TOASTYYYYYYYYY! Scorpion for Smash!

[Ridley_Prime]

Many people associate a character too much with their series. As if they heavily represent the game they come from regardless. While they can happen(Ness, Cloud, just for two examples), it doesn't always. Reality is, if Scorpion gets in, he'll be quite toned down.

And the thing is, many MK fans won't like that. And many non-MK fans won't get that he would be toned down, making him harder to sell. So in a way, he loses badly.

Tell that to Injustice Scorpion who was “toned down” yet fairly well received and sold the most as DLC on that game. Lack of blood aside, there’s really no toning down Scorpion’s moveset itself which wouldn’t need alteration for Smash. Kunai spear and such would still have the same effect, even his classic fatality toasty which is just breathing fire.

MKX was only in Japan on PC apparently, so same could still happen with MK11 as a loophole, but lack of console presence there will hurt, which is a shame after the recent hype of 11 being on the Switch.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Tell that to Injustice Scorpion who was “toned down” yet fairly well received and sold the most as DLC on that game. Lack of blood aside, there’s really no toning down Scorpion’s moveset itself which wouldn’t need alteration for Smash. Kunai spear and such would still have the same effect, even his classic fatality toasty which is just breathing fire.

MKX was only in Japan on PC apparently, so same could still happen with MK11 as a loophole, but lack of console presence there will hurt, which is a shame after the recent hype of 11 being on the Switch.

To be fair, I was thinking of DC Universe. I'm glad people changed their minds. Maybe it was the moveset or people maturing more.

Well, I'm worried less now. Thanks for the information.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Tell that to Injustice Scorpion who was “toned down” yet fairly well received and sold the most as DLC on that game. Lack of blood aside, there’s really no toning down Scorpion’s moveset itself which wouldn’t need alteration for Smash. Kunai spear and such would still have the same effect, even his classic fatality toasty which is just breathing fire.

MKX was only in Japan on PC apparently, so same could still happen with MK11 as a loophole, but lack of console presence there will hurt, which is a shame after the recent hype of 11 being on the Switch.

Adding to that, Bayonetta's iconic element, stripping, had to be toned down, but she still managed to have a brutal-looking FS that's faithful to the spirit of her series.

Everyone knows that you can't have blood in Smash Bros, but you can have the character be in there anyway. It's not like anyone's asking for Skarlet.

 

[Deleted member]

I’m the only one who would love to see one of Scorpion’s victory cutscenes being a reference to “Cooking with Scorpion”?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I’m the only one who would love to see one of Scorpion’s victory cutscenes being a reference to “Cooking with Scorpion”?

I want a Kane-O's Spirit.

 

[BreadnJamTomorrow]

I still have faith that Scorpion could get in even with the news that MK11 most likely wouldn't be released in Japan. MK11 still has some time left in it's development cycle for the whole "not being released in Japan" thing to change. Even if that was the case, a Japanese port could theoretically come after the game is released as well. Not saying that either situation here is likely, because it's possible that the Japanese market for MK11 is probably not big enough to justify going through the effort. But it's not impossible either. Mortal Kombat has been released in Japan before (albeit in the days of it's prime), so it's not like there has never been a precedent of it releasing in the East.

But with all that aside, I still think that the legacy of the series alone still gives Scorpion a shot. If people consider Dragon Quest characters as major contenders for Smash DLC, then I don't see why we can't do the same with Mortal Kombat characters.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

That's really great, love it.

Also, Venus of the Desert Bloom How is the advertisement for Mortal Kombat's return to Japan?
Have you seen any marketing for MK11?

None whatsoever

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I still have faith that Scorpion could get in even with the news that MK11 most likely wouldn't be released in Japan. MK11 still has some time left in it's development cycle for the whole "not being released in Japan" thing to change. Even if that was the case, a Japanese port could theoretically come after the game is released as well. Not saying that either situation here is likely, because it's possible that the Japanese market for MK11 is probably not big enough to justify going through the effort. But it's not impossible either. Mortal Kombat has been released in Japan before (albeit in the days of it's prime), so it's not like there has never been a precedent of it releasing in the East.

But with all that aside, I still think that the legacy of the series alone still gives Scorpion a shot. If people consider Dragon Quest characters as major contenders for Smash DLC, then I don't see why we can't do the same with Mortal Kombat characters.

To be fair, Dragon Quest isn't even unpopular worldwide. It has popularity worldwide and a huge legacy alone for how it shaped gaming as we know it.

People consider it because it has a huge gaming impact, and being Smash is made in Japan alone, those types of characters who have more impact in Japan can get in easier. We already know that Western picks can happen, but it's not actually all that common compared to Japanese picks. So basically DQ has more going for it than MK as a series overall, before even getting into stuff like "violence issues". The biggest issue DQ has even had so far relates mostly due to "who the hell to choose", with some hating the official composer getting his songs in because it means a bigot like him would get money. MK isn't popular in Japan at all. DQ has some popularity in the West, still being a megaton seller for many of the games.

Venus of the Desert Bloom Did any MK games sell actually well in Japan? Just wondering.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

The biggest issue DQ has even had so far relates mostly due to "who the hell to choose", with some hating the official composer getting his songs in because it means a bigot like him would get money.

And even then the crusade against him is silly/will be a moot point anyway, seeing as he's really old and not likely to have much longer left to live.

In terms of who to choose, Slime and the secondary characters are obviously more popular than the heroes. Yet people strongly believe in the "main characters go first" fan rule, so naturally people latched on to Eddy the first chance he got mentioned.

For MK to have a slight chance, there still needs to have a different Western IP to take the first step into Smash. Only then can there be a serious attempt at a character campaign for the series.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

And even then the crusade against him is silly/will be a moot point anyway, seeing as he's really old and not likely to have much longer left to live.

In terms of who to choose, Slime and the secondary characters are obviously more popular than the heroes. Yet people strongly believe in the "main characters go first" fan rule, so naturally people latched on to Eddy the first chance he got mentioned.

For MK to have a slight chance, there still needs to have a different Western IP to take the first step into Smash. Only then can there be a serious attempt at a character campaign for the series.

Well, good thing Steve is up to the task! Heh.

And yeah, true. I wonder who the composer rights will go to. Back to Square-Enix? I dunno. Or maybe never available again due to weird copyright laws.

Erdrick does have the advantage of being similar to the Marth or Cloud of the series. While not the first playable character, he's the most notable. Mind you, Western audiences might recognize someone different, like Luminary, Eight, or Erdrick's Descendant. But his legacy is everywhere. Slime is the other top notable character, being a major icon and most recognizable. It helps that both Eddy and Slime can heavily represent the series rather well via things like various skills, how important monsters are to rpg's, and tons of alternate colors/designs. There's over 30 variants of the Slime race, most being recolors in some way, though it's more like recolors of a different version of Slime. Like DrakSlime has its own recolor. Whereas regular Slime doesn't have that many(Blue, Red, RockSlime, MetalSlime) that I can properly think of. Monster Rancher followed a similar pattern... and so did Digimon to a rather extreme degree at times. There's over 10 Agumon variants, and nearly every single one of them have a palette swap with another.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

It is possible the Cyberninja process changed due to the reboot's design. Plus, Quan Chi can remove souls. Putting his soul back in a humanoid body is actually believable. My issue is how Sub-Zero stayed alive during all this in human form without a soul. Cryogenic freezing?

The reason is he wasn't. He was a zombie, remember?

To be fair, I was thinking of DC Universe. I'm glad people changed their minds. Maybe it was the moveset or people maturing more.

Well, I'm worried less now. Thanks for the information.

It's because Injustice was never trying to be Mortal Kombat without the Mortal. It was its own thing and they adapted Scorpion into it.

MK v. DC flopped because "family-friendly" and "Mortal Kombat" do not fit together. And that's excatly what this game tried to do,

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The reason is he wasn't. He was a zombie, remember?

...So putting his soul back was enough to revive him? And by zombie, do you mean like Liu Kang, or do you mean like how if a character doesn't have their soul, they're just mindless but alive? Just want to clarify.

And no, I don't remember. I remember only Zombie Liu Kang at best. I didn't finish all of 9's story mode, to be fair.

 

[VodkaHaze]

I still have faith that Scorpion could get in even with the news that MK11 most likely wouldn't be released in Japan. MK11 still has some time left in it's development cycle for the whole "not being released in Japan" thing to change. Even if that was the case, a Japanese port could theoretically come after the game is released as well. Not saying that either situation here is likely, because it's possible that the Japanese market for MK11 is probably not big enough to justify going through the effort. But it's not impossible either. Mortal Kombat has been released in Japan before (albeit in the days of it's prime), so it's not like there has never been a precedent of it releasing in the East.

But with all that aside, I still think that the legacy of the series alone still gives Scorpion a shot. If people consider Dragon Quest characters as major contenders for Smash DLC, then I don't see why we can't do the same with Mortal Kombat characters.

It's not that there isn't a market for MK in Japan, it's that under Japanese censorship laws MK can't be sold. The only way to purchase the games is to import them, which adds a language barrier since none of the games are in Japanese.

Venus of the Desert Bloom Did any MK games sell actually well in Japan? Just wondering.

The first few MK games weren't huge sellers in Japan, which is contrasted with the rest of the world were they were highly successful. This is in part because of the Japanese not liking the over-the-top bloody violence, but also because they didn't really localise the games into Japanese.

That being said, imported copies of Mortal Kombat X do get positive reviews on Amazon Japan, and searching MK with Japanese spelling on Youtube pulls a lot of videos, some with millions of views.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

...So putting his soul back was enough to revive him? And by zombie, do you mean like Liu Kang, or do you mean like how if a character doesn't have their soul, they're just mindless but alive? Just want to clarify.

And no, I don't remember. I remember only Zombie Liu Kang at best. I didn't finish all of 9's story mode, to be fair.

Oh... you... didn't?

Well... um... this is awkward...

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It's not that there isn't a market for MK in Japan, it's that under Japanese censorship laws MK can't be sold. The only way to purchase the games is to import them, which adds a language barrier since none of the games are in Japanese.

The first few MK games weren't huge sellers in Japan, which is contrasted with the rest of the world were they were highly successful. This is in part because of the Japanese not liking the over-the-top bloody violence, but also because they didn't really localise the games into Japanese.

That being said, imported copies of Mortal Kombat X do get positive reviews on Amazon Japan, and searching MK with Japanese spelling on Youtube pulls a lot of videos, some with millions of views.

Ah, so it's not a lack of popularity in itself. DQ might still be more popular in the West than MK is in Japan, but eh.

Though my bigger point was that since Smash likes to focus on pleasing the Japanese audience more, DQ has a small advantage. I rescind my points on MK having a large disadvantage, though. Bar, well, violence issues. Sakurai cares a lot about trying to make a character feel right, so if the violence is too important, and they can't be toned down to fit his own personal views on how it should be, the character wouldn't get in. I don't think it's a large issue, but I can't deny that this could keep Scorpion out.

Oh... you... didn't?

Well... um... this is awkward...

Just spoiler mark it. I'm at the final fight, trying to kill Shao Kahn with Raiden. No big deal.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Just spoiler mark it. I'm at the final fight, trying to kill Shao Kahn with Raiden. No big deal.

Oh, so you already know that...

Spoiler

They pretty much killed (almost) everyone.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Oh, so you already know that...

Spoiler

They pretty much killed (almost) everyone.

I heard of that.

Spoiler

Actually, I remember the previous fights against the zombies. Thanks for jogging my memory~

Though I don't know who is alive come the end?

 

[SuperDoom1]

I'd say spoiler-marking is a good idea. Even I have only played 1 through 3, Deception, and Vs. DCU.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Yeah, to be fair, it’s not just with MK, but Japan and how it handles certain levels of violence in games in general. Resident Evil’s been censored there to a point for instance and it’s a Japanese-made series, so is not like they roll out the red carpet for MK particularly.

 

[VodkaHaze]

Yeah, to be fair, it’s not just with MK, but Japan and how it handles certain levels of violence in games in general. Resident Evil’s been censored there to a point for instance and it’s a Japanese-made series, so is not like they roll out the red carpet for MK particularly.

Yep, the general rule on Japanese censorship is they're stricter on violence, but more lenient on sex. That being said, Netherrealm Studios could release MK11 in Japan, but in order to do that they'd have to censor the game so much that it would basically be like removing all fish from an aquarium in that no-one would be interested.

Spoiler

Especially considering the game starts off with Raiden beheading Shinnok, and many beheadings were either censored or removed in Japanese games like Resident Evil 4.

 

[SuperDoom1]

Yeah, to be fair, it’s not just with MK, but Japan and how it handles certain levels of violence in games in general. Resident Evil’s been censored there to a point for instance and it’s a Japanese-made series, so is not like they roll out the red carpet for MK particularly.

It's hilarious to think the region that brought us One Punch Man is strict on violence to the point where newer Mortal Kombat games can't even be released.

 

[evildevil97]

I kind of want to see Scorpion and Sub-Zero as echos of each other: Exact same regular moveset, different specials, as a reference to the palette swaps of the past. If any non-special differences are in at all, it would just be the type of elemental effect (fire vs ice).

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I kind of want to see Scorpion and Sub-Zero as echos of each other: Exact same regular moveset, different specials, as a reference to the palette swaps of the past. If any non-special differences are in at all, it would just be the type of elemental effect (fire vs ice).

Except that they can easily do that with just, y'know, Scorpion's palette swaps. Sub-Zero even got all of the ninjas as color options in Injustice 2, so it wouldn't even be the first time that happened.

Also, the two have grown very different over the years. Different specials, different combos and even in MK1, they had different Fatalities. It's not a Ken/Ryu situation where the two started as outright clones and became more unique as the franchise got older because they were already unique to begin with and simply became even more so over time.

But that's just my take on it. For all I know, I could be super duper wrong without even realizing it.

 

[evildevil97]

Except that they can easily do that with just, y'know, Scorpion's palette swaps. Sub-Zero even got all of the ninjas as color options in Injustice 2, so it wouldn't even be the first time that happened.

Also, the two have grown very different over the years. Different specials, different combos and even in MK1, they had different Fatalities. It's not a Ken/Ryu situation where the two started as outright clones and became more unique as the franchise got older because they were already unique to begin with and simply became even more so over time.

But that's just my take on it. For all I know, I could be super duper wrong without even realizing it.

They definitely drifted apart as the years went on, but I think having different specials / Final Smash, while keeping the same regular moves would hit the sweet spot. I just like to be a tad realistic too. Choosing one MK rep between Scorpion and Sub-Zero is hard to determine without upsetting some people.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

They definitely drifted apart as the years went on, but I think having different specials / Final Smash, while keeping the same regular moves would hit the sweet spot. I just like to be a tad realistic too. Choosing one MK rep between Scorpion and Sub-Zero is hard to determine without upsetting some people.

The problem is some moves don't translate similarly enough. The only way it'd work is if the Echoes rule is more just "bodyshape" than anything else. Cause Scorpion and Sub-Zero's Spear and Ice Slide are nothing alike. They share semi-similar moves, like the Ice Shot(I'm sure I have this name wrong) and Fireball(name is probably wrong too). Where it's just different properties but similar animations. But then Sub-Zero has the Ice Clone, which separates him even further. They would work better as semi-clones, as they can still do a fair amount of similar moves, which would make creation of them easier.

I do agree that having both in is better.

 

[Zakhara]

These two would work great as Echo Fighters. Their Nintendo appearances largely consisted of palette-swapping so there's already a precedent for it, and having different specials Ala Ken would hit the sweet spot. They even happen to have pretty G-rated movesets, given the series' reputation.

 

[SuperDoom1]

These two would work great as Echo Fighters. Their Nintendo appearances largely consisted of palette-swapping so there's already a precedent for it, and having different specials Ala Ken would hit the sweet spot.

Yeah!

They even happen to have pretty G-rated movesets, given the series' reputation.

Well...discounting Fatalities, that is.

 

[Deleted member]

Eh, I'd rather have Shang Tsung or Raiden

 

[SuperDoom1]

Eh, I'd rather have Shang Tsung or Raiden

Raiden would be cool (FLANG BABABAEEL-HYAA), but as for Shang Tsung, we already have Kirby, so...

 

[Deleted member]

Raiden would be cool (FLANG BABABAEEL-HYAA), but as for Shang Tsung, we already have Kirby, so...

Shang Tsung doesn't need to absorb powers, he can turn into other characters himself. He can turn into MK characters

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Shang Tsung doesn't need to absorb powers, he can turn into other characters himself. He can turn into MK characters

Kinda like how Mr. Game & Watch can change his appearance based on the games his attacks are from?

 

[SuperDoom1]

Shang Tsung doesn't need to absorb powers, he can turn into other characters himself. He can turn into MK characters

Genius.

 

[Arcadenik]

They definitely drifted apart as the years went on, but I think having different specials / Final Smash, while keeping the same regular moves would hit the sweet spot. I just like to be a tad realistic too. Choosing one MK rep between Scorpion and Sub-Zero is hard to determine without upsetting some people.

Yes, I feel that's the ideal way.

Scorpion and Sub-Zero are playable fighters.
Scorpion and Sub-Zero have the same normal A moves but different special B moves and Fatalities Final Smashes (semi-Echo Fighters? semi-clones?)
Scorpion and Sub-Zero have 1990s designs from the first three games.

 

[Oddball]

If Scorpion gets in, he needs the "buy a Scorpion doll" Friendship with a rainbow appearing over him as a taunt.

 

[Deleted member]

Kinda like how Mr. Game & Watch can change his appearance based on the games his attacks are from?

If you see it that way

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...uld_like_to_see_bayonetta_in_mortal_kombat_11

If Scorpion can't be brought to Smash Bros., this seems like the best next thing to try. And if this can't be done, at least it's still a better idea than Shaggy.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...uld_like_to_see_bayonetta_in_mortal_kombat_11

If Scorpion can't be brought to Smash Bros., this seems like the best next thing to try. And if this can't be done, at least it's still a better idea than Shaggy.

Bayonetta would be an interesting pick.

Unique moveset possibilities with the Wicked Weaves, different weapons and even demonic summons.

Latter one and her Torture Attacks basically give her more Fatality potential than an entire Mortal Kombat roster too.

I'd totally be okay with that, honestly.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

And Kamiya would be okay with her head getting ripped off and stuff apparently! Next best thing indeed if nothing else, and also a breath of fresh air to MK’s 3rd party lineup, much as I’d still like Michael Myers after all the horror movie icons it got last time...

Some naturally expect Kamiya to be just trolling which wouldn’t surprise me either, but will have to see what happens. A Japanese made character getting into MK would help alleviate the lack of connection between MK and Japan a bit at least. This would be the first time this kind of thing has happened with the series if I remember right. Baby steps.

 

[IsmaR]

The Kamiya thing to do/expect is say that "Bayonetta wouldn't have to worry about losing," so it'd be a moot point anyway.

Personally I don't take the statement as meaning much, but then again the same was said for things like Tekken 7/Harada's comments on Negan in the past.

As for the Smash implications, I'd be completely down for the "You get one, we get one" type collaboration, even if it isn't Nintendo specific.

 

[Ih8heels]

I do NOT = * infinity +2 want manhands in Mortal Kombat 11. Kamiya can kick rocks with that.