Social There are three of us now?! Good thing we are the true Link.

[zeldasmash]

Well....apparently you can Z-drop items out of hitstun...

https://twitter.com/_glacey/status/1070168741596618753

It's a bug apparently but still....interesting

 

[Zelkam]

 

[Blade of Evil's Bane]

Well....apparently you can Z-drop items out of hitstun...

https://twitter.com/_glacey/status/1070168741596618753

It's a bug apparently but still....interesting

Let's just hope this will be fixed with the day 1 patch...

View attachment 181592

 

[Rizen]

Let's just hope this will be fixed with the day 1 patch...

Why? We're on of the handful of characters who benefits.

 

[Rocketjay8]

Why? We're on of the handful of characters who benefits.

Do you really want Diddy to win neutral by losing neutral?

 

[Zelkam]

Remember when we could throw items to cancel hitstun when Sm4sh came out? Good times...

 

[Rizen]

Do you really want Diddy to win neutral by losing neutral?

You're blowing this out of proportion. A: it will be patched and B: how often is Diddy grabbed when holding a banana? It's not like he gets a free neutral win because this glitch (he gets one for being Diddy).

 

[Blade of Evil's Bane]

Why? We're on of the handful of characters who benefits.

Oh... simply because i prefer real buffs to sketchy bugs

For real tho, i'm all for Link benefiting from certain game mechanics... but you know, game mechanics that were intended to exist/considered in the overall balance of the game (i'm aware that the game won't be perfectly balanced as all things should be btw but i don't believe bugs can help reach a better balance).

But anyway, that's only my opinion and this will likely get fixed as you said.

 

[Rizen]

This is nothing; you guys should see brawl. If I can deal with chain grabs people can put up with z dropping in hitstun, until it's patched.

 

[JohnKnight416]

This is nothing; you guys should see brawl. If I can deal with chain grabs people can put up with z dropping in hitstun, until it's patched.

Well good thing chain grabbing is no longer a thing in Smash 4 and in Ultimate

 

[Deleted member]

Dang new things about Link everyday!

 

[Ryu_Ken]

First impressions of Link:

Spoiler: The Ultimate Link

He feels pretty different from Smash 4 Link, that's for sure. It's going to take me a while to get used to Ultimate's mechanics and Link's bomb recovery, but overall, he feels straight up improved from previous games. His ground attacks feel a tiny bit slower however, and not being able to neutral air with Tilt Attack on C-Stick or Slide Toss items the traditional way is going to take some getting used to (you can't jump-cancel throw them, you have to crouch/turn around during a dash and THEN tilt/smash throw them).
Still, Link's increased sword length is definitely noticeable, his grab is really good (especially shield grabbing), he has powerful moves to punish with out of a parry, his remote bomb is REALLY good offstage and stage control once you get your opponent up to a decent %, his old boomerang is back and good (the usual), his spin attack is still a really good OoS option and recovery move, and finally, his aerials... bless Nintendo for giving him the ability to have more landing options that are safe on shield.
Many of us will probably want to play Link as a mid-range swordfighter with plenty of zoning and stage control options at his disposal. Most of his ground attacks are still unsafe on shield, so you'll want to use dtilt and jab most of the time. Aerials are your friend due to the low lag they have and their range, so use them to pressure and approach. Boomerang will again be our go-to option to pressure the opponent, and it works even better at that thanks to having a returning hitbox. I don't see Arrows getting used too much until higher %s as a gimping/combo tool (remember you can pick up an arrow shot on stage and either throw/z-drop it at the opponent or stack it with neutral B for extra damage). Bombs have been pretty important for Link's gameplay, but in Ultimate, they're especially important. Remote Bombs have pretty high knockback, and they can kill opponents off-stage at high%. The stage control and pressure you get with them is pretty significant, and there's a lot of potential for setups/big brain plays with the ability to attack them to cause them to roll or fly in a direction.
To sum it up, don't play Link like / or else you'll get bodied. Focus on the items you have at your disposal and utilize his attack range, power, and aerials to zone and punish the opponent.

I got a chance to play Young Link as well, and while he does have faster attacks on the ground and overall, his attack range is a bit small, and he kills much later than Link does. I also didn't find myself using the Zair/Grab a lot because I felt his items and attacks do a better job at zoning and starting combos. I prefer Link's mid-range playstyle over YLink's aggressive playstyle, but they both compliment each other since one haves what the other lacks.

Some of it is a bit ranting, but I had to get my thoughts out.

 

[skydogc]

Do you really want Diddy to win neutral by losing neutral?

That's some 5-D underwater chess thinking right there.

 

[Sanjuro]

I feel like I’m having trouble getting used to the new engine. Loving Links new air game but his ground game doesn’t feel much better than smash 4 to me. It’s actually a little jarring

 

[Tri Knight]

I feel like I’m having trouble getting used to the new engine. Loving Links new air game but his ground game doesn’t feel much better than smash 4 to me. It’s actually a little jarring

I wanna say his frame data on ground is more or less the same. Been a bit since I saw the data. I dont think his ground game is much different, if at all.

I did notice he has more lag after running bomb throws though.

 

[Rizen]

I wanna say his frame data on ground is more or less the same. Been a bit since I saw the data. I dont think his ground game is much different, if at all.

I did notice he has more lag after running bomb throws though.

Jab has more endlag; he used to be able to combo upB from jab 2 at high %s for kills but can't now. I couldn't get Fair 1 to combo at all. Bair works and Link's grab>Dthrow has potential but needs to be tested vs a human mashing air dodge.



Well, I'll be the messenger: Link will have a rough time in ultimate.

SSB4 Link was undertuned but a well designed character and bombs were the keystone. I've said in the past bombs are the 1 thing keeping him from having a Ganon tier disadvantage state. All he needed were some minor frame data buffs to be high tier; f5 jab and Nair, F9 Dtilt, shave a frame off his js and all around endlag reduction (so basically what YL has).

Now here's how SSBU Link turned out. As positives: He got a js on par with everyone else and that's big. Dtilt probably combos much better with this js. His mobility was buffed but so was everyone's; it's a buff but not as much as if he was in ssb4. His sword's longer and that helps a little while not actually solving his CQC issues. His grab is normal so he can tomahawk at least but he must get close to use it and Link loses to faster characters up close; still overall a buff. Bair now combos well into Utilt and probably other things. Boomerang has a hit box returning but with very minor hitstun.

The negatives: bombs are a huge freaking nerf! I was playing vs lv9 DK (CPUs still suck btw) and felt very limited. Slightly increased sword range helps a little but keeping the ape out without Zair and bombs was much harder. Remote bombs put Link at a disadvantage when holding one, the detonation animation kills combo potential and they suck except at long range. Juggling DK by throwing a bomb up didn't work as well because Link is slow to detonate one. Pulling a bomb doesn't help landings at all. It makes Link's recovery more limited because throwing a bomb at close range means nothing and Link loses his sword attacks and has no Zair. In this game with over a second of lag on airdodges Link has a terrible disadvantage state. And what's the reward for successfully blowing an opponent up? 8 damage, that's it! As a minor positive they're good for pressuring side recoveries.

I can't stress enough how much SSB4 bombs helped Link; he needed midrange pressure to make up for his slow frame data. Zair and grab helped too. Link was designed around his 3 projectiles and Zair complimenting his CQC. Now he has the same slow frame data on attacks with a severely nerfed midrange game. Without mid range Link still loses in CQC to other swordies due to inferior frame data. Increased sword length helps spacing a little but not after the quick critters, ninjas and space animals get in. Mobility buffs only go so far on finite stages when most of the cast is still faster; BF used to be Link's best stage but now he'll want to stick with big ones where bombs do something. Link didn't actually have his problems fixed and he gained some in disadvantage. He's SSB4 Zelda; his kit just doesn't work.

The bottom line is Link needed strait stat buffs and got handed a mixed bag. IMO he'll probably end up lower mid tier.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Jab has more endlag; he used to be able to combo upB from jab 2 at high %s for kills but can't now. I couldn't get Fair 1 to combo at all. Bair works and Link's grab>Dthrow has potential but needs to be tested vs a human mashing air dodge.



Well, I'll be the messenger: Link will have a rough time in ultimate.

SSB4 Link was undertuned but a well designed character and bombs were the keystone. I've said in the past bombs are the 1 thing keeping him from having a Ganon tier disadvantage state. All he needed were some minor frame data buffs to be high tier; f5 jab and Nair, F9 Dtilt, shave a frame off his js and all around endlag reduction (so basically what YL has).

Now here's how SSBU Link turned out. As positives: He got a js on par with everyone else and that's big. Dtilt probably combos much better with this js. His mobility was buffed but so was everyone's; it's a buff but not as much as if he was in ssb4. His sword's longer and that helps a little while not actually solving his CQC issues. His grab is normal so he can tomahawk at least but he must get close to use it and Link loses to faster characters up close; still overall a buff. Bair now combos well into Utilt and probably other things. Boomerang has a hit box returning but with very minor hitstun.

The negatives: bombs are a huge freaking nerf! I was playing vs lv9 DK (CPUs still suck btw) and felt very limited. Slightly increased sword range helps a little but keeping the ape out without Zair and bombs was much harder. Remote bombs put Link at a disadvantage when holding one, the detonation animation kills combo potential and they suck except at long range. Juggling DK by throwing a bomb up didn't work as well because Link is slow to detonate one. Pulling a bomb doesn't help landings at all. It makes Link's recovery more limited because throwing a bomb at close range means nothing and Link loses his sword attacks and has no Zair. In this game with over a second of lag on airdodges Link has a terrible disadvantage state. And what's the reward for successfully blowing an opponent up? 8 damage, that's it! As a minor positive they're good for pressuring side recoveries.

I can't stress enough how much SSB4 bombs helped Link; he needed midrange pressure to make up for his slow frame data. Zair and grab helped too. Link was designed around his 3 projectiles and Zair complimenting his CQC. Now he has the same slow frame data on attacks with a severely nerfed midrange game. Without mid range Link still loses in CQC to other swordies due to inferior frame data. Increased sword length helps spacing a little but not after the quick critters, ninjas and space animals get in. Mobility buffs only go so far on finite stages when most of the cast is still faster; BF used to be Link's best stage but now he'll want to stick with big ones where bombs do something. Link didn't actually have his problems fixed and he gained some in disadvantage. He's SSB4 Zelda; his kit just doesn't work.

The bottom line is Link needed strait stat buffs and got handed a mixed bag. IMO he'll probably end up lower mid tier.

You bring up good points, but I must respectfully disagree with your placement of Link. There's much more to Ultimate Link than Smash 4 Link that we've merely scratched the surface on such as his remote bombs and reduced landing lag/jumpsquat.
You also fail to mention that his bombs can kill opponents offstage, and Ultimate's mechanics make his advantage state much more threatening than in Smash 4. Example, Link knocks Mario off stage, takes a bomb out (or picks one up if it's already out), throws it at the opponent, and detonates it. There is very little the opponent can do here since they have to either air dodge, double jump/Up B, or eat the explosion. Cape won't do much since the explosion radius is big enough to beat it.
Now for your DK example, you shouldn't be trying to pull out bombs and spam them like Smash 4 in the first place. You can take one out, Z-drop it, and get it whenever it's necessary, and the CPU/opponent won't get much out of holding the bomb since they can't detonate it. There's so much that can be theorycrafted with remote bombs for stage control and offstage play that has yet to be labbed, especially considering all of Link's attacks can send them at certain angles (and considering you can not only pick them up with aerials, but tilts, too).
Personally, the only reason why I found myself using Zair in Smash 4 was because it felt better playing defensive than offensive in that game. Now Link can actually land safely with his aerials, and him having one of the fastest grabs in the game in an environment where grabs are nerfed definitely helps a lot, especially against fast characters who like to get in his face. Arguably, he has more defensive/offensive options in Ultimate than he ever did in Smash 4 thanks to having buffed special moves, buffed grab, buffed jumpsquat and landing lag on aerials, and Ultimate's mechanics.

Overall, it's way too early to say whether he has a "mixed bag" or "SSB4 Zelda" (I vehemently disagree with the latter) because he is going to have a significantly different meta from Smash 4 Link.

 

[godogod]

I do think Link will be around mid tier at best, and YL high tier too.

 

[Sanjuro]

So I messed with the stick settings (suggested via the smash bros sub reddit) and the controls feel a lot better.

On a side note the online is pretty bad and I kind of miss for glory

 

[meleebrawler]

So I messed with the stick settings (suggested via the smash bros sub reddit) and the controls feel a lot better.

On a side note the online is pretty bad and I kind of miss for glory

Try making arenas with two players max, I hear that works well as a substitute.

 

[Sanjuro]

Try making arenas with two players max, I hear that works well as a substitute.

Yeah I’ve been trying that. The lag is still awful. Anyone randomly keep doing the same attack? I’ll trhow my boomerang and try to do something else and link tries to throw boomerang again. Or does a different move... this is only happening online

 

[Rizen]

I'm still unlocking characters and playing World of Light. They really should have started with more characters. WoL was fun at first but has grown boring yet addictive. I miss the frequent cutscenes in Subspace.

 

[skydogc]

On a side note the online is pretty bad and I kind of miss for glory

This is.........this is.........the darkest timeline, and so very very very accurate.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Nintendo needs to add more modes to the game. It feels weird having only Classic, Spirits, Mob Smash, and Training Mode.
They also need to tweak Quickplays to better separate people who want to compete in 1on1s versus FFAs because even in Elite Smash, you can be matched with FFA rulesets. I had the impression Elite Smash made it exclusively 1on1s, but that's not the case.
At least Battle Arenas are a thing...

 

[JohnKnight416]

Check out Zero's Link gameplay video! Seems to be one of the best performances from Link in Smash Ultimate so far.

If you're interested, watch at 20:10 of the video to witness a clean reverse edgeguard.

 

[Blade of Evil's Bane]

Check out Zero's Link gameplay video! Seems to be one of the best performances from Link in Smash Ultimate so far.

If you're interested, watch at 20:10 of the video to witness a clean reverse edgeguard.

Tagging Iridium (you were looking for Link footage earlier, here's some ^^^ )

Also, i'll share this here cause it's too beautiful:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[godogod]

Nintendo needs to add more modes to the game. It feels weird having only Classic, Spirits, Mob Smash, and Training Mode.
They also need to tweak Quickplays to better separate people who want to compete in 1on1s versus FFAs because even in Elite Smash, you can be matched with FFA rulesets. I had the impression Elite Smash made it exclusively 1on1s, but that's not the case.
At least Battle Arenas are a thing...

I think we will get some eventually.
Anyone tried all star mode in this game? I'm assuming it's not like the previous all star modes and more like endless smash capped to 74.

 

[Iridium]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Something I've noticed for a while, but seems like Link's Remote Bombs can jab lock. The combo's cool, too.

So his jab, arrows, Remote Bombs and n-air can all do it. Some are less practical than others, but I'll keep the info in mind.

 

[NobleClamtasm]

If anyone wants to see Link's Z-drop bombs in action, Salem makes a fantastic showcase of it in this set

 

[JohnKnight416]

If anyone wants to see Link's Z-drop bombs in action, Salem makes a fantastic showcase of it in this match

There's Z-drop to Nair Bomb catch looks like a really strong way to pressure an opponent up close. Might be able to do the same thing with Link Bair

 

[Tri Knight]

Link's shield pressure is insane with those bombs.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I haven't played Ultimate yet, so I just was wondering, how different does Link feel from Smash 4?

 

[micahismyname]

Haven't had the chance to play yet. Sorry if this has already been asked but are bombslides (aka Jump Cancel Throws, aka Jump Cancel Glide Toss) still a thing? That was a major part of my strategy in Sm4sh. I'll probably still play link if Ultimate regardless but it would really change my play style.

 

[Tri Knight]

I haven't played Ultimate yet, so I just was wondering, how different does Link feel from Smash 4?

He does feel a whole lot better. Faster and more fluid due to mechanic changes.

Bombs are still essential to his kit but for different reasons. Sometimes you dont even wanna explode the bomb. Just throw it or z-drop it on top of them just for the hitstun into a follow up. Bouncing the bomb off of them over and over can result in chained heavy combos and mixups or pressure that can result in putting Link at a good advantage. Because of how well he can pull this off with his new 3frame jump and how much pressure he can apply by juggling the bomb off of the enemy while attacking with SH's, I feel his meta will revolve around being able to do just that.

Link is also KING against enemies offstage. His edgeguarding options were good before but with the new bombs, which are valid kill tools, it's astronomical. I have already stage spiked more enemies than I ever have in any Smash game.

Overall, he might be the best Link we've had.

 

[JohnKnight416]

Izaw just uploaded his first Link highlight video in Smash Ultimate

This is honestly one of the cleanest Link plays that I've seen so far.

Based on what I seen from this video, not only does Link's new bombs allow him to put out some amazing shield pressure, but it also allows Link to absolute destroy characters who's recovery moves are either bad or exploitable.

 

[JohnKnight416]

The MU between Link and Sheik seems a lot more even for Link compared to how this particular MU was like for him in Smash 4

 

[Rizen]

I finally unlocked Link in WoL. He was on the last path I chose of course. I was using Mii Sword fighter as a substitute.

It looks like Link kept his throw combos so that's nice.

 

[JohnKnight416]

I finally unlocked Link in WoL. He was on the last path I chose of course. I was using Mii Sword fighter as a substitute.

It looks like Link kept his throw combos so that's nice.

Are you talking about the World of Light adventure mode? Cuz you automatically get Link by default in Smash mode.

 

[Rizen]

Are you talking about the World of Light adventure mode? Cuz you automatically get Link by default in Smash mode.

Yeah, I was trying to find him and/or YL for hours. I kept getting fighters that weren't my style.

 

[Himura Kenshin]

Is anyone else getting the impression that link can't cancel jab 2 with a spin attack? Maybe my timing is just off