Unbelievable! Also: How Should Samus Transform Into Zamus?

[freeman123]

I think "under certain conditions" might mean that she changes when you do her Super move. It would suck if Samus lost her bombs. Still, that'd also be kind of dumb if the only way to use her is by doing Samus' Super move. Maybe you can start off as Zamus by holding A, but the only way to change back & forth between the two is by using the Super. Or they could just change Samus' down B, but I hope not.

Also, it looks like McFox, or whoever said it, was right about the weapon being a whip & not a light saber.

 

[McFox]

I agree. Judging from the trailer at least, it seems that doing the Super move blasts of Samus' armor and turns you into Zamus. Of course, that leaves plenty of questions unanswered, things like "Can you use Zamus if items are turned off?" Still it's pretty cool.

Also, from the way they describe the "Wario Waft," it doesn't sound like a Super move, at least not one that would be activated by an item. Between this and Zamus' descriptions, maybe we're not right about super moves only being activated by an item, despite what the trailer shows.

 

[the_claw712]

yeah ever since i saw the trailer i knew what nintendo was up to. they told everybody how the two (samus and zamus) would be played right in the trailer!

obviously, it's samus' charge beam, wether that be the super move or what, maybe samus can charger her beam bigger naturally, no super move involved.

a lot of questions to be answered, so we wait.

 

[kmkzSP1K3R]

yeah i was thinking that to McFox. "The more time passes, the more Wario's gas builds up..." that statement leads me to believe that erhaps is a chargable move, or it's charged automatically, or that after acquiring the emblem item, a countdown/charge up initiates.

I am quite disappointed and concerned witht he zsSamus biography, leaving so many unanswered questions and complicating our assumptions even MORE...

All those things that was in zsSamus' biography...i think sakurai said all those thing to PURPOSELY confuse us...

"under certain condition" referring to Brawl? or to past Metroid games.

"isnt a pure chararcter addition" in respect to mvesets? or in respect to identiy meaning both are samus.

" And don't worry—you'll still be able to play as standard Samus, too." meaning they are separate characters so we can play as samus? or meaning they are both playable in one character by transformation.



UGH!!! THE ABIGUITY!!!! WHY MUST YOU TORTURE US SAKURAI!!!

 

[Bowserlick]

I think all this "she is not a pure character" addition means is that she is not one of the main characters. Maybe she is unlocked if you use Samus's supermove 50 times cumaltively in VS mode.

 

[Silpheed]

I think all this "she is not a pure character" addition means is that she is not one of the main characters. Maybe she is unlocked if you use Samus's supermove 50 times cumaltively in VS mode.

You're reading it wrong. It means its not a NEW entry into the Super Smash Bros. games. Not a totaly new character, but a new "thing' for an already existing character.

 

[commonyoshi]

I dont see why they just didn't make her into a new character altogether. Now we have to spend months agonizing over this. I dont think the charge beam has anything to do with it. It was just there for show. Like Wario's bike.

 

[Silpheed]

I'm sure the beam does have something to do with it. She may have sereral moves, or items, or both that trigger her loss of the armor.

 

[Caleb Wolfbrand]

I was hoping "under certain conditions" meant she needs to be unlocked...

 

[dan smith]

I'm glad Zamus isn't a seperate character, it would show that the development team wasn't actually being considerate in their character selections. There are so many people who want different characters in the game, they will be somewhat upset if their character didn't make the cut, so, including two Samus' would simply be an insult to the people who's characters didn't make it. It would also make the developers seem ignorant and unoriginal by overlooking so many unique characters and simply putting in another Samus without a suit. (They still might prove this second half by forgoing the inclusion of many popular and interesting characters, characters that are obvious choices: Ridley?)

As to how Samus-Zamus transformation takes place...that is a very interesting debate. A super move activation does seem convenient. Item triggering seems somewhat lame, as any real smasher knows items are rarely legal in serious tournament. Our knowledge is super limited in this subject, so I think the best plan for now is to make wide predictions, trying to think of factors we haven't considered yet. I personally think it would be innovative to have the transformation triggerd by Samus' percentage. Dosen't that make sense? Samus gets above 150% and her armour crumbles? This device is already used to alter characters ledge recoveries. I think it makes a lot of sense...conceptually.

Oh, and Wario, he expands and then passes gas? Seems pretty straight forward.

 

[McFox]

The problem with percentage though, is that Samus has a great recovery. And when do you need to recover most? When your percentage is high.

I seriously hope they don't go with that option.

 

[Energismus]

Well at first everyone assumed that Wario's giant fart was a supermove that required the powerup item, but from the new bio, it doesn't sound like that's the case. Maybe each of the characters has a way to eventually perform his/her supermove without needing the item.

Samus gets above 150% and her armour crumbles? This device is already used to alter characters ledge recoveries. I think it makes a lot of sense...conceptually.

That would make sense, but it would suck for the Samus player. From the sounds of it the Zero Suit version of Samus is going to be a fairly light character, whereas Samus is one of the heaviest characters in SSBM. So if Samus lost her suit after ~150%, she'd suddenly get knocked a lot further and lose her bomb jump/grappling beam recovery aids. 'Course maybe Zamus has a better recovery than Samus. =)

[EDIT: Like McFox said. ]

 

[kmkzSP1K3R]

I'm glad Zamus isn't a seperate character, it would show that the development team wasn't actually being considerate in their character selections. There are so many people who want different characters in the game, they will be somewhat upset if their character didn't make the cut, so, including two Samus' would simply be an insult to the people who's characters didn't make it. It would also make the developers seem ignorant and unoriginal by overlooking so many unique characters and simply putting in another Samus without a suit. (They still might prove this second half by forgoing the inclusion of many popular and interesting characters, characters that are obvious choices: Ridley?)

As to how Samus-Zamus transformation takes place...that is a very interesting debate. A super move activation does seem convenient. Item triggering seems somewhat lame, as any real smasher knows items are rarely legal in serious tournament. Our knowledge is super limited in this subject, so I think the best plan for now is to make wide predictions, trying to think of factors we haven't considered yet. I personally think it would be innovative to have the transformation triggerd by Samus' percentage. Dosen't that make sense? Samus gets above 150% and her armour crumbles? This device is already used to alter characters ledge recoveries. I think it makes a lot of sense...conceptually.

i think having samus change according to her damage is quite strange...so...everytime she reaches 150 she will chnage...so like in a 5 stock math she'll change 5 times? so that'll most likely mean she'll always die as zero-suit, unless she prematurely falls or gets pinged. and after she dies, does she remain Zero Suit or does she change back to Suited...dont you think it's a bit strange to die as an alter ego and then reappear as the original form...when you die as shiek you dont turn back to Zelda...

'Course maybe Zamus has a better recovery than Samus. =)

better recovery? maybe something along the lines of using the wihp like a propeller to raise herself, air dodge forward, press Z and the a grappling beam function comes out of her whip? i'd liek that...i'd liek that alot!

i'm starting to believe that she will be her own character because like everyone knows, items are banned from most tournaments, so it would be stupid to lose one character, and nintendo KNOWS tournaments are item-less. so they wouldnt wanna do something like that.

i think having the option to mail in our requests was kind of a mistake...because of this everyone is like "OH I WANT SO AND SO AND SO AND SO etc." and we're NEVER going to get all the characters we want. by doing this nintendo has made our hopes too high and they will be inevitably crushed when the game is released because ALOT of our requests will not be met.

i believe we are also forgetting that WE are not the ones making the game, the developers are, so they're gunna put the characters that THEY want in the game while prolly only adding about 5 of the most widely requested characters, and in total everyone has like a billion. and even though WE are the ones who will BUY the game, just because the characters we dont want dont make the cut doesnt mean we're not going buy the game. we ARE going to buy the game. c'mon, when you all saw the trailer you were "WOOOO OH YEAH IM GETTIN THAT WHEN IT COMES OUT!!!" if we are faithful fans, which most of us are, we'll buy the game.

 

[dan smith]

The problem with percentage though, is that Samus has a great recovery. And when do you need to recover most? When your percentage is high.

I seriously hope they don't go with that option.

Wow, I hadn't even really considered that. If Zamus has a less desirable recovery than Samus then having transformation percentage based would do a good job at spoiling Samus amazing longevity. No more endless bomb jumping. It would be a great balancing factor.

EDIT: The idea that Zamus will also be lighter is also an interesting handicap. Samus near death becomes a light fast character who can pull of lightning fast, Sheik like moves, but can't take a hit.

Keep in mind that 150% is a purely random number, maybe it would be higher? That would mean that Samus living long enough to turn into Zamus could be fairly rare.

Speculation is awesome.

SECOND EDIT: Haha...during my first edit Sensei posted a reply with amazing similarity. (kind of frighteningly similar...)

So...if we both came up with the same idea, maybe so did the developers?

 

[Silpheed]

I'm glad Zamus isn't a seperate character, it would show that the development team wasn't actually being considerate in their character selections. There are so many people who want different characters in the game, they will be somewhat upset if their character didn't make the cut, so, including two Samus' would simply be an insult to the people who's characters didn't make it. It would also make the developers seem ignorant and unoriginal by overlooking so many unique characters and simply putting in another Samus without a suit. (They still might prove this second half by forgoing the inclusion of many popular and interesting characters, characters that are obvious choices: Ridley?)

Well spoken.

 

[Sensei]

Maybe since she will be a high percetage and be in danger of dying, they will give her a lot more speed like they said and it will make up for her recovery. For example, she can rank up a lot of damage by comboing her oppenents and dodge attacks with her speed and agility (similar to sheik, but perhaps better?). That whip seems to interesting and perhaps it will have longer range than sheik's chain and have much less lag time and more power. I think Zamus might be an upcoming top tier character.

 

[Hyper Luigi]

Yes perhaps they are doing this to make Samus actually less "cheap" good news for me because my friend is deadly with Samus and now they've thrown a few monkey wrenches into the works.

I'm also glad to hear Z Samus isn't going to be taking a slot on her own. That seemed quite unneccessary.

 

[Energismus]

i think having the option to mail in our requests was kind of a mistake...because of this everyone is like "OH I WANT SO AND SO AND SO AND SO etc." and we're NEVER going to get all the characters we want. by doing this nintendo has made our hopes too high and they will be inevitably crushed when the game is released because ALOT of our requests will not be met.

i believe we are also forgetting that WE are not the ones making the game, the developers are, so they're gunna put the characters that THEY want in the game while prolly only adding about 5 of the most widely requested characters, and in total everyone has like a billion. and even though WE are the ones who will BUY the game, just because the characters we dont want dont make the cut doesnt mean we're not going buy the game. we ARE going to buy the game. c'mon, when you all saw the trailer you were "WOOOO OH YEAH IM GETTIN THAT WHEN IT COMES OUT!!!" if we are faithful fans, which most of us are, we'll buy the game.

I think they're going to be smart about it. They'll probably try to add an even representation of characters from the various franchises, while at the same time considering what the community wants most. Personally, I'm pretty satisfied that they are openly listening to player input like they are. At least this way the most highly demanded character(s) is sure to get in (so long as they can get the rights, of course).

 

[Energismus]

However they choose to do it, let's just cross our fingers in hopes that Samus and Zamus are balanced in effectiveness. It would be really lame if Samus players were just constantly trying to turn into Zamus because Zamus was several times better (ala Zelda/Sheik), or if Zamus sucked big time and when you lost your suit you'd be like, "Oh good, I'm dead."

 

[kmkzSP1K3R]

Having zero suit samus on her own is not going to take up that much disk space. since zero samus will MOST LIKELY already has her own moveset, it's technically already another character addition. if she DID get her own spot the only thing getting added to the game are a few pictures of her, 4 trophies(if they continue to dot that), and an extra character selection icon. all that would NOT make much of a difference in diskspace compared to if she was a zerosamus/transform/samus kinda deal.

 

[Silpheed]

Having zero suit samus on her own is not going to take up that much disk space. since zero samus will MOST LIKELY already has her own moveset, it's technically already another character addition. if she DID get her own spot the only thing getting added to the game are a few pictures of her, 4 trophies(if they continue to dot that), and an extra character selection icon. all that would NOT make much of a difference in diskspace compared to if she was a zerosamus/transform/samus kinda deal.

Its gonna be one character.

 

[Kokichi]

I wonder if once you take off your armor you can put it back on...I certainly hope so. Honestly, my guess is that it'll be as simple as the Zelda-Sheik transformation - I can't see them making it more complicated than that and still having it fun.

As for Wario's Waft, I'd imagine that it's not like Samus / DK's B charge, but more like Bowser's B recovery, where you have to wait a bit for his fire to reach maximum potential. Something like that seems more likely (plus that way we don't have to hold down B and watch Wario stick out his butt and charge it up).

Though, is anyone else concerned with Wario? I much rather prefer the standard Yellow/Purple costume that'd throw bombs and such, as opposed to biker Wario with a crazy grin and a fart attack, creating a character reminiscent of Boogerman.

 

[Kujirudo]

I didn't like Wario at all to be in this game. I didn't like Luigi either to be in this but I think I just have to live with it now. I don't care what kind of costume they give him, as long as he won't spoil my game...

 

[Energismus]

I wonder if once you take off your armor you can put it back on...I certainly hope so. Honestly, my guess is that it'll be as simple as the Zelda-Sheik transformation - I can't see them making it more complicated than that and still having it fun.

Maybe they'll just make it so that you can voluntarily break out of Samus's suit once per life (and you don't get the suit back until you die and respawn).
EDIT:

Why would someone break the armor being stronger, having proyectiles and the best recover in the game? The "under certain conditions" seems pretty random to me, as a punishment or a hazard.

Yeah, good point.

 

[GenG]

Maybe they'll just make it so that you can voluntarily break out of Samus's suit once per life (and you don't get the suit back until you die and respawn).

Why would someone break the armor being stronger, having proyectiles and the best recover in the game? The "under certain conditions" seems pretty random to me, as a punishment or a hazard.

If you have played Zero Mission, the ZZSamus was CRAP, you had to pass a level filled with Pirates and cameras ala Metal Gear with a stunning (not killing) gun and your bare feet.

 

[Silpheed]

I think you said it best. Falling on the lava several times. Boom, you've lost your armor.

We can safely say, that after perfoming a "super" with the possible help from an item ball (like the one Mario grabbed), will trigger an armor loss aswell. Could this mean Samus' super may be overpowered? I am JUMPING with joy.

 

[GenG]

Think about something: Samus losses her armor when she "dies" in the games (when the armor suffers from damage overload), but now she can still alive since this is a funny game and there is no oxygen deprivation.

So you'd better take care when playing Samus.

 

[Pit and Missingno ROCK!!]

Lol...my friends used to purposley die so they could see a woman in a bikini have oxygen deprivation...

Anyway, I think that the beam-thing is a WAY to do the transformation but not THE ONLY WAY to do it, you know? I'm kind of leaning towards the idea of zelda/sheik or just being a character slot. I mean, think about it: losing armor through damage or falling in lava is really stupid, and Nintendo knows it. No offense, people.

 

[The rAt]

A few things.

About Samus, I'd just like to say I called it. Granted, so did half of these forums, but I'll take my credit where it comes. Second, I hope we see a little of Wario World and Wario Land Wario in the Wario included in SSBM. Try saying that seven times fast. Then try saying it forty seven times at a moderate pace. Only then will comprehend the true power of my words.

Thirdly, I just pulled an all nighter writing an Eschatology paper and finishing up some journal entries for a creative writing course, so no I don't care if my post was anywhere near coherent. Later.

Andy

 

[Pit and Missingno ROCK!!]

Nice one. I hope there are some Wario stages, too. Hope you get a good grade.

Ai yai yai G2G 4 school.... LOL! Today's schedule isn't that bad, and friday's tomorrow anyways so YAH.

 

[Rosseh!]

I'm kinda disappointed that zamus isn't a selectable character. I wonder what the circumstances will be, probably the super move we saw in the trailer. Oh well, I'm sure there will be some cheat or action replay code to play as zamus straight away instead of having to meet the requirements. Of course that's only for fun matches or single player, you wouldn't be able to do that online.

 

[Excel_Zero]

I'm kinda disappointed that zamus isn't a selectable character. I wonder what the circumstances will be, probably the super move we saw in the trailer. Oh well, I'm sure there will be some cheat or action replay code to play as zamus straight away instead of having to meet the requirements. Of course that's only for fun matches or single player, you wouldn't be able to do that online.

We don't know about that yet.

A nice way to change to Z Samus is holding Z.

 

[GenG]

Maybe you change into ZSamus with a secret taunt? You know, like contacting with the Starfox Team in the Starfox Stages or unlocking the super grapple beam.

 

[Voodoo Daddy]

Super Moves will most likely be banned from tournaments, meaning if that IS how you transform into Zamus then she will essentially be unplayable. GEE WHIZ THAT'S GREAT NEWS!

 

[Sanguimancer]

Super moves can't be banned if they are actual built in moves. They'll be banned if they are items or toggleable (maybe), but if they are just and actual move, there is no reason or way to ban them.

 

[SSJ4Kazuki]

I don't think the super grapple beam is in the PAL version

 

[Fox_Rocks]

i think the "under certain conditions" (referring to Zamus) means she will have to be unlocked or something.

also, I want to see Wario with his purple/yellow shirt, and moves from Wario Land. Some moves from Wario World would also be nice. I don't like the idea of a biker/farting/WarioWare Wario too much.

 

[the Marronator]

Hmm, according to wario's page, his fart builds up over a period of time. Hopefully his fart isn't his super-move, or else that would imply that super-moves would build up over time. So hopefully his fart will be a seperate attack that the super-moves.

 

[Baron_54]

You don't know if she's just one character, the words in the update were vague DAMMIT stop talking as if you knew exactly what they meant!

 

[THK]

Starting to think super moves aren't item based....hmm.