Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[LiteTheIronMan]

Hi there, new here from the UK, just popped by to say I'm a big supporter of Ridley and have been since pre-Brawl (when I first started following character speculation and stuff). My #1 choice for an SSB4 newcomer.

yes. super cool you made this place your first stop. welcome.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Welcome.

Just watch yourself whenever a pyrosphere photo shows up.

Also it occurred to me can what Sakurai said about the stage be translated differently? Remember that sentence that seemed to debunk Ness was actually harmless in the original language?

 

[Dark Phazon]

Playable > assist trophy > stage hazard > boss

At this point....

Playable > **** Everything else.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Also it occurred to me can what Sakurai said about the stage be translated differently? Remember that sentence that seemed to debunk Ness was actually harmless in the original language?

If you mean the literal translation of the Japanese quote, then it merely says that Samus had a trauma at the location, doesn't really make a specific reference to Ridley.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

If you mean the literal translation of the Japanese quote, then it merely says that Samus had a trauma at the location, doesn't really make a specific reference to Ridley.

Hmmm...

Ladies, Gentlemen and whatever the-posh-term-for-gender-neutrals-is, I think we found another straw to clutch.

 

[Dark Phazon]

If I see a picture of with the lava at a different level than other pics, I will definitely feel safe.

I do agree though if Ridley was a stage hazard, it would be common sense to simply show him off and get it out of the way, especially early on. To simply drag it out and try and play mindgames with the fanbase is not trolling, its simply mean-spirited.

RealTalk i dont care what anyone else thinks on this one. RealTalk.

So first we figure out the logic and then we go against that because Sakurai doesn't work that way?

Your a Sick man.

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

If you mean the literal translation of the Japanese quote, then it merely says that Samus had a trauma at the location, doesn't really make a specific reference to Ridley.

Anthony Higgs confirmed?

 

[AnOkayDM]

Okay, if you're gonna misinterpret me, I'm gonna have to correct you.

I'd rather not get in tit for tat on the stage reveal details, but one I'm pretty sure the fire was revealed in this screenshot. In august. If I'm wrong, let me know.

You're correct. I said, as you noted, just about every stage reveal. That means most, not literally every single one. Also note that that picture from August is, again, the only picture of the stage since E3. Thus falling in line with Sakurai revealing stage hazards before other things about the stage.

1) my argument: 1 month of not showing Ridley as a stage hazard does not make him probably to be a playable character rather than as a stage hazard. nor does it seem make him even more likely to be a playable character. that is poor logic.

But ignoring or refusing to see what is a clear pattern isn't poor logic?
When we go for a month of consistent screenshots without showing a hazard, when most other stages have had hazards shown before other elements of the stage, it gives me cause to believe that there's not a stage hazard on that stage.

2)We don't know everything about every stage. By your own admission, the Garden of Hope stage is unclear. And what exactly is a gameplay element? characters have been shown fighting on the stage. Not every stage has a "gameplay element" and the ones that have hazards have not revealed all their hazards. Battlefield as far as I know does not have a gameplay element.

I do see what you're saying though so I am a little more open to the idea that this was a tease for Ridley as a character.

Gameplay element in this scenario is my catch-all term for stage hazard. Something that makes that stage stand out, something different about that stage. While you may not call scrolling a hazard, it affects gameplay. Pilotwings' planes tilting and swapping. The fire in Gerudo Valley. The spike pillars on the Mario stage. If Garden of Hope hasn't been shown to have hazards that affect the way you fight on the stage by this point, I'm assuming it doesn't have them, just like I'm drawing that same conclusion for Pyrosphere.

No, we don't know everything about every stage, but we know the major hazards for most of the ones shown thus far, if they have any. Since Ridley would likely have been shown as a stage element earlier rather than later, just like most other stage hazards, the fact that he has not makes it likelier to me that he's at least not a hazard.

 

[FalKoopa]

At this point....

Playable > F uck Everything else.

Please avoid Censor dodging like this.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Of coarse sadly i think we will never know if Ridley is playable to a couple of days too go till smash bros 4. I would not be surprised at all if Ridley is unlockable if confirmed playable.

 

[Anomilus]

No, we don't know everything about every stage, but we know the major hazards for most of the ones shown thus far, if they have any. Since Ridley would likely have been shown as a stage element earlier rather than later, just like most other stage hazards, the fact that he has not makes it likelier to me that he's at least not a hazard.

I've said it once, I've said it SEVERAL TIMES ALREADY, I'll say it AGAIN:

E3 Trailers and vids
Veteran reveals

These are the ONLY times new characters have been revealed. ANY new character, playable or not. Newcomers. Veterans. Stage elements. Props. If these were a character, they were revealed among special occasions.

The hazards that have been shown outside of special occasions have been elements with no identity: Fire, spike traps, whatever.

Whether or not Ridley is a hazard, he IS A CHARACTER. Do NOT expect him to be revealed so plainly as through a daily picture.

As of now I can only see two possible opportunities to reveal Ridley as a hazard: During Zero Suit Samus's reveal, or during a new trailer that doesn't involve playable Ridley.

 

[AnOkayDM]

I've said it once, I've said it SEVERAL TIMES ALREADY, I'll say it AGAIN:

E3 Trailers and vids
Veteran reveals

These are the ONLY times new characters have been revealed. ANY new character, playable or not. Newcomers. Veterans. Stage elements. Props. If these were a character, they were revealed among special occasions.

The hazards that have been shown outside of special occasions have been elements with no identity: Fire, spike traps, whatever.

Whether or not Ridley is a hazard, he IS A CHARACTER. Do NOT expect him to be revealed so plainly as through a daily picture.

As of now I can only see two possible opportunities to reveal Ridley as a hazard: During Zero Suit Samus's reveal, or during a new trailer that doesn't involve playable Ridley.

Toad.

 

[Anomilus]

Toad.

SPECIAL OCCASIONS.


PEACH'S REVEAL = SPECIAL OCCASION.

TOAD'S FIRST REVEAL = DURING PEACH'S REVEAL = SPECIAL OCCASION.

 

[Oasis_S]

Awh man. Anomilus said what I was going to say before I said it. What a jerk. As president of this thread I officially banish him to Siberia and claim his idea as my own.

But it would be pretty funny if we're treated to a clip of Samus, among others, fighting normally on Pyrosphere with Ridley appearing as his stage hazardy self. It then cuts to non-game footage of Samus fighting Ridley herself, and turning into Zero Suit Samus in the process.

 

[Anomilus]

I have returned after conquering Siberia for Ridley!

And in case it comes up, yes, stage reveals can be considered "special occasions". Doesn't necessarily mean they are 100% complete upon revelation. Same with characters who are revealed but not quite 100% done. Some stages were revealed with their hazards intact. Doesn't mean ALL stages will be revealed with all of their hazards intact. Applied to Pyrosphere, seeing it and all of these angles does not mean it's finished and/or we've seen it all.

 

[AnOkayDM]

SPECIAL OCCASIONS.


PEACH'S REVEAL = SPECIAL OCCASION.

TOAD'S FIRST REVEAL = DURING PEACH'S REVEAL = SPECIAL OCCASION.

Thank you for enlightening me. The colors really help me, as I'm deeply stupid.

 

[Anomilus]

Well to be fair, the rainbow color is pwetty...

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

wait... I'm honestly confused. what?

 

[jaytalks]

stuff.

I didn't mean to misinterpret you.

On OoT: I get what you're saying but it seems like a stretch to me. Elements is such a loose term. I doubt every stage we have seen currently passes that smell test.

On Patterns: I'm waiting to see more evidence. That's not poor logic. How many stage hazards actually have been seen? We don't know exactly how the Reset Bomb works. Or all the hazards in the Pikmin stage. Or in the Super Mario Bros Stage. We can't assume that we've seen all aspects of that stage hazard.

On Gameplay element: I think stage element would be a better term. Even then, it seems like you're drawing conclusions about stages. Assuming. Using conjecture. Saying things that aren't proven yet.

 

[Groose]

Guys...

Shokio is here!

0_o

Where? I want his autograph! We may not agree on everything (especially Ridley), but that man is one to be respected. He tells it straight.

Anywho, I've come to this realization about Ridley. Stick with me, people:

1) Ridley's size is a problem.
Sorry, fellow Ridley enthusiasts. The "too big" crew has a point. Ridley has to be substantially bigger than Samus (already one of the game's largest characters), but that's not really the core of the matter. The main problem is when you compound Ridley's size with his shape: Rildey's skinny and jointed body attached to those giant wings and snout make him difficult to design. The concept artists not only have to downsize him; they also have to make sure that all of his parts stay in proportion. The programmers have to make sure his animations are fluid, which is no easy task when he has so many joints and those giant wings.

Keep in mind that this is the worst possible entry for Ridley to join. I'm talking about the 3DS and Wii-U versions... it would be even more difficult to make such a complex character in TWO different systems. It would have been much easier to make him in the previous entries in the series, when only one game was made at a time.

Making Ridley playable is far more difficult than making any other conceivable character. K. Rool's rotund shape is easy to design and animate, Little Mac is a basic humanoid, Toad is simple and cartoony. I'd say that it with the time it would take to design and program Ridley, the developers could have made two simpler characters.

2) Problems can be solved. Ridley is worth the effort.
It would take a great amount of manpower to make Ridley satisfyingly playable. But it can be done if enough resources are put behind the idea. Charizard faces some of the same problems Ridley does (if on a lesser scale), and he's playable. Ice Climbers and Captain Olimar both took a great deal of work and the former wasn't even commonly requested or "important."

It basically boils down to this: would you rather have an awesome Ridley or two simpler but perhaps lovable characters?

I'd rather have Ridley. He's important and who DOESN'T want to play as a giant space dragon? Although I don't hold him in as high esteem as the most devoted of Ridley supporters (sorry guys; he is not so important that his lack of Melee playability is a crime), I fully acknowledge that he's one of the top five most important Nintendo characters left. His inclusion would please a great deal of people and he's too awesome not to attract the kiddies.

At this point, when we're seriously considering Waluigi and one-off characters as playable (not a bad thing), Ridley stands out as a diamond in the rough. I'm not going to ragequit and bail on the game if he's not playable, but it would be a real shame to let him fly this go round.

 

[Xhampi]

I really wouldn't call Other M Ridley skinny.

And that's the guy who made Kid Icarus Uprising, I don't see how one more flying character on the 3DS can stop him.

 

[CardiganBoy]

Ridleys body in Other M is quite ripped, i wonder what kinds of exercise routines he do.....

 

[Xhampi]

Ridleys body in Other M is quite ripped, i wonder what kinds of exercise routines he do.....

Ask the Wii Fit Trainer.

 

[grizby2]

The main problem is when you compound Ridley's size with his shape: Rildey's skinny and jointed body attached to those giant wings and snout make him difficult to design. The concept artists not only have to downsize him; they also have to make sure that all of his parts stay in proportion. The programmers have to make sure his animations are fluid, which is no easy task when he has so many joints and those giant wings..

I actually have a bit of experience with this when I use Garry's Mod. it is NOT fun to deal with!


I would like two simple yet lovable characters over ridley. BUT if they can do ridley really really REALLY SUPER-FRICKEN-OH-MY-JESUS-AWESOME, then he would be worth the trouble (or pleasure) of making.

I feel that if they were to take him on, they must execute him perfectly, which in effect, would be better than 2..no, 3 simple yet lovable characters.

 

[Morbi]

I actually have a bit of experience with this when I use Garry's Mod. it is NOT fun to deal with!


I would like two simple yet lovable characters over ridley. BUT if they can do ridley really really REALLY SUPER-FRICKEN-OH-MY-JESUS-AWESOME, then he would be worth the trouble (or pleasure) of making.

I feel that if they were to take him on, they must execute him perfectly, which in effect, would be better than 2..no, 3 simple yet lovable characters.

Yes. I would prefer one simple yet lovable character over Ridley. Jigglypuff. You just got served, Ridley!

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

Yes. I would prefer one simple yet lovable character over Ridley. Jigglypuff. You just got served, Ridley!

no. stop.

 

[Morbi]

no. stop.

Hey... at least Jigglypuff isn't too big.

 

[Oasis_S]

You people aren't thinking Straight. Get your head out of the homoclouds. Sunbathing on top of giant soft white puffy behinds.

 

[Groose]

I actually have a bit of experience with this when I use Garry's Mod. it is NOT fun to deal with!


I would like two simple yet lovable characters over ridley. BUT if they can do ridley really really REALLY SUPER-FRICKEN-OH-MY-JESUS-AWESOME, then he would be worth the trouble (or pleasure) of making.

I feel that if they were to take him on, they must execute him perfectly, which in effect, would be better than 2..no, 3 simple yet lovable characters.

Exactly my point. I have limited programming knowledge, but even I can see that Ridley would cause problems. It's not really his size (that is a contributing factor) but rather his shape. It's a nightmare to design and getting that moving smoothly.

My point is that this problem can be solved and really should be. He's worth it. I have no doubt that they would do him right if they choose to do him at all.

 

[jaytalks]

Where? I want his autograph!We may not agree on everything (especially Ridley), but that man is one to be respected. He tells it straight.

Anywho, I've come to this realization about Ridley. Stick with me, people:

1) Ridley's size is a problem.
Sorry, fellow Ridley enthusiasts. The "too big" crew has a point. Ridley has to be substantially bigger than Samus (already one of the game's largest characters), but that's not really the core of the matter. The main problem is when you compound Ridley's size with his shape: Rildey's skinny and jointed body attached to those giant wings and snout make him difficult to design. The concept artists not only have to downsize him; they also have to make sure that all of his parts stay in proportion. The programmers have to make sure his animations are fluid, which is no easy task when he has so many joints and those giant wings.

Keep in mind that this is the worst possible entry for Ridley to join. I'm talking about the 3DS and Wii-U versions... it would be even more difficult to make such a complex character in TWO different systems. It would have been much easier to make him in the previous entries in the series, when only one game was made at a time.

Making Ridley playable is far more difficult than making any other conceivable character. K. Rool's rotund shape is easy to design and animate, Little Mac is a basic humanoid, Toad is simple and cartoony. I'd say that it with the time it would take to design and program Ridley, the developers could have made two simpler characters.

2) Problems can be solved. Ridley is worth the effort.
It would take a great amount of manpower to make Ridley satisfyingly playable. But it can be done if enough resources are put behind the idea. Charizard faces some of the same problems Ridley does (if on a lesser scale), and he's playable. Ice Climbers and Captain Olimar both took a great deal of work and the former wasn't even commonly requested or "important."

It basically boils down to this: would you rather have an awesome Ridley or two simpler but perhaps lovable characters?

I'd rather have Ridley. He's important and who DOESN'T want to play as a giant space dragon? Although I don't hold him in as high esteem as the most devoted of Ridley supporters (sorry guys; he is not so important that his lack of Melee playability is a crime), I fully acknowledge that he's one of the top five most important Nintendo characters left. His inclusion would please a great deal of people and he's too awesome not to attract the kiddies.

At this point, when we're seriously considering Waluigi and one-off characters as playable (not a bad thing), Ridley stands out as a diamond in the rough. I'm not going to ragequit and bail on the game if he's not playable, but it would be a real shame to let him fly this go round.

From Sakurai's comments from Brawl, my guess is that it would be more than two characters. It may be 3 or even more characters.

The question is, how many characters are you willing to give up to get Ridley. For me, two would work. But three or more seems like a mighty gamble. Especially if they get Ridley "wrong."

 

[Morbi]

Exactly my point. I have limited programming knowledge, but even I can see that Ridley would cause problems. It's not really his size (that is a contributing factor) but rather his shape. It's a nightmare to design and getting that moving smoothly.

My point is that this problem can be solved and really should be. He's worth it. I have no doubt that they would do him right if they choose to do him at all.

That is my greatest fear. I don't want a rushed or messed up Ridley. If they do him, they almost HAVE to do him right. I can only imagine this being a "careful what you wish for" moments... unlike Jigglypuff.

 

[IsmaR]

Gaaaaaaaaah why can't I upload stuff from my SD card on this stupid desktop. I'd ask if anyone wants to help, but it's a whole bother of trouble, having to add both Brawl and Wii FCs to send stuff.

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

I'm seriously at the point of desperation where I couldn't care less if Ridley himself ends up being a bad character- I just want more Metroid representation in Smash, and it HAS to be Ridley.

 

[Phaazoid]

I'm guessing they're only going to confirm veterans with game releases. The only exception maybe being mewtwo with x/y. But I think they'll save the bigger hype stuff for next year.

We can probably map the announcements of veterans by big game releases, but we haven't seen any newcomers on the site yet. The only one that's even been hinted at, in any form, is ridley.

So maybe PKMN or mewtwo if we're lucky with x/y, and hopefully a newcomer by the end of the year (ridley if we're lucky)

 

[IsmaR]

Ridley is the best Pokemon.

 

[CardiganBoy]

Ask the Wii Fit Trainer.

Thanks, but I dont want to end like Mario, Link and Kirby in her reveal trailer.

I'm guessing they're only going to confirm veterans with game releases. The only exception maybe being mewtwo with x/y. But I think they'll save the bigger hype stuff for next year.

We can probably map the announcements of veterans by big game releases, but we haven't seen any newcomers on the site yet. The only one that's even been hinted at, in any form, is ridley.

So maybe PKMN or mewtwo if we're lucky with x/y, and hopefully a newcomer by the end of the year (ridley if we're lucky)

I think we will see a newcomer in the next Nintendo Direct

 

[AnOkayDM]

On Patterns: I'm waiting to see more evidence. That's not poor logic. How many stage hazards actually have been seen? We don't know exactly how the Reset Bomb works. Or all the hazards in the Pikmin stage. Or in the Super Mario Bros Stage. We can't assume that we've seen all aspects of that stage hazard.

On Gameplay element: I think stage element would be a better term. Even then, it seems like you're drawing conclusions about stages. Assuming. Using conjecture. Saying things that aren't proven yet.

You're not understanding me.

I'm not claiming we've seen all the hazards of every stage. I'm saying we've seen even the first hazard on stages that have them by now.

And since we haven't seen a hazard on Pyrosphere, it seems likely, to me, that there isn't one, and that Ridley certainly isn't one.

 

[LiteTheIronMan]

Ridley is the best Pokemon.

Ridley confirmed for XY

edit: I AM GOING TO NAME EVERY LEGENDARY POKEMON I CATCH IN XY RIDLEY. I WILL DELIVER.

 

[SmasherMaster]

Ridley confirmed for XY

edit: I AM GOING TO NAME EVERY LEGENDARY POKEMON I CATCH IN XY RIDLEY. I WILL DELIVER.

Along with every dragon and should be dragon type (charizard, aerodactyl, gyarados, etc.).

 

[MagnesD3]

I'll kill for Ridley, no one is off limits...