GrosMinou
Turbo Scrub
Well, it wouldnt look so good if they admit some character are stronger then others, especially if the ultimate goal is to have a balanced cast...
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Tier List Speculation
- Thread starter OkamiBW
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Radical Larry
Smash Lord
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Never thought about it that way...
But wouldn't that practically turn out in the same situation as us making a tier list?
They say it's not up to them to decide. They are trying to make a balanced game, so where characters fall in regards to the community is where they will be.
If they were to come out with an official tier list themselves then it could come off as they are purposely trying to make x characters better than y characters. That's not what they want game wise.
If they released their own tierlist they'd basically be tipping their hand regarding potential changes. Like if they come out and say "we acknowledge that Fox is OP and Jiggs is dead last", then you know those two are getting changed.
Whereas if we just make our own tierlists they're free to say "you guys are all scrubs, we never listen to what you say" while secretly taking some of our suggestions anyway.
GrosMinou
Turbo Scrub
Maybe it would, but I think a tier list is subjective...We play the same game, but we dont all play the same matches. That's why (in my opinion) it is hard for people to agree on ONE tier list.
Oro?!
Smash Hero
Plenty of PMBR have made tier lists. Doesn't make us 100% right. There are varied opinions even among developers as to character strengths.
... what?
Radical Larry
Smash Lord
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Well, I kind of lost my tier list in the wind (meaning I forgot where the hell the page I posted it is), but if I can get it back, I would make a bit of minor changes after playing more of the game against others. But trust me, my tier list would be a good one, as well.
Seriously, I lost it long ago, and I can't find it :/
Seriously, I lost it long ago, and I can't find it :/
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Scuba Steve
Smash Ace
I'm not too sold on your tier list being good after that absurd armor suggestion you made for Ganon.
Well he is called Radical Larry. What did you expect?
Axxo
Smash Apprentice
Axxo
Smash Apprentice
woundedust
Smash Apprentice
Written under americas front door
woundedust
Smash Apprentice
Conservative thoughts and ideas,
What else.
And talking about early meta game tiers......
Zelda was once 8th on the tier list in melee
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Radical Larry
Smash Lord
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Eh, I forgot about that suggestion, and now I don't really like it now that you brought it back up.
Bryonato
Green Hat
What winning mu's does Ganon have, if any?
I hear the Ganon matchup isn't bad.
Scuba Steve
Smash Ace
I love Ganon dittos. Ganon wrecks himself so hard.
Bryonato
Green Hat
that's how i feel about ness dittos, except for the loving it part.
Alfonzo Bagpipez
Smash Lord
I'd say he might have a 55 - 45 against Pikachu if that's something.
They went even in Melee. Ganon got buffed a bit more than Pika.
But it's still just 55 - 45.
Claire Diviner
President
Isn't Ganon's MU vs Bowser in Ganon's favor, if by a little bit? Bowser can outrange Ganon I'm sure, but Ganon can effectively combo Bowser pretty hard despite the knockback of some of his attacks (aerials, in this case). The only real problem is setting Bowser up for said combos. While he can aerial Flame Choke other characters (minus some fast-fallers) into a grab to up throw and then juggle, Bowser's fatass can't prop up well enough from said Flame Choke, so you're forced to tech chase to get a grab.
Okay, maybe it's 45-55 in Bowser's favor after all.
Okay, maybe it's 45-55 in Bowser's favor after all.
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JOE!
Smash Hero
Anyone else believe many characters share the same tier placement? Like, multiple people in the #5 spot or such.
Claire Diviner
President
Mario and Dr. Mario.
Seriously though, I think it may be a bit too early to say. I mean, it's not like characters sharing a number couldn't happen, because it can, but I don't recall this happening in any first draft of a tier list.
1FD
Smash Ace
Well really you could look at Melee Tiers either official tiers OR whatever actually accurate tiers would be and no matter what basically every Tier Spot is shared in some way to some degree and it's a good testament to how a lot of characters could be swapped around or are swap-able and it wouldn't make much of a difference to the meaning of the tiers list AT ALL.
The same is for project M in that you could have 4/5 Tiers of 8/7 characters and each of the 7 Characters WITHIN each tier MIGHT AS WELL share a number.
When Melee could ALMOST do this for the whole cast with very few exceptions there's no way it's LESS doable with PM when so much work (YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN) is put in to actually make this a distinct quality of the GAME itself. Balance in goodness is pretty directly resulted from making things fun/well designed/etc at that even. OMG my vocabulary is getting better I'm talking to bamsey to much!
The same is for project M in that you could have 4/5 Tiers of 8/7 characters and each of the 7 Characters WITHIN each tier MIGHT AS WELL share a number.
When Melee could ALMOST do this for the whole cast with very few exceptions there's no way it's LESS doable with PM when so much work (YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN) is put in to actually make this a distinct quality of the GAME itself. Balance in goodness is pretty directly resulted from making things fun/well designed/etc at that even. OMG my vocabulary is getting better I'm talking to bamsey to much!
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Thane of Blue Flames
Fire is catching.
So ESAM didn't drop any sets in MD/VA except to Mew2King, and Chillin took 2 games off him across four Bo5 sets.
I think if you wanted to give Samus anti-spacy tech it worked, lol.
I think if you wanted to give Samus anti-spacy tech it worked, lol.
NickRiddle
#negativeNick
The last time ESAM played Chillin in Melee, ESAM won.
It's just ESAM being a better player.
It's just ESAM being a better player.
MrBigstuff
Smash Apprentice
ESAM can't be better, he plays Brawl Kappa
Yoshi can outspeed and outrange him a lot of the time. Neutral-B, Up-B, B-Air, pivot grab...They all do quite well against Ganon.
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Yoshi definitely has the tools to do well against ganon (and the rest of the cast for that matter), ganon just has that gimp potential against yoshi that few others have. Poor ganon, still prolly isn't enough.
Edit: in other news I played an ic main yesterday and I'm now convinced the yoshi beats em pretty convincingly.
Feel free to discuss.
Edit: in other news I played an ic main yesterday and I'm now convinced the yoshi beats em pretty convincingly.
Feel free to discuss.
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Hinichii.ez.™
insincere personality
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IC are weak..
Nguz95
Smash Lord
Yoshi is nuts. Seriously, that character will be the next Diddy Kong/Link.
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Nguz95
Smash Lord
Actually, I get to see that mu a lot. All roy has to do to take a stock is grab and uthrow, but diddy has a lot of tools to make that difficult. Roy has enough disjoint and mobility to make it hard for diddy to get in, but diddy's punish game is better. Honestly I think it's a very even mu.
DrinkingFood
Smash Hero
How the hell does diddy have a better punish game than Roy
There's like nobody Roy can't 0-to-death, diddy included, off of a dair sourspot launcher into fairs/uairs into 100+% into bair/fsmash/nB/offstage
Roy might have the best or tied for best punish game in PM
There's like nobody Roy can't 0-to-death, diddy included, off of a dair sourspot launcher into fairs/uairs into 100+% into bair/fsmash/nB/offstage
Roy might have the best or tied for best punish game in PM
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Nguz95
Smash Lord
It's relative. Diddy can survive longer than Roy, especially on a larger stage. Roy, on the other hand, gets mauled by
DrinkingFood
Smash Hero
Not to mention Roy will outright kill characters a lot of the time instead of relying on sending them offstage for a gimp like marth does