Toronto and Surrounding GTA Pokérankings

[unknown522]

yea, I find that pretty odd too still. If ustick to one sort of play style, then ppl are gonna find ways to counter it. ex: spamming up-tilt, f-smash and f-air with marth. There's obviously ways around that. U just gotta figure out how. It may take time, maybe not

 

[Europhoria]

I'm just saying that the vast majority of times Sheik is going to beat Marth unless the player is M2K, Ken or Azen, at which point no player or character really has much of a chance anyways.

I realize those guys make it close with Marth but that takes months of training in contrast to like the few days with Sheik. It takes alot of fun out of the game for me.

 

[RaynEX]

God. Give it up...he's not into it.

It's just one less Marth to worry about.

 

[D.B]

^ cruel, yes but he's right.

 

[TyrantWolf]

I realize those guys make it close with Marth but that takes months of training in contrast to like the few days with Sheik. It takes alot of fun out of the game for me.

kay, I'm not going to lie. Since I was a Sheik player before and managing with the other matchups outside of the Marth one, Sheik is a pretty difficult character to get good with after a certain peek. Kinda pisses me off that you think she's that easy to play.


But you know if you really want to get good at this game, and want to beat sheik. Learn Sheik for yourself since that shouldn't take too long, and then learn the ditto since theres probably the most gay in that ditto. You sure did well learning the Marth ditto, go for the Sheik ditto. I don't mean to sound sour at all.

 

[alphameric]

sheik = lame
[/argument]

just go low tier.
it takes 13285729836728936284091258293789x more tech ability and skill to be a good lt player than it does to be a good ht player

AND lt brings the variety and fun back

 

[Deleted member]

Haha. Low tier is fun. Mike, don't quit because some gay ***** got ya down.

Btw adrian, what's the status on those vids?

 

[coolhat]

wow, quitting over one character match up that's accually hard for marth? No sympathy. Just take up a spacie if ur gonna quit the game over it.

or yea as adrian said, just take up low tier, doesnt matter how many times u lose its still fun.

but i guess if u just dont like the game then........there's no point in playing it

 

[Chaotic Yoshi]

First,
This just sounds like a case of "The pot calling the kettle black" >_> You can't call a broken character broken when you yourself are playing a broken character. I'm at work reading this and i seriously laughed and got alot of looks in my direction. Like coolhat said, you find a slight weakness if your broken character and you quit the game, childlike.

Second,
You give up way too easy and for unreputable reasons... Shiek vs Falcon is far more in shieks favor than in Shiek vs Marth. And even if you argue the gap is not that big, point still remains. Past the characters abilities, YOU need to read your opponent and play accordingly. Tier lists disadvantages for the top 5 characters are minor enough that it's not even worth *****ing about.

Third,
Ask for help on the matchup if you can't read the opponent yourself, there's an entire marth forum that i bet you will agree that the matchup is only slightly in shieks favor.

 

[Europhoria]

Sigh...
A) Sheik vs Falcon is even.
B) I read Sheiks surprisingly well. However, her needles, and awkward priority (her d-smash clanks with, or beats everything Marth has for instance) means that even though I know exactly what she's going to do, I can't do anything about it.
C) I hate the match up because all the Sheik needs to do is needle camp me. I'm used to FPS games where camping and doing the same thing over and over gets you *****. This match up is the exact opposite. That takes the fun out of the game for me.

 

[D.B]

If you can read sheiks that the match up should be easy fake her out when she does down smash or something grab that ***** and own her, and falcon vs sheik is not even.

 

[Gichan]

The only problem I have with Sheik is that whip thing, it can honestly go on forever. Sometimes jumping over it is just not enough.

 

[Europhoria]

^ Cute. Try playing Marth vs Sheik and nothing else but that one match up. Tell me how fun the game is after a few days. You'll be able to read Sheik's perfectly, but you'll quickly realize her needles, etc. prevent you from doing anything about it.

Also, to Coolhat... Well your main doesn't have any good match ups anyways. If you like doing nothing but losing then that's lovely for you. It's not fun for me to play a game where if someone plays a halfway decent Sheik, I'm probably going to lose just because of how broken the match up is.

 

[Chaotic Yoshi]

Time your sword to wait for the d-smash to finish if it clanks...

Pick a stage where she can't needle camp...

Smack off the needles and make her come to you...

 

[Europhoria]

^ Lol. Marth can't swat the needles like he can most projectiles. And she can camp Marth anywhere. Her d-smash actually protects her very well. Usually all I can hope for is to run away and get back for a grab. F-air out of shield is too slow even.

 

[Deleted member]

You keep saying that you can read Sheiks perfectly... yet you still get needle camped, of all gay strats that Sheiks use. I'm not going to say, "just don't get grabbed", or something lame like that, but honestly, if you're so good at reading them, you shouldn't be getting ***** by someone who picked up Sheik 5 minutes prior. You take this game so literally it scares me. Things happen, 6-4 matchups aren't terrible.

 

[Europhoria]

5 minutes? No. A day to a week? Well that's about all that's needed.

 

[SonicZeroX]

^ Lol. Marth can't swat the needles like he can most projectiles. And she can camp Marth anywhere. Her d-smash actually protects her very well. Usually all I can hope for is to run away and get back for a grab. F-air out of shield is too slow even.

One good grab is all you need to deal a good amount of damage to shiek anyways. Upthrow > Utilt/Uair chain. Of course Sheik can double jump out of it, but if you can predict and catch him before he lands he's screwed. Remember, Shiek's weakest right under him. Can't needle there.

 

[Chaotic Yoshi]

You can swat single needles...
If she has time to keep charging needles, your doing something wrong...

If she double jumps out of what SonicZeroX was saying, up+b and try to hit her off stage. She has no double jump now and you can edgeguard her fairly well. Hang off the edge and force her on stage, waveland on past her landing spot and fmash her, tipper if your good enough.

 

[Europhoria]

Try playing that match up. She always has time. Even she just jumps she can throw 2-4 at me.
I'm sorry that I don't have any desire to play a game where the character I enjoy can be counter-picked by a character that requires little to no tech skill and can be totally mastered in the match up in 7 days or less.

 

[Chaotic Yoshi]

There's more to winning than tech skill...

 

[TyrantWolf]

Campy Falco > Campy Sheik

Yeah yeah, I know about the laser vs needles thing, but really. If you wanna learn anyone to hide/take over your bad matchups, it's Falco.

He owns both the Falcon and the Sheek. Put time and effort into that, learn a good and affective SHL style, get some good pillaring down and voila you got 80% of Falco down. Easier said than done ofcourse but that's **** you can learn by sitting down and putting time into it.


But you decide not to, well ggs no re and hope you do well in your other games. We'll still talk Pokemon anyway so it's all good.

 

[SonicZeroX]

Campy Falco > Campy Sheik

Yeah yeah, I know about the laser vs needles thing, but really. If you wanna learn anyone to hide/take over your bad matchups, it's Falco.

He owns both the Falcon and the Sheek. Put time and effort into that, learn a good and affective SHL style, get some good pillaring down and voila you got 80% of Falco down. Easier said than done ofcourse but that's **** you can learn by sitting down and putting time into it.


But you decide not to, well ggs no re and hope you do well in your other games. We'll still talk Pokemon anyway so it's all good.

I'm pretty good at Pokemon :x

 

[Europhoria]

^ I don't mind C. Falcon as much. At least he has to play well to beat me. Even if I outplay David's Sheik for instance, and 0-death him on a stock it doesn't usually matter because of how easy a match up it is for Sheik.

I don't want to play a spacey. I hate them in terms of their character builds and how they play.
Slowbro for high tier. ^^

 

[Dragon_Hawk]

Perfect pillaring is hard >_____>

Like really fecking hard.

iirc the Falco boards are like, "You have a four frame window of error or it's escapable."

.___.

Also, would you guys leave me out of this? I've voiced my opinion to Mike many times. If he wants to win he's going to have to make compromises with himself and learn a secondary because of how easy Marth is to counterpick (not just talking characters either). He doesn't want to do that (even though Sheik and Falcon are both acceptable secondaries without getting into a space animal). Therefore, I don't see what's left to discuss. He doesn't want to, he wants to quit and he isn't having fun. Therefore, I'd almost rather see him go.

@ Ken: I personally feel that Falcon is harder to fight than Marth is. I can talk to you about why I feel that way in private later, this really isn't the thread for that.

 

[Ice44]

When in doubt, go G&W

 

[Lanowen]

Well, if you are going to quit for those reasons then quit.

It isn't even a real reason, those Sheiks are not mastered. Go to the US or play some of the Montrealers, THEN you will have a reason to quit.

If something as simple as this makes you want to quit then it is useless. None of you know how 'good' we REALLY are at smash until you have actually been there and done that.

So, like I said. If you are going to quit for that, do it before you realize what you are really up against. This game isn't as easy as you think.

 

[BigRick]

No johns?


Newayz this PR wins cause it gotz Pokémans in it!!!

 

[D.B]

Lol Andy has the right to say that cause he's been there before

 

[alphameric]

oh man.
longest string of johns i have seen.

ken play sheik tonight, and i'll play marf, or vice versa

 

[Chaotic Yoshi]

word to your mother

 

[Drolian]

I really know my opinion doesn't count because I play Falco but...

>___> Not to take sides or anything, but I can use the same argument with Marf, I don't play him, but I'm decent with him. <____<

Anyway, I think you should play Falco, Mike. It befits you. You say you have good reactions, and that's good for Falco. (Don't take this part the wrong way) And you say Falco doesn't need mindgames rite [IMFHO, that's wrong BTW], you can learn to be the smartest falco around, and you probably can with your smart Marth playing.

Anyway, I might have taken it the wrong way, but it sounded like you were dissing Coolhat. Which isn't cool(hat), because he does **** well with his low tier.

Maybe you can play low tier and win, like coolhat. >__>

Also, I might make bowser mah main

 

[Dice]

To play against sheik with marth:

1) Stay out of the air, and if you must use an aerial, make them nicely spaced fairs. Because if you are in the air with poor spaced aerials (especially nairs), sheik will shield grab you.

2) Grab sheik before she can grab you, mindgame that shiz. Marth's grab range is too friggin good, one you grab either up throw into combo (sheik is a nice weight to combo) or forward/down throw to tech chase forward smash.

3) Have lots of patience. Dash dance camp a bit if you need to, make you sure land that grab/fair before sheik can grab you.

I know this seems like common sense, but really pay attention to the little things. It's a close matchup.

Now, I am quite terrible at marth vs sheik, but Locke) is alright at the matchup. He usually gets beat by really good sheiks (pkmvoda/testrider) but he can tear apart average sheiks easily.

And you are playing marth! Stop complaining about one hard matchup you have. Try playing falcon in tournament whose hardest matchups are the top 3 chars in the game (fox/falco/sheik), then you can complain all you'd like

 

[Dragon_Hawk]

Euro says (to Dice): The people around me play nothing but sheik, it's quite straight. And when I only get to play that one **** match up it sucks a lot of the fun out of the game for me. It's like playing C. Falcon against nothing against but the spacies. (To Jeff) I've been over my "love' of the spacies with you and my desire to play them.

 

[BigRick]

lol Dice is right...

Step yo Marth game up or learn a counterpick char

whining gets you no where yea...

 

[Deleted member]

yo bigrick tellz it like it ****in is yo nomsain dat ***** real son str8 up say word

 

[BigRick]

^^ Word ...

 

[Runawayfire]

Europhoria:

It sucks to see you feel the way you do, seeing as I hate to see another player go, but given your attitude I agree that you should quit.

Know this though, you've given up. You ran into one thing in the game which didn't terribly look to be in your favour and you couldn't handle it.
Sheik vs Jiggs is even more unfair for Jiggs.... and oh yeah Jiggs vs (you guessed it) Marth is just as hard.

Ultimately in this game its your mind vs your opponent's. There are other factors (matchups, physical mistakes, random luck, etc...) that come into play, but they're secondary.
In chess white is given an outright advantage vs black. Its not like you see chess players quiting the second they see they'll have to play black, whining about "bad matchups".

There's that whole " quiters never win" thing too, but thats just a little too corny.
A wise video game once said " Winners never use drugs".... I know this to be wrong.
I also know you'll never win with your attitude.

Dragon_Hawk: I dont see what a mm is going to do. We seem to meet up often in brackets... so that would serve even better than a mm as far as the rankings go. (Although a best of 3 match is a good idea to really settle things.)
I mean.... if we both go the whole tourny without faceing each other and we both finish close and you insist, then sure.

 

[Europhoria]

^ Cute. I look for even match ups in this game which I why I love the ditto, and the vs spacies. However, Sheik's advantages and campy style are quite boring when it's all I get to play against.
So I'll still play casually and stuff (because people seem to want to drag me out to fests and tournaments) but I don't wanna train and devout the hours and weeks I need to put in to get beat Sheiks; or rather even stand a chance against good Sheiks.

 

[Runawayfire]

Way to not listen to a thing I just said.
Please read it again, seriously.