The State of Fire Emblem Characters and what can change?

[Folt]

Honestly, in terms of priority, I'd go:

- He's the first. He's the original Lord. He's pretty much one of the most iconic faces of old FE.
:ultrobin- His moveset is extremely unique, even among other FE characters, and even other series characters in general.
- Much like Robin, his moveset is extremely unique, even among other series reps, so I'd prioritize him this high.
- I don't really care much for Ike, but in terms of concept, he's extremely unique. I'd also imagine there'd be be an outcry of slighted fanatics if he was ever cut from the roster too. *sigh*
- I'd include him to satisfy Melee fans, and I like his moveset more than Ike, but he's not super important to me or anything. Probably the one that'd most likely be cut out of the uniques.
- If there's time left after completing the roster, these two might see another playable appearance.

 

[Fane]

: Get. Out. Of. Smash. You. Don't. Belong. Here. You. Advertisement. That. Barely. Anyone. Wanted.

Same could be said for Roy tbh.

He was included for the exact same reasoning. Corrin is only hated so much bc he was the only 1st part DLC newcomer and he happened to be put in to further hype up the Fates games.

It's just bias when it comes to Corrin. Should he have been DLC? Yeah, there's no reason for him not to have been DLC. Does he have a large fanbase in both communities? Yeah, although the female version is far more popular, the character is still a very popular and well-liked addition. Could we have gotten someone else instead? Definitely, Azura would've been a better choice, but Sakurai went with the 'main playable avatar' like he did with Awakening's rep. Still worked out okay.

I will never understand the blind hatred for the character. Everyone uses the same arguments against him, and I never see one actual good reason as to why he shouldn't be in Smash.

Also Fire Emblem isn't even as popular as nintendo's other first parties that have been given the finger by Fire Emblem characters.

No one character interfered with another character's addition to Smash. This is a silly belief among the entire Smash community.

Also, Fire Emblem is one of the most popular and best selling IPs Nintendo owns, and it's only growing more and more. It's honestly not far behind the big names, and is right there alongside Animal Crossing and Splatoon.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

No one character interfered with another character's addition to Smash. This is a silly belief among the entire Smash community.

Also, Fire Emblem is one of the most popular and best selling IPs Nintendo owns, and it's only growing more and more. It's honestly not far behind the big names, and is right there alongside Animal Crossing and Splatoon.

I'm not saying they flipped a coin and decided between each FE character or a different one. I'm saying if they spent more time discussing and asking the player base, they definately would have found a more popular and reasonable character.

And yes of course FE fans are not going to say that Corrin was a bad idea. I'm a Kirby fan. If they added 4 Kirby reps I wouldn't say it was a bad idea, but someone else might. But Corrin received the most backlash over the rest of the DLC characters, and frankly, all of the Smash 4 newcomers in general.

 

[Fane]

I'm not saying they flipped a coin and decided between each FE character or a different one. I'm saying if they spent more time discussing and asking the player base, they definately would have found a more popular and reasonable character.

And yes of course FE fans are not going to say that Corrin was a bad idea. I'm a Kirby fan. If they added 4 Kirby reps I wouldn't say it was a bad idea, but someone else might. But Corrin received the most backlash over the rest of the DLC characters, and frankly, all of the Smash 4 newcomers in general.

Except they did just that with the Smash Ballot and many of the other DLC characters. Mewtwo, Roy, and Lucas were all brought back due to high fan demand. Bayonetta was a highly requested newcomer. They even went the extra mile to bring Cloud and Ryu into the fray as well.

Among that roster of DLC, everyone chooses to complain and whine about one of the additions instead of simply ignoring it and praising the others.

Corrin was likely a decision Sakurai and Nintendo made, not one based on "Does the community want him?" because the character was very new and wasn't really in the forefront of people's minds when it came to DLC. Fire Emblem had gained a lot of popularity after Awakening and Fates was currently being hyped up a lot, so I can see the logic behind choosing a character from Fates.

I'm not saying Corrin was a great idea because I personally love the character and Fire Emblem, it was a great idea in the business perspective. The fact that people got overly upset and began to whine about his inclusion isn't on Sakurai, Nintendo, Sora Ltd., etc... It's on that person. They chose to let his inclusion affect them negatively for whatever reason.

Me personally, I hate 3rd party representation in Smash, but I never got upset about Cloud, Ryu, or Bayonetta. That's because I was mature about it and instead looked at the brighter side of their inclusion and the fact that there were other characters in the game let me just... ignore their presence and play others. It's not hard to be mature and respect the character choices they make, after all, Ultimate is heavily catering towards fanservice and fan demand, so I just have to laugh whenever someone gets upset about Chrom's inclusion.(Which is even funnier because he's an Echo which means he was a low effort implementation) It's not like those people didn't get Ridley, K. Rool, Snake, or Ice Climbers.

Basically complaining about Fire Emblem's representation and showing unnecessary backlash is literally biting the hand that feeds you.

 

[Ikenna]

Not even a Fire Emblem guy and I like what we have here considering my sword bias. Heck, I used the semi-unique Roy and echo fighter Lucina and not Marth. I even wanted Corrin before he/she as announced for DLC and then secondaried him/her in Smash 4. Robin and Ike (nerf that man tho xd) are alright too. I wouldn't cut anyone and would welcome more getting into Smash, as long as those newcomers don't look ridiculous in my eyes.

 

[Quetzal77]

And yes of course FE fans are not going to say that Corrin was a bad idea.

Don't be too sure about that. Corrin isn't that popular in the FE fanbase, yes they are liked but nowhere near the levels of the other FE lords. Imo Corrin was a bad choice because they're a terrible character in their game, the dullest player worship vehicle ever, and if uniqueness is all they have going for them in Smash, Azura would have been even more unique and also advertised Fates while being a likeable to tolerable character depending on who you ask.

Edit: to make this bump a bit less ranty, I think what they should do if the next Smash is a reboot is trim the FE roster down to Marth, Ike, and Robin, with one of either Lucina (non-echo), Edelgard, or Lyn in the base roster as well and one or both of the other two as DLC, if Three Houses is a success.

 

[Pokelego999]

Don't be too sure about that. Corrin isn't that popular in the FE fanbase, yes they are liked but nowhere near the levels of the other FE lords. Imo Corrin was a bad choice because they're a terrible character in their game, the dullest player worship vehicle ever, and if uniqueness is all they have going for them in Smash, Azura would have been even more unique and also advertised Fates while being a likeable to tolerable character depending on who you ask.

Edit: to make this bump a bit less ranty, I think what they should do if the next Smash is a reboot is trim the FE roster down to Marth, Ike, and Robin, with one of either Lucina (non-echo), Edelgard, or Lyn in the base roster as well and one or both of the other two as DLC, if Three Houses is a success.

Sighs.
I feel i'm the only one here who respects corrin.

 

[Perkilator]

Well, since this thread was bumped:

I don't care about the current state. I'll happily take an 8th one, my current most wanted being Celica, Byleth, and Claude.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

I still can't wait to watch a trailer and suddenly hear "My moment has arrived!"

Here's to Claude making it in before Edelgard.....

 

[Nah]

as much as I'd like to see one (or more) of the 4 main characters of Three Houses make it in, I don't really expect that to happen

the best time to have made that reveal would've been shortly after Three Houses' release, and on top of that DLC has been almost entirely 3rd party characters, with little reason to believe that will change

 

[Nihilem]

Well I think the best way to do FE Justice is to give them the hero treatment. Meaning that we have one "Hero"-like characters with lots of alt skins representing all the blue (or red) haired, sword wielding fe protagonist, who - if we are completly honest, are incredible similiar in style and gameplay. So basically Marth, Roy, Chrom, Ike and Lucina would become one character. As extra goodies I would also throw into that Lyn (unfortunately i havent play the game where shes from, but shes wielding a katana on most of her art so the quick swordsmen trope would apply to her also.) and male/female Byleth. (Which would then use a normal sword and not the sword of the creator.)

That would be 8 customes in total. But it would also be possible that one or two of them would be echos with slightly varied attributes (and clones can have one special attack as seen with chrom). With that we could keep e.g. Ikes slower but heavy hitting style (even if that was not supported by his games if I remember correctly.) and his famous Aether or giving the Byleths their famous sword (then they have higher range but more endlag).



That would make place for at least two more Fire Emblem Character Spots. Which I would give to Robin (because magic) and to Edelgard.

 

[Opossum]

Well I think the best way to do FE Justice is to give them the hero treatment. Meaning that we have one "Hero"-like characters with lots of alt skins representing all the blue (or red) haired, sword wielding fe protagonist, who - if we are completly honest, are incredible similiar in style and gameplay. So basically Marth, Roy, Chrom, Ike and Lucina would become one character. As extra goodies I would also throw into that Lyn (unfortunately i havent play the game where shes from, but shes wielding a katana on most of her art so the quick swordsmen trope would apply to her also.) and male/female Byleth. (Which would then use a normal sword and not the sword of the creator.)

That would be 8 customes in total. But it would also be possible that one or two of them would be echos with slightly varied attributes (and clones can have one special attack as seen with chrom). With that we could keep e.g. Ikes slower but heavy hitting style (even if that was not supported by his games if I remember correctly.) and his famous Aether or giving the Byleths their famous sword (then they have higher range but more endlag).



That would make place for at least two more Fire Emblem Character Spots. Which I would give to Robin (because magic) and to Edelgard.

Making all of them share a single moveset when it makes zero sense to do so is the exact opposite of "doing them justice."

The Heroes in Dragon Quest are purposely made as blank slates for the player to project themselves onto. As such, they don't have as defined of personalities beyond being, well, heroic. All of the characters you suggested combining have completely different personalities and fighting styles (especially Ike, who doesn't have any similarities to Marth's moveset beyond, like, Counter, down tilt, and up air).

 

[Nihilem]

The Heroes in Dragon Quest are purposely made as blank slates for the player to project themselves onto. As such, they don't have as defined of personalities beyond being, well, heroic. All of the characters you suggested combining have completely different personalities and fighting styles (especially Ike, who doesn't have any similarities to Marth's moveset beyond, like, Counter, down tilt, and up air).

Are we talking now smash or fire emblem? Because if we are talking source material I dont see too much difference in the fighting styles of the lord classes in the different games. This difference mostly comes from smash which tried in the past to differenciate the old "clones" to make them semi clones. Which lead us to the situation that we now have that almost all fire emblem characters feel so similiar and the meme that fire emblem only has "blue haired anime swordsmen".

And I like to avoid taking old smash games as basis of the characters. Thats the reason why we still have no original ganondorf moveset that does him justice, but therefore sheik which only appears in one mainline game and which role is much more minor than lets say midna, horror kid or girahim. Oh and Mario have his fludd which also only appeared in only one game instead of his much more iconic hammer or ground stomp. In my argumentation I assumed that the next smash will be that "Remake" we heards rumores about, where everything can be designed from ground up.

 

[Opossum]

Are we talking now smash or fire emblem? Because if we are talking source material I dont see too much difference in the fighting styles of the lord classes in the different games. This difference mostly comes from smash which tried in the past to differenciate the old "clones" to make them semi clones. Which lead us to the situation that we now have that almost all fire emblem characters feel so similiar and the meme that fire emblem only has "blue haired anime swordsmen".

And I like to avoid taking old smash games as basis of the characters. Thats the reason why we still have no original ganondorf moveset that does him justice, but therefore sheik which only appears in one mainline game and which role is much more minor than lets say midna, horror kid or girahim. Oh and Mario have his fludd which also only appeared in only one game instead of his much more iconic hammer or ground stomp. In my argumentation I assumed that the next smash will be that "Remake" we heards rumores about, where everything can be designed from ground up.

Yes, I'm talking about the source material. The way Marth is portrayed is incredibly different when compared to someone like Ike. Their weapons alone would dictate it as such: Falchion is a much lighter blade than Ragnell, which is a greatsword. Marth is the traditional lord: light footwork, high speed, lighter weaponry. Ike, meanwhile, has a much more strength based utilitarian style due to being a mercenary instead of a lord.

Then there's the issue of the moves themselves. It'd make zero sense for Ike to have Shield Breaker or for Marth to have Aether.

And the personalities wouldn't match either. For a character to "share a slot" or be an alt, they need to share the same animations. Moves, taunts, victory poses, idle stances, Final Smashes, all of that.

Marth is a noble, classically trained swordsman who keeps an optimistic facade even in the face of horrible danger to prevent a loss of morale. Ike is a rugged and stoic mercenary who lets his actions do the talking and has no regard for decorum. Chrom is a man who you can always count on to carry the day, but he often dives into a fight without regard for his own safety and wears his heart on his (missing) sleeve.

To suggest that these three, for example, should share a slot would mean wiping away everything that sets them apart. They're totally different characters and it makes no sense for them to fight identically, and that's why they don't fight identically. To fit them into a one-size-fits-all mold would be to strip them of their individual characters.

 

[Pokelego999]

Well I think the best way to do FE Justice is to give them the hero treatment. Meaning that we have one "Hero"-like characters with lots of alt skins representing all the blue (or red) haired, sword wielding fe protagonist, who - if we are completly honest, are incredible similiar in style and gameplay. So basically Marth, Roy, Chrom, Ike and Lucina would become one character. As extra goodies I would also throw into that Lyn (unfortunately i havent play the game where shes from, but shes wielding a katana on most of her art so the quick swordsmen trope would apply to her also.) and male/female Byleth. (Which would then use a normal sword and not the sword of the creator.)

That would be 8 customes in total. But it would also be possible that one or two of them would be echos with slightly varied attributes (and clones can have one special attack as seen with chrom). With that we could keep e.g. Ikes slower but heavy hitting style (even if that was not supported by his games if I remember correctly.) and his famous Aether or giving the Byleths their famous sword (then they have higher range but more endlag).



That would make place for at least two more Fire Emblem Character Spots. Which I would give to Robin (because magic) and to Edelgard.

I've heard this same idea three times. And it's still dumb. Marth and Ike have competely different movesets (bar counter), Chrom and Roy have enough differences to differentiate themselves. (Not roy and chrom from each other) Swords like Falchion, Ragnell, The Binding Blade, etc, all have different attributes, and can you really picture ike performing shield breaker? Or marth performing flare blade? On top of that, they share different porportions and hitboxes as well. Lucina is the only one out of these ones listed that makes sense as she is marth's literal echo. Stripping Byleth of their signature weapon is also quite dumb as that's like stripping link of the master sword. And besides, this isn't how palette swaps work. They don't get different attributes: that's what echos are for. This is what comes of people who call themselves "fire emblem fans" or saying "we're doing fire emblem good." It's like saying Mario, Luigi, Peach, and Toad should share a slot as they have the same moveset in Mario 2. Think before you speak.

 

[I.D.]

The obvious solution is to add an equivalent amount of fire emblem characters for every other weapon type, so 7 spears, 7 axes, etc

 

[whitesnake]

I've heard this same idea three times. And it's still dumb. Marth and Ike have competely different movesets (bar counter), Chrom and Roy have enough differences to differentiate themselves. (Not roy and chrom from each other) Swords like Falchion, Ragnell, The Binding Blade, etc, all have different attributes, and can you really picture ike performing shield breaker? Or marth performing flare blade? On top of that, they share different porportions and hitboxes as well. Lucina is the only one out of these ones listed that makes sense as she is marth's literal echo. Stripping Byleth of their signature weapon is also quite dumb as that's like stripping link of the master sword. And besides, this isn't how palette swaps work. They don't get different attributes: that's what echos are for. This is what comes of people who call themselves "fire emblem fans" or saying "we're doing fire emblem good." It's like saying Mario, Luigi, Peach, and Toad should share a slot as they have the same moveset in Mario 2. Think before you speak.

sorry bud... the initial post was correct. You are exaggerating minor differences. We have 5 FE “anime swordsmen” that are all super similar

 

[Nah]

The obvious solution is to add an equivalent amount of fire emblem characters for every other weapon type, so 7 spears, 7 axes, etc

i like the way you think

 

[Perkilator]

sorry bud... the initial post was correct. You are exaggerating minor differences. We have 5 FE “anime swordsmen” that are all super similar

They still have different traits to them, with being the most different from , and being the most similar (which makes sense as is ‘s Echo Fighter).

 

[Zeb Nasaki]

Three houses is probably gettinga rep in the dlc. They do not have spirits yet and we do not know how post pass will be handled. They could do a fighter pass 2 with only third parties while they give us some nintendo characters, like dixie, bandana dee, fe rep, or astral chian with only the character and music.


Personally I have conflict opinions in the representation of FE in smash.

Marth: He is great. The first lord, sword user wih light speed a veteran since Melee. His inclusion while questionable before is now irrelevant considering how huge Fire Emblem has become. Marth is also loved by the comunity, not as popular as other lords but his games in DS have make enough for the people in the West to know his character and fell in love with him.

Roy: Lucky Boy, if it weren't for Melee he will probably be with Seliph, Sigurd and Leif as the most forgotten lords in the franchise, his game is still a japan exlcusive an does not have a remake like exhoes that bumped Alm and Celica popularity on the comunity.
However this story is another and despite of being a bland and useless, he was very bad, chatacter in his games to the point of being one of the primary reasons to not play Binding Blade, Sakurai make him flashy, energetic and added some fire moves that give him the personality he never had so now is a fan favourite both in Smash an FE comunities.
So now I think he is fine as a Melee veteran and is distinct enough of Marth to consider him as his own character. He literally is almost an Smash original since he debuted first in melee than his own game, so do not make him leave his true home.

Ike: Good choice before and good choice know, a very distinct moveset than Marth making him a proper "second" rep of the franchise. His heavy attacks and more agressive personality reflect his mercenary status. He is loved in both comunities. In the FE comunity he is the most popualr lord and his games are considered some of the best in the franchise despite the abismal sales. A good representstion in my opinion.

Lucina: The first "official" clone of Marth, we alredy had Roy so another clone was questionable, but he was very, VERY, loved by the FE comunity so i guess Sakurai tried to put her by all costs even if she weren't her own fighter. Now I think with overall aceptance of echoes Lucina is not so much hated by the Smash comunity, specially with the preference of top players for Lucina in ckntrast os Smash4 days when barelly anyone used her over Marth, she has gained her spot, and represent one of the most important games for IS: Awakening. But we had another character to do that..

Robin: A huge suprise considering the popularity of Chrom, but for me it was the right move. He had so much more moveset potential than Chrom and it represents weapon durability, magic, dark magic, a different class, the types and changes of weapons, even the types of spells, a lot of things in the franchise are represented trough robin, so while he is not so popular in the fanbase, he is an important inclusion for the roster of Fe characters and a perfect rep for Awakening in my opinion. That game at least deserved one character for not letting the franchise die.

Corrin: This is the problem. Fates was even not out yet, and the character was not requested, but they put him in at the worst possible moment. They were argues over the size of the Fire Emblem roster before but Corrin was the thing that really upset the people. They were all expecting and praying to have theri favourtie character in the game, knowing it will be their last chance, they have askin for years and then a charavter than no one wanted, with a series with too many characters, from a game not even out yet, to "steal" that precious oportunity for your character, what an amazing Smash villain Sakurai and Nintendo created.
Corrin could have a unique moveset in contrast of the other FE reps and represent the manakete part of Fire Emblem, but he never should have been a character. He is hated everywhere. Almost all the FE fanbase consider him the worst lord of the series and the primary reason of the bad writing in the Fates games, myself included, so if he was not added probably no one would ever requested him, not even now. And in smash well Ihave explained it alredy. Despite FE being my second favourite videogame franchise of all time I am not okay with his inclusion, specially the timing, literally every other FE lord would have been better and it should have been added in ultimate not Smash4. But he has gained some love nowadays, his moveset is fun and the female alt is cute so a similar situation with roy has happened, but with the origin of the hate for a roster from a not so well represented franchise. I would cut him personally if it would be another smash game, and give his moveset to another character like tiki or myrrh.

Chrom: He was requested but I think it is an overrepresentation of awakening with three characters from one game of a the whole 16 games of the franchise. However he is an interesting echo different enough to roym so is meaningfull to pkay one form the other. He does not bring harm or good is only another FE "clone". I would have put someone like alm to represent more games in the franchise but chrom is not a terrible choice.

So now I think FE has the curse that most of hsi characters are clones or semiclones that do not rpresent well the obrrall franchise using mostly one fo the various types of weapons, and representing with 7 characters only 5 games of the franchise. I woul really love to have a Threehouse rep that bring somethin unique to the table and is loved by both the FE and Smash comunities, so it does not matter for me if is Claude, Byleth, Dimitri or Edelgard, as long as they represent well Three Houses as a whole, is now my favourite game of the franchise, I will be happy and perhaps it could finally erase this undeserving hate the franchise in Smash has showing them that is more than just "anime sword fighter".

 

[Nihilem]

Yes, I'm talking about the source material. The way Marth is portrayed is incredibly different when compared to someone like Ike. Their weapons alone would dictate it as such: Falchion is a much lighter blade than Ragnell, which is a greatsword. Marth is the traditional lord: light footwork, high speed, lighter weaponry. Ike, meanwhile, has a much more strength based utilitarian style due to being a mercenary instead of a lord.

Then there's the issue of the moves themselves. It'd make zero sense for Ike to have Shield Breaker or for Marth to have Aether.

And the personalities wouldn't match either. For a character to "share a slot" or be an alt, they need to share the same animations. Moves, taunts, victory poses, idle stances, Final Smashes, all of that.

Marth is a noble, classically trained swordsman who keeps an optimistic facade even in the face of horrible danger to prevent a loss of morale. Ike is a rugged and stoic mercenary who lets his actions do the talking and has no regard for decorum. Chrom is a man who you can always count on to carry the day, but he often dives into a fight without regard for his own safety and wears his heart on his (missing) sleeve.

To suggest that these three, for example, should share a slot would mean wiping away everything that sets them apart. They're totally different characters and it makes no sense for them to fight identically, and that's why they don't fight identically. To fit them into a one-size-fits-all mold would be to strip them of their individual characters.

Well I admit that the inclusion of Ike was a little bit of a stretch. Thats why I mention him first as potential echo. In my opinion most of the future "echos" should be more designed like ken instead of richter (richter in my opinion should be a skin instead of an echo.) Meaning that they indeed can have their own animations (like ken has for example for mutiple attacks) to represent their personalities, while keeping the same movement design as their originating character. And while Shield Breaker and Erruption surely look different their still have the same core design beeing slow chargable heavy hitter attacks.

But I can totally understand everyone who wants him as his own char. I just come from the perspective that the next smash game will most likely be a reboot of the series, meaning that it would probably not have more than 50 chars. Which means for a niche series like FE heavy cuts. And before getting no Ike at all I prefer echo Ike. Even if his personality is not 100% hit in this implementation.

But for the others (namely beeing marth, roy, lucina and chrom) I think not much is lost when they share a spot. Lucina impersonates marth in her own game after all and marth and roy were clones once in melee. Also that whole "attack with the hilt" is stupid and makes my heart bleed whenever i hear it. I suppose it was just added so that nintendo could sell him as his own character instead of another clone.

Lyn I just added to the list because i like her character design. I honestly have no idea about her or her game. But a katana is known for quick swordplay so I thought it fit. And I do not see any chance for her getting her own character slot. Maybe in wish-smash bros with 300 characters to choose from ... but otherwise alt-skin is the maximum i see for her.

While Byleth may get his own spot (with female version as alt-skin) and it is true that him not wielding the SotC is weird, as a supporter of playable Edelgard i am a little bit biased in this regard. Because I dont see two reps for Three Houses (even if the game would deserve it). But to still have battles between Byleth and Edelgard on Garreg Mach, playable Edelgard with echo/skin Byleth is my preference.




Finally I want to mention (I should have probably started with that ...) the basis of my argumentation is that in future (because the roster spreads more and more, including more third parties and probably indies at some point and sooner or later a roster cut is inevitable) we probably only have like three slots free to represent Fire Emblem as a whole. And in this hypothetical scenario Marth, Robin and Edelgard represent much more of Fire Emblem then having three swordsfighter with chargable neutral b and counters. So for the rest of the series to be included compromises are necessary. Everyone being their as their own character with original moveset and animations would be nice for the fans of specific characters - but I dont see that happening.

 

[Pokelego999]

Corrin: This is the problem. Fates was even not out yet, and the character was not requested, but they put him in at the worst possible moment. They were argues over the size of the Fire Emblem roster before but Corrin was the thing that really upset the people. They were all expecting and praying to have theri favourtie character in the game, knowing it will be their last chance, they have askin for years and then a charavter than no one wanted, with a series with too many characters, from a game not even out yet, to "steal" that precious oportunity for your character, what an amazing Smash villain Sakurai and Nintendo created.
Corrin could have a unique moveset in contrast of the other FE reps and represent the manakete part of Fire Emblem, but he never should have been a character. He is hated everywhere. Almost all the FE fanbase consider him the worst lord of the series and the primary reason of the bad writing in the Fates games, myself included, so if he was not added probably no one would ever requested him, not even now. And in smash well Ihave explained it alredy. Despite FE being my second favourite videogame franchise of all time I am not okay with his inclusion, specially the timing, literally every other FE lord would have been better and it should have been added in ultimate not Smash4. But he has gained some love nowadays, his moveset is fun and the female alt is cute so a similar situation with roy has happened, but with the origin of the hate for a roster from a not so well represented franchise. I would cut him personally if it would be another smash game, and give his moveset to another character like tiki or myrrh.

Corrin did not have "the" worst writing out there. The reason Corrin was added was not because of marketing (that may have partially been the reason, but not the whole reason), they were added because of the staff. Sakurai saw the upset so many FE characters caused and when corrin was brought to him, he was uncertain, thinking that there would be more negativity and backlash. However the staff convinced Sakurai that Corrin could be unique, and Sakurai went with it. Also, no character has a slot "stolen". They were probably never considered (for a good amount, some were definetly considered, as seen with ultimate.) But this negativity and backlash is what leads to fire emblem being so negatively seen. Also, they aren't hated "everywhere". Sure, there is a lot of negativity, but that was mainly due to smash and fates' mostly cringy writing (which wasn't the worst, but was decently bad.) The character itself isn't the worst, and could probably have been built better. Honestly, I do agree, another lord would've been better. (I still want Leif or Seliph or someone from Fe4 or 5) And tiki would have been a better manakete rep. But, Corrin is fun, and this negativity is what is causing the hate around Corrin.

Well I admit that the inclusion of Ike was a little bit of a stretch. Thats why I mention him first as potential echo. In my opinion most of the future "echos" should be more designed like ken instead of richter (richter in my opinion should be a skin instead of an echo.) Meaning that they indeed can have their own animations (like ken has for example for mutiple attacks) to represent their personalities, while keeping the same movement design as their originating character. And while Shield Breaker and Erruption surely look different their still have the same core design beeing slow chargable heavy hitter attacks.

But I can totally understand everyone who wants him as his own char. I just come from the perspective that the next smash game will most likely be a reboot of the series, meaning that it would probably not have more than 50 chars. Which means for a niche series like FE heavy cuts. And before getting no Ike at all I prefer echo Ike. Even if his personality is not 100% hit in this implementation.

But for the others (namely beeing marth, roy, lucina and chrom) I think not much is lost when they share a spot. Lucina impersonates marth in her own game after all and marth and roy were clones once in melee. Also that whole "attack with the hilt" is stupid and makes my heart bleed whenever i hear it. I suppose it was just added so that nintendo could sell him as his own character instead of another clone.

Lyn I just added to the list because i like her character design. I honestly have no idea about her or her game. But a katana is known for quick swordplay so I thought it fit. And I do not see any chance for her getting her own character slot. Maybe in wish-smash bros with 300 characters to choose from ... but otherwise alt-skin is the maximum i see for her.

While Byleth may get his own spot (with female version as alt-skin) and it is true that him not wielding the SotC is weird, as a supporter of playable Edelgard i am a little bit biased in this regard. Because I dont see two reps for Three Houses (even if the game would deserve it). But to still have battles between Byleth and Edelgard on Garreg Mach, playable Edelgard with echo/skin Byleth is my preference.




Finally I want to mention (I should have probably started with that ...) the basis of my argumentation is that in future (because the roster spreads more and more, including more third parties and probably indies at some point and sooner or later a roster cut is inevitable) we probably only have like three slots free to represent Fire Emblem as a whole. And in this hypothetical scenario Marth, Robin and Edelgard represent much more of Fire Emblem then having three swordsfighter with chargable neutral b and counters. So for the rest of the series to be included compromises are necessary. Everyone being their as their own character with original moveset and animations would be nice for the fans of specific characters - but I dont see that happening.

This is a lot more understandable than that first post. I like your thinking on echos, and it could be like this in the future. Your first post didn't clarify much so I thought you were being super negative. Sorry on that. Lyn also is a great echo idea for marth, as her sword/katana deisgn fits well with Marth's.

sorry bud... the initial post was correct. You are exaggerating minor differences. We have 5 FE “anime swordsmen” that are all super similar

Dude that is literally what I was arguing against. Marth, Lucina, Roy, and Chrom are similar yes, but for the most part, Roy and Chrom have enough differences from marth they could be fleshed out in the future. Ike, Robin, and Corrin are more unique than all of these guys, with the only similarities being down b and sword. Corrin and Robin hardly use the sword though. Ike is far different from Marth and Roy, having completely different moves (bar down b)
Their appearence is all anyone thinks of them before seeing them.

The obvious solution is to add an equivalent amount of fire emblem characters for every other weapon type, so 7 spears, 7 axes, etc

I agree with Nah, this way of thinking is brilliant and deserves a nobel.

 

[Perkilator]

as much as I'd like to see one (or more) of the 4 main characters of Three Houses make it in, I don't really expect that to happen

the best time to have made that reveal would've been shortly after Three Houses' release, and on top of that DLC has been almost entirely 3rd party characters, with little reason to believe that will change

Just because it didn't happen then doesn't mean it won't happen in the future. Sakurai would've specifically stated if the DLC AFTER the Fighter's Pass was going to be all 3rd party again (which I highly doubt), so let's not throw in the towel just yet.

 

[Nah]

as much as I'd like to see one (or more) of the 4 main characters of Three Houses make it in, I don't really expect that to happen

the best time to have made that reveal would've been shortly after Three Houses' release, and on top of that DLC has been almost entirely 3rd party characters, with little reason to believe that will change

ay lmao I ended up being so wrong about this

love how they took at stab at the "too many swords" thing lol

so ready for the salt

 

[smileMasky]

Well they did change things up with the weapon triangle. But I see a river of salt coming from a mile away