The ROB Matchup Thread

[T.O.Y]

Either way, G&W shuts down most of R.O.B's options. This MU is all about Mix Up and keeping your opponent off guard.
Get predictable and you will lose, although that's most matchups.
Tilts are beat by turtle, Gyro is beat by turtle, and most aerials are too slow or lack the range to beat bair 30-70 if not 35-65

 

[-LzR-]

35-65? Are you serious? It just can't be. G&W has some good tools against us, but he doesn't totally shut us down.

 

[Cubone]

Either way, G&W shuts down most of R.O.B's options. This MU is all about Mix Up and keeping your opponent off guard.
Get predictable and you will lose, although that's most matchups.
Tilts are beat by turtle, Gyro is beat by turtle, and most aerials are too slow or lack the range to beat bair 30-70 if not 35-65

GW doesn't shut down anything.

I have posted numerous times on how to beat the freaking turtle...

I really thought people would know how to beat out the turtle by now... Ftilt outranges it unless its being thrown early (in which case WALK AWAY), you can space a fsmash through it, or hell, SDI ruins it. Take 4% and watch his end lag if hes hitting you with the very tip or SDI up and fair him if its not spaced as well.

Nair also outranges it, with some prediction. Its not like GW has much of a mix up game for you to deal with.

This MU is even. You're making it out to be as bad as freaking DDD

 

[T.O.Y]

GW doesn't shut down anything.

I have posted numerous times on how to beat the freaking turtle...


Nair also outranges it, with some prediction. Its not like GW has much of a mix up game for you to deal with.

This MU is even. You're making it out to be as bad as freaking DDD

Okay, lol. Maybe I am making it out to be worse than it really is. However, even? Im not sure.

 

[Rizk18]

What's the ROB boards opinion on the MU ratio for Fox? Fox boards say 55-45.

 

[stingers]

55-45 fox? i could buy that

 

[-LzR-]

I think it's 40-60 or it might be 45-55 or let's say it's 50-50... mmm not sure I guess it's 55-45 oh the hell it's our advantage 60-40.

 

[Heartstring]

im not sure what to make of it, cause the current direction of the fox metagame is easy enough for rob to deal with, but a more koooky fox playstyle is really hard for rob to deal with

 

[TeeVee]

i feel its 60 - 40 fox but meh

 

[Heartstring]

oh...im begginning to get this whole thing now...
let me see
never mind -__-

 

[ccst]

Easily our disadvantage 40:60.

 

[sneakytako]

We beat fox guys no trollin.

 

[Zwarm]

We beat Fox imo, but not by a lot. It's probably 55:45 in our favor at most.

 

[-LzR-]

Lol and no one has yet to mention a single reason.

 

[Heartstring]

well like i said, i find it heavily depends on playstyle, because of that its hard to bring up some really solid reasons

i reckon its 50;50 personally.
+one of the easier character to edgeguard
+utilt pesudo infinite chains into other tilts and can have an fsmash if they are busy trying to sdi another utilt
+our f-tilt outranges everything he has
-our poor vertical momentum cancel means his u-smash will be killing us very fast should he land it
-we cant really camp him because of-arguably-having the best reflector in the game
-he can punish our lack of a safe landing easily

you happy now?

 

[sneakytako]

He's light and he's got a very gimpable recovery. These two things together make life easy for ROB.

 

[Claire Diviner]

55-45

This MU is in R.O.B.'s favor, but not by a whole lot. Fox has good speed and string ability. His Dair to Utilt is a pain, and the fact that R.O.B.'s shield does little in the way of protection doesn't help this either. Making things worse is the fact that R.O.B.'s very floaty, so unless you can time your air dodges/Nair/etc. well, Fox can juggle us all day.

What makes this MU easier to deal with than - say - Falco, is the fact that Fox's Blaster has no stun ability, and that alone takes a huge load off of R.O.B.. His Reflector isn't anything to worry about compared to Falco's, but still be aware that smart Fox players will utilize it to reflect obviously predictable projectiles back at us. His recovery isn't as horrible as one may think, as Fox's Fair can help him rise, and he has the Fox Illusion as an option. Assuming he has no choice but to recover from a low angle, his recovery is easy as dirt to gimp with Fair. A few Fairs and you don't even need to edge-hog for the KO.

One thing of note is that Fox's air game is quite impressive, especially in the speed department. Though not the strongest air game, his Fair comes out very fast and can lead to unnecessary headaches for R.O.B.. Also, because R.O.B.'s so floaty, his poor verticle DI/momentum cancel means that Fox can KO him vertically fairly easily with his quick Uair or Usmash. This is a MU that requires some patience and good spacing of moves, like Fair and Ftilt. You may use smashes for damage racking, if you wish, since power kills isn't the main source for our KOs more than gimping. Also, as long as you don't spam your projectiles too much, you'll be able to hit him with a surprise Robo Beam/Gyro.

Just keep your cool at all times. Fox is a very fast character who can dance around us if we get too predictable or panicky. As for stages, I'd personally ban Battlefield, as the platforms can give Fox an edge in harrassing us with F/Uairs. Even though we can Usmash him whilst he's standing on a lower platform, smart players would know better than to be directly above R.O.B.. I would go with Final Destination; even though Fox has a clear shot at us with his Blaster, the damage isn't much to worry about, and we will not get stunned, all the while, there are no platforms for Fox to do aerial shenanigans.

Any thoughts, comments, changes? I'd like to get some opinions - be it good or... not so good - just so we're as knowledgable as possible in this MU.

EDIT: That reminds me, shouldn't someone change the title to this thread telling everyone that the Fox MU is being discussed. I'm sure we're well past Mr. Game & Watch. o.O

 

[Rizk18]

I agree with almost everything you said Sol. Just don't forget that even though Fox's laser's don't stun, short hop triple laser can rack up damage really quickly,especially if the Fox is camping super hard. Your Beam does interupt us and can get annoying at times, but if we reflect it or Gyro, we can jump right out of shine due to SCP(shine canceling projectiles). Works against any projectile in the game. I think it's 50-50, but I can see it being 55-45 Fox or 55-45 ROB depending on stages.

 

[Cubone]

Wow. Thats a nice write up Sol.

I'd contribute if I didn't go Pika in this MU.

Spoiler

cuz its free

 

[Heartstring]

Wow. Thats a nice write up Sol.

I'd contribute if I didn't go Pika in this MU.

Spoiler

cuz its free

you go pika...on poor old fox?
i want to hug you

also, for the record. something i found that makes out life a lot easier is that six of fox's lasers (assuming that they are staling, of course) (i.e: 2 shtl) do the same amount of damage as 'tippered' ftilt from us. so if he wants to try and camp us, thats fine, we can just ftilt him and come off even, maybe even better if his lasers are already stale (highly likely, but in this, ftilt is probably gonig to be stale aswell)
as for when we get to about 100% he will want to start getting in, whens hes away, dont use shielf, save your shield for when he tries to dair>usmash us. and learn to time dsmash oos, you have time to do this after the dair

 

[ccst]

And how exactly are we going to get him in a gimp position?

 

[-LzR-]

By doing stuff. Stuff like that shouldn't actually be considered for a MU.

 

[Heartstring]

well with his fall speed, ping throws are good for getting them like that
ftr, a ping throw is when you grab and use your fast throws insantly, so they hardly have time to react, meaning bad or no DI
so in other words, instant f/bthrow

 

[T.O.Y]

Even, as Fox can camp, but when we approach, spacing tilts keep him at bay. Offstage, we win. Id take fox to PS1 and then brinstar, THEN FD.

 

[Claire Diviner]

well with his fall speed, ping throws are good for getting them like that
ftr, a ping throw is when you grab and use your fast throws insantly, so they hardly have time to react, meaning bad or no DI
so in other words, instant f/bthrow

^ This.

So as long as we knock Fox off the stage at a low trajectory, edge-guarding him becomes easy, since our Fair beats out the charge frames of his Fox Fire by a long shot. If you fail to gimp him successfully at that point, then you've pretty much choked. Be sure to not use moves that would allow him access to options that allow him to recover from a high point. You can always try a Robo Burner into Nair in an attempt to gimp a stratosphere-borne Fox, but smart Fox players would easily avoid such a gimp and we'd end up in a potentially bad position.

 

[ccst]

I love how people say that our predictable tilts/projectiles/camping/gimping are what make a MU our advantage... No one mentions juggles/low killing power/dying and comboed easily/footstools/hardly no shield/out camped etc.

 

[Claire Diviner]

I love how people say that our predictable tilts/projectiles/camping/gimping are what make a MU our advantage... No one mentions juggles/low killing power/dying and comboed easily/footstools/hardly no shield/out camped etc.

Our tilts and Fair - when properly spaced - can go a long way, since properly spaced tilts mean he can't shield-grab us or do that much in response in general. I don't know if you've read my analyses, but I've discouraged against spamming our projectiles, only using them when they least expect it, otherwise they'll predict them and reflect it back at us. Also, you be amazed how effective R.O.B.'s gimping ability can really be on Fox, especially with Fox's lackluster recovery.

I've already mentioned that R.O.B.'s floatiness allows him to get juggled easily, so it's best not to be in the air above Fox, and our gimping ability means we don't need to rely on killing power to take down his stock. As for footstools, it's rather difficult to footstool a R.O.B., as he can recover from a high point, though this makes him a target for being harrassed by Fox's Fair/Uair, unless one can time R.O.B.'s Fair/Nair/air dodge properly. He may also be out-camped, but Fox's blaster isn't as annoying as - say - Falco's, so we can just run straight toward Fox without worrying about stunning effects if we so wish, and everyone knows R.O.B.'s shield is bad, but it can still be used to protect us from Fox's killers (don't know about Dsmash though).

Again, I say this MU is in R.O.B.'s favor, but not by a whole lot. It also depends on stages and counterpicks. If the first match is on a stage that benefits R.O.B., then there's a good chance R.O.B. will win. Of course, the same can be said for Fox, and in the case of that scenario, R.O.B. will have to go for gimps as early and as hard as possible, which isn't all that hard to do against Fox.

 

[Heartstring]

ccst, man i agree with you msot of the time. but i have to say that our 'predictable' options are amazing when you use them to their fullest potential. ftilt outranges the ice climbers blizzard, thats how long its range is (you have to get it perfect, but it is possible)
generally being optimistic is a good stance to have, as focusing on the bad just doesnt get anything done. because there is always only so much you can do to cover disadvantages, wheread advantages can be mixed together to make some amaziing things happen.

just look at some good ganonplay, i wouldnt call mine outstanding, but it is (just) tournament viable, yes he dies to everything, yes he has no autocancel moves, all of these things are terrible. but his raw power, plus tiny gimmicks such as early IASA on his usmash make such an overwhelming difference.

tl;dr: be positive

 

[ccst]

Thanks, it helped a little. =)
But the Fox mainers can say the same purpose about this MU too...

 

[-LzR-]

@ccst, you say we can't do **** with our predictable moveset, but say G&W destroys us with probably the most predictable moveset in the whole game?

Rob isn't Snake, but his tilts are amazing. Correctly used they are a pain to deal with and are safe against most characters without ******** OoS options like MK.

Now, let's see about Fox... What are the advantages Fox has against us?
-Kills early
-Reflector that hurts our projectiles
-Blaster
-Can abuse our weak shield

What we have against Fox?
-Very strong offstage game
-Very strong ground game
-He is light and falls fast, easy to kill and gimp
-Our tilts take away most of his options

I don't honestly see what Fox has against Rob. He simply cannot challenge us grounded where we shine and even our aerials aren't so easy to beat. This MU is even at worst, Fox sucks.
Oh and he can't gimp us so we will only die from Usmash which can be avoided by smart and strong groundgame.

 

[Bees!]

In my experience our "predictable" tilts provide for excellent mix-ups. baiting them to dash in and shield then boost grabbing them. Many other mixups can be done as well.

 

[ccst]

Can someone please give me advice about the Sheik MU? I might face her twice in a tournament.

 

[stingers]

shiek will **** u up if she gets in, and shes fast enough to get in. so keep her out with superior range as much as u can, dont be afraid to play mad gay. if she gets in ur range u WILL take good damage

 

[Heartstring]

its another game of keep out vs. get in
let her in and she will **** you...just like a penis :3
shielding her ftilt and grabbing is probably a decent idea. i havent played any competent sheiks...ever

 

[ccst]

Yeah I think that's a really good idea actually. I would say this MU is even but I've heard that we have an advantage LoL...

 

[-LzR-]

Rob might have the advantage, but you don't. Keep that in mind. MU Stuff only matters when both sides are experienced enough so right now it doesn't matter how bad or good it is, but how to win.
And like they said, you win by keeping her away with your superior range.

 

[Cubone]

I don't know this MU... I blame going Pikachu in it. Just looking at it though it seems like it should be reltively close (slightly our favor?) due to our usual nonsense. Keep sheik out since we outrange her, gimp her offstage, and both characters can have quite some time trying to kill. Sheik does rack up damage awful quick though.

 

[Heartstring]

also, if its true that our up-b has invincibility frames on the startup, then we can use that to escape the ftilt instantly, which is always useful, but it does then put us in a poor position to eat any of her aerials

i can sorta use her, im jsut a bit bad at effectively playing aggro to be really good with her

 

[Claire Diviner]

I've played several Sheiks before, but not enough t really know the MU. What I do know is that her recovery isn't very good. In my opinion, I think it's worse than Fox. Gimping her isn't that much of a problem. The trick is getting her off stage.

 

[T.O.Y]

At a tournament recently, Ed was in my face to the point that I had no options. If Shiek is constantly applying pressure, what can we do?