Toad parade - Oh boy it's Els--- I mean, Rosalina

[Supermario12]

That's like saying the Mario and Luigi games wouldn't represent Mario. They would represent the Mario and Luigi series. Paper Mario falls under the wide range of Mario RPG. He would be counted as a Mario rep.

I'd say the Mario and Luigi series are a different from the Super Mario Series. Their two very different games. And The Mario and Luigi series doesn't need to have reps because Mario and Luigi are all ready in super smash brothers

 

[Deleted member]

It's all within the same damn canon.

 

[Deleted member]

There is also the fact that any Mario newcomer would most likely be a hidden character. There is a possibility that Toad could be confirmed on the Dojo, however, due to the relative minor status of most of these Mario character (despite how iconic and well known they all are) within the series, they will probably become hidden characters if they were to get in at all.

I have a feeling that if we do get Toad in Smash that he'll be a starter given how incredibly iconic he is. But yeah, the others are likely to be unlockable.

 

[Neanderthal]

Toad is a very interesting one.

I think he should be more heavily involved in the game. But not as a fighter.

Maybe the mastermind surprise villain in the story mode?
If not, then playing some important role in story mode or even in the selection menu's somehow.

As a fighter it would ruin the credibility of every other fighter in the game. How would they explain Toad who is useless in the mario games being able to go toe to toe with Bowser and Ganondorf?
He would be the only character of whom it doesn't make sense as to why they are such a good fighter.

 

[CalumG]

Toad is a very interesting one.

I think he should be more heavily involved in the game. But not as a fighter.

Maybe the mastermind surprise villain in the story mode?
If not, then playing some important role in story mode or even in the selection menu's somehow.

As a fighter it would ruin the credibility of every other fighter in the game. How would they explain Toad who is useless in the mario games being able to go toe to toe with Bowser and Ganondorf?
He would be the only character of whom it doesn't make sense as to why they are such a good fighter.

Go play SMB2, NSMBWii and NSMBU, then come back and say that. Toad is clumsy and often nervous, but in no way incapable - not that different from Luigi's personality, really.

 

[FalKoopa]

As a fighter it would ruin the credibility of every other fighter in the game. How would they explain Toad who is useless in the mario games being able to go toe to toe with Bowser and Ganondorf?

Capability as a fighter hardly matters in Smash Bros.
Characters don't HAVE to look like fighters. Peach, for example.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

How would they explain Toad who is useless in the mario games being able to go toe to toe with Bowser and Ganondorf?

Because and had a lot of combat in their games....

Toad fights quite a bit. He's fought twice (whom you say he can't fight) and Wart once. That's a better record than a lot of smash participants.

 

[Neanderthal]

Some good points. SMB2 is a good example, I hadn't thought of that.

Although generally in most games he is more likely to be seen hiding away from a goomba waiting for Mario to save him rather than stomping on them. His character is "supposed" to be our physically challenged little guide/helper.
In some games like the new super Mario brothers they use toads as fillers for P3 and P4 since theres really no other protagonists to use. I wouldn't rely on that as an argument.
I'll be honest I can't think when Toad has ever fought Bowser?


I'm not sure he could be seen as a legitimate fighter, but I'll take your point that it's been done before. And judging by the prompt responses there is certainly passionate enough support for the little mushroom.

I'd still prefer him as a tool for story mode or something. I guess he just doesn't excite me and seems like a filler just to boost the Mario game numbers. Obviously you guys see it differently.

 

[CalumG]

Some good points. SMB2 is a good example, I hadn't thought of that.

Although generally in most games he is more likely to be seen hiding away from a goomba waiting for Mario to save him rather than stomping on them. His character is "supposed" to be our physically challenged little guide/helper.
In some games like the new super Mario brothers they use toads as fillers for P3 and P4 since theres really no other protagonists to use. I wouldn't rely on that as an argument.
I'll be honest I can't think when Toad has ever fought Bowser?


I'm not sure he could be seen as a legitimate fighter, but I'll take your point that it's been done before. And judging by the prompt responses there is certainly passionate enough support for the little mushroom.

I'd still prefer him as a tool for story mode or something. I guess he just doesn't excite me and seems like a filler just to boost the Mario game numbers. Obviously you guys see it differently.

In many ways, that is how he's used. Even so, he's one of the oldest characters to show up in the Mario series - enemies aside, he's the only character from the original Super Mario Brothers that hasn't appeared in Smash yet. Likewise, including Toad would mean every playable character from SMB2 is now playable, and Toad is the only character who got a costume in Tekken Tag Tournament 2 that isn't currently playable. He's been in every main series Mario game, probably every spin-off to the series as well, and is the figurehead of an entire species, not unlike Yoshi.

He also fills a niche position in the roster; Toad, assuming he follows his ingame stats, would be light, powerful, high-speed on the ground and capable of lifting far above his weight (no slowdown when carrying heavy objects, ability to carry people a la Donkey Kong) whilst having a very stunted aerial game, and some very 'clumsy' moves like some of Luigi's (his Dash Attack springs to mind).

Toad is the last iconic character left of the Mario series. Mario, Luigi, Peach, Toad and Bowser is pretty much the standard Mario cast, exactly as it has appeared from 1985 through to 2013. I'd be perfectly happy to see a character like Paper Mario, Waluigi or Bowser Jr., but as far as I'm concerned, the shoe-in character for a 5th Mario rep is, and always will be Toad.

 

[Neanderthal]

In many ways, that is how he's used. Even so, he's one of the oldest characters to show up in the Mario series - enemies aside, he's the only character from the original Super Mario Brothers that hasn't appeared in Smash yet. Likewise, including Toad would mean every playable character from SMB2 is now playable, and Toad is the only character who got a costume in Tekken Tag Tournament 2 that isn't currently playable. He's been in every main series Mario game, probably every spin-off to the series as well, and is the figurehead of an entire species, not unlike Yoshi.

He also fills a niche position in the roster; Toad, assuming he follows his ingame stats, would be light, powerful, high-speed on the ground and capable of lifting far above his weight (no slowdown when carrying heavy objects, ability to carry people a la Donkey Kong) whilst having a very stunted aerial game, and some very 'clumsy' moves like some of Luigi's (his Dash Attack springs to mind).

Toad is the last iconic character left of the Mario series. Mario, Luigi, Peach, Toad and Bowser is pretty much the standard Mario cast, exactly as it has appeared from 1985 through to 2013. I'd be perfectly happy to see a character like Paper Mario, Waluigi or Bowser Jr., but as far as I'm concerned, the shoe-in character for a 5th Mario rep is, and always will be Toad.

Some good points also, but you make him sound way overpowered That would be the last thing I would want for Toad if he made it.

 

[CalumG]

Some good points also, but you make him sound way overpowered That would be the last thing I would want for Toad if he made it.

Well, his trophy in Brawl does mention his 'superhuman strength' (questionable use of the word human there, but yeah)! He'd obviously have features to balance him out (high start-up lag on moves, poor aerial game and jump height, etc), but in the past, Toad has had a lot more raw power than his appearance or mannerisms would suggest.

 

[Opossum]

I have a feeling that if we do get Toad in Smash that he'll be a starter given how incredibly iconic he is. But yeah, the others are likely to be unlockable.

You see, I see Toad as unlockable because and only because Mario, Peach, and Bowser are all starters. It would just seem odd for Mario to have four slots without unlocking, leaving Luigi to be forever an unlockable.

 

[Arcadenik]

Personally I'd rather see the Mario Big Eight to be available from the start. No need to unlock Luigi or Toad.

 

[final lap]

The problem I see with Toad is that his arms are too short, and he has no legs. When I think of Smash candidates, I look for characters with reach, meaning they must have discernible limbs, weapons, or body proportions that would work.

Furthermore, in NSMB Wii, Toad wasn't even a character, there were 2 of them and they were just there to fill out the player 3 and 4 slots. In many other Mario games, Toad is just a race, not a character. There are many "Toads" and they all look identical.

That said, there is one reason only I would be support of Toad, which is SMB2. (aka Mario Advance) (aka Super Mario USA?) But given the reasons stated above, it probably isn't really worth it.

In another thread, someone listed Sakurai's 4 criteria for adding a new character. One of the criteria is that it must be unique. (What is unique about Toad?) But the first criteria listed was it must make people want to play. Will people really be excited for Smash 4 because of Toad?

 

[FalKoopa]

The problem I see with Toad is that his arms are too short, and he has no legs. When I think of Smash candidates, I look for characters with reach, meaning they must have discernible limbs, weapons, or body proportions that would work.

Really? Then how does Kirby work?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

The problem I see with Toad is that his arms are too short, and he has no legs. When I think of Smash candidates, I look for characters with reach, meaning they must have discernible limbs, weapons, or body proportions that would work.

Furthermore, in NSMB Wii, Toad wasn't even a character, there were 2 of them and they were just there to fill out the player 3 and 4 slots. In many other Mario games, Toad is just a race, not a character. There are many "Toads" and they all look identical.

That said, there is one reason only I would be support of Toad, which is SMB2. (aka Mario Advance) (aka Super Mario USA?) But given the reasons stated above, it probably isn't really worth it.

In another thread, someone listed Sakurai's 4 criteria for adding a new character. One of the criteria is that it must be unique. (What is unique about Toad?) But the first criteria listed was it must make people want to play. Will people really be excited for Smash 4 because of Toad?

Kirby and Jigglypuff don't have short arms? Ivysaur doesn't even have arms for crying out loud! This is a terrible arguement. Are you trolling?

Yoshi has the same problem. There are several yoshis but there is one Yoshi in particular that is special. Likewise there are several Toads, but there is one that is special.

If you can't find anything unique about Toad, you're not using your imagination. Heck you're in the Toad thread, just read some of the movesets! It takes, what, two minutes?

 

[final lap]

Yes I know there is Kirby, but in defense of my argument, I would say that short limbs is a reason not to make Kirby a fighter, but the reasons FOR making Kirby a fighter far outweighed the cons. Whereas the reasons for making Toad a fighter are not nearly as strong as they were for Kirby.

Another funny thing about Kirby is that he is perfectly round, so his arms/legs could stick out from the most outward part of his body. With Toad, his head essentially creates more distance between him and his opponent. Can Toad's arms even reach further than his head?

edit: Actually if Toad's moveset was based on SMB2 (i.e. throw vegetables, etc) then that could be very cool.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Yes I know there is Kirby, but in defense of my argument, I would say that short limbs is a reason not to make Kirby a fighter, but the reasons FOR making Kirby a fighter far outweighed the cons. Whereas the reasons for making Toad a fighter are not nearly as strong as they were for Kirby.

Another funny thing about Kirby is that he is perfectly round, so his arms/legs could stick out from the most outward part of his body. With Toad, his head essentially creates more distance between him and his opponent. Can Toad's arms even reach further than his head?

edit: Actually if Toad's moveset was based on SMB2 (i.e. throw vegetables, etc) then that could be very cool.

Those reasons would be subjective. There are plenty of reasons to have Toad as a fighter. Don't make me sick Chrono on you.

That's not really an issue. It's not like he can't have poor reach. Or headbutt a lot.

I'd like it more based on NSMBW but that's just me.

 

[final lap]

But if it was based on NSMB then what would Toad even do?

I look at Wario, and he's based on WarioWare universe rather than Mario. So it would make most sense to me for Toad to be SMB2: The Character considering there is already Mario and Luigi.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

But if it was based on NSMB then what would Toad even do?

Up B: Could be the propeller hat.

Neutral A: could be the cool spin move that you do when you shake the wii-mote.

The rest could be based off of his other games but I really want those two moves if he gets in.

 

[CalumG]

The problem I see with Toad is that his arms are too short, and he has no legs. When I think of Smash candidates, I look for characters with reach, meaning they must have discernible limbs, weapons, or body proportions that would work.

Thus far in the Smash series, members of the Mario franchise (as well as many others, namely Sonic) have had extendable, size-changing limbs depending on what move they're doing. Limb size isn't even an "issue" up for debate.

Besides, if anything, short hit-boxes would make up for the fact that Toad is light, powerful, and can carry characters over his head a la Donkey Kong. The little guy's gotta have some weaknesses, right?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Toad is awesome, he should be in. No WALUIGI, no Bowser Jr., no Dr.Mario,just give me TOAD already.

 

[ChronoBound]

Luigi's Mansion 2 has been released. It did not have Waluigi in a prominent position like his fans were hoping, but guess who had a minor role?

Seriously, due to all of the possible Mario characters all having quite a bit of popularity to them. I think the choice for a Mario newcomer will come down to something aside from "popularity".

Toad's long-standing iconicness and senority to the series could be what makes him next-in-line for a playable Mario character.

Again for those who don't know, New Super Mario Bros. Wii was the SECOND highest selling home console game of all time in Japan (the only one that has sold more was the original Super Mario Bros.). Toad being a playable character in that helps him more than a lot of people think (though Bowser Jr. was also a prominent antagonist in that game).

Regardless, for fans of every possible Mario newcomer (Toad, Bowser Jr., Paper Mario, Waluigi, Geno, and Dr. Mario), we are very likely going to be looking at having to wait until Smash 4's release to find out whether they are playable. The only two I think could be confirmed as playable characters prior to the release are Toad and maybe Geno (only due to third-party characters having a history of being confirmed before a game's release). However, Toad is overall more likely to be a hidden character in my opinion.

Overall, supporters for Mario characters should be crossing their fingers against "deconfirmations" more than confirmations for this reason. Waluigi has a good chance of returning as an Assist Trophy, and I could very well see Bowser Jr. being added as one as well (as well as Doc being a costume, though, I guess that makes him in technically)

I do think that if Peach has Toad as one of her specials again that won't necesarrily de-confirm him (though it will certainly de-moralize much of his fanbase). I think due to the fact that there is so many Toads, that one being a an offensive fighter and one being a bodyguard for Peach allows for this discrepancy. Besides there is already a history of this in Smash Bros. (ROB was shown as an enemy on the Dojo, yet he was a playable character in the final game).

 

[Arcadenik]

I do think that if Peach has Toad as one of her specials again that won't necesarrily de-confirm him (though it will certainly de-moralize much of his fanbase). I think due to the fact that there is so many Toads, that one being a an offensive fighter and one being a bodyguard for Peach allows for this discrepancy. Besides there is already a history of this in Smash Bros. (ROB was shown as an enemy on the Dojo, yet he was a playable character in the final game).

Well, people tend to have the memory span of a goldfish when it comes to potential newcomers.

 

[8-peacock-8]

 

[Arcadenik]

That reminds me of Little Nemo: The Dream Master. Damn you, Capcom. Why isn't this game on Wii Virtual Console yet? Oh well, I forgive you for creating Bad Box Art Mega Man.

I am keeping my fingers crossed for Toad to be playable in SSB4.

 

[Ben Holt]

Yes! Yes! **** YES!!!!!!
After Mewtwo, Toad is my most wanted newcomer!

 

[Maffewt]

I dunno if anyone has mentioned it, but in a major Japanese poll in '08, Toad was listed the 8th most popular video game character.
Not Mario character; video game character.
boo yah.
The only other Mario character in there apart from the man himself is Yoshi. It's interesting for third party perspective, too - Cloud higher than Slime, Layton in the top ten (double boo yah).
But not to go off topic, this is awesome for toad's chances.
Also, do/can we post movesets here? I have some ideas, haven't posted one before so dunno is this the thread for it or what...

 

[FalKoopa]

This thread is for EVERYTHING about Toad. Go ahead!

 

[Autumn ♫]

I really do hope Toad gets in ssb4.
Here's my moveset for him
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWseY3HRYs4

 

[Maffewt]

cool :D I don't have much time so I won't go into too much depth; i'll probably leave out standards if I have to go because I think specials/FS contribute more to defining a character...

But anyways:

I'm sure other people have talked about him having a strong/fast/light/bad-recovery stat-spread, so I won't go into that. I was keeping that in mind so that his play style would be ash in, get hits, dash out, with one or two stall moves.

Standard B: Ice ball. I think ice attacks are under -utilised in smash. It's pretty much just Ice-Climbers and G&W's hammer. It would have a distinctive 'bounce', different from Mario's I guess; shorter range too . Weaker but with a mild chance to freeze for a second. I just think ice ball should be incorporated, plus it would establish a similarity with the Mario bros, akin I suppose to how Ike and Marth both have counter? Just for a cohesion with the Mario Bros series as a whole, seeing as Toad has recently become like the third Mario bro as far as NSMBW is concerned.

^B: Propeller hat. Pretty good vertical recovery somewhat compensates for atrocious jumps, however horizontal is meh (must float-descend like in the game), and damages is poor. Plus, is adorable.

vB: POW block. Toad whips out a pow block. Slowish to pull out and throw. Can throw directly at opponent or on the ground beside them. Shockwave effect for all opponents on the same platform as where the block lands. Shockwaves also becomes weaker the further they are from where the POW block lands. Next to no knockback, and unless it hits them directly, POW block will not do severe damage; however, it has unique effect of knocking enemies onto the ground where they stand, which is its main boon. Occasionally, Toad whips out a giant veggie instead, a la SMB2. No shockwave effect, but more more damage/knockback. However, slows Toad down to carry.

>B: This one I wasn't as sure about, because I'd like to incorporate spores somehow, but in the end I decided to go with another NSMB nod because to be fair they've had some really good item ideas, were a huge boost for Toad and they've been such a huge success in general. It was between Squirrel and Penguin, but I thought penguin suited the fightstyle of Toad better. Toad runs and slides on his belly, slows down to a halt after a while. Comparable to Withdraw, but harder to break.

Grab: Picks opponent up over head, like a veggie in SMB2. I meant to get into various throws, but short on time...

FS: Toad House Roulette. Three cards show up on screen, like SMB3's toad house. Player taps A to make the first card set match, then the second, then the third - or I guess al three could match automatically, as messing up would be just like getting an item? Toad then gets the abilities of the relevant items in smash bros- if you get mushroom he's giant, if you get the star he gets the speed and invulnerability of invincibility star and if a fire flower shows then one comically protrudes from Toad's head, constantly shooting fire. You can potentially have all these at once.
I think it's good for representing Toad's history as item keeper and longevity with the series.

's all I have time for... I don't think it's as creative as OP's, I kinda threw it together



But I think it would compliment his low-range high-power standards, and represents his many roles throughout the series.

 

[Maffewt]

I really do hope Toad gets in ssb4.
Here's my moveset for him
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWseY3HRYs4

nice! I like Posion Mushroom and dig. I was actually gonna use toad brigade but put in roulette for retro throwbacks/iconism

 

[Neanderthal]

To me, Toad has always been the item guy. I always thought the mushroom people who populated the Toad Houses of SMB3 were the same person: one loyal subject who was the absolute authority on all the crazy items of Mario's world and in Mario Kart Wii it's established that he even has a boxing factory for them! So my Toad used items for his attacks (Kuribo's Shoe, P Balloon etc.) but as it had similarities to other newcomers of mine I eventually condensed it into a block themed set.

Mushroom Block: Inspired by Wario's Woods and SMB2, Toad pulls out a mushroom block which can be hurled at opponents. Charge it up and a stack of up to five blocks can be carried, covering more ground when thrown.

Grab Block: From SMB3 and SMW, this glowing blue block can be kicked along the ground and will continue to slide until it hits an enemy or a wall.

Propellor Block: NSMBWii introduced this one, though it would probably be orange as in SM3DLand. A pretty obvious recovery, and maybe the block will carry on after Toad lets go, similar to Snake's flying machine.

Brick Block: An interesting one. For this, Toad drops a large brick block directly underneath him which will last until a certain amount of time has passed or until it's destroyed. A standard obstacle on the ground, but if used in the air it will float and function as a temporary platform. Best utilised above an opponent trying to get back on the stage. Watch as they bash their heads and fall to their doom!

POW Block: Toad's Final Smash involves him smashing a giant POW block to the ground, causing an almost instant knockout to anyone touching the ground at that time. Extremely powerful, but lasts for a very short amount of time so you're best off using it as a particular enemy is just about to touch down.

By ProfessorFandango @ DevientArt
http://professorfandango.deviantart.com/art/SMASH-Toad-261903113?q=galleryrofessorfandango/31856694&qo=25

 

[Diddy Kong]

Many blocks, but it's still nice. Really hope they make Toad the newcomer for the Mario series.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Maybe all those blocks should be comprised into one special move, like how SSF2 Megaman managed to get many of his moves and switch it using one move. That way he can have more variety of move sets besides being a brick thrower.

 

[Neanderthal]

I've always dislike the idea of including Toad because I found it inconsistent with the story of most games that he would be able to go toe to toe with Mario and Bowser etc

But if you justify it by making alot of his fighting ability through the use of items then I actually start to really like the idea of including Toad!
Would make him a very unique and interesting fighter too.

I've done a 180 and now consider myself a Toad supporter.

 

[Starcutter]

I specifically came on here to bash toast, but then I skimmed over the moveset. I still don't like him, but If he got in I wouldn't be nearly as upset as I would have a few minutes ago. still, I'd rather have kamek then toast. also, wouldn't they be forced to use something else as peach's counter then as well?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Toad canoncally not being as strong as Mario or Bowser shouldn't matter when you play a game where the likes of Fox, Sheik, and Jigglypuff beat up Ganondorf, Mewtwo, Samus and Ness with ease.

Besides, it's entirely possible that Toad beats Bowser in the NSMB games he's playable in. Also, he was playable in SMB2. So there really shouldn't be a problem. Toad is awesome, and we need him.

 

[LaniusShrike]

I actually really like the block moveset, it's a fun gimmick that makes a lot of sense for Toad. Also, I'm not really sure why people think Toad isn't as strong as Mario- remember what his SMB2 specialty was? He could lift objects much faster than the other characters. If that's not showing off his buff mushroom strength, I don't know what is.

While there are characters I'd rather see, I definitely can see Toad being in the game, especially with Toadette and Toadsworth as alternate costumes. Peach's counter special should be switched to Toadsworth, but I don't think it's much of an issue if it's still Toad, since it could be any Toad, not the Toad.
... Nintendo really should've given the character a name.
Also, this.

http://quick2004.deviantart.com/art/TOAD-113391799

 

[Diddy Kong]

Toad's nickname? What about.. Todd?