want CLOUD STRIFE in brawl? official thread.

[Aiser]

Don't forget Chrono

 

[Chaos_Tyrant]

chrono doesnt have a big fan base...

 

[Diddy Kong]

He does. Atleast Nintendo fans like Chrono to. And correct me if im wrong but Chrono never appeared outside of a Nintendo console.

 

[Aiser]

He was on ps1 for final fantasy chronicles came with chrono trigger and final fantsay 5 or 4 not sure. I miss that game, =(

But Chrono does have a large fanbase, not as big as cloud. But I say his fanbase is as big as geno <_<

 

[Chaos_Tyrant]

hmm...well i still think geno has a better chance then chrono and cloud

 

[tirkaro]

*rises above the debris of anti-cloud bombings*
>.>......
<.<......
are the anti cloud nazi's gone now? *puts on the jar* soldiers, I'm going in.....

.....okay, all warzone metaphors aside, I'm gonna switch to the "no cloud in brawl" side. I mean, like, who cares if this desision would switch MILLIONS of FF7 fans to the wii, thus DRAMATICALY increasing sales of the wii and SSBB. and cloud is, like so not a PERFECT APOLOGY to nintendo because of the lack of square games for nintendo systems, when they were supposed to be loyal to nintendo. and, like, who cares if square and FF fans obviously favors Cloud to other characters. and,like, who cares about SGT's smartest-post-on-this-topic post here:

To everyone who says Cloud has nothing to do with Nintendo can just shut up. Square and Nintendo are "buddys". Where did the first six FF games come out on? Nintendo. Who made the Mario RPG game? Square. So Cloud himself I guess doesn't have anything to do with Nintendo. But Nintendo has every right to be able to put him on there. They would just have to ask Square and share profit with them. It would actually be a smart move on Nintendos part. All the crazed fan-boys would by this game. They would also buy the Wii just to play this game. Thus, racking in much more money for Nintendo and some for Square.

and,like, who cares about the undoubtedly upcoming ff7 for the ds? and who cares about the fact that cloud was one of the few(if not only) ff charaters in COM who had a full spritesheet complete with attacks, jumps, and had the most detailed movement and drawing IN THE ENTIRE GAME.(I'm a spriter, so I have an eye for this stuff.)
and heck, who cares about the fact that every negative nancy in this thread doesn't dislike cloud, but just doubts his appearance. and who cares if, like, he has a HUGE fanbase, being one of the usual winners of the gamefaqs character contest, next to link. and who the hell cares about the fact that cloud would answer the prayers to many ff fans, being that smash is supposed to appeal to EVERYONE. and who cares about the fact that ff7 was supposed to be on the n64, but it was switched to the PS due to technical reasons.
yeah, cloud is like, teh sux, lol

 

[Maverick69]

Exactly, who cares? I certainly don't.

Even if it boosts wii sales, I really don't care. I don't want FF7 fans challenging me to brawl just for the chance to play as their favorite emo hero holding a butter knife.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

I'm getting really sick of all of the Geno crap.Why do people assume that since he was on a list of suggested characters,he all of the sudden isgod of Square-Enix Rep because he was in a nintendo game?IT DOESN'T MATTER PEOPLE!!!! There are several characters that rep Square-Enix,and bcause he was in one freakin nintendo game,and a cameo in another doesn't man that he is shoe-in,even though he is cool.

Sakurai said the character had to appear on a nintendo consol,not have their own game.And if you want to talk about Square-Enix Characters that wont make it,i can say one is Lenneth from Valkyrie profile,and i might add is my dream character.

Just chill people,chill.

 

[tirkaro]

Exactly, who cares? I certainly don't.

Even if it boosts wii sales, I really don't care. I don't want FF7 fans challenging me to brawl just for the chance to play as their favorite emo hero holding a butter knife.

*steps out of the reverse phsycolegy fuffy bunny suit of doom.*
the fact that you dont want cloud in because he is popular just supports my claim. and that extremley exaggerated senerio will never appen, face the facts.

E:

I'm getting really sick of all of the Geno crap.Why do people assume that since he was on a list of suggested characters,he all of the sudden isgod of Square-Enix Rep because he was in a nintendo game?IT DOESN'T MATTER PEOPLE!!!! There are several characters that rep Square-Enix,and bcause he was in one freakin nintendo game,and a cameo in another doesn't man that he is shoe-in,even though he is cool.

thanks EPF, I am also getting sick of that geno crap too.we have plenty of mario characters, the last thing we need is a side character who is owned by a 3rd party company. hell,one of the reasons I support cloud is because of the ovveratedness of geno.(yes, geno is ovverated, DEAL WITH IT!)

 

[Maverick69]

*steps out of the reverse phsycolegy fuffy bunny suit of doom.*
the fact that you dont want cloud in because he is popular just supports my claim. and that extremley exaggerated senerio will never appen, face the facts.

E:

thanks EPF, I am also getting sick of that geno crap too.we have plenty of mario characters, the last thing we need is a side character who is owned by a 3rd party company. hell,one of the reasons I support cloud is because of the ovveratedness of geno.(yes, geno is ovverated, DEAL WITH IT!)

*cough* hate to repeat myself, but you're talking about geno being overrated in a cloud topic?

W/e. I dont care if geno gets in or not. if he does, cool, if he doesnt, i dont care.

And as for Cloud, that's not the ONLY reason I don't want him in, hating someone because they're popular makes no sense. If i hated popular characters I would start crying every time I saw Mario.

I DO however, have a dislike for characters that are extremely well liked but have done nothing to deserve it. And I'm being honest here, I have NEVER seen why cloud is so hyped. He's just a blonde guy. generic FF character, but he has a really big sword. (oh I will however bow to omnislash. very cool move) And I never cared for the game he was in either. Even if you care enough to sort through all the stuff that doesn't make sense and take the time to fully comprehend the backstory with jenova, sephiroth, cloud, lifestream, all that crap, it STILL isn't very interesting. And the main story is just terrible. "find sephiroth before this really big rock hits the planet...... wow" I highly prefer the FF8 story. Hell I prefer the 9 story flame me all you want.

You really want a good story? go play the classics.

My personal vendetta against overrated games aside, I honestly don't think cloud would make a good brawl character. I see him as either being ridiculously overpowered, or too similar to marth (i know they're very different it's just how I see it) if they actually give him the buster sword and let him wield it as quickly and effectively as he does in the game and in Advent Children, then he will be ridiculously strong. And if they decide to incorporate his KH form (which is the only argument for his nintendo status so i guess they'd have to) then he's going to be able to fly and have dark powers!!!

But let's say they tone him down, then we've either got a really slow character with a bulky sword, or another generic swordsmen. Not to mention the fact that he's going to have a disjointed hitbox the size of 3 jigglypuffs.

Also, I think there are more deserving Square characters. I'm not going to say geno cuz i dont really see the hype for him either. But come on, even in the FF franchise there are more deserving characters, characters that actually appeared on nintendo. ( in a whole game not just a subplot. come on people it's getting old. Chain of memories BARELY counts.) Celes, Cid, Cedric, and my personal favorite, Faris!( A pirate with a pet dragon. come on that just pwns lol)

So to those who call me just a cloud hater. I think I provided enough real substance to have a substantial and intelligent stance on the matter.

 

[Aiser]

.....................lol

http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Cloud+fanboys&word2=Cloud+haters

 

[Destruction_King]

OK. Let's set Geno aside a second and think. I can think of four characters who just recently moved way further ahead of Cloud on the Squareenix totem pole.

Black Mage, White Mage, Moogle, and Ninja.

Not only have these characters been in Nintendo released FF games (FF 1 and 2, and FF 4-6,) they've now appeared on a recent game with Mario. If that doesn't put them on par with Geno, and in front of Cloud, I don't know what does.

Add that together with the popularity of Nuklearpower with American audiences and Geno's popularity (both on Sakurai's poll and on this site,) there are now five definitive characters in front of Cloud.

 

[xianfeng]

Thinking about it if Nintendo wanted money (which they don't) then they would put cloud in because he is uberly popular, more so than link almost.

 

[tirkaro]

thank you dante, that post was a shining example of what a cloud hater SHOULD be, someone who gives a very good reason opinion without instantly saying that thier opinion is absolute fact and what should happen. and without the obligatory derogatory pic or link. bravo. if all the cloud-not-want-for-brawl-ers were like that, we woudn't have to put up with the stupdty, and I would ignore people less

Thinking about it if Nintendo wanted money (which they don't)

how do you know?

 

[Maverick69]

thank you dante, that post was a shining example of what a cloud hater SHOULD be, someone who gives a very good reason opinion without instantly saying that thier opinion is absolute fact and what should happen. and without the obligatory derogatory pic or link. bravo. if all the cloud-not-want-for-brawl-ers were like that, we woudn't have to put up with the stupdty, and I would ignore people less

I know what you mean man. I feel like I'm dealing with an obligatory hater right now in a certain thread about a certain shopkeep.

And I know how annoying it can be. Sorry if I came off as a random "lawl cloud suxorz" type of guy.

Glad we reached an understanding ^_^

 

[xianfeng]

how do you know?

Look at the gamecube it is chock full of platform games look at the other consoles they have barely any but they are full of innovative games such as GTA and first person shooters and stuff that people want, Nintendo doesn't have what the modern audience wants, they know what the modern audience wants.

 

[Aiser]

Nintendo is a company you're diluted if you think they don't care about money.

 

[xianfeng]

They don't care about western money, just the japanese stuff

 

[Zombie Cola]

Look at the gamecube it is chock full of platform games look at the other consoles they have barely any but they are full of innovative games such as GTA and first person shooters and stuff that people want, Nintendo doesn't have what the modern audience wants, they know what the modern audience wants.

Nintendo is the only one, fiscally speaking, that is going to win for, honestly at least a year. Microsoft and Sony both fully understand that they wont make any actualy money untill 2007 due to the high production costs of the sytems in comparison to the current MSRPs. The money is going to come from software, accessories and whatever crazy peripherals they release. Nintendo on the other hand, is hearing a nice "KUCHING" every time they sell a console, because A. The console sells for literally more than it costs to make, and B. They are offering a new way to game. There is no longer a "modern audience" especially with the Wii, I hate to say it, but we all are gonna have to admit it, the super supreme l337ness we have all held over non-gamers and n00bs over the last several generations is going to fade. This is a new way to play. Watch any demo of someone playing a Wii for the first time, the guys at GameSpot even admitted at the press conference yesterday that we are all going to have to learn to game again, learning curves are one hting in a game, but can you guys remember the last time you said "****, I can't get this controller down, it's so hard to use!" It hasn't happened to a lot of us because frankly, controllers, and the way we play games hasn't realy changes much since the Atari, they have all been gamepads with buttons, every 4-5 years they just got bulkier, and they added more buttons. For the first time in over two decades we are finally getting the change that we have been needing, we just never knew we needed it until now.

Edit: I wanted to point out that although we will all have to learn the controls, we will still have the g33k advantage over our lesser, barbaric, nongaming counterparts...God help them all.

 

[Maverick69]

it's a good point, but we gamers are still gonna have an advantage

Just from knowning gameplay mechanics, having faster reflexes, and being more intelligent in general (you know it's true. we tend to have better problem solving skills.) It's more likely that we will pick up on it much quicker than if you hand a casual gamer or someone who doesnt game a wiimote.

Going from SNES to N64 was a big change (in my opinion) but I was pwning people up soon enough.

It all comes down to whether you can adapt to change or not.

 

[Aiser]

They don't care about western money, just the japanese stuff

Uhm what are you getting at? ultimately money is money.

 

[xianfeng]

You make it out like Nintendo doesn;t have heaps of stupid peripherals like the bongos, the hundreds of wii remote add ons etc.

 

[Aiser]

No I'm making it out like they're a company that just like any company they want money. Just because they seem to be more idealistic toward the consumer doesn't mean they're not out for your money lol.

 

[Spaniard364]

Aiser, I too believe Nintendo is not out for your money. If they were, IMO, they would have stuck with another control pad, similar or not, to the Gamecube. By making this Wiimote, they took a chance. They had no clue how people would react to such a major change in physically playing a game. They didn't know if people would complain too much about it taking too much physical energy to play, or if they'd acually like using their physical energy to play. Either way, they took a chance. As Wii, lol, all know Nintendo is about "revolutionizing" the gaming industry. With this, they've done such. But I should probably to go another site to ramble on about this because its WAY off topic.

Just sharing my thoughts. Mayeb Gamfaqs would be good for this Wii subject

 

[The Bino]

Spaniard.... Nintendo isn't really taking a CHANCE with Wii.... they took the CHANCE with DS, that's why that system was said by NINTENDO that this DS won't replace the SP... u remember that... it was a new design for them to add into it, they did say that the DS was a test subject for their upcoming NEW CONSOLE SYSTEM, Wii..... and if u look at the sales of the DS it has skyrocketed beyond Nintendo's expectations, now if DS didn't sell, they wouldn't have lost as much money as if they didn't release DS and still created Wii and lost millions over it and would end up like Sega, u want Nintendo to end up like Sega, i don't....

Any way, they took the risk with DS and since the DS has done extremely well, destroying all competition that tried to take out Nintendo failed horribly, since DS is the top selling handheld and with its new design that was in it, they put it in the Wii, since DS was their "test subject"

 

[Spaniard364]

I never read up that that. I had no clue the DS was a test subject...learn something new everyday. Thanks for the update.

 

[8-bit hacker]

Spaniard.... Nintendo isn't really taking a CHANCE with Wii.... they took the CHANCE with DS, that's why that system was said by NINTENDO that this DS won't replace the SP... u remember that... it was a new design for them to add into it, they did say that the DS was a test subject for their upcoming NEW CONSOLE SYSTEM, Wii..... and if u look at the sales of the DS it has skyrocketed beyond Nintendo's expectations, now if DS didn't sell, they wouldn't have lost as much money as if they didn't release DS and still created Wii and lost millions over it and would end up like Sega, u want Nintendo to end up like Sega, i don't....

Any way, they took the risk with DS and since the DS has done extremely well, destroying all competition that tried to take out Nintendo failed horribly, since DS is the top selling handheld and with its new design that was in it, they put it in the Wii, since DS was their "test subject"

Where was this? I didn't know the Wii had a touch screen.

Sega's delima was something totally diffrent. They lacked third party support which is on a diffrent end of the spectrum.

 

[The Bino]

Sega demise was because basically they didnt' have DVD support on there Dreamcast, the system had some fun games, but because it didn't have DVD support and then like a couple of months later PS2 had better everything and had DVD support and mainly in Japan, DVD players were almost as expensive as a Home Console System, so they bought PS2 cuz of the DVD players support on it as well as the better Specs on the System

Also WII ain't got a touch screen, but look at the Wiimote, if u deny that the Wii and DS ain't extremely similar then ur blind to the way of what Nintendo had in mind for what they had in plan for Revolutionising the way we play, the DS revolutionized the way we played Handheld games and it was something that noone expected and it worked extremely well, now take a look at the Wiimote, it has a sensor on top of the TV or System (im not 100% where the sensor goes) but its extremely similar to the touch screen on DS

 

[Dr.Marioboy]

But..does that mean leon could get in? i mean he was in resident evil 2 which was on the n64 and gamecube in resi4 so he has a chance too doesn't he?
Please don't flame me im new : )

 

[Thrillhouse-vh.]

But..does that mean leon could get in? i mean he was in resident evil 2 which was on the n64 and gamecube in resi4 so he has a chance too doesn't he?
Please don't flame me im new : )

There is a thread for Leon already and I do support him , but this thread is for Cloud. I hope you don't take this as a flame but more like advice

 

[Spaniard364]

I feel this thread is coming to close a soon. Its been at least a week since the last time someone (Dr.Marioboy) posted. And the subject has slipped from Cloud in SSBB to Nintendos plans with the Wii and other characters getting in. Not flaming. Just predicting.

 

[tirkaro]

nah, even if everyone ran outta things to say, if the event comes that cloud is put in brawl, or all of a sudden a new FF7 game comes out for the ds/wii, then we can use this topic, no matter how dead it gets.

 

[Crazy Ace 01]

Exactly, who cares? I certainly don't.

Even if it boosts wii sales, I really don't care. I don't want FF7 fans challenging me to brawl just for the chance to play as their favorite emo hero holding a butter knife.

That made me laugh when I read it... a butter knife...
But you do realize you are in a room of Cloud zealots?

Edit: Not that Cloud zealotry is a bad thing.

Still, guys, come on. He was in one Nintendo game. On a handheld. As an attack. And a card attack at that. What are the chances?

 

[tirkaro]

That made me laugh when I read it... a butter knife...
But you do realize you are in a room of Cloud zealots?

Edit: Not that Cloud zealotry is a bad thing.

Still, guys, come on. He was in one Nintendo game. On a handheld. As an attack. And a card attack at that. What are the chances?

wrong. he was on one game as a subplot, at the center of that subplot. and he was a boss. (a pretty hard boss if you ask me.) and he was an attack. (a very useful attack at that)
however I dont belive that it is the reason why cloud should be in brawl. smash is about game titans clashing. cloud is the titan of square. adding any other square character as a replacement would be......weird.

 

[Crazy Ace 01]

wrong. he was on one game as a subplot, at the center of that subplot. and he was a boss. (a pretty hard boss if you ask me.) and he was an attack. (a very useful attack at that)

I had no idea he was a boss, and in a sub plot. That ups his amazingly huge chances from 1/84456426464 to 1/43573527.

 

[tirkaro]

I had no idea he was a boss, and in a sub plot. That ups his amazingly huge chances from 1/84456426464 to 1/43573527.

once again, I stand by my point that I dont belive that COM is the reason why cloud should be in brawl. smash is about game titans clashing. cloud is the titan of square. adding any other square character as a replacement would be......weird. plus cloud would be a perfect apology to nintendo for the lack of square games for nintendo. >.> god, have people forgotten about the very good points people made in the past pages? *sigh* time for shamanposting:

Square and Nintendo are "buddys". Where did the first six FF games come out on? Nintendo. Who made the Mario RPG game? Square. So Cloud himself I guess doesn't have anything to do with Nintendo. But Nintendo/square has every right to be able to put him on there. They would just have to ask Square and share profit with them. It would actually be a smart move on Nintendos part. All the crazed fan-boys would by this game. They would also buy the Wii just to play this game. Thus, racking in much more money for Nintendo and some for Square.

also Cloud is ALMOST to Square as Mario is to Nintendo- The reason I say almost is beceause Square hasen't quite hored Cloud as much as Nintendo has Mario as of late.
plus Square oviously favors Cloud to other Final Fantasys. As much as many of them
dirserve to have there own movie, or multiple game series, they don't.
AND The majority of Final Fantasy fans oviously favor Cloud as well. Why do you think
Cloud is being hored as of late?
and, Final Fantasy 7 was a revolution in FF gameing. It brought 3D worlds and some amazing(For its time mind you) Graphics. I won't say 7 has the most in-deph story as that isent a fact, BUT I've never heard FF8 be called "One of the only RPGs that have made gamers cry". Oviously some in-depth story line must have been made to have this happen
Cloud being famous is not a mere opoion, it is a fact. Even the worse FF HATER out there know who he is. (And desipise his name for makeing the serises even more infamous for them)
For those of you who STILL don't know: Sakuri has decided that to be elegible for Brawl the character MUST have one apperence in an outside game. AN APPERENCE NOT A STARING!! Cloud has appeared in KH: COM for the Gameboy Advance. Which makes him elegbale. However Leon has olso made an apperence in the same game(But his part was much shorter.), and many other suggested characters were on the nes or snes. These are eligebal characters.

also, putting cloud in increases the chance for geno. and who WOULDN'T want that?
and clouds chances, belive it or not, is not 1%. it is actually 39%
He is one of the only Final Fantasy characters that has a chance. There arent many other characters FF fans have to root for. The only other ones are Leon and the FF1 serise game characters. Shure people can root for the FF2-wherever FF stopped makeing games for Nintendo, but its blaintly ovious that Square them-selves has forgotten about them.(besides 3).

also, take a look-see at this quote:

This lead to talk about collaborations, which of course, lead to talk of Solid Snake's appearance in the Wii version of Smash Brothers: "That was very surprising," said Nomura. "Cloud won't make an appearance?" asked Kojima. "We didn't get an offer," responded Nomura with a laugh.

taken from here
this hints (note I only said HINTS)that cloud really is the only choice for square

 

[Crazy Ace 01]

While I commend your great reasoning and huge amount of supporting evidence:
SUB plot

Edit: BTW, I'm not really against Cloud, per se; I just don't think he has a viable chance of getting in SSBB. It's not realistic; not because Square and Nintendo aren't buddies, not because Cloud is a huge, well-known character that could make a lot of money potentially for Brawl, but because of the above word.

I also don't want Cloud in because he tends to be over-zealoted. I mean, if someone says: "Cloud is good, he should be in." I say "He might get in. You never know." If someone says "Cloud is 73l-l RULEZ n00bs! CLOUDCLOUDCLOUD heissogreatifheisnotinowontbuythegame and SHUT UP if you dont like him n00bzor!!?!?!" then I get put on the defensive automatically.

Once again, though, good reasoning tirkaro. ^This does not apply to you, only some.

 

[Maverick69]

I think the only reason FF7 gets it's own movie and extra games is because of the fanbase for FF7, not because square prefers cloud.

And in all reality, I think 7 was the worst possible choice for a final fantasy movie. (other than spirits within. just terrible. and the first couple were too small) I honestly think that 4,5,6, and especially 8 would have made a better movie. hell i would have been more interested in a movie based on X than VII. but that's just me. Waiting in suspense for sephiroth to appear (you know you all did it. and no one was suprised when he did) doesnt make a good plot for me.

And as for putting a FF character in, I still support the early characters like cedric and FARIS. And if we're using COM as te gateway (which I still dont agree with) then i believe squall (his name is squall dammit) would be much better. I would love to smash with a gunblade.

And cloud =/= mario in popularity (for their own company i mean.) Mario is everywhere because he deserves to be. Everyone likes mario, we grew up with mario, he's the most recognizable face in the gaming world.

and setting ff aside for a minute, why is cloud the most deserving aquare character? you know what was a much better game? Chrono Trigger! (IMO no flaming) I certainly think crono is more deserving of a slot than cloud. Granted I have no idea what his attacks would be and he's not as recognized, i still think he's a better character.

and answer me this, what makes cloud so cool? what do all you fanboys see in him? Don't use the fact that he's popular as an explanation. What made him cool other than omnislash. He was just some guy with a big sword. his character didn't develop much. he never did anything really cool or said any really memorable lines. he was kind of emotionless..... So tell me, why is cloud so well liked?

I'd ask the same question for sephiroth since he's just some emotionless guy wit ha big sword too... but i cant that would make me a hypocrite... I like him for some reason. I have no idea why.

 

[McFox]

This lead to talk about collaborations, which of course, lead to talk of Solid Snake's appearance in the Wii version of Smash Brothers: "That was very surprising," said Nomura. "Cloud won't make an appearance?" asked Kojima. "We didn't get an offer," responded Nomura with a laugh.

Maybe I'm just missing something, but how does this hint that Cloud will be in?

"We didn't get an offer to put Cloud in the game."

I'd say that's supporting evidence that he WON'T be in the game. If they had gotten an offer for Cloud, he would've said "no comment" or "we can't comment on any speculation and rumors." It would've seemed a little suspicious, but if they said that in regards to every character, then it wouldn't. To me, it sounds like he was telling the truth.

Cloud (and Sephiroth, for that matter) are starting to get like Shadow (the Hedgehog) to me. They were cool the first time, but really stop using them. They're getting cliche. There's been the movie, Dirge of Cerberus (didn't play it, but I'm pretty sure Cloud's in that game), and all three Kingdom Hearts. And isn't there some kind of other FF7 thing coming out? Let it die already.

 

[The Franchise]

also Cloud is ALMOST to Square as Mario is to Nintendo- The reason I say almost is beceause Square hasen't quite hored Cloud as much as Nintendo has Mario as of late.

I don't think Mario and Cloud should be compared to one another. Cloud was the star of one Final Fantasy game. Mario on the other hand is an icon that helped bring the video gaming industry back after Ataria. Does he get hored as you put it? Maybe. But the only reason its done is because he's so popular.

Shure people can root for the FF2-wherever FF stopped makeing games for Nintendo, but its blaintly ovious that Square them-selves has forgotten about them.(besides 3).

Square has remade several of its older FF games with improvements for the GBA and DS in the last few years and is in the process of doing more. So I pretty sure that they haven't forgotten about them.

I have nothing against Cloud, really I don't. But personally I feel that there are just other square characters that would relate better to Nintendo fans such as Geno or, by a pure miracle someone from Chrono Trigger.