teflon_climbers
Smash Lord
Kish: With draining the capacitor, could you put an energy-draining load on the end of the circuit, effectively sapping the capacitor of it's former stored energy?
Just a thought ^^
Just a thought ^^
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Wavedash and powershield a BETTER WAY: a GCN Controller Modification
- Thread starter superpichu
- Start date
Phantom Phox
Smash Rookie
nice
thats a nice statagey but some people(like me) just find nice regular controls that our hand likes
i love using the wave bird and microcon
i can wave dash much easer
thats a nice statagey but some people(like me) just find nice regular controls that our hand likes
i love using the wave bird and microcon
i can wave dash much easer
KishSquared
Smash Master
And this energy-draining load... what might this be, a resistor? And by end, do you mean in series or parallel?
It's true that a load through which the capacitor could discharge would work, but that isn't the problem. The problem is in the mechanics, in that the capacitor must be in the "charged" state while the button is pressed, and it must be connected to a discharging circuit when the button is let go. I'm about ready to give up on mechanical stuff and go strictly with electrical switches, i.e. transistors, maybe even some timing ICs and whatnot. Of course, this is what I think about when I do my electronics homework each week, so I haven't actually given it much serious thought yet. It should work in theory, will let you guys know if I can come up with anything.
It's true that a load through which the capacitor could discharge would work, but that isn't the problem. The problem is in the mechanics, in that the capacitor must be in the "charged" state while the button is pressed, and it must be connected to a discharging circuit when the button is let go. I'm about ready to give up on mechanical stuff and go strictly with electrical switches, i.e. transistors, maybe even some timing ICs and whatnot. Of course, this is what I think about when I do my electronics homework each week, so I haven't actually given it much serious thought yet. It should work in theory, will let you guys know if I can come up with anything.
Shadows
Smash Journeyman
That doesnt make it easier, that just makes it harder in the long run when your used to Controlers with the triggers in them.
For example, I tried that out, then I got used to wavebirds and Mad cats, after 3 months, I picked the modified controller up, and couldnt wave dash.
For example, I tried that out, then I got used to wavebirds and Mad cats, after 3 months, I picked the modified controller up, and couldnt wave dash.
Doctor X
Smash Lord
Hey, guys! I'm new here... First post, I hope I don't make myself look like an *** and make a bad first impression... Oh well.
I had somebody help me modify one of my controllers a month or so ago, just so I could try it out.
A few techniques I use with Fox are a bit easier with it, but not by that much as far as I've seen. I'm thinking it might be better to not stray from the original controller, because there will definitely be some situations when I can't use a modded one, and I don't want to feel too out of my element when it happens.
I like to play at a local gamestore once in a while, and they use a projector screen, with the Gamecube sitting on a shelf about six or seven feet behind the players. They have to use wavebirds, so I can't use my modified controller there.
I had somebody help me modify one of my controllers a month or so ago, just so I could try it out.
A few techniques I use with Fox are a bit easier with it, but not by that much as far as I've seen. I'm thinking it might be better to not stray from the original controller, because there will definitely be some situations when I can't use a modded one, and I don't want to feel too out of my element when it happens.
I like to play at a local gamestore once in a while, and they use a projector screen, with the Gamecube sitting on a shelf about six or seven feet behind the players. They have to use wavebirds, so I can't use my modified controller there.
i just finished this mod and i have a pointer for using the jewlers screwdriver. If you have the kind that comes in the small kit with the magnifying glass melt it and push it into a screwdriver with changeable bits .. that way you can get more strength behind it .
DARKsideofMARTH
Smash Cadet
KNOW WHAT? I JUST USE THE CONTROLED AS IS AND I STILL AM REALLY GOOD. IF YOU NEED A MODDED CONTROLER, YOU MUST NOT BE THAT EXPERIENCED OF A PLAYER
David Kirk
Smash Ace
Shut up.Originally posted by DARKsideofMARTH
KNOW WHAT? I JUST USE THE CONTROLED AS IS AND I STILL AM REALLY GOOD. IF YOU NEED A MODDED CONTROLER, YOU MUST NOT BE THAT EXPERIENCED OF A PLAYER
CaliburChamp
Smash Master
Im a technician in training, but I dont expect to modify my controller for this. But you made need to get a Capacitor with less voltage and uF. Once you replace it with that, it will be easy to short hop, but you do need expert soldering skills cause it such a small amount of space. Anyways, how much voltage and uF does this Capacitor have?
David Kirk
Smash Ace
I do not think that anyone knows what you are talking about...
KishSquared
Smash Master
Kirk: I do! I am the Electrical Engineer of the SoF, after all...
Calibur: I'm already using a cap to do the short hop, I've already found a value for it that works (I'm assuming you mean micro-Farads by uF). The problem is draining the cap after it's been charged. Any ideas?
Regardless, I think I'm ditching the cap idea for a digital electronics method, using delayed inverters to close the "jump" signal through a MOSFET after allowing the signal to pass for a short while. Makes sense? Will let you know if this works, although it'll probably take me a while to obtain the right chips to do this.
Calibur: I'm already using a cap to do the short hop, I've already found a value for it that works (I'm assuming you mean micro-Farads by uF). The problem is draining the cap after it's been charged. Any ideas?
Regardless, I think I'm ditching the cap idea for a digital electronics method, using delayed inverters to close the "jump" signal through a MOSFET after allowing the signal to pass for a short while. Makes sense? Will let you know if this works, although it'll probably take me a while to obtain the right chips to do this.
CaliburChamp
Smash Master
KishSquared, I think thats a great idea. But I would take that Cap out, and what ever its voltage is, divide it by 2 so that the voltage is halfed. Then go get a Cap with that kind of voltage and solder the new one in, and it should work. Your other idea works fine too. Anyways, whatever is easier to you.
KishSquared
Smash Master
Maybe I'm not explaining it well, but the cap I have is fine. Voltage isn't a property of capacitors, the capacitance itself determines its charge time. Once the cap is charged, it cuts off current.
Anywho, the problem is that I can't discharge the capacitor, as the space in the controller is too small for a mechanical switch. In case you don't know, once a cap is charged, it stays charged for a good while, or until it is discharged. Therefore, if you want to short hop repeatedly, you have to discharge it somehow. That's the problem, hope that makes more sense.
Anywho, like I said, the cap is old news anyway, I'm gonna work on that digital circuitry application next. Here's hoping!
Anywho, the problem is that I can't discharge the capacitor, as the space in the controller is too small for a mechanical switch. In case you don't know, once a cap is charged, it stays charged for a good while, or until it is discharged. Therefore, if you want to short hop repeatedly, you have to discharge it somehow. That's the problem, hope that makes more sense.
Anywho, like I said, the cap is old news anyway, I'm gonna work on that digital circuitry application next. Here's hoping!
CaliburChamp
Smash Master
Kind of complex for me, but yeah I like your plan. Tell us how it works out when done. 
New news regarding powershielding/reflecting!
All testing and credit for this should go to usea.
Powershielding is in no way effective, other than negating the loss of shield that would normally affect it from the attack. Powershielding will cause you to slide further than a full shield (light shield affect), but will give neither player an advantage that they would not normally have. So unless it's just to show off, there's not much point to attempting to master powershielding, or increase the percentage at which you can powershield.
However, shield reflecting (as in projectiles) is still usefull, just for its obvious effect. But here's the thing: it only allows 2 frames opening to shield the said projectiles. That's 1/30th of a second. Powershielding attacks allows 4 frames to powershield, so while not much higher, is still easier to do in that respect.
... And whatever else I was going to add, I've forgotten, so in short, Reflecting>Powershielding, for all those working on training with those techniques. Again, all credit goes to usea for testing.
Edit: And yes I do only refer to powershielding for physical attacks, whereas shield reflecting is for projectiles. Just how I go about things.
All testing and credit for this should go to usea.
Powershielding is in no way effective, other than negating the loss of shield that would normally affect it from the attack. Powershielding will cause you to slide further than a full shield (light shield affect), but will give neither player an advantage that they would not normally have. So unless it's just to show off, there's not much point to attempting to master powershielding, or increase the percentage at which you can powershield.
However, shield reflecting (as in projectiles) is still usefull, just for its obvious effect. But here's the thing: it only allows 2 frames opening to shield the said projectiles. That's 1/30th of a second. Powershielding attacks allows 4 frames to powershield, so while not much higher, is still easier to do in that respect.
... And whatever else I was going to add, I've forgotten, so in short, Reflecting>Powershielding, for all those working on training with those techniques. Again, all credit goes to usea for testing.
Edit: And yes I do only refer to powershielding for physical attacks, whereas shield reflecting is for projectiles. Just how I go about things.
hey I don't need any credit, I didn't program the game, sir
while it's true what omnigamer said, that powershielding attacks doesn't give you any frame advantage at all (over normal, full-shielding), he seems to interpret the name "powershielding" to only refer to attacks. I believe that it refers to reflecting projectiles as well as shielding attacks. it's still very useful to powershield projectiles, just very hard
while it's true what omnigamer said, that powershielding attacks doesn't give you any frame advantage at all (over normal, full-shielding), he seems to interpret the name "powershielding" to only refer to attacks. I believe that it refers to reflecting projectiles as well as shielding attacks. it's still very useful to powershield projectiles, just very hard
I used to think the same thing, until I went back and did further tests since it seemed odd to make powershielding useless. What I found was quite interesting.
I found powershielding attacks is EXTREMELY useful in the hands of a master. Normally when you let go of the shield button after having your shield up you undergo a recovery time of about 15 frames, give or take depending on the character. When you powershield an attack, you still undergo this recovery time, however it is different in that it can be cancelled into any ground attack. This means you could block an attack and immediately attack with ANY move without having to wait for your shield recovery. What you must do is release the shield button before your shield stun duration is over (so you don't go into shielding again), then after your shield stun duration is over do whatever attack of your choice anytime during you shield recovery animation and it will cancel the animation. This is huge, the problem is that its very difficult to do consistantly. But imagine the possibilities if one could, take for example Sheik blocking an attack and countering with a forward tilt or downsmash!
neosyrex is right actually. I have a few disagreements but it's true that your animation for letting go of the shield is cancellable with ground moves after a powershield. though it is still normally cancellable with a jump, sidestep, or upsmash anyway, and this doesn't allow you to cancel it with running or walking
as for it being 'huge' I am skeptical, even if it weren't really hard to powershield attacks, let alone consistently.
people usually wavedash or jump out of the shield to avoid that lag. if somebody hits your shield with a ground move, they're probably getting shieldgrabbed/shorthop attacked/rested/wavedash attacked anyway so it's a moot point. and any strong ground move will push you too far away to be of any advantage over a normal shield.
as for aerials, if they can l-cancel and get away before you recover from stun to shieldgrab them, then powershielding, letting go of your shield and attacking them won't work either (same amount of shield stun). and if they're slow enough to get shieldgrabbed, this won't be any faster. just a difference between getting a grab or getting an attack (if you don't slide too far).
definitely an advantage to be able to eliminate your shield release lag, however the only real use of it is to counter quick, minimal knockback moves on the ground (finally you can shield sheik's FT and get her back...if you can powershield it. good luck).
as for it being 'huge' I am skeptical, even if it weren't really hard to powershield attacks, let alone consistently.
people usually wavedash or jump out of the shield to avoid that lag. if somebody hits your shield with a ground move, they're probably getting shieldgrabbed/shorthop attacked/rested/wavedash attacked anyway so it's a moot point. and any strong ground move will push you too far away to be of any advantage over a normal shield.
as for aerials, if they can l-cancel and get away before you recover from stun to shieldgrab them, then powershielding, letting go of your shield and attacking them won't work either (same amount of shield stun). and if they're slow enough to get shieldgrabbed, this won't be any faster. just a difference between getting a grab or getting an attack (if you don't slide too far).
definitely an advantage to be able to eliminate your shield release lag, however the only real use of it is to counter quick, minimal knockback moves on the ground (finally you can shield sheik's FT and get her back...if you can powershield it. good luck).
vidjogamer
Smash Master
heh, i had no idea so much was going on inside this topic.
It would be huge if someone were able to master it. It would give you the ability to counter people who hit you outside of your grab range, including people far away or behind you. And not everyone has good short hops (Sheik or Samus, for example). Wavedashing out of shield has about the same recovery time as letting go of shield, only has the added benefit of moving you forward, but it is still very slow. And the difference between countering with a grab or an attack can be great in some situations. Like for example being able to choose between a grab from Marth or a forward smash from Marth, especially if they are staying out of grab range and in tipper range. And it would also be the best way to defeat L-Cancels, as most characters have attacks that are faster than their grabs, like for example powershielding into Reflector with Fox (faster and more reliable than jumping out of shield and doing it on the ground). I don't see how it wouldn't be huge if we are assuming someone could do it flawlessly. Yeah, it might not be beneficial in every situation but in many it will be.
Belmont
Smash Apprentice
does anyone have a picture of this modded controller?
HoNgKoNgPHOOEY
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2003
- Messages
- 14
SuperPichu : Hey thx man for sharing on how to modify the controller to better wave dash and l cancel. Owe ya one man. 
Yeah, those triangle screws piss the **** out of me. Itz a big hassle jus to get em out. Do you by any chance no where to buy those triangular screw drivers ?
Everyone : Do you guyz know how to format your username for smashboards ? The one that appears above you avatar. So mine would be " HongKongPhooey" Do you guyz know how to change the way it looks like you can on AIM ? You guyz were members here a year before i was so thas y im askin.
Sorry for the long azz post
Yeah, those triangle screws piss the **** out of me. Itz a big hassle jus to get em out. Do you by any chance no where to buy those triangular screw drivers ?Everyone : Do you guyz know how to format your username for smashboards ? The one that appears above you avatar. So mine would be " HongKongPhooey" Do you guyz know how to change the way it looks like you can on AIM ? You guyz were members here a year before i was so thas y im askin.
Sorry for the long azz post
superpichu
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2002
- Messages
- 412
There are many places to buy them. This is just one site I found after 10 minutes of searching with google:
http://www.electricquarter.com/sbit.htm
What you are looking for is the triwing driver. I'm sure you can find at other places online, and that might be cheaper. If you do, please post here about it.
http://www.electricquarter.com/sbit.htm
What you are looking for is the triwing driver. I'm sure you can find at other places online, and that might be cheaper. If you do, please post here about it.
HoNgKoNgPHOOEY
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2003
- Messages
- 14
Alright Thx for the site and yeah...i'll be sure to do that once i get the triwing driver. Again Thx a lot
Supernova
Smash Ace
we should find a site that sells replacement parts for the gamecube controller. like spare sticks and such. anyone know any sites?
HoNgKoNgPHOOEY
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2003
- Messages
- 14
No , not that i know of but ill try and see if there are any 
UNDlSPUT3D
Smash Journeyman
I'm hardcore and I used fingernail clippers to take out the screws to my gc controller. Actually I just couldn't find any screwdrivers for the triangle screw at fred myers or radio shaq like you listed. Oh well. I tore my fingers about, ripping the flesh and blistering them, just trying to take out the screws. This better be worth it.
HugS
Smash Champion
Sorry to revive an old topic, But i had a question. I just bought a brand new controller, and the joystick was very loose so that i can move it all over the place and get no response from it. Brand new....how awesome. Well i was wondering if there was anything i can do to make it tighter so a slight movement would get a response and the joystick would "jiggle" less? Get what im saying? I need it before i head out to another tournament.
I don't want to mod it and make it all crazy or anything...i just want the joystick to be tighter.
Please help.
I don't want to mod it and make it all crazy or anything...i just want the joystick to be tighter.
Please help.
HoChiMinhTrail
Smash Master
indeed
well
I think that if you learn to do the fancy tricks the hard way, it will be more helpfull on the count of the fact that (well heck I don't know just do it the ordinary practice way).
9/6/10 EDIT: This argument was going somewhere, and then I blew it.
I think that if you learn to do the fancy tricks the hard way, it will be more helpfull on the count of the fact that (well heck I don't know just do it the ordinary practice way).
9/6/10 EDIT: This argument was going somewhere, and then I blew it.
HoChiMinhTrail
Smash Master
yea just regular practice would probobly be better for you in the long run ('')(._.)......
yeah
I like your guts
9/6/10 EDIT: Oh god I used the rolling smiley in a post. Why hasn't somebody killed me yet.
I like your guts
9/6/10 EDIT: Oh god I used the rolling smiley in a post. Why hasn't somebody killed me yet.
HoChiMinhTrail
Smash Master
well its what i do --;
AmishTechnology
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2004
- Messages
- 374
- NNID
- KIMPHIE
Isn't this banned in tournaments?
On mine it is
9/6/10 EDIT: Oh man look at this here post. It's so snarky, yet so unnecessary.
9/6/10 EDIT: Oh man look at this here post. It's so snarky, yet so unnecessary.
Vegard
Smash Lord
Who'll check if you got a modded controller when you play online on revolution? =O
Ok, we don't know how the control will be like, though.
Ok, we don't know how the control will be like, though.
Wow, thanks for posting that! (ancient I know, but a first for me)MasterOfFlames said:You could do that whole long precedure..........
Or just keep down L while the game's starting up
As I'm pretty new to wavedashing, there's still a few little timing issues I've yet to work out, pretty minor stuff. But there's two huge really annoying problems I get that make WDing not worth using practically at all; rolling instead of WDing in the opposite direction you just did, and sidestepping instead of smashing. This rids me of both of those problems SO easily, wow! :bigthumbu
Nexis
Smash Apprentice
So looks like it is mostly up to you if you want to use this as training wheels or forever. I personally want to try this, but I like the old fashion way too so I am still deciding.
As for tournament people, will it be ok to bring 2 controlers, just in case you dont allow a modded controller? Or would that just give it away and you wont be allowed in? Heh
As for tournament people, will it be ok to bring 2 controlers, just in case you dont allow a modded controller? Or would that just give it away and you wont be allowed in? Heh
I'd rather just go through the frustration of learning it the hard way. Your conscience will be clear and you'll feel great when you finally pull it off with relative ease. Second if by some chance you play where it happened that you didn't have the controller with you, or that it was banned and you were given a different one, you've just become wavedashless.
Yep! That's the word of the day folks! WAVEDASHLESS! I am pure Genius.
and you'll feel great when you finally pull it off with relative ease. Second if by some chance you play where it happened that you didn't have the controller with you, or that it was banned and you were given a different one, you've just become wavedashless. Yep! That's the word of the day folks! WAVEDASHLESS! I am pure Genius.