Ganondorf or DK."

Yeah I think that fits a bit better since "power" and "KO" are pretty different things.

True.

But it's also been stated that for a Link to win, you have to excel at mind games. It's a lot of "If you get into this situation you are screwed, so don't get into it."

Which is what makes his learning curve so high, which is what lowers his tier spot.

Link, in all of his games, has been the guy that can do everything. If people can play with him and bring out that his recovery isn't so bad, and even give him a bit of an approach game, he'll rise. If you noticed, Y.Link was doing just that IMO in melee.

 

[TwinTurbo]

Wow, I'm surprised so many mods and good players think he's good lol. Link sux, no doubt about it.

And seriously, unless someone else here has been consistantly placing well with him at something bigger than local tournaments, don't even try to argue lol. You have no idea how bad Link is at the competetive level.

well, link does suck. but he's really fun and really badass. This game cannot be played with the intention of dumping fun and cool characters for gay cheap chars (meta-knight) just so you can win. Sure, we link mains may lose more, but we stick with him. Not because we're stubborn or looking for some kind of badass potential, but because we play this game for the fun of it. Thats how a video game should be played.

 

[Force]

link has potential but everyone is playing him wrong except for Smasher "look up his vids" and now me cause i stole his style

 

[AeroLink_the_SoulMaster]

link has potential but everyone is playing him wrong except for Smasher "look up his vids" and now me cause i stole his style

I've looked him up, and I can say we have similar playing styles.

 

[Deva]

Smasher was really good in melee, and he's definately good in Brawl too. In his matches though, he abused the d-throw bomb a bit too much. I mean, I would too if my opponent fell for it that much, but I'd like to see some of his matches against players that didn't, to see if he knows any of the other tactics for other situations.

 

[Metro Knight]

Smasher is a beast. Note: Watch more Force, Deva, Smasher, Legan, ArkiveZero videos.

 

[Legan]

link has potential but everyone is playing him wrong except for Smasher "look up his vids" and now me cause i stole his style

You dont have to steal or copy someone else's style to be good. Your also wrong about people playing wrong, Hes just another good link that had the more recent video out. All the good links have all naturally adapted.

 

[Scala]

Does link get a good glide toss with his bomb? I never see people using it in videos.

 

[Legan]

Does link get a good glide toss with his bomb? I never see people using it in videos.

No, for some reason they didnt give link a glide toss. I guess they felt he already had too many techniques as it is.

 

[Deva]

His Dac toss is just as good, he just can't do it backwards like the glide toss.

 

[henrytran]

His Dac toss is just as good, he just can't do it backwards like the glide toss.

As much as I've tried to practice it, I sometimes still throw it down and blow myself up in the face =[.

 

[Nelo Vergil]

the timing for the good version of the attack is a little difficult, but well worth it when setting up a dome. I love Link, his projectile game is great, he has a good assortment of aerials, and he is a very technicaly character, especially with that Boomerang of his. One of my favorite things to do with it, if the chance ever arises, is to use it to hit both hits of Links D-Smash, can create some crazy damage

 

[Kyari]

Link really has to play differently depending on the enemy character though. Like you know you have to change your playstyle a little bit depending on which character they use, plus their playstyle, but it almost seems like Link uses almost totally different movesets against characters like Metaknight vs characters like ROB.

Of course you still end up using basically all of your moves anyway, that's just how good play works, but it feels like you alternate among which moves you use most often way more with Link's matchups moreso than the matchups of other characters, which also would explain why he has a high learning curve.

 

[Deva]

Poor Link, takes some of the most tech skill in the game, one of the highest learning curves, and no matter what you do, you can still lose to a Snake that knows how to f-tilt out of shield, XD.

IDK, after all the tournaments I've been to, even though I've always placed well, it's never satisfying. I always have to work so much harder than my opponent to win. Wins with Link are never **** matches for me. Even playing some nub Snake, It's always 1 stock high percent. I just luckily trick them into getting hit by the killing blow first. My only gripe is that for how much skill it take to use Link, I wish it was more rewarding in how hard you beat your opponent. Even if I win, it just doesn't feel that great knowing I barely beat that nub Snake player along the way.

 

[MiraiGen]

That's pretty much the inherent flaw with playing characters that aren't as good as other characters.

Welcome to the low tiers.

EDIT: Came off a little meaner than I thought. Let me rephrase.

I agree in that it's disappointing to be really good yet get whupped because your character sucks, but that's the inherent flaw of picking a character you like and only have them end up lower on the chain. It sucks, but eh, what're you going to do?

 

[Overswarm]

I won the MM, btw.

 

[Lucrece]

Poor Link, takes some of the most tech skill in the game, one of the highest learning curves, and no matter what you do, you can still lose to a Snake that knows how to f-tilt out of shield, XD.

IDK, after all the tournaments I've been to, even though I've always placed well, it's never satisfying. I always have to work so much harder than my opponent to win. Wins with Link are never **** matches for me. Even playing some nub Snake, It's always 1 stock high percent. I just luckily trick them into getting hit by the killing blow first. My only gripe is that for how much skill it take to use Link, I wish it was more rewarding in how hard you beat your opponent. Even if I win, it just doesn't feel that great knowing I barely beat that nub Snake player along the way.

Meanwhile, Skler is regressing in Melee la-la land.

People are just starting to notice how stupidly imbalanced this game is.

 

[MiraiGen]

Brawl is better than Melee. Nobody sucked harder than Roy.

 

[Crooked Crow]

Brawl is better than Melee. Nobody sucked harder than Roy.

false
and false

so i went to play melee with some people
and link is so top tier in that game
even though you'll still get ***** by spacies