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The Smash 64 Video Critique Thread ~ post your videos for strategy/advice/tips =D

King Funk

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Hello everyone. I saw the Smash 64 section didn't have a thread like this so I thought it'd be worth posting one. =D

Post your videos here and get advice for improvement here by me or other players. ^^

The player that wants to be analyzed should:
a. Provide 2-3 videos of the same match-up against the same player. Preferably a set.
b. Have lost the match by at least 2 or more stocks (in a 5 stock match) or 1 stock with low percent (in a 4 stock match)
c. List a few things they think they did wrong in the match

The criterias above are not mandatory but are definitely preferable to get better and more helpful feedback.
 

The Star King

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I think critiquing people you play is a lot more effective.

However, I see people asking for criticism and the only thing we have to go off is the text description of their playstyle, so this is still a good idea.
 

King Funk

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I think critiquing people you play is a lot more effective.

However, I see people asking for criticism and the only thing we have to go off is the text description of their playstyle, so this is still a good idea.
I give a TON of advice to newer players as I play with them. Tons of European players can tell you that. =p

I just want to take it to the next level and help more people.
 

3mmanu3lrc

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I think critiquing people you play is a lot more effective.

However, I see people asking for criticism and the only thing we have to go off is the text description of their playstyle, so this is still a good idea.
This ^^^

Moreover, let me be the first to post a vid, I posted these two vids a while ago expecting some critiques, but I kind of got nothing, so here they are again...


I'm using White Falcon in the second one.

Also bellow in my signature is my youtube channel, some critics in the vids there will be appretiated.
 

Sangoku

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I would love to post a lot of vids, but I mostly play Bear and he doesn't want to be on youtube =(.

I'll try to record a few matches during the weekend though.
 

O.o-RITH-o.O

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This ^^^

Moreover, let me be the first to post a vid, I posted these two vids a while ago expecting some critiques, but I kind of got nothing, so here they are again...


I'm using White Falcon in the second one.

Also bellow in my signature is my youtube channel, some critics in the vids there will be appretiated.
well...i'll risk..you have some nice moves like uair > f.punch and dash turn around jump bair/uair inverse, but i think you could experiment with other aerials...like from 0% do grab>uair>grab> nair>uair>upb, and many other variations with nair and fair...
but more important,you oponent was really weak,but i think your mindgame was a little sloppy,prolly playing with some defencive or carefull oponent you will have a lot of trouble..spacing with bair is nice,dash dance too but gets a little predictible if you do it all the time..but guess i kinda liked your falcon,is going in the right path i think
 

King Funk

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Training mode combos is not really the aim of this thread here. Real matches are. xD

OK, your Falcon ditto now:

Your opponent does a ton of errors and is very predictable, but there's definitely a few things you can do better.

0:11 -> your opponent has you on a corner, but don't panic in this situation ; dropping down into the box zone is the safest option you have.
0:15 -> you can't combo from this part of the stage with fair at 0% ; you can either try another move or, after the f-throw, read where he's techrolling to (probably towards the middle of the stage), and continue the combo.
0:24 -> risky dair but it paid off ; after that, take it slower and wait till he techs before going down there ; I also love to use nair instead of bair on that exact spot because nair has a nice reverse hitbox and has a good forward hitbox that bair can't really provide.
0:28 -> your opponent could have used FP recovery to go further but good edgeguard nonetheless.

There are many parts where you try to hit him with full hop uair at low% a bit too much. Remember that uairs are not very rewarding if you hit your airborne opponent at 0-20%. Same goes for that dash attack at 0:41.

0:53 -> funny combo ; here's that uair we were talking about, usmash would have been a much better option to start a combo as he was clearly landing on you ; I have no idea whether the reverse utilt was planned, but if it was kudos. xD
1:04 -> nice f-throw pivot bair ; but remember that a reverse uair has far stronger knockback and you could have hit him with that too. =p
1:15 -> at first I thought "why doesn't he nair to start a wall combo" then you did that FP finish ; good stuff.

Not bad, I'd prefer to see a 5-stock match though. And in other matchups and vs other opponents. =D
 

3mmanu3lrc

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Well, I'm not a Falcon main, but it's a cool character to use, so I'll be implementing those tips you gave me, which were also true now that I think about em.
Thanks.

It was a 3 stock match because the software I was usen crashes when it was recording about 3+ minutes, but I'll try some updates/changes on that.

Thanks again.
 

B Link

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The only advice I'd take is from a high level player (e.g. "a" tier players >_>) in regards to them commenting on a match. Their advice on matches would necessarily be subtle as there is only so much you can do to help through a forum. You could say "do __ instead of __" but that might actually have a negative effect on some other aspect of the person's 'mindset' when playing. The best way to learn is to meet up with the best players in person - it's too bad this is often impossible for the majority of us.

I think the best advice anyone can give here strictly in terms of IMPROVING RESULTS is noticing common mistakes or seemingly insignificant errors.

Here's some examples:
- noticing too many missed z-cancels that got punished
- always trying to ledge hop and getting punished by a fsmash edgeguard
- not finishing combos

These 'small' mistakes separate the average players from the better ones. Anything more detailed than that is too detailed in my opinion (e.g. telling someone to use 'x' aerial more often then 'y' aerial) and would probably NOT improve results.
 

King Funk

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Here's some examples:
- noticing too many missed z-cancels that got punished
- always trying to ledge hop and getting punished by a fsmash edgeguard
- not finishing combos
Those are very general things that the player himself should know about. But it's true I should have mentioned that.

And I'm not FORCING anyone to use one move instead of another, it's purely recommendations. You have such a wide range of possibilities when it comes to combos with Falcon.

This thread is not gonna SAVE you, it's just gonna attempt to help you get better, even if it's just a tiny bit.
 

B Link

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I actually had this idea a while back and think this thread could be very productive if the videos analyzed had strict criteria.

I only make that post so that this thread won't DIE as it has a very high probability of doing so given the vagueness in its description. With it's current description I don't think any good player would be inclined to give their advice, making it mostly useless.

I think that 3mmanu3l can learn nothing from that video to improve. He won by 3 stocks against a bad player. No matter what advice you gave him, he'd probably win either way. (Maybe he was playing a good player, I don't know since he didn't link to enough matches) So what's the point?

Here's what I think you should put in the first post as a criteria for video critique requests:

1. The player that wants to be analyzed must:
a. Provide 2-3 videos of the same match-up against the same player. Preferably a set.
b. Have lost the match by at least 2 or more stocks (in a 5 stock match) or 1 stock with low percent (in a 4 stock match)
c. List a few things they think they did wrong in the match


If it was a close match (like Nova's video) I think the poster would have to mention whether or not they were alternating wins with the opponent or always losing in very close matches. If they were always losing then they could probably use feedback. If they were alternating wins then the reason they lost probably comes down to their mental game, which can be generally suggested to the player to improve.
 

King Funk

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I actually had this idea a while back and think this thread could be very productive if the videos analyzed had strict criteria.

I only make that post so that this thread won't DIE as it has a very high probability of doing so given the vagueness in its description. With it's current description I don't think any good player would be inclined to give their advice, making it mostly useless.

I think that 3mmanu3l can learn nothing from that video to improve. He won by 3 stocks against a bad player. No matter what advice you gave him, he'd probably win either way. (Maybe he was playing a good player, I don't know since he didn't link to enough matches) So what's the point?

Here's what I think you should put in the first post as a criteria for video critique requests:

1. The player that wants to be analyzed must:
a. Provide 2-3 videos of the same match-up against the same player. Preferably a set.
b. Have lost the match by at least 2 or more stocks (in a 5 stock match) or 1 stock with low percent (in a 4 stock match)
c. List a few things they think they did wrong in the match


If it was a close match (like Nova's video) I think the poster would have to mention whether or not they were alternating wins with the opponent or always losing in very close matches. If they were always losing then they could probably use feedback. If they were alternating wins then the reason they lost probably comes down to their mental game, which can be generally suggested to the player to improve.
I don't see why good players would complain about the description. Some threads on the other boards have far more vague descriptions and yet actually work quite well. But yeah I get what you mean, the criterias you listed seem nice, but I don't really want to make them mandatory. I listed them as recommended though.

And well, I told 3mmanu3l his video wasn't really ideal, tbh. There's not much I could talk about in his gameplay except in really basic stuff like combos. It's hard for me to talk about strategy if his opponent is not a good player. =S
 

B Link

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Here, I can start one off with that format, seeing as I'm trying to improve my luigi >_>

B Link (Luigi) vs Peek~ (Ness)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9u88g4AFB2M

a. How many matches?
- 5 matches in total.

b. Stocks Lost?
- Lost by 1 stock to 3 stocks (4 stock match)

c. Things I think I did wrong:
- should have ledge hop'd + fireball instead of ledge hop aerial attacks when I was getting edgeguarded
- should put more pressure with dsmash when I'M edgeguarding, so that the ness player couldn't continuously ledge hop stall
- didn't UpB counter all of the times that I could have, (e.g. after getting hit by Uair at low percent)

Feel free to give your advice in regards to the Luigi vs Ness match-up specifically.

You can also contrast my gameplay against a better Luigi player, Frogles, who won 2/3 matches against Peek's Ness >_>

Frogles (Luigi) vs Peek~ (Ness) - First 3 matches
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLzrSYaoM2k
 

Peek~

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Feel free to give your advice in regards to the Luigi vs Ness match-up specifically
I forgot who said it on here(I think it was an aussiebro) but playing vs Ness is actually simple.

1. Grab early
2. Keep combos simple(Luigi: Any Air -> Grab)
3. Force Ness to PKthunder from below
4. Projectiles vs Ness on Dreamland are good, both for edgeguarding and pressure

I should upload more Boom since he does an amazing job at countering everything Ness does
 

B Link

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I forgot who said it on here(I think it was an aussiebro) but playing vs Ness is actually simple.

1. Grab early
2. Keep combos simple(Luigi: Any Air -> Grab)
3. Force Ness to PKthunder from below
4. Projectiles vs Ness on Dreamland are good, both for edgeguarding and pressure

I should upload more Boom since he does an amazing job at countering everything Ness does
Been doing more of this and it's been really helpful (I think #3 actually helps me against fox, jiggs and kirby too lol)

Sometimes I forget the basics and forget how useful fireballs are.
 

Sangoku

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ballin4life

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I'm watching the first video, and the first thing that comes to mind is you don't grab enough.

1:35 you have a guaranteed grab here and yet you shine on his shield. You could fthrow him into the tent and possibly follow up with a fair/dair into tent combo kill. A few seconds later you do jab dtilt. Why not grab? Grab can throw him off the edge where Fox is most vulnerable.

Watching match 2 and I see the same thing. You get a bunch of hits in at the beginning, but you don't throw him off the stage and gimp. Fox dittos are a gimpfest.
 

Sangoku

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Thanks ballin! I'll try to grab more in the future, but I've often been disapointed by its frustrating hitbox (doesn't work if too close). Concerning the bad DI thing, it's just that my right DI is way better than my left, so I took the (bad) habit of always DIing right when taken in a combo.

Nobody else want to give tips? =(

Here are other vids, unfortunately not sets:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw_kfdFHUXs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zWPVQyMjS4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA_EM0OmBNM

As I've written in the video description it was lagging badly during the first two.
 

SuPeRbOoM

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2 vital things I noticed right away: You miss edgeguards a lot of the time. You need to get these edgeguards right vs ness cause ness is a monster onstage.

And secondly, I noticed your oshi- tactic is to uptilt. You need to find something else to do in that situation other than uptilting, it's getting you punished pretty hard.
 

asianaussie

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would you say full hop u-air is a legitimate panic tactic

it works well when i try to u-smash, realise i was going to get owned, then realise my techskill sucks and i did a jump u-air instead
 

ciaza

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Don't roll (especially on platforms to nowhere).
Don't just upsmash without any sort of lead in like a uair.
Approach with fair as little as possible.
The f*ck were you doing from 1:48 - 1:53 (first video).
I think ledge-hop uair > ledgehop fair.

Dair is a sh*t approach, for the most part the best you'll get is a trade off. ESPECIALLY don't go for it from above where a Ness can space his broken uair (like what happened in second vid, third match).

You don't seem to be bad at edgeguarding...but that ness was getting back a lot more than one should on dreamland against a pikachu.

Otherwise ggs entertaining matches.
 

Surri-Sama

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2 vital things I noticed right away: You miss edgeguards a lot of the time. You need to get these edgeguards right vs ness cause ness is a monster onstage.

And secondly, I noticed your oshi- tactic is to uptilt. You need to find something else to do in that situation other than uptilting, it's getting you punished pretty hard.
I'll definitely need to work on edge guarding, i felt that through out the match i became more aware of it but it seemed as if there was nothing i could do to drastically change this (even though ness is obviously very weak in recovery).

as for the Utilt thing, I noticed this after watching these fights, as it actually lead directly to me getting pushed off the edge as kirby, which lead to me using Uair off stage..falling to my doom :(

would you say full hop u-air is a legitimate panic tactic

it works well when i try to u-smash, realise i was going to get owned, then realise my techskill sucks and i did a jump u-air instead
The problem i see with trying to change my oshi- (as boom put it) tactic is it's mostly instinctive after all these years of play and i do it with every char except perhaps Falcon. It's going to be tough to break.

Don't roll (especially on platforms to nowhere).
Don't just upsmash without any sort of lead in like a uair.
Approach with fair as little as possible.
The f*ck were you doing from 1:48 - 1:53 (first video).
I think ledge-hop uair > ledgehop fair.

Dair is a sh*t approach, for the most part the best you'll get is a trade off. ESPECIALLY don't go for it from above where a Ness can space his broken uair (like what happened in second vid, third match).

You don't seem to be bad at edgeguarding...but that ness was getting back a lot more than one should on dreamland against a pikachu.

Try to be more erratic in recovery, Peek had your number a lot as often you went for the ledge (though I am guilty of that too).

Otherwise ggs entertaining matches.
Rolling is a flaw im already working on, im surprised you didn't say something about standing techs...something that im also already working on as i find it a big problem of my technical game.

Usmashing stupidly is something i'll definitely cut out asap...got to much into the habit because of trying to learn combos with pikachu...obviously using it stupidly isn't the answer i just need to find a better application.

Any Fair APPROACH thats not off the edge is most likely an error either due to my controller being crap or to my own personal mistake.


About 1:48 - 1:53...I dont know....o.o;;

"I think ledge-hop uair > ledgehop fair." I'll start using this.

Using Dair as an approach is a mistake im starting to realize. I use it a lot because i can pressure most people very well with this attack but the better people get the worse it seems to become.

My accuracy with Bair isn't what it used to be and i've become terribly predictable, this ..with a few other things...in my opinion is the biggest reason my edge guarding has gone down.


Recovering from above does seem to be the best option in most cases, unless of course theres an obviously easy escape from the edge.






thanks to everyone who has given me advice so far!!
 

ciaza

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I was tempted to mention standing techs and probably should of... but it's a dilemma because pikachu tech rolls are b*llocks and easily punished anyway =/. One of pikachu's few flaws.
 

Battlecow

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STOP INSULTING BULLOCKS

My namesake right there

Don't compare them to lame things like pika's techroll

And don't listen to the Sex Pistols

Mind the Bullocks.
 

The Star King

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I played Surri today and he is looking significantly better already, compared to the video.
 

O.o-RITH-o.O

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1º - you can shield grab samus dash atack...
2º - try to space more with the whole uair hitbox
3º - EG vs samus usually is very easy if you stay onstage and wait for fsmash the right time... or even dtilt..if he is coming to high,you can also easily utilt (you are fsmashing too far from the edge sometimes)
4º - when pikachu is utilting some light char like samus,is easy and effective uair combo him,even if in the middle of the stage.. just utilts > jump uair > get a little bellow him and jump uair again > falling from the second jump you bair.. that's the basic basic stuff that i shoud be seen at least.
5º - is kinda ridiculous you so scare from a samus with pikachu,he should be scared... make better spacing , try to link aerias into grabs and use better the utilt..
 

NovaSmash

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1º - you can shield grab samus dash atack...
2º - try to space more with the whole uair hitbox
3º - EG vs samus usually is very easy if you stay onstage and wait for fsmash the right time... or even dtilt..if he is coming to high,you can also easily utilt (you are fsmashing too far from the edge sometimes)
4º - when pikachu is utilting some light char like samus,is easy and effective uair combo him,even if in the middle of the stage.. just utilts > jump uair > get a little bellow him and jump uair again > falling from the second jump you bair.. that's the basic basic stuff that i shoud be seen at least.
5º - is kinda ridiculous you so scare from a samus with pikachu,he should be scared... make better spacing , try to link aerias into grabs and use better the utilt..
i guess because this guy has ***** so many times in the past that im afraid to play agressive. I was thinkin he would dair me if i went out to edgegaurd him.
 

ciaza

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Don't try to space Captain Falcon Uptilt alot, end lag is punishable.
Don't go for risky edgeguards that force you to recover with UpB. A player like Jaime will punish.
Don't try to upsmash a Samus when she's anything like beyond 30%. Too sluggish and the rewards are little. Going for an Uair is probably the better option.
3rd match, 0:35: FALCON KICK!


I could tell you got frustrated end of second match so I know that I don't have to point anything you did wrong there, you would know yourself =P

Otherwise it's hard. You seem an OK falcon. Going against a Samus that knows how to minimise error, capitalise on any mistake and create a tight defense can be hard. I think improvement will come mostly from experience at this stage.
 

sharksquail

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yea some of those uptilts were just missed u-smash, i **** up a lot online cause i don't play it very often, and can't get the controls to feel like console + input delay bull****. I also found when I was playing that match that I couldn't find a good way to edgeguard which was frustrating and led to some really stupid plays.
 
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