Toonami Mafia - Game Over - Daytime Programing wins!

[#HBC | Joker]

Red-X from Teen Titans, Toonami Vanilla.

 

[Inferno3044]

Well I'm having trouble with my top two picks. However, I also don't see 2 scum guaranteed. I'm looking for mafia right now so anyone I refer to as scum for this is considered mafia. If there's an indy running around we can find him later. They don't have a kill so it's not as high a priority.

We know Badwolf and Rake are scum and it's very likely that Nabe was also scum of some sort (whether indy or mafia is uncertain. Yes I have said this multiple times but it's important). However we know that there must be at least 1 scum left due to a NK happening this past night. With Nabe's claim on killing PJB in combination with Rake being a mafia immune, I'm saying that he isn't scum. WATT also did an additional kill plus a watch which caught Rake so he can't be scum either (I would be pissed if he was mafia with those abilities). Whether you guys believe it or not, I'm town too. Due to process of elimination, scum resides in the following players:

Soup
Vandy
Kary

Scum resides in these 3 so I guess these are my 3 scum picks. Yeah I know that Soup had that push on BW early and yeah Vandy has been playing super townie. I actually find it very odd that Vandy and Soup are alive at this point, but that's just an observation.

WATT and JPB, do either of you find fault with my logic?

 

[Inferno3044]

Kary, you can also answer that question. Mainly in regards to PJB and WATT.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Wait, you think that Nabe claiming to have shot at me proves that we're not aligned? I mean, you could argue it as making it unlikely, but a guarantee it is not. That actually would have been a really easy thing to fake for purposes of distancing, even if it's a less orthodox method of doing so.

So you're saying that Nabe's claimed shot at me proves that we can't be aligned, but you suspect soup, despite his interactions with Badwolf? You're gonna have to explain that one.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Inferno, I'd argue that vanz vs Nabe was pretty genuine and takes him out of that pool.
I'd also have to say that I can see it as a hella starnge distance between nabe and PJB(though pjb pointing that out gives him a tick off the scummeter)

 

[Wots All This Then?]

I had forgotten that Nabe claimed a shot on PJB...

Continue with the massclaim, Orbo has a theory when we're done that I think holds merit.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I don't think WATT/PJB are mafia, based on their interactions with Rake/BW respectively. on the other hand, I don't think Vanz/Soup are mafia based just on general townieness.

Idk though, i'm trying to be logical about this. My biggest problem at the moment is where exactly the townferno I was expecting has got to.

finish massclaim IMO

 

[vanderzant]

I'm batman from batman tad, too ami seeker. Basically I can target someone each night and potentially open a quick topic if they are who I'm seeking. I'm assuming baddy was that person for obvious reasons.

N1 Swiss/ruker targetted nabe, I assume because he was there scum read. I idled the last two nights because I assumed that with baddy dead there was no point to my role and that doing nothing would be safer.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Wait, i'm not sure I'm following your role. You're a seeker, who opens a quicktopic with the specific person you're seeking? How do you know Radfic targeted Nabe if you're a seeker? Where'd that info come from, cuz I don't remember it being brought up before now...?

 

[Jdietz43]

I'm batman from batman tad, too ami seeker. Basically I can target someone each night and potentially open a quick topic if they are who I'm seeking. I'm assuming baddy was that person for obvious reasons.

N1 Swiss/ruker targetted nabe, I assume because he was there scum read. I idled the last two nights because I assumed that with baddy dead there was no point to my role and that doing nothing would be safer.

What? Can you explain that out better.

How do you determine who you're seeking and what do you mean by "baddy"? Do you mean BadWolf? Why do you assume this, and why haven't you tried since: why wouldn't that be "safe"?

 

[Wots All This Then?]

What? Can you explain that out better.

How do you determine who you're seeking and what do you mean by "baddy"? Do you mean BadWolf? Why do you assume this, and why haven't you tried since: why wouldn't that be "safe"?

Every day I'm shuff'lin'.

 

[Wots All This Then?]

Nvm I think I get what you're trying to say now.

But why not try to seek others at all? Just because BadWolf had Seeker doesn't mean you had to find each other in particular unless you left out the part of your role that suggests this.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Right. My turn to claim.

I'm Domon Kasshu From G Gundam, Toonami FBI Agent.

I'm a weak cop that is allowed to check if a player is independent or not.

On N1, I checked RadFic. He is not independent.
On N2, I checked Rajam. He was town and not independent.
On N3, I checked KevinM. He was town and not independent.
On N4, I checked Kary. He is not independent.

Looking at the current player-list:
Me
Vandy
PJB
Kary
WATT
Inferno

There is an independent and scum within those three. I know Kary and Vandy could very well be scum but there is an independent out there.

Let me think of numbers real quick.

 

[Inferno3044]

What do you think of Nabe possibly being the indy?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

6 alive
2 scum factions

ML and we're at 4 players alive. The indy must be some sort of survivor as there hasn't been a second kill at all (besides WATT's shot last night). I don't think we're in kingmaker/autolose at this point, as long as we lynch scum the following day.

I don't think looking for indy should be priority today, but I feel it would be relevant would we ~happen~ to lynch scum.

@Ninja

What makes you think Nabe was indy, is there two scum alive right now?

 

[Inferno3044]

I think there's one alive. What makes you think there are two alive?

 

[vanderzant]

Wait, i'm not sure I'm following your role. You're a seeker, who opens a quicktopic with the specific person you're seeking? How do you know Radfic targeted Nabe if you're a seeker? Where'd that info come from, cuz I don't remember it being brought up before now...?

Did you forget that I replaced Radfic again?

To clarify again (paraphrasing here), I'm Batman from Batman TAS the Toonami Seeker.

Each night I can target a player, and if that player is who I'm looking for I will form a quicktopic with them.

But why not try to seek others at all? Just because BadWolf had Seeker doesn't mean you had to find each other in particular unless you left out the part of your role that suggests this.

My pm uses the phrase "one you are looking for." It makes it clear that I'm looking for a certain person, and that person obviously was BadWolf.

Since my ability is effectively useless except to make myself visit any player of my choosing I decided to not use it. All it could really do is give results to any Voyeurs/Trackers/Watchers we might of had, and I saw no utility in causing them confusion, which could result in them claiming early or something.

 

[vanderzant]

Right. My turn to claim.

I'm Domon Kasshu From G Gundam, Toonami FBI Agent.

I'm a weak cop that is allowed to check if a player is independent or not.

On N1, I checked RadFic. He is not independent.
On N2, I checked Rajam. He was town and not independent.
On N3, I checked KevinM. He was town and not independent.
On N4, I checked Kary. He is not independent.

Looking at the current player-list:
Me
Vandy
PJB
Kary
WATT
Inferno

There is an independent and scum within those three. I know Kary and Vandy could very well be scum but there is an independent out there.

Let me think of numbers real quick.

Is this the most terrible fake claim I've ever seen?

It's Day 4 bro and we've only had 3 night phases. I know because RadFic targeted one person and I've idled twice.

You can't possibly have 4 night results.

I don't buy a N0 Cop because no one else has claimed a N0 ability.

I can't think of an explanation where this is a mistake on your part. You don't just "imagine" up extra this person isn't independant results. That information is pretty freaking crucial and it's not as if your claim was rushed or anything.

Your results are incredibly odd as well. Why would you not check Rake for indy when we both agreed that BSP's play and role both smelled like an indy? Why in the world were you worried about Indy Rajam on Day 2?

Indy Soup might clear up a ton of things, unless you're mafia but that in itself would be weird.

Pretty down to vote you but I don't want this to be rushed.

 

[Inferno3044]

Wow I'm dumb for not even noticing that. I was thinking that the claim was fishy because for some reason some results said "not indy" and some said "town and not indy." Not only that but the people that he got as town are both coincidentally dead while the just indies are coincidentally alive.

Vand, I'm down to vote Soup with this.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

lol, i did forget you replaced radfic. goddamn revolving door mafia so hard to keep track of.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Ok, so soup having 4 nights worth of results is mad suspicious. Like, wtf soup.

I would buy him not wanting to scan Rake tho, since he claimed to be immune to all actions. That part isn't weird. It's that N4 result that's got me worried. I'm mad I didn't even catch that at first glance.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Also, Inferno, him saying that some people were town and not others was because those people are flipped. Also not suspicious.

 

[vanderzant]

I forgot about Rake being immune, true point. But then why on earth did he agree with me that BSP/Rake could potentially be an indy if he's a freaking FBI Agent? Surely he would think that an immune indy + FBI agent can't coexist? I distinctly remember him agreeing with me, but I'll try and find the quote.

 

[vanderzant]

@Soup: I was thinking over this last night but I realised that BSP/Rake might definitely fit the indy bill, irrespective of that claim. Until I noticed WATT was calling Kary indy, I hadn't really given much thought to indy hunting (and however still don't think we should go down this route at this stage).

BSP's defence against Gheb did read genuine to me (and it's possible he was just busy town) but it's very obvious how defensive and concerned with his own survival he was. It's pretty much been the bulk of his play. It's also possibly why I didn't see a very scummy connection between him and Badwolf.

Something I'll definietly keep in mind I guess.

I think it could make sense considering his change in playstyle and cautiousness. I've played with IndyRake before and he tended to kind of do the same thing he's doing here. I like this consideration. WATT is basically who you want today? I recall you wanting Nabe still, and that personally interests me.

FOUND IT

Do you really think Soup would be all "yeah, IndyRake is possible" if he's an FBI Agent?

He shouldn't be entertaining the possibility of IndyRake, because if Rake was, Soup's role is nothing but a red herring, unless he's assuming multiple indys.

If Soup was legit surely he would of instead said "nah Vand, I think RakeMafia is more likely."

 

[#HBC | Joker]

That's a valid point. This isn't looking good for soup. Soup's getting voted if he doesn't come in here with some kinda explanation that just blows everybody's mind.. which I find unlikely.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

That was in the gutter because I'm an idiot. I'm just VT. I fakeclaimed trying to garner reactions as I do believe that there is an indy, I figured there would be no issue, and I could use it as an incentive to indy/scumhunt.

Inferno's suggestion about Nabe being indy at least holds water and I got something out of it. I don't think he ever came back to say anything agter.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

My plan was pretty simple. I was pretty upset with how the day was going, so to generate controversy and reactions, I fakeclaimed. I haven't done it in a long time but I felt safe with my current position. I know I've been looked down upon for doing it, but it merits credible results if done right. PJB can tell you what I did in Newbie 20. Perhaps part of it is because I wanted thread control as I'm twiddling my thumbs in this game already. I didn't figure scum would kill me over WATT, seeing how he is more of a threat against them.

Two of my picks right now are Inferno and PJB. Do you notice how PJB was unchecked, along with Inferno? I was going to claim tommorow with a result on one of them, to see how they react to another. I know PJB is against Kary also, so claiming that he wasn't Indy could show me how he would handle that result. Perhaps I should have claimed something stronger to make impact, but I didn't want to completely incriminate myself.

Talking about this is completely moot however and the only thing I'm upset about is the fact I screwed it up before I could even do anything. I'm honestly a bit more surprised as to how PJB reacted, he didn't even bat an eyelash to the fact I cleared Kary as Indy. I'm also really surprised Inferno didn't really say anything either.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I kind of don't want to lynch today, but still running through numbers it wouldn't really matter. If we NL'd today then we could ML tommorow. I guarantee that WATT will die this phase regardless of what we do.

Speaking of WATT, did he say he had a shot today or something? I recall something of that matter.

PJB, Look past my claim and tell me what you thought of it had it actually been real. I cleared Kary as Indy for a moment, but did it not mean anything to you?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

soupa with the high quality gambits right there. epic.

still fine with soup

wanna hear orbo's theory, whatever that was.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

soupa, why do you think WATT's guaranteed to die tonight?

on a related note, I don't think WATT should claim whatever their ability to use toDay is.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Something I really wanted to talk about too was the fact that there isn't any janitors/abductions anymore. I don't know if anyone forgot, or what people are assuming, but the fact right after Nabe was killed that nobody has suffered the same fate is pretty fishy if you ask me. Rake was untargetable so I suppose that could explain him not getting the same treatment, but that's counteractive as to why those abductions happened.

That gut feeling really makes me feel like there is indeed an Indy, but I don't understand what kind of Indy. I don't think Nabe was Indy either, simply because abducting/janitoring his own flip would deem pointless. He was likely scum as he lied about his role and could not shoot anyone. I don't feel like I'm speaking crazy talk here, because it doesn't make sense in my head.

soupa, why do you think WATT's guaranteed to die tonight?

on a related note, I don't think WATT should claim whatever their ability to use toDay is.

He claimed the guilty and got Rake personally lynched himself. He's not aligned with Rake, unless he was doing a super-ballsy bus for no real reason.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Does anyone think Nabe could janitor his own flip?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

once you're dead, you tend to stop being able to do anything, so I don't think so.

I've just realized we might not get a flip from toDay's lynch, which would be a royal pain in the ***

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

That wouldn't make sense with the fact of there not being anymore Janitors/Abductions, they followed consistently with another for Nabe/Vinyl. but they stopped right after Nabe died.

It might be a scum role if I look at it that way, and scum was just trying to cause misinformation.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I look at it as someone thinking it was more important to keep Nabe's flip hidden than Rake's. I don't know whether come the end of toDay it'll still be important to keep Nabe's flip hidden.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

No, I just think Rake wasn't allowed to be targeted by any actions. That part makes sense to me, but I guess there is priority in keeping Nabe janitored/hidden/whatever but...why? He simply can't be town at this point.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

The more I think about Nabe's play, the more I think of it like a martyr. He didn't really try to not get lynched that day, and he did a last-minute vigilante claim, which in the end proved false. I recall what I told myself back then, and that was scum would not vote Nabe.

I'm starting to come around to the idea that it's incredibly impractical for Nabe to have planned this out.

Unvote

Not about to get shot by him

So since we don't have all the time in the world, who are we lynching? I see a Gangsta lynch being tossed around, but I'm not very into that idea. Is there any new evidence against him? Like, what's he done toDay? Cuz I'm not down to lynch him based on yesterDay's play.

I would be ok with a Rajam lynch, though.

I figured I would do another re-read but I came across this. I want to look at how Inferno handled his claim too, if anything.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

9. Nabe - [6] - Wots All This Then?, Vanderzant, Clownbot, Kary, Rake, FrozenFlame751,

1. Rake - [5] - Wots All This Then? (Orboknown/JDietz hydra), FrozenFlame751, PrivateJoker-Brown, soup, Vanderzant

I really need to do a hard re-read soon, as I have a ton of theories in my head right now looking at this.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Just wrote up a bunch of **** for it to accidently get erased ****

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I feel like I'm descending to madness the more I think about possible scum. I want to believe that was an ulterior to Nabe's claim and the interaction between that claim would be very fruitful. I know we (hopefully) have come to a conclusion that Nabe was janitored/abducted for a reason, and it bothers me. It bothers me to the point where I get a headache thinking about it.

It bothers me that Nabe's role was an obvious lie yet he was still kept hidden for a reason. It bothers me that PJB believed Nabe's claim so hapharzardly, even to the point of unvoting him. My gut tells me that it was a ploy to simply get unvotes and not get voted, but that's on the surface.

I'm pretty confident in Vandy being town, and even more that he himself gave the hammer to Nabe. The only thing I could suspect is a plausibility of him knowing it was fake, but that's obvious. I remember thinking that I disliked WATT's assurance and confidence in Nabe, and that he simply sat on Nabe the whole day, and didn't care about his claim at all. If the incentive was to get unvotes and to be believed, wouldn't that be against what Nabe was trying to do? WATT had every reason to unvote him by then, but he stuck to his guns. This fact and the underlying fact of what happened the next day doesn't make me think he was involved. There is not any reason for WATT to do that at all, especially if Nabe was scum...

I feel like there is something I'm missing

Rake wasn't moved by Nabe's claim either, and simply voted despite it. Nabe actually wanted Rake shot and was pushing on him, and that just looks like simple bussing.

Perhaps I have it wrong? I'm not sure, I feel so disillusioned right now, I can feel like victory is so ****ing close. Perhaps I'm repeating myself, but I don't think Vandy is aligned with scum. I don't think WATT is either.

Maybe I should look into Kary more..