Toad/Captain Toad for Smash, Toad Brigade Assemble!

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So now that Nintendo's E3 presentation has passed, we now know of the next 2 DLC fighters, both of which are heavy-hitting third parties. The only question is, where do us Toad fans (and fans of other first parties) go from here? I've seen many people try to think of what 3rd party could possibly top Banjo and Kazooie in 4th and 5th Challenger Packs, and that may lead some to scoff at us for supporting a character that's "not exciting enough".

However, I personally don't believe they will try to "top" BanKazu. Now that the big E3 reveals are out... I think the 4th and/or 5th challengers may actually be first parties. Smash has usually had a history with showing off their more "spectacular" characters first. I think our chances of being in the 4th or 5th packs are pretty good, in all honesty (and not just Toad, but simply a first party in general). But, what do you all think?
 
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Hmm... so now that Nintendo's E3 presentation has passed, we now know of the next 2 DLC fighters, both of which are heavy-hitting third parties. The only question is, where do us Toad fans (and fans of other first parties) go from here? I've seen many people try to think of what 3rd party could possibly top Banjo and Kazooie in 4th and 5th Challenger Packs, and that may lead some to scoff at us for supporting a character that's "not exciting enough".

However, I personally don't believe they will try to "top" BanKazu. Now that the big E3 reveals are out... I think the 4th and 5th challengers may actually be first parties. Smash has usually had a history with showing off their more "spectacular" characters first. I think our chances of being in the 4th or 5th packs are pretty good, in all honesty (and not just Toad, but simply a first party in general). But, what do you all think?
I must admit I'm concerned we're not getting a single first party as I have a feeling we may get Resident Evil representation and maybe Crash Bandicoot...however if Banjo's proven anything it's that the rules we fans seem to set in place are arbitary at best.

As much as I like both Jill/Chris and Crash I'd sacrifice them in a heartbeat for Toad and Dixie just to complete Nintendo's All Star lineup for Ultimate.
Okay, there's Bandana Waddle Dee and Waluigi as other big names, but Toad and Dixie have been lead protagonists in their own games so that would make me prioritise them first.

The one thing I see many people bring up is the DLC Spirit Board regarding holding first parties back...

So on that note; let's see if we can come up with a Spirit Board related to the Toads now, all original, no repeats of current spirits;
  1. Hint Toad
  2. Yellow Toad
  3. Bank Toad
  4. Mail Toad
  5. Purple Captain Toad/Player 2 Captain Toad
  6. Wingo
  7. Draggadon
  8. Cookatiel
  9. Flaptor
  10. Mole
  11. Mummy-Me
  12. Golden Draggadon
  13. Pixel Toad
  14. Wall-Eye
  15. Stumper
  16. Mud Trooper
  17. Turnip
  18. Power Gem
  19. Super Pickaxe
  20. Double Cherry
  21. Minecart
  22. Super Crown
  23. Turnip Cannon
  24. Invinicibility Mushroom
I doubled Joker's measly eleven DLC Spirit Board with surprising ease.
This didn't even require any Wario's Woods stuff either just purely characters and items that appear in the Captain Toad Treasure Tracker game and Mail Toad, who is missing in said game, but an official member of the Brigade in both Odyssey and the Galaxy games.

I think maybe people make a bigger deal out of the DLC Spirit Board than is needed after this exercise. Treasure Tracker isn't even a very character heavy game but there's already more than enough to warrant it getting it's own Spirit Board based off this even if you remove the items and just have characters only.
 

jreed3842

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I must admit I'm concerned we're not getting a single first party as I have a feeling we may get Resident Evil representation and maybe Crash Bandicoot...however if Banjo's proven anything it's that the rules we fans seem to set in place are arbitary at best.

As much as I like both Jill/Chris and Crash I'd sacrifice them in a heartbeat for Toad and Dixie just to complete Nintendo's All Star lineup for Ultimate.
Okay, there's Bandana Waddle Dee and Waluigi as other big names, but Toad and Dixie have been lead protagonists in their own games so that would make me prioritise them first.

The one thing I see many people bring up is the DLC Spirit Board regarding holding first parties back...

So on that note; let's see if we can come up with a Spirit Board related to the Toads now, all original, no repeats of current spirits;
  1. Hint Toad
  2. Yellow Toad
  3. Bank Toad
  4. Mail Toad
  5. Purple Captain Toad/Player 2 Captain Toad
  6. Wingo
  7. Draggadon
  8. Cookatiel
  9. Flaptor
  10. Mole
  11. Mummy-Me
  12. Golden Draggadon
  13. Pixel Toad
  14. Wall-Eye
  15. Stumper
  16. Mud Trooper
  17. Turnip
  18. Power Gem
  19. Super Pickaxe
  20. Double Cherry
  21. Minecart
  22. Super Crown
  23. Turnip Cannon
  24. Invinicibility Mushroom
I doubled Joker's measly eleven DLC Spirit Board with surprising ease.
This didn't even require any Wario's Woods stuff either just purely characters and items that appear in the Captain Toad Treasure Tracker game and Mail Toad, who is missing in said game, but an official member of the Brigade in both Odyssey and the Galaxy games.

I think maybe people make a bigger deal out of the DLC Spirit Board than is needed after this exercise. Treasure Tracker isn't even a very character heavy game but there's already more than enough to warrant it getting it's own Spirit Board based off this even if you remove the items and just have characters only.
I don’t think we’re getting any first Party characters either.
Honestly I had no idea who the first 2 DLC characters were.
And Banjo-Kazooie has ruined my streak of not being interested enough in the DLC character to wanna spend money on it. I haven’t spent a single cent in any Smash DLC (EXCEPT to get the Toad costume in Smash 4)
But Banjo is the first character in a looong time to actually get me excited. I didn’t even know I wanted them. Lol

But I was chatting with my boyfriend last night. The way things are looking, I think all DLC characters are gonna be 3rd parties.

I still am holding on to hope for our mushroom boy tho.
No matter how bad it looks, I just can’t bring myself to completely give up.
 
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I don’t think we’re getting any first Party characters either.
Honestly I had no idea who the first 2 DLC characters were.
And Banjo-Kazooie has ruined my streak of not being interested enough in the DLC character to wanna spend money on it. I haven’t spent a single cent in any Smash DLC (EXCEPT to get the Toad costume in Smash 4)
But Banjo is the first character in a looong time to actually get me excited. I didn’t even know I wanted them. Lol

But I was chatting with my boyfriend last night. The way things are looking, I think all DLC characters are gonna be 3rd parties.

I still am holding on to hope for our mushroom boy tho.
No matter how bad it looks, I just can’t bring myself to completely give up.
That's the spirit friend. Though quite a difficult battle as many of us have endured for all these years, I will always be hopeful for Toad to make an appearance in Smash one day. I'm not as active in Smash speculation as I had been in previous entries; however, this mushroom retainer needs all the help he can get.

Pleasantly content by both Banjo-Kazooie and the Heroes from Dragon Quest (have many memories of Banjo back in the day and I played a fair share of the DQ remakes for the DS as well). Both well deserved in their own right and very well made (Banjo/Kazooie are oozing with charm while the various DQ spells are great throwbacks).

It's quite amusing to see the new Toad/Toadette sprites in Super Mario Maker 2 as well (especially the SMW appearance). Looks like we can even select the character we want to use during the stage creation modes as seen by the gameplay videos (almost makes me want to purchase the game for the playable Toad and Toadette alone!).
 
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Okay, delve into the idea further fogbadge, let's hear about some of your concepts and ideas!
it really was just of of those spur of the moment ideas when i was thinking about toad ideas it never really went anywhere beyond toad brigade in starshrooms blasting shroobs

on the subject of e3, im with the idea that itll be all 3rd parties for dlc and these dragon ball guys i mean dragon quest guys are taking up a few of those character slots they data minded so its a bit of a blow to the idea of a second fighter pass, still banjo & kazooie got me so hyped im almost tempted to buy the whole fighter pass even though im not interested in joker and hero
 
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This is simply amazing! The amount of dedication KingBob did for the moveset, trailer, and even the model is outstanding overall! Having a reveal trailer like this for Toad/Captain Toad would be perfect in a future Smash title with a bit of payback to Peach (nothing personal against the princess, but Sakurai forcefully keeping Toad as a move after all these years really left a sour feeling). Definitely have a lot of respect for the amount of work put into this project.

I quite like how some moves even seem a bit similar to Toad's moveset from Smash Bros. Crusade with the down smash looking like that spore burst move he had there. Plus the aerial throws akin to SMB2 is a great nod to Toad's infamous superhuman strength. Let's hope the Turnip Cannon will be able to be implemented as well for a final smash as otherwise the kit is fitting together very well.

Regardless, every move in this kit seems very familiar to what we've seen from Toad's various roles (Toad's platformer days, role as an item shop host, a popular kart rider, a literal Indiana Jones-incarnate in the Mushroom Kingdom) - all of which is a good thing! Additionally, all of these are moves I can see Toad performing in the game - KingBob even goes on to mention how few of Toad's moves actually use his stubby limbs despite this being a silly argument in the first place from those opposing Toad considering characters like Kirby, Jigglypuff, AC characters, and of course a rather infamous plant playable in the game. Even the spores can be considered fitting as a result of his general anatomy as well as Smash Bros. Melee already establishing that Toads are capable of emitting spores offensively.

At this rate, I'd either accept Toad or Captain Toad as the default tbh (along with Toadette as a prominent alt with unique VO and effects) - a playable Toad is very long overdue in Smash. The jumping inability of the Captain even strikes me more as an innovative design to play around rather than it being a complete exclusion in his case as well. There is plenty of material for the Toads as the video illustrated; however, it is ultimately up to Sakurai to take the charge.

Toads are continuously being used as multiplayer characters in the Mario platform titles - hopefully Nintendo continues to push the Captain Toad series onwards as well. It really baffles me as to how Sakurai keeps passing over Toad as if it were any other Mario character with the credentials as Toad - there would be a massive outrage as to the exclusion of the character. Imagine if Waluigi even had half the main series appearances that the Toads had over the course of their history. Really a shame how overlooked little Toad is.
You pretty much summed up everything that I was going to say about this phenomenal Project M mod. It is a really thorough love letter to Toad and all the various roles he has had over the past 30 years. It might actually be the best Project M moveset that I have ever seen, and that says a lot. It is a shame so few people now play Project M nowadays, as I believe this mod would help convince many people just what Toad could bring to Super Smash Bros., and that he would not be a "boring" addition like many in the Smash Bubble would think him to be.

Toad fans have their work cut out for them. Waluigi and Geno have among the largest fanbases in the Smash Bubble, and Paper Mario has a very large fanbase as well (and probably would be even bigger if a great well-received Paper Mario title is made again). Toad has a lot of competition going forward. However, one thing Toad has over other characters is a very rich history spanning 30 years. From 1988's Super Mario Bros. 2, to 1994's Wario's Woods, to 2014's Captain Toad. Toad has brought new inventive things throughout each generation that makes him as much a "can do anything" man as his likely idol, Mario.
 
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You pretty much summed up everything that I was going to say about this phenomenal Project M mod. It is a really thorough love letter to Toad and all the various roles he has had over the past 30 years. It might actually be the best Project M moveset that I have ever seen, and that says a lot. It is a shame so few people now play Project M nowadays, as I believe this mod would help convince many people just what Toad could bring to Super Smash Bros., and that he would not be a "boring" addition like many in the Smash Bubble would think him to be.

Toad fans have their work cut out for them. Waluigi and Geno have among the largest fanbases in the Smash Bubble, and Paper Mario has a very large fanbase as well (and probably would be even bigger if a great well-received Paper Mario title is made again). Toad has a lot of competition going forward. However, one thing Toad has over other characters is a very rich history spanning 30 years. From 1988's Super Mario Bros. 2, to 1994's Wario's Woods, to 2014's Captain Toad. Toad has brought new inventive things throughout each generation that makes him as much a "can do anything" man as his likely idol, Mario.
Not sure it matters, but Toad fans also have to worry about their voice being split between Captain Toad and Toad himself. I don't think it matters too much considering everyone here would be OK with either, but I'm not sure if there's division elsewhere that makes the fan-bases smaller. Just something to consider.
 
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You pretty much summed up everything that I was going to say about this phenomenal Project M mod. It is a really thorough love letter to Toad and all the various roles he has had over the past 30 years. It might actually be the best Project M moveset that I have ever seen, and that says a lot. It is a shame so few people now play Project M nowadays, as I believe this mod would help convince many people just what Toad could bring to Super Smash Bros., and that he would not be a "boring" addition like many in the Smash Bubble would think him to be.

Toad fans have their work cut out for them. Waluigi and Geno have among the largest fanbases in the Smash Bubble, and Paper Mario has a very large fanbase as well (and probably would be even bigger if a great well-received Paper Mario title is made again). Toad has a lot of competition going forward. However, one thing Toad has over other characters is a very rich history spanning 30 years. From 1988's Super Mario Bros. 2, to 1994's Wario's Woods, to 2014's Captain Toad. Toad has brought new inventive things throughout each generation that makes him as much a "can do anything" man as his likely idol, Mario.
King Bob definitely did a very good job with that moveset and I too hope more will get to enjoy Project M as a result of Toad's kit as well. Kits like this and the Captain Toad moveset made by YoshiandToad YoshiandToad really prove that the Toads have plenty of unique fighting potential for Smash Bros., and that we are still missing an essential Nintendo All Star.

Not sure it matters, but Toad fans also have to worry about their voice being split between Captain Toad and Toad himself. I don't think it matters too much considering everyone here would be OK with either, but I'm not sure if there's division elsewhere that makes the fan-bases smaller. Just something to consider.
I can see the concern in this as well, as I too have been leaning towards Captain Toad in recent times as well.

However, don't get me wrong - I still absolutely love Toad himself and still have a special place in my heart for him to be in Smash Bros. After all, Super Mario Bros. 2 was the very first Mario title I owned as a child, and the "mushroom guy" was always my to go character due to his distinct look and playstyle. However, I do wish that Nintendo would make Toad return with red spots and blue vest as a playable character just to clear up the confusion with him and Blue Toad. This is a very minor nitpick as having both Toad and Toadette playable together in SMM2 is a blessing; however, it's a trend we have been seeing as of late with the playable Toad having blue spots instead (even SMM2's storymode has regular Toad and Toadette as primary characters; yet, the playable Toad is once again blue spotted). Even SM3DW had this, and that was probably the closest game to SMB2 we have gotten so far - but to be fair, Toad's very first playable appearance also had him with blue spots so this along with gameplay clarity (to contrast Mario's red palette) may have come up first instead.

Captain Toad is the closest we have gotten to getting a major Toad with a very distinguished look; yet, still maintains a very close look to Toad himself and the bond with Toadette too. Furthermore, I feel that in the long run having Captain Toad being pushed can lead to having a major Toad in the main roster more often or even provide Toad with an alternate costume in various games as well such as Mario Kart (or Captain as a standalone character as well).

Despite all this, I am very happy to see that we are getting more playable Toads in the main series games. While we may never know what tarnished Blue Toad and Yellow Toad's bond to appear on the same screen in NSMB Deluxe - having Toad and Toadette as playable characters in SMM2 is honestly how the playable Toad duo since NSMB Wii should have been since Day 1. It just feels so right alongside Mario and Luigi for some reason!
 
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I always wondered if Smash basically connects all the video game worlds together, which worlds would the Captain explore...personally I love the idea of him teaming up with Lara Croft to raid some tombs together.


Also check out the Toads in the opening for Luigi's Mansion 3:

Apparently all those years of practice on Mario Kart didn't quite pay off...would help if he could see over the wheel mind you...
 
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Captain Toad and Lara Croft - now that's something I never thought of, but would love to see! We've seen a Mario and Rabbids game, I think nothing is truly impossible at this rate!

Also that opening for LM3 is extremely adorable! Toad is lucky the brakes and accelerator have been elevated for him as well, but least he drove the crew safely enough to their destination! Great to see Blue Toad and Yellow Toad there as well as well though looks like they're on duty as Peach's waterboys this time around. :p Cinematics like this are why I adore the Mario series and its characters.
 
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