Toad Discussion

[Masque]

fawful on the other hand had a major role in the first game in that not only was he second in command but he carried cackletta's spirit so it could be transfered to bowser, and without him the game would be an hour shorter.

And without Toad, SMB would have been 7 worlds shorter.

Kudos to Fawriel on a wonderful moveset! Even though I have yet to play Mario Strikers Charged (U.S. here, haha), I like how you incorporated his moves from that outing; his Uair could be called "Bicycle Kick", if that's the term for which you were searching.

I posted a moveset a while back, but I don't feel like digging it up. I also have it saved on the computer, but all the Microsoft Office programs are on the fritz today. Here are some special ideas that either I have come up with (or someone else has):

B - Star Toss (origin: Mario Party) - As the original keeper of the stars, Toad has plenty at his behest. He grabs a star and lobs it forward. By holding B, you can use the Control Stick to adjust the direction of the arc, from short and high to long and shallow. The default toss is the medium distance with a basic arc of -x^2 (the standard negative parabola).

SideB - Mushroom Kart (origin: Mario Kart) - Toad is one of the fastest racers around, and this move is no exception. Much like the Wario Chopper, Toad can drive around with speed, pressing B to use a Mushroom to accelerate. Only one can be used at a time, however. Also, the kart can turn around with a flick of the Control Stick, but not during acceleration.

UpB 1 - Super Jump (origin: Super Mario Bros. 2) - Toad crouches down to charge up power. He flashes, then launches upward, damaging any foes in his way. This third jump covers quite a bit of vertical ground, and while it is possible to move slightly in a horizontal direction of your choosing, the amount of horizontal movement is minimal by comparison.

UpB 2 - Surprise! (origin: Super Mario All-Stars - SMB) - Remember how, when you beat a castle in the SMAS version of SMB, all those Toads escaped from a giant bag? Think Fox's Fire Fox attack, but Toad shooting out of a burlap bag with confetti instead of fire.

DownB - Turnip Toss (origin: Super Mario Bros. 2) - Essentially the same as Peach's move with a few changes. Sick turnips and Mr. Saturn do not appear; instead, Toad can pull POW Blocks (damage all enemies on-screen), Potion (from SMB2; Toad "exits" through a Subcon door, essentially making him invisible for a few seconds) and Mushrooms (heal a bit of health)

 

[Fawriel]

Yay, appreciation! ^^

The term's bicycle kick indeed! I'll go fix it now.
I like some of your ideas, too... with so many roles, Toad should probably have a moveset with more varied origins... and another Up-b with two variations? Interesting.

By the way, I know that Toad's strength is speed most of the time... but I decided that, matching him up against people like Fox, his speed wouldn't look all that extraordinary, what with his tiny size and little feet, so I imagined his ground movement to be about the speed of Falco in Melee. His speed is instead seen in how quickly he performs actions like jumps and attacks and how he bounces around like a rubber ball.

 

[PrinnyFlute]

Toad wouldn't be a bad addition, though I'm curious to see how he'd fit on the battlefield.

Spoiler

Hey, if we get Toad, can we have Toadette, too?

 

[Sir Jigsbee]

and what was toad, a minor character in most of the games except for two, and one was a tetris wannabe. and you forgot to mention how most of the other 15 were either small cameos, sports games, party games, and kart games. by your logic we should let waluigi in too.

No,no,no,NO! Toad has appeared in countlessly many games. He's been PLAYABLE in at least 17. In one of those games, Toad WAS the hero, if you chose to play as him (ie SMB2)

fawful on the other hand had a major role in the first game in that not only was he second in command but he carried cackletta's spirit so it could be transfered to bowser, and without him the game would be an hour shorter. then he was a crazed shop keeper with plans for world domination in the second game.
so ie jigglybee, fawful>toad, you loose

oh and I HAVE FURY!!!!!!!

Fawful = Secondary villain in one game; Shopkeeper in other game
Toad = HERO in one game; player in one game; sportsman/racer in at LEAST 15 games.

ie TOAD>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Fawful

"I'm the best!"

 

[Masque]

By the way, I know that Toad's strength is speed most of the time... but I decided that, matching him up against people like Fox, his speed wouldn't look all that extraordinary, what with his tiny size and little feet, so I imagined his ground movement to be about the speed of Falco in Melee. His speed is instead seen in how quickly he performs actions like jumps and attacks and how he bounces around like a rubber ball.

See, it's hard for me to say on that point. I'm used to the SMB2 idea of Toad being very strong and very fast but terrible at jumping. The Super Jump would help, but it makes the most sense to me. I think Fox / Falco speed is appropriate; in fact, Fox's stats would be almost appropriate. Toad would be light, quick and hard-hitting, but his poor jump would balance out against the positive aspects and likewise contrast with the Space Animals.

And I say "blah" to Toadette. I don't mind her, really, but I would like to see a whole slew of other characters before her. Plus it would ruin Toad's sole mushroom competitor appeal.

"I'm the best!" is such a cute Toad quote. I'm becoming partial to "Wowzer!" from MP8.

 

[I Like Smash...]

i think it would be awesome if he was a playable character...
hes funny-looking...
and i think it would be hilarious to send someboyd big like Bowser flying with the little dude...
but i dont see it happening...
i hope im wrong though...

 

[Masque]

i think it would be awesome if he was a playable character...
hes funny-looking...
and i think it would be hilarious to send someboyd big like Bowser flying with the little dude...
but i dont see it happening...
i hope im wrong though...

I hope you're wrong, too! But it's good to see someone else that would love to dominate over big bad villains--especially Bowser--with our favorite mushroom man. And I think you take the cake for biggest fan of ellipses.

 

[Osi]

While I know the character doesn't fit it I think a all speed toad like fox would be nice. Add a few head smash moves and it's set.

 

[Masque]

While I know the character doesn't fit it I think a all speed toad like fox would be nice. Add a few head smash moves and it's set.

What? Toad DEFINITELY fits a speedy moveset. Fox would probably be the general idea, but Toad's jump is greatly diminished. His recovery would be better from his UpB (maybe SideB if he gets the kart), but I think that would balance out.

 

[Icey]

in my opinion, Toad will definitely be in Brawl. Now, whether or not he will be playable or an assist trophy is the answer we will be waiting for.

 

[I Like Smash...]

And I think you take the cake for biggest fan of ellipses.

WOOHOO!!!
anyway...
Toad has my vote for Brawl...

 

[L_Cancel]

Anyone who doesn't want Toad because of Peach's B move, I just want to point out that they could easily make it so she pulls out Toadsworth instead of Toad. That would make more sense considering Toadsworth is now basically an adviser to Peach. This way, Toad being a character would still work without altering Peach's moveset. Toad fans, and Peach fans rejoice.

 

[Masque]

Anyone who doesn't want Toad because of Peach's B move, I just want to point out that they could easily make it so she pulls out Toadsworth instead of Toad. That would make more sense considering Toadsworth is now basically an adviser to Peach. This way, Toad being a character would still work without altering Peach's moveset. Toad fans, and Peach fans rejoice.

Yayyy, we have the same brain! Or at least we think on the same wavelengths on one particular subject. Seriously, though, it's the most basic and logical change imaginable. I would personally prefer to see an entirely different move there, preferably one involving SPP, but still. Good stuff either way.

 

[Star105]

Toad wouldn't be a bad addition, though I'm curious to see how he'd fit on the battlefield.

Spoiler

Hey, if we get Toad, can we have Toadette, too?

well...... i agree though but toadette will probably be a palette for toad if he makes it into brawl.
I just want toad in the game as a playable character.

 

[Circus]

well...... i agree though but toadette will probably be a palette for toad if he makes it into brawl.
I just want toad in the game as a playable character.

That would be pretty odd, being as Toad and Toadette have different genders. Toad would essentially be getting an instant sex change or dressing in drag.

Not that there's anything wrong with either of those options.

 

[Masque]

That would be pretty odd, being as Toad and Toadette have different genders. Toad would essentially be getting an instant sex change or dressing in drag.

Not that there's anything wrong with either of those options.

lol Agreed. I'm not going to be doing it, but if that's what someone wants, they might as well be able to do it.

Toadette has no chance of being a PC in Brawl, but we might see her as an AT. The most she'll appear as is a palette-swap for Toad. I still have hope for Toad!

 

[Sir Jigsbee]

I think its possible that palette swaps will be a much more important affair in this game to include similiar characters. Toad is way too similiar to Toadette to pass off the oportunity (appearance-wise). There could even be others, like Dr. Mario as a palette-swap of Mario (Daisy was in Melee as a palette-swap of Peach!).

Also, instead of replacing Peach's B-move with Toadsworth, it should be completely different. Like a SPP move or a SPM move!

 

[Masque]

I think its possible that palette swaps will be a much more important affair in this game to include similiar characters. Toad is way too similiar to Toadette to pass off the oportunity (appearance-wise). There could even be others, like Dr. Mario as a palette-swap of Mario (Daisy was in Melee as a palette-swap of Peach!).

Also, instead of replacing Peach's B-move with Toadsworth, it should be completely different. Like a SPP move or a SPM move!

Palette-swapping is a likely option. On the other hand, the advent of ATs makes it harder to say which will be a palette option and which will make it in as an AT. Daisy and Doc have high chances of making it into Brawl as ATs, while Toadette's chances are somewhat lower. It's difficult to say until we see one of them get reverse-confirmed.

I definitely agree about replacing B with an SPP move! I'd like to see the Chargebrella, or just some incorporation of Parry.

 

[Tiamat]

Anyone who doesn't want Toad because of Peach's B move, I just want to point out that they could easily make it so she pulls out Toadsworth instead of Toad. That would make more sense considering Toadsworth is now basically an adviser to Peach. This way, Toad being a character would still work without altering Peach's moveset. Toad fans, and Peach fans rejoice.

They'll probably just remove the move completely and replace it with a Super Princess Peach move. They can't just ignore the game Peach WAS THE STAR OF, after all, and they have to remove SOMETHING to make room for moves from that game.

 

[Red_Maniac]

I don't really see why Toad can't be in Brawl. I would be REALLY surprised if he didn't make it.

 

[Masque]

I don't really see why Toad can't be in Brawl. I would be REALLY surprised if he didn't make it.

As would I, my friend! People get so pessimistic about it, but I think that Toad has the best chance out of all the other Mario characters. If another gets a spot on the roster over Toad, I will be deeply upset.

And agreed about SPP! The B move was just a filler, not to mention a move that paints Toad in a bad light. Fill it in with Parry and we'll all be happy!

 

[Gindor]

I'm not that much of a toad fan, but I would be interested int toad and happy if had a speed/defensive moveset, that represented his sports and vaegtable picking days. I think he should have a annoying and counter attacking styled gamepley to provoke other players to attack his near ultimate defenses and get counter attacked painfully.
YAY MINDGAMES!

 

[Masque]

I'm not that much of a toad fan, but I would be interested int toad and happy if had a speed/defensive moveset, that represented his sports and vaegtable picking days. I think he should have a annoying and counter attacking styled gamepley to provoke other players to attack his near ultimate defenses and get counter attacked painfully.
YAY MINDGAMES!

It's interestng that you bring up this point, especially because of Toad's stats in Mario Strikers Charged--which I have yet to actually play, but I've certainly heard about it. In any case, a defensive countering style would be rather interesting, especially giving the offense style of Smash. If anything, though, Toad needs speed. From that point, it's up to Sakurai to determine which style of Toad he wants to endorse: the quick and powerful (retro Toad of SMB2) or the quick and defensive (modern Toad of MSC). Only time will tell...hopefully we'll know by December 3rd, if not sooner!

 

[Gindor]

Toad would be a very fast moving character with very low power, but a lot of stun, counter, defending (as in immune to damage), annoying (like his taunt), and recovery moves. He wouldn't need a lot jump stat, because of his defenseive skills. He would be like a fly (annoying), making you want to swat him away (meaning attack him), but when you try swat him, he kills you with a counter attack. He would either make his foes run from him (out of fear), or try to kill him first and fast.
I am now a fan of toad, and can't wait to see him in smash!

 

[digifreak642]

Toad would be a very fast moving character with very low power, but a lot of stun, counter, defending (as in immune to damage), annoying (like his taunt), and recovery moves. He wouldn't need a lot jump stat, because of his defenseive skills. He would be like a fly (annoying), making you want to swat him away (meaning attack him), but
when you try swat him, he kills you with a counter attack. He would either make his foes run from him (out of fear), or try to kill him first and fast.
I am now a fan of toad, and can't wait to see him in smash!

Welcome to the legion of Toad fans!

 

[Masque]

I am now a fan of toad, and can't wait to see him in smash!

Yayyy! We are always glad to welcome more to the club. Thanks for your support! I like your idea for Toad. It's neat to see a very counter-oriented character. I can't say whether or not Nintendo feels such a stance is appropriate, but time will tell. Would it were able to tell us now!

 

[Star105]

I still want toad in brawl he would make some addition to the cast :mushroom:

 

[Blackadder]

If toad was in, he'd replace Pichu as the Joke character.
Anyone that wants him in for real must be on LSD...
It's just such an insane thought, him being a non-joke.
I think he'll be an AT anyways.

 

[digifreak642]

I'm dissapointed in you, Blackadder! Why would Toad be a joke character? He may become an AT, but us Toad fans hope for him to be playable.

 

[ClarkJables]

if toad was in he would be the quint-essential LSD character. in fact he needs a move where he uses his mushroom powers to make everyone trip out by releasing spores that reverse their movements and makes em loopy, that and the summon mushroom power i posted eariler, hell i might even make a toad moveset

 

[Gindor]

if toad was in he would be the quint-essential LSD character. in fact he needs a move where he uses his mushroom powers to make everyone trip out by releasing spores that reverse their movements and makes em loopy, that and the summon mushroom power i posted eariler, hell i might even make a toad moveset

The dizzy shroom spores, is a good idea. It would match incredibly well with his annoy/counter attack style. Maybe when your making the moveset, you can make it the annoy/counter attack style, since I don't know how to make a toad moveset?

 

[Masque]

if toad was in he would be the quint-essential LSD character. in fact he needs a move where he uses his mushroom powers to make everyone trip out by releasing spores that reverse their movements and makes em loopy, that and the summon mushroom power i posted eariler, hell i might even make a toad moveset

I actually think that's a really neat idea! Think of how frustrating it would be for your opponent: they come in as Marth, slashing for the kill when suddenly they're turned around and slashing into the ground because their controls have gone all wonky. Cool stuff.

 

[MirageofMadness]

I wouldn't be surprised if Toad is in Brawl, but i'm honestly not sure how I feel about it, since, IMO, he is sort of...useless? I mean, the fact that Peach pulled him out to use as a meat shield seems like a testament to how useless he truly is.

BUT- He doesn't have to be this way, necessarily! My theory is that Toad will be in it as a Mario Kart influenced character, perhaps even in his kart. Here are a few reasons why I think this is possible:

1. It would give the Mario Kart stage a character to go with it
2. Toad is hard to imagine as not being virtually worthless regarding attacks, so having him use a Mario-Kart-inspired moveset seems like a very fitting way to both tie in the Mario Kart games, as well as give Toad that little extra "oomph" he needs.
3. Much of Peach's moves were inspired by Super Mario 2 (the turnips, the floating) and by the Mario Sports games (the tennis racket, the golf club), so I would imagine that it would make plenty of sense to have a character that manages to use Mario Kart-style attacks.

This is just a suggestion, but I don't think it's that impossible. He could still have other moves that are made up for him, like a defensive spore attack or other counter attack moves.

However, if he were to be in a Kart, I really have no clue how his double-jump could work.

 

[Gindor]

I wouldn't be surprised if Toad is in Brawl, but i'm honestly not sure how I feel about it, since, IMO, he is sort of...useless? I mean, the fact that Peach pulled him out to use as a meat shield seems like a testament to how useless he truly is.

BUT- He doesn't have to be this way, necessarily! My theory is that Toad will be in it as a Mario Kart influenced character, perhaps even in his kart. Here are a few reasons why I think this is possible:

1. It would give the Mario Kart stage a character to go with it
2. Toad is hard to imagine as not being virtually worthless regarding attacks, so having him use a Mario-Kart-inspired moveset seems like a very fitting way to both tie in the Mario Kart games, as well as give Toad that little extra "oomph" he needs.
3. Much of Peach's moves were inspired by Super Mario 2 (the turnips, the floating) and by the Mario Sports games (the tennis racket, the golf club), so I would imagine that it would make plenty of sense to have a character that manages to use Mario Kart-style attacks.

This is just a suggestion, but I don't think it's that impossible. He could still have other moves that are made up for him, like a defensive spore attack or other counter attack moves.

However, if he were to be in a Kart, I really have no clue how his double-jump could work.

I think that he will most probably be in brawl for these reasons (including one of yours).
1-Toad is playable in his turnip picking/throwing game and mario cart games.
2-They have a mario cart level.
3-Also supporting the cart level is the banana peel.

Maybe peach will drop the turnips, or share them with toad (the move I mean).
Like said before, toad's cart maybe will be like wario's chopper.
And for the double and normal jumping in his cart, he could use the feather from the much older mario cart games.

Edit-I still would want to see his annoy/counter attack style even including his cart.

 

[ClarkJables]

well i picture toad as a powerful, small, and fast character with loads of upper body strength and stubby legs that give him poor jumping ability.

 

[Masque]

I wouldn't be surprised if Toad is in Brawl, but i'm honestly not sure how I feel about it, since, IMO, he is sort of...useless? I mean, the fact that Peach pulled him out to use as a meat shield seems like a testament to how useless he truly is.

BUT- He doesn't have to be this way, necessarily! My theory is that Toad will be in it as a Mario Kart influenced character, perhaps even in his kart. Here are a few reasons why I think this is possible:

1. It would give the Mario Kart stage a character to go with it
2. Toad is hard to imagine as not being virtually worthless regarding attacks, so having him use a Mario-Kart-inspired moveset seems like a very fitting way to both tie in the Mario Kart games, as well as give Toad that little extra "oomph" he needs.
3. Much of Peach's moves were inspired by Super Mario 2 (the turnips, the floating) and by the Mario Sports games (the tennis racket, the golf club), so I would imagine that it would make plenty of sense to have a character that manages to use Mario Kart-style attacks.

This is just a suggestion, but I don't think it's that impossible. He could still have other moves that are made up for him, like a defensive spore attack or other counter attack moves.

However, if he were to be in a Kart, I really have no clue how his double-jump could work.

I hadn't even taken into account the fact that the Mario Circuit had yet to be considered! I'm sure there will be more stages to go around for the Mario reps, so this stage would be perfect for Toad. I think that Toad's kart would work like Wario's chopper: you can drive it around when necessary, and only one is onstage at a time. Toad's moveset would take root in SMB2, though, as far as I'm concerned. He started there, so it's only natural that one of his biggest roles is heavily accounted for. Toad's jump is poor anyhow, so I think he would have two weak jumps and then the kart for horizontal recovery and an UpB for vertical help.

 

[ClarkJables]

ok here is my toad moveset, its only b moves but they are incredibly detailed

Speed- 4/5 Power- 4/5 Defense- 3/5 Jump- 1/5

^B- parachute hat, toad takes his hat off and it inflates like a parachute, allowing him to float as if he had an umbrella, and is canceled when he is attacked or when the down button is pushed. While on this parachute his legs flail back and forth, doing damage to anyone who touches them.
Strategy- since this move grant toad no extra height, but gives him floatiness it is best to use this after getting knocked off stage to float back, so if you double jump back and are still below the level of edge grab this move does you no good. Another good way to use this move is to jump over someone and activate it…

B>- summons mushroom, toad reaches down, pulls an item out of the ground, and throws it in front of him. Each item has a different effect, whether it is positive or negative. Move cannot be done in the air
Item list-
Poison mushroom- 5% damage every second for 10 seconds
death mushroom- instant KO
1 up mushroom- gives an extra head in stock battles, or raise score by 1
regular mushroom- heals player 20%
giant mushroom- turn giant for 30 seconds
Turnip- does 15% damage when thrown
Shrink mushroom- shrinks for 1 minute
Bomb- explodes doing 20% damage

VB- release spores, toad releases spores from his mushroom that spreads out in a cloud around him. If an opponent enters the cloud he becomes confused and his movements are reversed, meaning that up becomes down, left becomes right, and visa-versa. This not only effects general movements but button combos, so pressing VB while confused produces your ^B move. Can be used in the air
Strategy- this move is incredibly effective against speed characters, comboers, and jugglers who would otherwise have an unfair advantage over toad because of his poor jumping ability, and if you’ve ever played earthbound when you get a mushroom on your head you know how it feels to have your movements reversed.

B- hat trick, toad climbs into his enormous hat, negating all damage inflicted upon him while in hat. If done in the air the hat will spin, doing damage to anyone it hits in its decent and bouncing twice after hitting the ground. Watch out though because toad can be kicked while in hat trick mode. Lasts three attacks

Final smash- mushroom cloud, toad’s hat builds up energy and expands until it explodes releasing a large cloud of poison gas onto the field. All opponents caught in the blast are poisoned and stunned for 20 seconds.
Toads A moves are a mix of wrestling, grappling, and tackling moves which utilize his speed and power to the fullest. Oh and did I mention that he has the weakest jump in the game.

 

[Kirby knight]

o_o That mushroom on Toad is a hat? I always thought it was a part of his head. If it is a hat does anyone have a picture of what Toad looks like without out it?

 

[ClarkJables]

we've never seen what he looks like without it

 

[Gindor]

it probably is a hat, and part of the guard's uniform, plus look at toadette.