The West MI Thread / Make Plans Here - PM Tourney: Red Edition

[Sarix]

It wouldn't completely surprise me if parts of the P:M community were badmouthing Brawl players but I have yet to hear of anything myself as well (Mostly b/c I have a low opinion of the human race). Most of the time I hear the P:M community just mentioning their dislike of the game Brawl itself not the players. But zealots, fanatics, and purists can form in any community unfortunately.

 

[L_Cancel]

Tom is talking about how lordy events, were primarily brawl events but lordy would host for PM to accommodate the community. Once lordy was unable to host tournies, PM TOs didn't do the same for brawl. That's why Tom doesn't want to support the events.

 

[Damittom]

The saddest part of that fact is when Lordy wanted to stop running PM and do Brawl Low Tiers instead, It was me and L_Cancel that convinced him to keep doing PM.

 

[Ori_bro]

I do kinda miss coming to the West Side if you guys did do co-op tourneys I know East MI would come for both games.

 

[W.C.N]

The saddest part of that fact is when Lordy wanted to stop running PM and do Brawl Low Tiers instead, It was me and L_Cancel that convinced him to keep doing PM.

This!

and I would still love to have low tiers or mid tier doubles

 

[Damittom]

It would actually be cool to have side events like Low tiers and mid tiers at events every now and again

 

[Solharath]

I'm just taking a guess here, but a lot of Brawl players... left Brawl when Project Melee become bigger in West Michigan due to the fact West MI had a larger Melee scene already, and would draw in those players in higher numbers. I have no problem with Brawl tournaments, but I'm curious as to how many West Michigan smashers even play Brawl competitively anymore. I'm not saying they don't exist - far from the truth - I'm just saying I can name only a few off the top of my head.

1. Legit
2. Lordy
3. L_Cancel
4. Red?
5. Jawsome?
6. Sarix?
7. Tbird?
8. Bflake?
9. Torvus?

And that pretty much clinches what I know of the West MI Brawl Scene. Question marks mean I don't know if they still play Brawl, but I assume they do. Project Melee, on the other hand...

Myself, Robjoe, Flan~, Red, A2, Artificial Flavor, Root, Punctuation Man, McK, ColdCut, Lordy, L_Cancel, MoneyMatchMike, Tbird, Sophy, CSock, Bflake, Storm/Smalls, ManaX, Torvus?

Granted I go to Project M tournaments more than Brawl tournaments, but that's a massive difference in players I know exist. If there are more, they are quiet, and they need to make themselves known so we can run tournaments to cater to what they want to play. But I'm seeing nearly 20 confirmed Project M players and only 9, at best, Brawl players, and that's assuming they all play Brawl still. Now, obviously, I could be missing people. And I'm obviously leaving out East MI because we're focusing on more local players.

Feel free to correct me where I'm wrong, but I just don't see enough interest for a Brawl tournament. And many of the Brawl players we do have are also Project M players, so running tournaments side by side would be very time consuming as many players would be running between tournament brackets.

Lordy brought in SE MI for his Monthlies a lot, and plenty of them would play Brawl, but we saw a very obvious trend toward Project Melee among West MI smashers, and currently we have not had many tournaments since Lordy had to stop his monthlies.

1. Lake Effect 1
2. Project M: Red Edition
3. Coldcut's House Tournament.

I think that about clinches it. The first one was a Melee/Project M tournament, which still had branching out, just not in Brawl's direction. The other two are house tournaments - the second one doesn't have a ton of useable space for tournaments(but it's hella chill), and the third one was confined to a basement. Good fun, but we were near capacity in the playspace and having a Brawl tournament as well likely would not have gone over well. They were smaller, local tournaments, not meant to bring in many from East MI. If Project M does host a major tournament, I'd be willing to bet we'd run a Brawl side event. However, the Gentlemen's Open is a Melee/Project M tournement run out of the K-Zoo area, which I've really not dealt with often! Small aside, I hope I can go to that. But work johns.

Of course, if I've got anything wrong, please feel free to correct me. I've only been paying mind to one Smash game recently and have not been following developments in the others. Consider this just casually observing.

TL;DR
Much higher known(to me) PM players than Brawl players (More than double) in West Michigan
No major tournaments in a location that can cater to both games and multiple regions(East MI, OH, IN, IL).
Feel free to correct!

 

[W.C.N]

well your missing amity for a brawl player that I know of

the point is when we had lordy as an only brawl players hosting we still held PM as a side event instead of just another side event of a game we more preferred, now the PM community doesnt care to return the favor when the tides have turned.... Thats a bad partnership/friendship between communities

where you would get your more entrants from in the brawl tournaments would be the rest of MI, you guys used to want us to come up now youve taken away the only reason for most of us and dont seem to care

 

[Arcalyth]

@Super:

Sarix dropped Brawl for PM but he's not super active because he's always busy or playing Guilty Gear. lol
So did Torvus.
Vox is pretty much Grand Rapids' only Brawl-exclusive player as of last year when I went and corrupted GRCC. Everyone else plays PM primarily or on the side, even our Melee players (Fishnax, Shocksauce, Brenton).

@DRDN:

Lake Effect I had a decent amount of East MI attendance for Melee (considering I had pretty much no reputation as a TO at that point)
And East MI still has a ridiculous amount of Melee... there's definitely incentive.

Most of the Brawl players I know switched to Project M because they think it's better and I have to agree. I think it's better than Melee too. Project M is mature enough to have its own standalone tournaments and doesn't need Brawl or Melee to support it anymore. Is there really an obligation to host Brawl? (Especially for Melee-centric Kalamazoo, they're literally half of West MI's Melee scene)

I think most of us definitely hate the game and not the players.

 

[Ori_bro]

Root, what DRDN is trying to get at is by you hosting Brawl at your P:M tourneys your attendance will jump up immensely.

A lot of the SE MI scene plays P:M along with Brawl, if you look at the MI Ranbats which I host Brawl and P:M, the entry list for both games are almost identical.Many of those players at the Ranbats wouldn't strictly travel exclusively for a solo P:M tourney if you include Brawl, players will be willing to make the 2.5 hour travel. You guys on the West Side are only catering to your little niche of a scene which is unhealthy. You need to look at the bigger scene. We are the Michigan Smash Scene not just the Brawl Scene, P:M Scene, Melee Scene. We all want to play, travel, and improve but if you are only allow the P:M players to join you at your table no one else will want to make an effort to join you all.

 

[Gifts]

There is an obligation to host brawl. And if you guys don't understand why then i don't even ****ing know what to say.

Wouldn't bringing in MORE entrants to your tournament be nice?

Here are some stats from the MI Ranbats tournament that was hosted on 6/23

20 entrants into brawl singles.
17 entrants into P:M singles.

Of those 17 entrants 12 of them entered P:M

So pretty much 70% of the P:M bracket was entrants from the brawl tournament.

Of those 12 people who entered the P:M singles and Brawl singles bracket to my knowledge 3 of them either play Melee or P:M is their main game.

So that leaves us with 52% of P:M singles bracket was composed of players who call brawl their "main" game.

So the big question I see is there an obligation to either run Brawl or Melee as a side event? Yes, I honestly think you need to in order for players to show up. I know there is no way in hell I'm about to drive to the west side of the state for a P:M only tournament. And probably 90% of the drivers on the east side of MI will probably say the same thing.

So I mean it is up to you guys, I know we are going to take into account for you guys and host P:M tourny's for incentive to you guys coming out over here. Why can't you guys do the same?...

Also, I may get some flak for this next comment.

How can you guys hate a game that you weren't even good at? Or even really attempted to put time into? Most of your P:M scene are Brawl players who pretty much said "I'm no good at this game so let's pick up P:M as an attempt to be good at something." So please, don't hate on a game that you didn't put enough time into to become decent at.

 

[whitmorethetoadpirate]

The point isn't becoming good at the game, it's that the game has a much slower and deliberate pace to it compared to Melee/P:M. Hell, I'd even go so far as to say most other fighters out there, because they're at least artificially sped up due to their lower time limit on rounds (90 sec for most of them). That being said, I thought it was fun watching Brawl games that included certain characters (Icies, Olimar, Falco, anyone except MK honestly). But I think a lot of melee/P:M players just find brawl games to be comparable to an hbox v armada match where it's puff v yl going for a full eight minutes of what looks like nonstop camping.

While I understand that it's more than that (battle of attrition/endurance, spacing, etc.), most people would rather watch cf dittos or something of the like.

 

[Solharath]

I'm just going to reiterate a point from my last post. We've had 3 tournaments since Lordy's Monthlies passed away, and one of them catered to the Michigan Melee scene as well as Project M. Not just West MI but all of the Michigan Melee scene.

The other two were house tournaments. One took place in two rooms of a house that was running out of space super quick and started late, finished even later, and that was just a smaller tournament. The other took place in a parent's basement, spread over, yes, two rooms. There simply wasn't going to be room for bringing in all of Michigan for two games.

When West Michigan runs a major tournament like Lake Effect or something similar, I would not be surprised to see a Brawl event as well. However, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Melee put up instead. I should think that, should the opportunity arise, that a poll will be taken and the event will be decided that way.

TL;DR
There have been no tournaments in West MI that could reasonably foster Brawl/PM.

 

[Gifts]

The point isn't becoming good at the game, it's that the game has a much slower and deliberate pace to it compared to Melee/P:M. Hell, I'd even go so far as to say most other fighters out there, because they're at least artificially sped up due to their lower time limit on rounds (90 sec for most of them). That being said, I thought it was fun watching Brawl games that included certain characters (Icies, Olimar, Falco, anyone except MK honestly). But I think a lot of melee/P:M players just find brawl games to be comparable to an hbox v armada match where it's puff v yl going for a full eight minutes of what looks like nonstop camping.

While I understand that it's more than that (battle of attrition/endurance, spacing, etc.), most people would rather watch cf dittos or something of the like.

So you enjoy eatching brawl games with possibly the most campy characters in the game and don't enjoy watching one of the most aggresive characters in the game? Then go on to say that the reason you don't like watching/playing it is because of the slow passed campyness of the game??


Mind ****ing blown.

Dip.

 

[Gifts]

I'm just going to reiterate a point from my last post. We've had 3 tournaments since Lordy's Monthlies passed away, and one of them catered to the Michigan Melee scene as well as Project M. Not just West MI but all of the Michigan Melee scene.

The other two were house tournaments. One took place in two rooms of a house that was running out of space super quick and started late, finished even later, and that was just a smaller tournament. The other took place in a parent's basement, spread over, yes, two rooms. There simply wasn't going to be room for bringing in all of Michigan for two games.

When West Michigan runs a major tournament like Lake Effect or something similar, I would not be surprised to see a Brawl event as well. However, I also wouldn't be surprised to see Melee put up instead. I should think that, should the opportunity arise, that a poll will be taken and the event will be decided that way.

TL;DR
There have been no tournaments in West MI that could reasonably foster Brawl/PM.

Is it too hard to find a venue? What happened to the game center West MI used to host their tournaments? That seems like enough space.

 

[Sarix]

Sarix dropped Brawl for PM but he's not super active because he's always busy or playing Guilty Gear. lol

The life and responsibilities of being a digital art major haha. I was actually hoping to be more active over the summer but I haven't been able to really contact anyone or get on Smashboards much.

I think it would be wise for West MI PM tournaments to include Brawl if we are not running Melee. This will at the very least be inclusive to non-PM players and as Gifts said it gives East MI a reason to drive 3 hours over. There really is no downside to including Brawl at tournies; because if we didn't it would only serve to make West MI's PM community look exclusive and unwelcoming to Brawl players which would be idiotic.

Also, I may get some flak for this next comment.

How can you guys hate a game that you weren't even good at? Or even really attempted to put time into? Most of your P:M scene are Brawl players who pretty much said "I'm no good at this game so let's pick up P:M as an attempt to be good at something." So please, don't hate on a game that you didn't put enough time into to become decent at.

I wouldn't say it was a lack of skill that made everyone drop Brawl in favor of PM in West MI. If anything I would attribute it to how West MI had many more players than in East MI who mained mid to low tier characters who were never viable in Brawl's metagame. And with PM's dev team seeking to balance out the cast that suffered in the lower tiers, the option definitely becomes more appealing to not have to think "The character I like to play is bad".

I'm not trying to harp on your opinion Gifts, just present another potential reason.

 

[Ori_bro]

Is it too hard to find a venue? What happened to the game center West MI used to host their tournaments? That seems like enough space.

SKYNETTTTTTTTTTT

 

[Gifts]

I wouldn't say it was a lack of skill that made everyone drop Brawl in favor of PM in West MI. If anything I would attribute it to how West MI had many more players than in East MI who mained mid to low tier characters who were never viable in Brawl's metagame. And with PM's dev team seeking to balance out the cast that suffered in the lower tiers, the option definitely becomes more appealing to not have to think "The character I like to play is bad".

I'm not trying to harp on your opinion Gifts, just present another potential reason.

I totally understand where you are coming from but then I remember players like Mikey and Tutu who did consistently well at most of the tournaments they entered maining mid tier characters.Granted, at the moment they are inactive. But that still didn't stop them from maining "bad" characters. Hell, Jawsome bodied me the last time we played because I had no idea how to play the pikachu matchup and he knew what he was doing against snake. It honestly just all comes down to how much practice and dedication you put into the game. And honestly, I feel like West MI gave up too soon.

 

[SoulPech]

I totally understand where you are coming from but then I remember players like Mikey and Tutu who did consistently well at most of the tournaments they entered maining mid tier characters..

 

[RED6]

Why are people hurt that we haven't been running brawl? A lot of us have realized that brawl isn't a balanced game, and that's just the sad truth about it. You wanna be good? Then you can't necessarily look at the entire roster and play whoever you like. You could, but in most cases, you're setting yourself up for failure.
Then to be told to run a tournament for it when you're trying to learn a different game? Melee is far more comparable to P:M than brawl, and has the same sort of speed and hype to it that P:M generates. This can, in some ways, appeal to Melee players more and appeal to P:M players because it's more like the game they most often play. I realize brawl can, in some cases, do that. But that's it; it's all about the circumstance.
In some match-ups, you're FORCED to play a different character if you want to have any chance of winning. It's join or die. I'm not against running a brawl side event (in fact, that's what I had planned for my next house tournament), but I see no reason for people to believe P:M players should feel it's their "obligation" to host brawl side events for brawl players. That's ridiculous to say.
Lots of people are migrating to a game where the effort is constantly towards a point of balance, and I find that a good thing. Suddenly, it doesn't become about a game where you're forced to a pick a different character, or to go to a certain stage just to have a chance at winning. It puts people on a more level ground. A lot of people did switch over to P:M because they were bad at brawl, but I don't see how that's any different from people switching from their main to MK in a 2/3 so that they can more easily obtain a win. He's SS tier for a reason.
Roller's post about picking up a high tier in order to prove you actually have a desire to win and don't wish to set yourself up for a failure is a sad truth, and one that I refused to accept simply because I played the game for a specific character. I'd like to reference this as an idea: http://smashboards.com/threads/official-swf-matchup-chart-v3-0.338390/

Wanna play Ganondorf? Look how this puts it into perspective for your chances of victory.

Wanna play MK? Yeah, I thought so.

Wanna quit brawl? I don't blame you.

I won't hate on Brawl players. Heck, I still play the game for fun sometimes. No one is, in any way, obligated to run a tournament for it though. You want a brawl tournament around in West Michigan? Host it. I'll help with a side event in my own tournament, but I won't host a straight-up, main brawl tournament. I'm always also willing to help with any brawl tournaments going around here. Hosting a melee side-event could generate the same amount, if not more players than brawl could in its own right as well. To say Brawl would get you more, especially in West MI, seems rather bold to say. It could, but it's not a definite truth.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

@Super:

Sarix dropped Brawl for PM but he's not super active because he's always busy or playing Guilty Gear. lol
So did Torvus.
Vox is pretty much Grand Rapids' only Brawl-exclusive player as of last year when I went and corrupted GRCC. Everyone else plays PM primarily or on the side, even our Melee players (Fishnax, Shocksauce, Brenton).

@DRDN:

Lake Effect I had a decent amount of East MI attendance for Melee (considering I had pretty much no reputation as a TO at that point)
And East MI still has a ridiculous amount of Melee... there's definitely incentive.

Most of the Brawl players I know switched to Project M because they think it's better and I have to agree. I think it's better than Melee too. Project M is mature enough to have its own standalone tournaments and doesn't need Brawl or Melee to support it anymore. Is there really an obligation to host Brawl? (Especially for Melee-centric Kalamazoo, they're literally half of West MI's Melee scene)

I think most of us definitely hate the game and not the players.

To be completely honest, I think part of the reason that so many people are switching to P:M is because they're bad at Brawl. Game physics definitely play a role but let's be honest here: West Michigan with a few exceptions has never been particularly great at Brawl. The players who are good put in MASSIVE work to compensate for the lack of activity in the area. And while, it's cool that so many people are hopping on the P:M bandwagon, things aren't really going to change if you don't find a way to attract the East side of the state. If a majority of your players are mediocre, it's going to be extremely hard to actually get good at any game that you play. Unless you're some serious natural talent at the game, you get better by bringing in more people from areas where the skill is higher. And I know that if I played a game for years and I was not going anywhere with it, unless the scene is AWESOME, I'm quitting for something else lol. Most of West MI is pretty medicore at PM as well. And so eventually the same thing is going to happen. People quit the most when they feel like they aren't making any progress. You won't really achieve significant progress under the current conditions you have by just isolating yourselves in your West MI bubble. This isn't New Jersey Brawl. It would only be beneficial to your scene to keep hosting Brawl so you guys can have some more competition/leverage to attract East MI. That's if you care about growing your scene. If you're just doing it to do it and play, then ignore everything I said lol.

I hope none of this sounds too harsh, just have to be honest here. I LOVE the West MI scene and it was me and Tutu that made the first steps to bridge the gap between the two sides of the state. I would hate to see that undone. I visit West MI regardless of what game is being played because I enjoy the people over there. In the end, you guys can do whatever you want. I just want to see you guys around is all.

 

[Damittom]

Someone pls. Play DDD in pm and tell me that game is anymore balanced than brawl. And every pm tournament I've ever gone to all I've heard is ******** about how Super only wins because he plays sonic etc. There is no proof that brawl is any less balanced than pm or melee. Infact, melee has far more unwinable matchups than brawl. The only reason pm looks balanced is because its meta game is underdeveloped so the results have a large character variety. Go look at brawl results from 5 years ago when game and watch and rob were top tier and ics and diddy were mid. Until someone can provide a value to rank balance that is a terrible reason to discredit brawl when comparing it to the other games

 

[SoulPech]

I play P:M instead of Brawl because Puff is bad in that game and I find Melee/P:M more fun than brawl. Nothing to do with being good/bad w/ Brawl.

 

[SoulPech]

Infact, melee has far more unwinable matchups than brawl.

Please tell me how...

 

[What's The Point]

You are going to be severely disappointed if you think more than 50% of the PM cast will be viable (15% if we're talking big tourney 1st place viable).

The only reason the game may appear balanced is because there is no large competitive scene. It's mostly Melee/Brawl players entering a side event. Also it's new.

Please tell me how...

Shiek.


Side note, in general, Brawl players are better at PM than Melee players.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I play P:M instead of Brawl because Puff is bad in that game and I find Melee/P:M more fun than brawl. Nothing to do with being good/bad w/ Brawl.

That's a "viable" reason. And everyone's motivation for switching games can be different. But if you think that some people don't switch to PM because of their lack of success (I'm not saying you said that personally, just making a general statement), then you're naive. Frustration from a game comes from the mechanics, the people you play with, your success with it and more. I would have a very difficult time believing someone if they played Brawl for 3 or so years, never made any money, never beat anyone good, never got a reputation, etc and they said that none of that influenced their decision to play a new game.

 

[SoulPech]

oh i understand. I'm just stating my reason just cuz.

 

[Solharath]

So it's come to pass that the great Melee/Brawl debates are over. Welcome the new Brawl/Project M debates!

Skynet got split into two different stores, I believe. One is still Skynet, but focuses completely on card/tabletop games now, and the other... I don't rightly recall. Might be the place that root scored for Lake Effect, and that venue was not helpful in any way shape or form.We only got away with running the tournament smoothly because the manager was out and the guy working the store didn't know what to do with us.

I'd also like to mention that the West MI Brawl scene was very new when I started around here. I didn't hear of anyone outside of Lordy and L_Cancel when I went to my first tournament, and it took until the first Skynet to meet people from Muskegon and some of the Grand Rapids people. After that it was us trying to get our scene together, but some of us are an hour to two hours away from each other - an investment in time and money just to play each other. TCity has all but dried up, with rsr2 peeking in from time to time(<3 you Randall~). Two years later, we don't have the most cohesive scene, and our "bubble" of West MI tournaments is more a method of just getting everyone together to play and provide a little incentive to get better.

Don't get huffy over the fact we found a game we enjoy more as a means of getting everyone together. The house tournaments are really more like glorified smashfests West MI has to give incentive for the drive out. Not that everyone is super close in East MI, mind, but by and large you're all closer to each other.

When we want to grow and get supergood and become national threats, I'm certain we'll open our tournaments up to more, of that I have no doubt. But right now, I think West MI is trying to put it's head on straight and play some games. If you don't wanna drive out and hang with us because we're playing a niche game, that's cool, it's your loss. You can bring Brawl if you want, I'm sure there's some friendlies and money matches to throw down for.

Anyone else in West MI can correct me if that view doesn't coincide with yours. I'm arguably taking a shot in the dark, here.

 

[RED6]

Someone pls. Play DDD in pm and tell me that game is anymore balanced than brawl. And every pm tournament I've ever gone to all I've heard is *****ing about how Super only wins because he plays sonic etc. There is no proof that brawl is any less balanced than pm or melee. Infact, melee has far more unwinable matchups than brawl. The only reason pm looks balanced is because its meta game is underdeveloped so the results have a large character variety. Go look at brawl results from 5 years ago when game and watch and rob were top tier and ics and diddy were mid. Until someone can provide a value to rank balance that is a terrible reason to discredit brawl when comparing it to the other games

"where the effort is constantly towards a point of balance"

 

[fZk]

I would have a very difficult time believing someone if they played Brawl for 3 or so years, never made any money, never beat anyone good, never got a reputation, etc and they said that none of that influenced their decision to play a new game.

I kind of agree with this, and speaking honestly, a lot of the people that were bad in Brawl are still bad in P:M. Being unsafe, having crap DI, not adapting, etc. do not change just because now you can combo. But I don't think success is the tell-all when it comes to your preferences.

As for my case, I played Brawl for many years, I won money, beat plenty of good people and made somewhat of a reputation, but I just stopped enjoying Brawl. I wasn't enjoying the game as much and tried P:M pout of curiosity and I just liked it better. I think is better game that I enjoy more and that's why I play. I should clarify that do not hate Brawl at all.

 

[fZk]

accidental post

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

That makes sense. Like me personally, I enjoy both games. I would consider actually learning PM more as I do enjoy being able to combo people and move faster. And on the flip side, I enjoy Brawl because it's more like a game of chess in a way. I find both games cool for different reasons. Although PM has more appeal to me now because I've played Brawl for like 4 years. Sometimes you do just lose interest or want to do something new. That's totally understandable.

 

[SoulPech]

That makes sense. Like me personally, I enjoy both games. I would consider actually learning PM more as I do enjoy being able to combo people and move faster. And on the flip side, I enjoy Brawl because it's more like a game of chess in a way. I find both games cool for different reasons. Although PM has more appeal to me now because I've played Brawl for like 4 years. Sometimes you do just lose interest or want to do something new. That's totally understandable.

i just wonder if people see these as two different games. It's like comparing Chess with Chutes and Ladders.

 

[Sarix]

The majority of my reason for switching is similar to SoulPech's in that I just find P:M a more enjoyable game to play and the characters I like playing don't make me feel like I'm severely hindering myself by choice to play them. I started playing other fighting games again when I stopped enjoying Brawl like Blazblue and Guilty Gear and fell in love with how dynamic and flexible both games are. When I started playing P:M and comparing it to Brawl I just simply preferred P:M b/c it played more closely like the arcade fighters I enjoy. I don't hate Brawl but I find it less enjoyable.

I do believe some/many people have switched to P:M b/c of a lack of success since results are a pretty basic drive of anything competitive. I never considered myself a good player at Brawl, especially with how terrible my tourney nerves are. I spent a MASSIVE amount of time learning about my character but I had unconscious flaws in my play style that were magnified by my tourney nerves.

It would be suicidal though for West MI to cut off Brawl from our P:M tournies. The simple truth is that we need East MI if we hope to grow as better players, they are simply more experienced and skilled in Smash overall. It's not an "obligation" but it's in our best interest if we want to get West MI's community into a more cohesive whole. Running Brawl at least gives a reason for East MI to come and even if they don't touch P:M it's at least better than them not showing up since it means we're keeping in contact with each other.

 

[JTsm]

All of you guys are bad. Brawl, PM, melee. MI is such a terrible smash state.

 

[Gifts]

All of you guys are bad. Brawl, PM, melee. MI is such a terrible smash state.

I mean you only add to the badness.

 

[JTsm]

Well of course.


But seriously, such a terrible state.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Just so you guys know: Phoenix Saga 6 will be having Project: Melee Singles in addition to Brawl Doubles and Singles. Hope to see you guys there.

 

[Arcalyth]

Is it too hard to find a venue? What happened to the game center West MI used to host their tournaments? That seems like enough space.

You mean GrandLAN (or maybe Skynet)? That's where I hosted Lake Effect. I really don't want to go back there, the owner is really grimy and a lot of people complained about the venue at the last tournament.
There are probably other places but I don't have a car so it's kinda hard to go scout around. Super is pretty on point.

Someone pls. Play DDD in pm and tell me that game is anymore balanced than brawl. And every pm tournament I've ever gone to all I've heard is *****ing about how Super only wins because he plays sonic etc. There is no proof that brawl is any less balanced than pm or melee. Infact, melee has far more unwinable matchups than brawl. The only reason pm looks balanced is because its meta game is underdeveloped so the results have a large character variety. Go look at brawl results from 5 years ago when game and watch and rob were top tier and ics and diddy were mid. Until someone can provide a value to rank balance that is a terrible reason to discredit brawl when comparing it to the other games

Hope you don't get grabbed
If you go prowl around on the Sonic boards, you'll realize that we're not the only ones who thought Sonic was broken. PM2.6 is out now and the character was changed to be (hopefully) not broken. Super will certainly be less of a tournament threat (though still a substantial one, this is not meant to discredit Super's skills). It's no different than the controversy surrounding Wizzrobe's tournament wins.

/I/ don't like Brawl because it's slow and campy and feels like I'm floating through jello. I was originally a Melee player (obviously I'm gonna be **** at Brawl if I've never played it competitively) so of course I'm going to cater to that scene more. It's not a matter of not being able to see the qualities and intricacy of Brawl, because all of the Smash fundamentals are still there and it's still a fairly deep game... but the metagame in Brawl is pretty much reaching its peak at this point. Melee's metagame is STILL developing to this day with new technology being shown on stream every major tournament. (Correct me if I'm wrong about Brawl because it's likely that I'm misinformed)

Anyway, we can gather just as much East MI attendance with Melee as we can with Brawl.
and this point is going nowhere and making no real point whatsoever. I just woke up and I'm rambling, lol.

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I really hope I don't sound like a ****, that's not my intention at all. I'd love to cater to whoever will get more attendance in the PM bracket (/bias) and I mean no harm to the east siders.

 

[rsr2]

rsr2 peeking in from time to time(<3 you Randall~).

Stop it you <3

I have been playing off and on recently but I still suck at this game. I miss you sexy turds and sorry for not getting on skype and gaying it up like usual. It lags my computer bad when I am trying to livestream or play Path of Exile >_>