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We NEED to use Instant Dash Attack more, it could change our matchups ...

LanceStern

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TOO LONG DIDN'T READ

The instant dash attack is different from a regular dash attack because it is faster. Using the instant dash attack out of shield allows us to punish a lot of things that didn't use to be punishable unless maybe we had a turnip (kirby's bair, mk fair, camping falcos and ness/lucas/wario). Please use it more
MAIN TOPIC
It seems lately I have had a lot of time to contemplate spacing and how to control it using Peach. I think it's becausee I've decided to main Peach for my next tournament, and I want to make sure I'm doing the right things to represent her correctly.

It all comes back to her short horizontal range (besides jab) and how I can effectively get around that shortcoming with a fast and long-ranged attack. I don’t feel that Peach users are effectively using a move that could change a few matchups for Peach, and that’s the instant dash attack.

To execute: Input a dash like you’re going to run or dash, and then immediately hit down on the cstick (if cstick is set to smash or attack). You will do a dash attack instantly.


It’s not our fastest move (jab and nair get those honors) but it is the fastest move that has the biggest horizontal range in Peach’s arsenal. With that said, we can use this to punish a LOT of moves that would otherwise be unpunishable, and therefore implement a new level of harassment to frustrate our opponents.

The key is the broken, disjointed hitbox the second hit has. You can't see it, but it reaches out far in front of peach and a little bit above her. Check the hitbubble.

I’ve already used it to drastically change the pace of my matchup vs. Kirby. As you know, Kirby loves to spam bairs when in trouble and to keep you out. I’ve heard you could punish with Jab OOS or Ftilt OOS, but Kriby’s love to space it by retreating the bair so that the tip of his feet hit your shield and you can do NOTHING to hit him unless you have a turnip.

But I have 100% punished Kirby’s perfectly spaced short hop bair with instant dash attack out of shield. It has drastically changed the matchup for me whereas it used to be I had to let him control the pace because I couldn’t get in, he can’t even harass me with bairs anymore because it gets punished everytime.

You can use it to harass marths that like to jump a lot, D3’s spamming bair in front of you or Metaknights fair. If the opponent is staying just out of range on the ground, the deceptive speed and RANGE of the dash attack will catch them off guard more than once. You can even use it to catch those pesky Falco's and force them in a bad position (above you, you under him). Often times they will predictably try to phantasm away, and then you can do it again. What about diddy kong sitting away from you with a banana between you? Instant dash attack will pick up the banana and pop diddy in the face

I'm not saying be predictable and spam it all day, but I see NO peaches using it. And it can change a lot of things. Helps her ground game definitely.

What Peach was not able to punish before – someone just out of her horizontal jab range – she can effectively punish and frustrate with Instant Dash Attack. Please start using it.

Any comments?
 

Rickerdy-doo-da-day

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Tried this and I kept accidently doing a D Smash instead xD Woopsy, got it down now

I've never actually looked into using instant Dash attacks at all in Brawl, how many frames do they save in comparison to simply dashing and mashing A asap?
If you have any vids like you normally do with the stuff you post Lance to showcase it punishing stuff like Kirby's Bair I'd love to see them...would help me visualize it a lot more because whilst I sometimes Dash Attack after dropping my shield, I never ever use instant Dash Attack
 

hotgarbage

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Yap. From a neutral position it out-ranges everything MK has (save for his own dash attack?). The downside of course being that it's pretty bloody unsafe. The second hit has enough disjointed range to be safe on shield (from grab) against most if you space it correctly though.
I've never actually looked into using instant Dash attacks at all in Brawl, how many frames do they save in comparison to simply dashing and mashing A asap?
6 frames. If you're going to be using this in the way described in the OP it's mandatory you use the c-stick.
 

Peachkid

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Yap. From a neutral position it out-ranges everything MK has (save for his own dash attack?). The downside of course being that it's pretty bloody unsafe. The second hit has enough disjointed range to be safe on shield (from grab) against most if you space it correctly though.

6 frames. If you're going to be using this in the way described in the OP it's mandatory you use the c-stick.
Oh look...another thing meno cant use ;D

<3 you meno dont kick me out this weekend DX. but yeah i could see instant dash attacks being useful... Quick mix-up for when people expect you to grab and sidestep or something
 

Metatitan

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Again, this has been known for a long time :embarrass
I do like the idea of playing with DA's disjoint (I've been toying with it a lot) and if spaced well it seems to be safe-ish on shield.

Anyways my original point being, post in the Q/A thread (or even better, the dash attack move discussion thread) instead of making new ones.
 

LanceStern

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Gotcha metatitan, my bad.

And rickerdy, unfortunately I do not have videos of this like I normally do. But believe me it works: Kirby uses rising short hop bair on your shield -> release shield -> instant dash attack. Works everytime and really makes the kirby player uncomfortable.

And tonight it worked WONDERS against Falco. You know how they love to SH laser or SH double laser in front of you and then phantasm away? Not only is it great for hitting the phantasm lag, but when you are in front of him and he's shooting you can get away with an instant dash attack to pop him in the air.

Supposedly this wrecks a lot of Game and Watches' aerials as well.

Really you should try it out. I have no means of recording matches.
 
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My comments on these thread is mostly one of awarness. There are a lot of moves that push shields away and simply trying to use OoS options like Nair, Bair, or grabbing just canno solve. Actually dropping shield and using moves like Ftilt, jab, and dash attack are good and safe moves to punish with so long as they are used in the correct circumstance. However, if you play enough, you will have already realized this a long time ago.
 

Razmakazi

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it's rly no secret that this move is pretty handy for punishing landings moves that are seemingly hard to punish like good bairs, snake's tilts, marth's fsmash, sneaking it under falco's lasers, gdubz's everything, etc.

this is good.

aside from that it can be spaced so that the 2nd hit can be perfectly spaced to hit at the tip or close enough so that you cross them up and land behind them kind of like what falcos, foxes, mks, lucarios, etc. tend to do. it's also pretty cool that some ppl don't know to shield both hits also. the only real prob w/ wut i just said is that dash atk isn't rly that safe on block but i guess if u space it vs anyone w/ snake's/mk's ftilt then they might not be able to punish hard or might miss a punish w/ something that lacks range or going for something too laggy.

it's all good i guess lol
 

Gadiel_VaStar

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Again, this has been known for a long time :embarrass
I do like the idea of playing with DA's disjoint (I've been toying with it a lot) and if spaced well it seems to be safe-ish on shield.

Anyways my original point being, post in the Q/A thread (or even better, the dash attack move discussion thread) instead of making new ones.
I'm w/ you Metatitan, I already knew about this >_< How do you guys not know this!!! I've been using dash attack w/ c-stick down when I first learned you could do it in brawl, which is the 1st day I got Brawl on release! I don't really think the dash attack is "instant." It's pretty much the same as a normal, but it's easier to start because you won't get stuck doing an f-smash.
 

Deathfox30

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I'm w/ you Metatitan, I already knew about this >_< How do you guys not know this!!! I've been using dash attack w/ c-stick down when I first learned you could do it in brawl, which is the 1st day I got Brawl on release! I don't really think the dash attack is "instant." It's pretty much the same as a normal, but it's easier to start because you won't get stuck doing an f-smash.
Cut him a break, it's not like he's claiming he found how to do it. It's pretty much instant, you have to dash a tiny bit first, since hitting Down C + the control stick left/right at the same time will result in a D smash but it's barely noticeable.
 

Praxis

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Dash attack is broken, I think I've told Kyon about this before, but you can space dash attack to detonate Green Greens blocks without getting damaged by the explosion, and also space it on Marth's shield so that he can't punish it OOS.
 

Razmakazi

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I'm pretty sure marth can fsmash or ftilt.

well if he powershields I know he can hit us with fsmash for sure and we might be in the dsmash tipper range.

if he doesn't powershield though idk if he can hit us though.

still good though, just nothing to spam.
 

wwwilliam0024

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Hello there, im a proud peach mainer and the best in my region.

How to say it.... the dash attack is good but bad at sometimes.

Lets put it this way, you get a 50 - 50 chance to have a successful approach with it.

I preferably use these against MK and marth.

MK since you must be constantly running away from him, there are times when he comes after you, so quickly dash attack him without him knowing and making space to run once more.

Marth has a very annoying Fair spam defense against us, and taking advantage of the attacks pretty large hitbox, you can manage to hit him without getting punished.

But dash attack is also very risky due to the fact that it can be shielded easily and that it can be predictable at some points.

For example, if you run at an opponent, people normally shield by reaction, if you pull this attack against a shield it wont even push them far enough to escape, you will certainly get punished :S

So i dont consider using the attack a lot, but using it once in a while is good, since its really a non-expected attack.

Well... i use the attack against: MK, marths, space animals.

Using the attack against snake is risky as ****, his insane hitboxes can beat you right away.

The key to a successful approach with this attack is mind gaming and situation.
 

Silly Kyle

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I really like this!! I've been incorporating it into my game and I'm seeing positive results. I've been wanting to utilize dash attack more in this game and now I see more situations where I can use it!! w00t <3
 
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