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Utah Thread - Dead thread is dead

Anonano

is the mano, ya know?
Joined
Jul 25, 2008
Messages
1,769
Location
Utah
Yeah, I've been giving you lots of reasons to disrespect my Link over the past several months. I've been using an experimental style based on aggressive punishing, and now that I've taken a few months' break and looked it over I should polish up on a more standard style.

And yeah, Marz has a pretty beast Link.
 

MeatIsMURDER

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 23, 2011
Messages
568
Location
Salt Lake City in body, midwest in soul
i literally won a 100 dollar tournament 5 minutes ago. split 5 ways is 20 bucks. that's herb money yall #countit
i'm reallygood at dota. played since 2005, been playing tournaments for about 2 years. when i first moved here i was on the best team i've ever been on. we were the 4th best NA team (it went liquid, dignitas, eg, then us "grats tho") and won in total about $350 for me individually, as well as 2 full sets of pc gear (i sold on ebay for another $100 and also kept a sick ass roccat keyboard/mouse/headset)

i'd estimate that i'm top 50 in the US
everybody here plays lol and brawl, simplified/tweaked versions of the games i fiend T_T
 

Z'zgashi

Smash Legend
Joined
May 20, 2009
Messages
17,322
Location
WeJo, Utah
NNID
ZzgashiZzShy
3DS FC
1521-3678-2980
I just hate that in DotA you can hit your own creeps, it just doesnt feel right and I hate how most of the time the better farmer wins lanes making certain archetypes of characters either have to go through complete and utter hell to do anything or need a hardcore babysit. Also, I find it weird how there arent any static lane barriers and effectively you can just cut through walls when in other MOBAs jumping walls, cutting corners, etc is a big part of juking (not that you cant still juke, just a preference); those are the main reasons I prefer LoL. Also I like LoL's art style better and when I played DotA I felt like I was playing just your average dude with a hook or something while in LoL I feel I can connect easier with the characters. I know you still can in DotA and that if you look deeper into the backstories and such of each character they are more personalized, but from in my experience you have to delve deeper into the lore to get the kind of connection LoL has. And I admit, I do like the simplicity of LoL and thats a big reason why I prefer it (not thats its even that simple game, just MOBAs in general are usually really in depth and LoL is on the more simple side), but I dont have anything against DotA and think its a good game, I just prefer LoL and enjoy playing it more.

Also, LoL has Gay Pride skins, YOU CANT BEAT THAT:

 

MeatIsMURDER

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 23, 2011
Messages
568
Location
Salt Lake City in body, midwest in soul
denying is probably the biggest reason dota is a superior game to me
i mean seriously, you prefer in lol where you watch each other free farm?
in dota, every single creep is contested in some lanes (such as mid) and if you are better than somebody you will build an advantage. also your point of "hell for some to farm" is actually totally wrong because in organized games you will always have your safe lane to farm (unless they contest you with an aggressive tri lane, in which case the game's depth grows exponentially as you now can manipulate creep aggro, neutral creep pulling, and body blocking neutral spawns to influence the way the lane plays out)
whereas in lol i can be the best player on the planet laning against a total scrub who knows how to last hit and we will leave laning phase on near equal terms. even if i kill that guy 3 times in 10 minutes he's still going to leave his lane farmed because you don't even lose gold from dying which again blows my mind
that's actually ******** if you ask me. reminds me of "no rush 20 minute" broodwar games


there are so many mechanisms in lol that work to minimize skill differences and that's never something in a competitive game that appeals to me
don't really understand your point about dota juking, there's only one hero that actually go off the map.

also i play melee which i believe is the most difficult fighter still played (correct me if im wrong) and i've played dota for 8 years
i got a thing for difficult gamesi guess
 

MeatIsMURDER

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 23, 2011
Messages
568
Location
Salt Lake City in body, midwest in soul
laning phase in lol feels like this to me
*game starts*
XxBliTzeDKraNk420xX1337: hey top dont hit me lets trade farm
360broscope:ok dog lets take turns getting farmed, truce!!
360broscope has pawned XxBliTzeDKraNk420xX1337!
XxBliTzeDKraNk420xX1337 respawns and buys a bunch of items, casually ports back to lane, continues his item progression casually

lol is like going bowling with bumpers enabled


*MELEE*
me and ebo are gunna try to play around FIVE at my place [if nobody else hosts] but neither of us have setups T_T
anybody playing some melee today on the lord's fine day
 

Tuesday

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
645
Location
ATX
I'd be down to play today, but my place isn't very comfortable. I've got a tv in my closet and you'd be sitting on the floor lol. How I roll. Rockmix knows how I do.
 

Fortress | Sveet

▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
Joined
Dec 21, 2005
Messages
16,256
Location
Northern IL
"there are so many mechanisms in lol that work to minimize skill differences and that's never something in a competitive game that appeals to me"
 

Superw0rri0

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 16, 2013
Messages
849
Location
SoCal
denying is probably the biggest reason dota is a superior game to me
i mean seriously, you prefer in lol where you watch each other free farm?
in dota, every single creep is contested in some lanes (such as mid) and if you are better than somebody you will build an advantage. also your point of "hell for some to farm" is actually totally wrong because in organized games you will always have your safe lane to farm (unless they contest you with an aggressive tri lane, in which case the game's depth grows exponentially as you now can manipulate creep aggro, neutral creep pulling, and body blocking neutral spawns to influence the way the lane plays out)
whereas in lol i can be the best player on the planet laning against a total scrub who knows how to last hit and we will leave laning phase on near equal terms. even if i kill that guy 3 times in 10 minutes he's still going to leave his lane farmed because you don't even lose gold from dying which again blows my mind
that's actually ******** if you ask me. reminds me of "no rush 20 minute" broodwar games


there are so many mechanisms in lol that work to minimize skill differences and that's never something in a competitive game that appeals to me
don't really understand your point about dota juking, there's only one hero that actually go off the map.

also i play melee which i believe is the most difficult fighter still played (correct me if im wrong) and i've played dota for 8 years
i got a thing for difficult gamesi guess

:eek: Someone that understands!!! Someone that understands dota!!! I've been surrounded by Lol players, smite players, and crappy to alright dota players for so long! Finally someone that understands! We must play together sometime...
 

Sephiroths Masamune

Shocodoro Blagshidect
Joined
Nov 21, 2008
Messages
7,683
Location
In Sephiroth's hands.
denying is probably the biggest reason dota is a superior game to me
i mean seriously, you prefer in lol where you watch each other free farm?
in dota, every single creep is contested in some lanes (such as mid) and if you are better than somebody you will build an advantage. also your point of "hell for some to farm" is actually totally wrong because in organized games you will always have your safe lane to farm (unless they contest you with an aggressive tri lane, in which case the game's depth grows exponentially as you now can manipulate creep aggro, neutral creep pulling, and body blocking neutral spawns to influence the way the lane plays out)
whereas in lol i can be the best player on the planet laning against a total scrub who knows how to last hit and we will leave laning phase on near equal terms. even if i kill that guy 3 times in 10 minutes he's still going to leave his lane farmed because you don't even lose gold from dying which again blows my mind
that's actually ******** if you ask me. reminds me of "no rush 20 minute" broodwar games


there are so many mechanisms in lol that work to minimize skill differences and that's never something in a competitive game that appeals to me
don't really understand your point about dota juking, there's only one hero that actually go off the map.

also i play melee which i believe is the most difficult fighter still played (correct me if im wrong) and i've played dota for 8 years
i got a thing for difficult gamesi guess
To me it's not much of what version is better competitively, and like. But what game I've invested the most time in. When I entered the scene Brawl just came out, I played Melee casually before, and tried to get into it later but it's harder to get into when not many people play it and with the skill gap hard to close. It's even harder to get into especially.

Kinda the same way for me with DotA. I played DotA on WC3:FT for about 2-3 years before I had started to play LoL. At that time it was getting harder to find the games I wanted and there were fewer people playing and getting on an older client was getting well, old. I picked up HoN didn't like it much but it was an upgrade. I also picked up LoL and it was hard to get into at first. I had the same thought process of wtf, no denying? No gold taken away from death? The way skills worked was different too. The worst part for me was that if you wanted to play you basically had to pay for the champs. But I played because of Zz was playing it and I wanted to play with someone I knew and so I did that. I started to get better after awhile and I started to like it more. It wasn't until after I'd invested enough time and money into LoL before DotA2 came out. I actually tried to get back into it a little bit ago, but I can't. It's too hard visually wise for me. And the shops are structured differently so it'll take awhile before I start getting the hang of it.

There's things about LoL that aren't in DotA that I feel like are fun aspects. It's more focused on being a lane bully rather than farming. If you can out trade someone in lane and force them out, then they lose out on CS and Gold and you get your advantage that way. If you get a kill, you try and snowball from that. And the way the game works, it's more focused on objectives like towers and large jungle camps because of the gold from CS being relatively equal in close games and building an already large advantage when wining.
 

Z'zgashi

Smash Legend
Joined
May 20, 2009
Messages
17,322
Location
WeJo, Utah
NNID
ZzgashiZzShy
3DS FC
1521-3678-2980
"there are so many mechanisms in lol that work to minimize skill differences and that's never something in a competitive game that appeals to me"
Lmao, this is so laughably wrong. Nothing in LoL 'minimizes skill', it is just a VASTLY different moba than DotA, the main goals of the game (while technically are still the same) are gone about in completely different ways, and the ways best to gain an advantage are done COMPLETELY differently. There is nothing in LoL that minimizes skill in any way and it's just as hard to be a top player is LoL as it is in DotA. The difference is LoL has a MUCH easier initial skill wall making it MUCH easier to get into, however at top level, you need to be just as proficient at the game as you would in DotA, just in much different ways.
 

Fortress | Sveet

▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
Joined
Dec 21, 2005
Messages
16,256
Location
Northern IL
Lmao, this is so laughably wrong. Nothing in LoL 'minimizes skill', it is just a VASTLY different moba than DotA, the main goals of the game (while technically are still the same) are gone about in completely different ways, and the ways best to gain an advantage are done COMPLETELY differently. There is nothing in LoL that minimizes skill in any way and it's just as hard to be a top player is LoL as it is in DotA. The difference is LoL has a MUCH easier initial skill wall making it MUCH easier to get into, however at top level, you need to be just as proficient at the game as you would in DotA, just in much different ways.

LoL is a reaction of DotA. LoL wouldn't even exist if there wasn't a dota 5.84b, much less 6.1x. The creators of LoL thought DotA was too hard and made it easier. Skill differences were lost. You can't contest your opponent's creeps, which was a measure of skill, so skill has been minimized by definition. I'm not going to go through every change, but it is obvious that by definition LoL does minimize skill, relatively.
 

Ken Neth

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 22, 2007
Messages
2,545
Location
BYU- Provo, Utah
Smashboards looks like it's back up for good now. Wonder how many people aren't going to check back here anymore because of how long it was down.
 

Tane

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 1, 2011
Messages
437
Location
SLC, UT
3DS FC
2122-6733-6416
If you're into Breaking Bad, come to my place next Sunday around 2 to have a smash fest, watch the new episode, the moar smash. Mexis and ebo are coming, Marz will too if he isn't a pus sy.
 

Z'zgashi

Smash Legend
Joined
May 20, 2009
Messages
17,322
Location
WeJo, Utah
NNID
ZzgashiZzShy
3DS FC
1521-3678-2980
LoL is a reaction of DotA. LoL wouldn't even exist if there wasn't a dota 5.84b, much less 6.1x.
...K? Everyone knows this... lol.
The creators of LoL thought DotA was too hard and made it easier. Skill differences were lost.
Wrong. The creators of LoL wanted to make a different game with different goals and objectives, just because two games are of the same genre doesnt mean they need to be mirror images of each other.
You can't contest your opponent's creeps, which was a measure of skill, so skill has been minimized by definition.
You contest creeps in this game by denying them via zoning, pressure, and lane control. Just because I personally cant kill my own creep doesnt mean I cant deny it. Like I said before, AND I QUOTE: 'the main goals of the game (while technically are still the same) are gone about in completely different ways'.
I'm not going to go through every change, but it is obvious that by definition LoL does minimize skill, relatively.
LoL didnt minimize skill, it just lowered the accessibility gap and made it an easier game to play and understand. A very good example to compare this to is the differences between Melee and Brawl. Melee (DotA) is much more technical and requires a lot of very direct counter play and focuses more on constant pressure and aggression , where as Brawl (LoL) focuses more on spacing, control, zoning, etc. Both are very high skill gap games, just they focus on completely different aspects of gameplay. Just because DotA has a few more technical things (which it does and anyone who says it doesnt is dumb) doesnt mean its any more skill based. If anything, the lack of need for as much technical skill in LoL forces a need for even MORE skill in other areas, it doesnt make it a less skilled game, just a less technical game.
Zz, is October 5th the set date for sure for that tourney?
Yes.
 

MeatIsMURDER

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 23, 2011
Messages
568
Location
Salt Lake City in body, midwest in soul
You contest creeps in this game by denying them via zoning, pressure, and lane control. Just because I personally cant kill my own creep doesnt mean I cant deny it. Like I said before, AND I QUOTE: 'the main goals of the game (while technically are still the same) are gone about in completely different ways'.

LoL didnt minimize skill, it just lowered the accessibility gap and made it an easier game to play and understand. A very good example to compare this to is the differences between Melee and Brawl. Melee (DotA) is much more technical and requires a lot of very direct counter play and focuses more on constant pressure and aggression , where as Brawl (LoL) focuses more on spacing, control, zoning, etc. Both are very high skill gap games, just they focus on completely different aspects of gameplay. Just because DotA has a few more technical things (which it does and anyone who says it doesnt is dumb) doesnt mean its any more skill based. If anything, the lack of need for as much technical skill in LoL forces a need for even MORE skill in other areas, it doesnt make it a less skilled game, just a less technical game.

Yes.
first off, "contest creeps by denying them via .." you do all of that in dota. plus denying creeps. and pulling your creep waves to jungle camps. and manipulating creep equilibrium by tanking creeps while the next wave comes. and single pulling certain creep waves, such as 3:30 and 7 for get 2 creep waves + a catapult to push a tower. that's already a gigantic portion of knowledge, timing, and execution gone.

also, tech skill IS skill. for every piece of techskill you remove from the game, you remove another aspect of practice that is no longer necessary. you remove a piece of the game that distinguishes those who practice from those who don't.

just want to tell you there was a player named "tidesoftime" that was pro at dota2. he hit platinum (i think thats what it is, whatever the highest skill rank for lol is) in < 3 months of playing
show me any lol player who successfully switched from lol to dota and became a top player
spoiler-there are 0

i don't know what to tell you. you're playing a game that is watered down, substantially easier, and intentionally simplified to create mass appeal. you're trying to argue that it's just as deep as dota, from what I see. you cannot win that argument because you're wrong. the game by design is significantly noobier.
doesn't mean lol isn't "competitive" and that your game is somehow a ****ty game.
i mean christ your punishment for death is the loss of opportunity cost of farming more creeps. if that doesn't encourage sucking ass and still succeeding i don't know what is

If you're into Breaking Bad, come to my place next Sunday around 2 to have a smash fest, watch the new episode, the moar smash. Mexis and ebo are coming, Marz will too if he isn't a pus sy.
im down, can we get a melee setup or umvc3 or sf4? not trying to brawl
w0ri0 i gave you my steam like 3 months ago. http://www.steamcommunity.com/id/herbivorestyle
add me, but be warned i play in the lower-middle end of top level and playing with me can be stressful because of that
we'll be paired against the best players and our team will flame you if you aren't up to par
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I want to play melee REALLY ****ING BAD. I'm fiending hard as ****. somebody please come get waveshined i need this
 
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