The Up smash spike thread: Trying to make it work consistently - Hm?

[Chis]

So yeah, at around 60%ish, 2 characters that can not be spiked can be spiked. If they DI down. That's the catch. I don't know why anyone would be DIinng down in the first place. There is are more, but I'll test that when I can. I'm also excepting requests, tell me what character to do next.




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Disclaimer: It's a semi-spike, I know >_>

So I experimented a little with the up smash...

Video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd45fGx45lQ

How does the Up smash spike work?

Sonic's up smash has 8 hits. The most noticeable ones are the first hit and the last. The 7th hit launches the opponent downwards into the last hit box which launches them into the air. However, once they have a certain %, the knock back from the 7th hit will be enough to launch them fast enough before the 8th hit can hit them. Hence the 'spike'. The strength is dependent on what % they are when the 7th hit hits them.

Note: It spikes them behind Sonic.

• The 7th hit is the one that 'spikes'.
• If the DI down, towards you, behind you, it wont work.
• You can spike out of a Hyphen up smash.
• Up smash can trip >_>
• If a Bowser DI's behind you at around 100%, a tiny semi-spike.
• Only works on the left or right edge of the up smash.
• The first hit MUST hit for it to work.
• When Sonic spikes with a hyphen up smash, his spikes forward. Hard to do.
• I spike from the standing position once...The 7th hit is the one that 'spikes'.
• There is a 'sweet spot' area in the middle of Sonic when he jumps into a ball from a hyphen up smash. So you can spike. Very hard, but I was doing it mid consistantly. :/

If used on stage, I doubt that your opponent would tech it. So a tech chase/jab lock.

Using on it Jungle Japes (water and crocs), Frigate Orpheon (can't grab an edge) and Rainbow Ride's edges? Quick ledge hog against a poor recovery = easy kill?

Anywhere but recommend has a low chance of working.

These are based on fresh up smashes, the more stale your upsmash is, the higher the starting rate and the higher the stop rate. Semi-spikes are included.

Starts at 35% Recommended 39% to 60% Stops at 70%
Jab lock: 39% to 42% Tech Chase: Range: 35%
Starts at 41% Recommended 45% to 59% Stops at 77%
Jab lock: Tech Chase: Range: 36%
Starts at 49% Recommended 50% to 55% Stops at 58%
Jab lock: Tech chase: Range: 9%
Starts at 51% Recommended 59% to 75% Stops at 101%
Jab lock: Tech chase: Range: 50%
Starts at 56% Recommended 59% to 64% Stops at 91%
Jab lock: Tech chase: Range: 35%
Starts at 22% Stops at 52%
Jab lock: Tech chase:Range: ?
Starts at 60% Recommended 60% to 78% Stops at 86%
Jab lock: Tech chase: Range: 26%
Starts at 43% Recommended 43% 76% Ends and changes
Jab lock: 43% to 47%



If they DI out of it, congats, you just got so and so damage.

I BELIEVE that they can't DI up out of it all of the time, but I need someone to confirm it for me...

If it doesn't spike/work...you've still landed a up smash. HOWEVER if it does spike, this thread should help you capitalize it to the fullest, and if you see can oppuntity, you CAN possibly take off a stock early. This is just to increase awareness. An out of shield up smash or a Hyphen can also produce the desired effect, but it's difficult.

Will you get punished if they tech?
I don't have frame data, but I doubt it :o

More latas...

Discuss//

=======Ignore=========
Close
Slightly father way
Thrown them of stage to gain pressure

Good at getting people if bad recoverys of stage
Have to be closeAt an agle down ward
Slide bound
If they tech that you may be able to punish it

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Interesting...so does DI'ing up, which is the main form of escaping the Up Smash cause the person caught in it to be semi spiked?

And how many hits does Up Smash do? If you have the time, you might want to try and find out a what percents this works on characters

 

[Chis]

Interesting...so does DI'ing up, which is the main form of escaping the Up Smash cause the person caught in it to be semi spiked?

I believe it doesn't stop them ffrom being spike, however I need someone to comferm this.

And how many hits does Up Smash do?

8

If you have the time, you might want to try and find out a what percents this works on characters

Okay.

 

[TwinkleToes]

Semi spike means the angle of send is not downward, which the u-smash spike definitely is. Ultimately the u-smash is always going to be a bit of a crap shoot but as long as you know the mechanics behind it and go for it when the opportunity to land an u-smash arises you should just get lucky every now and then.

 

[Tenki]

Have you tried looking into this weird trait of the U-smash where it will launch people out of the U-smash early if you land the first (?) hit of the U-smash?

 

[Jim Morrison]

U-smash moves your opponent in an arc. First hit knocks them at a 90 degree angle upwards, the 2nd one like 70 degrees, etc, etc. Second to last hit sends at something 30 degrees below the stage, or something between 30-70. Last hit sends them upwards, so avoid hitting with that. The first hit is what gives the speed boost. If you hit with U-smash without first hit, it's only small knockback in all those directions.

 

[Chis]

Have you tried looking into this weird trait of the U-smash where it will launch people out of the U-smash early if you land the first (?) hit of the U-smash?

Hm, I'll try and look into that.

 

[Boxob.]

Ugh.

I must have said this at LEAST 4 times in the previous thread for the same matter.

YOU. CAN. NOT. CONSISTENTLY. REPRODUCE. THE. DESIRED. SPIKE.

Ever.

 

[Chis]

I thought you were against people shooting down threads rather then contributing to them.

 

[Tenki]

It's not really the thread as it is the move that you're trying to figure out.

Like, even if you do figure it out, you won't generally be landing the first hit of the U-smash by the edge.

The conditions to set it up are really rare/difficult to find.

 

[Boxob.]

Only when the thread has a point to it, and can potentially get somewhere.

This one can't.

You're trying to hit a moving target with the opening frames of the attack, to DI out in a specific way depending on their characters weight, without letting the attack finish, at the right percent, off the edge.

It isn't going to happen. Even if you manage to get the move off the edge, they have to meet so many prerequisites, and also DI completely ********.

 

[Ayaz18]

yeah i'm agreeing with Boxob with this...........Usmash spike is WAY too situational.

there's no way to consistently do it.

 

[Chis]

It works on moving targets. You can get a tech chase on the ground. Who DI's out for you Up smash?

And why don't you try, rather then jump to conclusions?

 

[Boxob.]

Because I have tried, a lot of us have.

It's a nice gift when it happens, but trying to incorporate it into your game is useless.

 

[Chis]

And hence the title.

 

[Boxob.]

What?

 

[aeghrur]

He's trying to make it work consistently so you CAN get it into your game... if he can make it work consistently.

 

[Trillion]

Ugh.

I must have said this at LEAST 4 times in the previous thread for the same matter.

YOU. CAN. NOT. CONSISTENTLY. REPRODUCE. THE. DESIRED. SPIKE.

Ever.

I will make a video disproving this statement sometime within the next week or so. I have upsmash spike on a fox in my combo video and I have been able to recreate the exact same occurance several times consistently.

 

[Boxob.]

But you CAN'T get it to work constantly.

 

[Boxob.]

I will make a video disproving this statement sometime within the next week or so. I have upsmash spike on a fox in my combo video and I have been able to recreate the exact same occurance several times consistently.

You opponent's an idiot.

He can simply not move his control stick, and nothing will happen.

 

[aeghrur]

In this game for this character, consistently is good enough.
Getting anything to work constantly for a low tier would be a dream.

 

[Trillion]

You opponent's an idiot.

He can simply not move his control stick, and nothing will happen.

LOL that would be a great claim if i had an opponent who was trying to react. I can consistently recreate it in training mode with the opponent set to human control and not moving. I just set up the same occurance over and over again and without the other controller DI-ing I can make it happen about 6 or so times out of 10.

 

[Boxob.]

In this game for this character, consistently is good enough.
Getting anything to work constantly for a low tier would be a dream.

Getting THIS to work consistently is IMPOSSIBLE.

People are stupid.

 

[Boxob.]

LOL that would be a great claim if i had an opponent who was trying to react. I can consistently recreate it in training mode with the opponent set to human control and not moving. I just set up the same occurance over and over again and without the other controller DI-ing I can make it happen about 6 or so times out of 10.

How about we wifi sometime, and if you can land it and kill me twice with it, I'll stfu.

I won't even use sonic, ****, I'll use link; make it easy for you.

 

[Ayaz18]

Getting THIS to work consistently is IMPOSSIBLE.

People are stupid.

but when I say it it becomes offensive


talk about picking on the new guy


but on topic,

it won't work

consistently

like ever

 

[Chis]

How about you be productive or don't post in this thread?

 

[aeghrur]

How about we wifi sometime, and if you can land it and kill me twice with it, I'll stfu.

I won't even use sonic, ****, I'll use link; make it easy for you.

Flaw in your theory Boxob.
You admit it's hard to do.
If he can do it consistently offline 6/10 times, it means it still requires precision.
Wifi kills precision.
Maybe if you didn't move, or there wasn't input lag, but with input lag, the precision dies and you're right, it would be impossible.

 

[Trillion]

How about we wifi sometime, and if you can land it and kill me twice with it, I'll stfu.

I won't even use sonic, ****, I'll use link; make it easy for you.

I don't have knowledge on the percents or w/e to do it on link. I can create the exact same occurance with Fox as what was in my combo video. I don't believe that I can just pull it off out of the blue. YET. I do believe that we can arrange circumstances where it will work either EVERY time or MOST of the time. The problem is that we don't know what those circumstances all are. IF you have time look in my combo vid. I have a clip where I up smash spike Fox on battlefield. I down throw to hyphen smash and it spikes. In training mode when I do the exact same motions at the exact same percents in roughly the same area of the stage and stuff I am able to make it happen many times in a row or quite a large percentage of the time. I don't have enough knowledge of many situations where I can do it, but I believe that if we analyze every situation of when it happens by looking at video footage that we can start to get an idea of what are some situations that it can be used in.

 

[thecatinthehat]

but when I say it it becomes offensive


talk about picking on the new guy

That's just how it works here on SWF, unfortunately. Especially the Sonic Boards.

Popular ppl can get away with alot things.

 

[Boxob.]

Flaw in your theory Boxob.
You admit it's hard to do.
If he can do it consistently offline 6/10 times, it means it still requires precision.
Wifi kills precision.
Maybe if you didn't move, or there wasn't input lag, but with input lag, the precision dies and you're right, it would be impossible.

I can do everything on wifi that I do irl.

Usmash spiking included.

 

[Boxob.]

I don't have knowledge on the percents or w/e to do it on link. I can create the exact same occurance with Fox as what was in my combo video. I don't believe that I can just pull it off out of the blue. YET. I do believe that we can arrange circumstances where it will work either EVERY time or MOST of the time. The problem is that we don't know what those circumstances all are. IF you have time look in my combo vid. I have a clip where I up smash spike Fox on battlefield. I down throw to hyphen smash and it spikes. In training mode when I do the exact same motions at the exact same percents in roughly the same area of the stage and stuff I am able to make it happen many times in a row or quite a large percentage of the time. I don't have enough knowledge of many situations where I can do it, but I believe that if we analyze every situation of when it happens by looking at video footage that we can start to get an idea of what are some situations that it can be used in.

So I'll use fox.

 

[aeghrur]

I can do everything on wifi that I do irl.

Usmash spiking included.

I envy you.
I can't stand wifi lag.
I miss my grabs, I miss my ASC cancels, etc. How do you do it.

 

[Trillion]

So I'll use fox.

Again, it might be possible for me to do it, but I really doubt that I could make it happen like that. Right now I only know the ONE situation where it works. But if it would help, I will make a video of myself in training mode without editing it to show the process that I am able to use to recreate it as I do.


This is the only Fox situation that I know. You can see it in my vid.

Fox: Starting at 19%, on the ground after a down throw so that if he was standing, then he would be facing left while Sonic was facing right. Hyphen smash ends at 28% with the spike.

 

[Boxob.]

You do what you want, fact is, it's impracticable as all hell, and there are much better options 99.93 percent of the time. And that even during the small amount of time that you can do it, at the right percent, on the right characters, on the right stage, on a Sunday while it's raining and has no control of his control stick. he's going to get to to high of a percentage before it becomes of any use.

 

[Ayaz18]

I envy you.
I can't stand wifi lag.
I miss my grabs, I miss my ASC cancels, etc. How do you do it.

Johns.


anyways about my productivity................


i'll get back to you on that

 

[Chis]

Now, let's talk about how to apply this, where and how. Rather then just full it up with unhelpful posts.

Read the title, any more useless posts will be reported.

 

[Boxob.]

You apply it by doing Usmash running towards an edge, at around 29-36-40-43 percent on most characters.

 

[Trillion]

You do what you want, fact is, it's impracticable as all hell, and there are much better options 99.93 percent of the time. And that even during the small amount of time that you can do it, at the right percent, on the right characters, on the right stage, on a Sunday while it's raining and has no control of his control stick. he's going to get to to high of a percentage before it becomes of any use.

Like I said and have video of, high percentage is not required. I have vid of it killing at 28% and while it does have him trying to escape and accidently bairing which most likely prevented any possibility of recovery, he would have still had to deal with the problem of being ledge guarded after being spiked.

 

[Camalange]

You apply it by doing Usmash running towards an edge, at around 29-36-40-43 percent on most characters.

I honestly think this bit right here will pretty much some up this whole thread...

The whole thing is too DI reliant etc. etc. etc.

Now if it were something like Luigi's weird Dair spike, it would make more sense to research it...but this is just far too situational.

EDIT:

Forgot to touch on this.

Magnum, you kinda just proved Boxob's point. The fact that you only know how to do it on Fox, at a certain level, at a certain percent, at a certain area of the stage, and you can usually do it, proves how situational this move is.

 

[Boxob.]

Camalange gtfo, smart people aren't allowed on SWF.