~The Olimar Matchup Thread~Review: R.O.B. or someone~

[Stiltzskin]

One of the best ways to powershield more easily is to map shield to one of the face buttons. For instance, if you don't use X, map shield to it. The response is instant and, while not good for up close (your thumb needs to get back to A and B up close), is great against projectile spam. Also, if you whistle TL's dair while on the ground, you'll almost always have a sweetspot with dsmash. I'm fine using R against most projectiles, but for stuff like Pit's arrows and Pikachu's electro-bouncyball thingys, it's a nice option to have.

Olimar is a good counter for TL. So far, I've beaten every TL I've met except Santi.

Oh and to Dangr: Congrats, man! I'm going up to Hylian's tourney on the 16th. That one should be around 60 and I hear theres an Olimainer who's going thats sixth in the power rankings for Texas! (Can't wait to meet him :D)

Wow, I barely check the olimar boards and I see a mention of me. Makes me feel warm inside. Yea, it's good to hear of another olimar player in texas. Can't wait to meet up this saturday.

Btw, did they finally release the power rankings for Texas?

On topic:

Against toon link, I always like to bait them into doing a sh bair and giving them a running up smash up the butt.

 

[asob4]

toon link is one of the easier matches for olimar in the high tiers. it's 65-35 oli's favor imo.

he can't camp you, which is all he really has, his kill moves are easily avoidable, his recovery can easily be spiked if you time it correctly, you will kill a lot faster than he will, and he has trouble apporoaching

you're too light to really get combo'd to really high percents unless you DI wrong.

i play against a really good toon link, i 3 stock him very often (not in the vids up cause that's mean)

 

[Kyas]

I haven't had problems against TL, until I met Santi.

Santi gets up in your face and STAYS THERE. When he approached, he would use SH hookshot spam (yes, Zair). Because zair shoots twice in one SH, and the last shot goes right before he hits the ground, making it impossible for me to grab him as he lands. Since zair autocancels, I don't quite know what to do against this technique.

 

[asob4]

that seems like a problem with spacing
learn the length of the zair and act accordingly
it's isn't very long at all so you should be able to fsmash through it

 

[Kyas]

Wow, I barely check the olimar boards and I see a mention of me. Makes me feel warm inside. Yea, it's good to hear of another olimar player in texas. Can't wait to meet up this saturday.

Btw, did they finally release the power rankings for Texas?

On topic:

Against toon link, I always like to bait them into doing a sh bair and giving them a running up smash up the butt.

I've been trying to find the power rankings. I heard from someone else that you were sixth.

Also, I hear Santi will be at the tourney saturday. His Olimar game is incredible for a TL. I'd like to see you try him, Stiltzskin.

 

[TheWii]

Now im just waiting to meet the TL im having trouble with. I have been working on powershielding.

 

[Puddin]

You can DI up and out of TL's Fsmash, but not once you get to higher percents (around 100) but it is easy to shield grab like Snail said.

Anyway I'll just post things about priority and such lol. I'm having trouble finding out who's Dsmash out-prioritizes who's, because I keep getting mixed results sometimes Olimars hits, sometimes they clang, and sometimes Toon Link's hits for the most part it's been Toon Link but my testing is prone to human error, and both characters have a fast Dsmash.

Obviously Toon Link's Fsmash has priority over Olimars, but if you can hit him in the time between the first and second attack you can stop him (obviously) but it's probably easier to just shield grab or something.

And now for my favorite part, aerials. Toon Links Nair has priority over Olimars super tornado (Nair lol) Olimar's Fair has priority over Toon Links Fair and so does his Bair...I would say just don't fight in the air because it will probably be a losing battle.

Two uncharged Usmashes will stop Toon Links Dair from hitting you, and if he is close enough the second one will hurt him without knocking him right back above you.

 

[TheWii]

I just played with Pepito (the one that plays TL) and I did not get owned this time but he never used TL, he says he forgot lol.

 

[TheWii]

Also he sidestepp really good! I can never follow up with a fair after a dthrow and im lucky if I can upsmash him after a dthrow. Almost every attack he sidesteps! Im wondering does every pro sidestep ALOT? Because of him I started countering and learned how to sidestep good but not as good as him.

 

[Snail]

Also he sidestepp really good! I can never follow up with a fair after a dthrow and im lucky if I can upsmash him after a dthrow. Almost every attack he sidesteps! Im wondering does every pro sidestep ALOT? Because of him I started countering and learned how to sidestep good but not as good as him.

Sidestepping owns. I use it all the time and I know a lot of people do too :3 Practice it!

 

[TheWii]

Thats what I am doing right know. Im trying to get really good at it but it annoys me when people try to sidestep EVERY move and actually succed, lol.

 

[Barge]

I think you should do snake after TL.

 

[DanGR]

If people are spotdodging your attacks too much, try using dtilt or ftilt some. The latter lasts a long time.

 

[TheWii]

Ok, will try it out.

 

[Greward]

tink's Dsmash can kill oli at 0% if sweetpotted :S

 

[Snail]

tink's Dsmash can kill oli at 0% if sweetpotted :S

That's only on slopes, and you'd have to be an idiot to walk straight into a TL's downsmash at 0% on a slope. Just pay attention and it won't happen o.o

 

[OlimarFan]

That's only on slopes, and you'd have to be an idiot to walk straight into a TL's downsmash at 0% on a slope. Just pay attention and it won't happen o.o

lololol
Just keep your distance and let your Pikmin fly. If he comes close, shield appropriately or Down C-Stick Up Z.

P.S. After watching numerous Mr. X videos over the past weeks, he has a signature combo, and it guarntees 40% damage, (this only works when the opponent is heavy, and at 0% )

1. D-Throw
2. F-Smash
3. D-Throw
4. F-Air OR U-Smash
5. If F-Air, F-Smash

 

[Snail]

lololol
Just keep your distance and let your Pikmin fly. If he comes close, shield appropriately or Down C-Stick Up Z.

P.S. After watching numerous Mr. X videos over the past weeks, he has a signature combo, and it guarntees 40% damage, (this only works when the opponent is heavy, and at 0% )

1. D-Throw
2. F-Smash
3. D-Throw
4. F-Air OR U-Smash
5. If F-Air, F-Smash

Yeah I love that combo ^^ On heavies you can Dthrow, run under, upsmash, nair, uair and UpB sometimes if they don't know how to DI out of it. They're already pretty high when they get uair'd so they try to DI sideways setting them up for the UpB. 57% if done correctly. Granted, it's not too hard to get out of, but I manage to pull it off quite often... Try it sometime :D

 

[TheWii]

Now I need help against Wolf! This Wolf is always pressuring me and and often leaves me with no room to throw pikmins and I sometimes fail to grab because he is good with dodging/sidestepping and he got experience against other Olimars.

 

[asob4]

pivot grab a lot, change up your approaches too
space well, fsmash is great for that

once you get a grab it's a free 40-60 damage
you can chain grab him for mind games

if all else fails, go to weegee's mansion ^^

 

[DanGR]

next character for discussion anyone?

 

[Snail]

next character for discussion anyone?

Peach? >< Might as well get the hard matchups over with first, so we can have some fun at the end

 

[Barge]

I vote yoshi

 

[Dabuz]

lucluc (lucario)

 

[asob4]

i agree with peach.... actually i don't care cause i secondary GnW

 

[Master Knight DH]

Voting Ness. I want to know how Ness can do against Oli.

I was thinking the TL matchup would be 55-45 in Oli's favor, but that's possibly overcompensation for my bias toward fighting TLs, which would set my opinion to maybe 70-30, possibly 75-25, in Oli's favor, but is most likely founded on knowing Link's moves. Sorry, I'm not the most reliable guy for managing to figure out matchup stats.

 

[asob4]

i play a TL often
we agree on roughly 65-35 or 60-40
depends on if they can DI properly really
-shrugs-

 

[TheWii]

asob4: Thanks, will pivot grab more. Or else Weegee mansion like you said.

 

[Excellence]

i play a TL often
we agree on roughly 65-35 or 60-40
depends on if they can DI properly really
-shrugs-

I'd say 65-35, too.

Toon Link's projectiles and spam game and a big part of what make him so good. Olimar's Pikmin spam is a lot faster eventually forcing an smart Toon Link to approach, once he realizes he can't camp you.

We're all aware of Toon Link's chainable B/F-Air combos, but they can be easily avoided with the Whistle. That'll allow you to hit the ground quicker and keep the pressure on Toon Link who now realizes he's in trouble.

Toon Link's best KO options are F-Smash and U-Smash, both of which are predictable. A lot of the Toon Link's I play setup for U-Smash by throwing projectiles to try and force me to spam Pikmin, then run in for the kill. That's a little predictable after the first use and you can easily grab him out of it. F-Smash is slow and if you're constantly keeping yourself space which should be out of F-Smash range, you can grab that too.

UAir outprioritizes TLink's DAir Spike, so that's a plus for us because he can't expect to Spike you out of your tether.

 

[Puddin]

Master Knight, don't both the Earthbound kids do pretty bad against Olimar although I think Ness has better odds.

Anyway Excellence it's pretty easy to avoid being Spiked by Toon Link anyway. If he is above you and you're in range with the Pikmin Chain it's easy to let him try and spike you from there, then use the Pikmin Chain and immediately pull yourself to the edge (with invincibility frames)

Not to mention how incredibly predictable a Dair is from Toon Link and how easy it is to shield grab. Toon Link is a light character, and can be KO'd at as low as 70% which is pretty low.

I don't really have anything else to post =\ But I think I may have found something out in training mode, I'll search the boards and make a thread if I don't find anything about it.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Peach has the advantage here. Her Forward B is a save approach b/c it destroys Olimars Pikmin. Her aerials are powerful, especially bair and a well placed usmash is an easy kill. Her turnips can gimp Olimar and he can't even Shieldgrab her - her jabs after an aerial are faster than Olis grab. She's a good edgeguard too...is there anything else?

65:35 for Peach or maybe 60:40

 

[Rocann]

I HATE PEACH. Floating dairs and fairs above grab range outprioritizing every god**** thing and killing all pikmin, then dropping into jabs behind shield MAKES ME CRY

 

[Snail]

Peach is awfully annoying. I'm glad I've never had to fight one... yet.

 

[P.O.P.]

Peach has the advantage here. Her Forward B is a save approach b/c it destroys Olimars Pikmin. Her aerials are powerful, especially bair and a well placed usmash is an easy kill. Her turnips can gimp Olimar and he can't even Shieldgrab her - her jabs after an aerial are faster than Olis grab. She's a good edgeguard too...is there anything else?

65:35 for Peach or maybe 60:40

As a peach player, i agree with everything Gheb says. The only thing i know about olimar that is annoying to me are his grabs and aerials (occasionally smash attacks). I usually dont have problems against olimar because it is easy to space, gimp and kill him. However, one way Olimar can fight back (imo) is to 1) stay on the stage as much as possible to prevent from getting gimped 2) keep as many pikmin alive as possible and bring up ur defensive game 3) use aerial attacks and run away ( kinda like a hit and run game). But overall the match up is clearly in peach's favor 65-35.

 

[deepseadiva]

Her Forward B is a save approach b/c it destroys Olimars Pikmin.

*scribbles into notebook*

1) stay on the stage as much as possible to prevent from getting gimped

:D You mean play Smash Bros. and not lose?

Olimar... Olimar...
He's both a hassle and a push-over. His ground game is powerful, fast, and bordering on unreadable. Yet off the stage, the little walking fish bowl epically fails.

So here's the two competing objectives for both characters:
Peach's job is to pile on enough damage to launch Olimar off the stage and win the ultra-easy gimp kill - all while avoiding KO smashes and damage dealing Pikmin.

Olimar's job is to land those smashes and Pikmin and get the honest kill - all while avoiding being thrown off the stage completly. You can clearly see the harder job here.

Alrighty, so down to some specifics.
Peach will approach from the air - always (the grabs and smashes should scare off most glidetossing). This does a good number of things for Peach, it helps her:
- mainly avoid Olimar's scary grabs
- avoid smashes
- be in her preferred offense state for dairs, fairs, and landing jabs.

So how can Olimar counteract this? I say the secret weapon Oli has is his purple thrown Pikmin. Hop, throw the fatso, Peach falls, hit her with a smash a grab, whatever. Normal Pikmin will just latch - which Peach can then remove easily while dairing Olimars face in. :D
Purple Pikmin put Princess Peach in her proper place! Mainly the ground.

Although, I'm only thinking in theory with this, but wouldn't the Chain be fantastic in grounding Peach?

Note: NEVER attack Peach from above when she is on the ground. Her up-tilit has god priority. Your feeble dair will be destroyed by the power of love. And nobody wants to that. (Though, I'm wondering if the yellow Pikmin would go through... somebody wanna test?)

Overall, Peach has an easy advantage. Though it's not hopeless on Olimar's part if he plays very smart. 40:60 at Oli's disadvantage.

 

[OlimarFan]

*scribbles into notebook*



:D You mean play Smash Bros. and not lose?

Olimar... Olimar...
He's both a hassle and a push-over. His ground game is powerful, fast, and bordering on unreadable. Yet off the stage, the little walking fish bowl epically fails.

So here's the two competing objectives for both characters:
Peach's job is to pile on enough damage to launch Olimar off the stage and win the ultra-easy gimp kill - all while avoiding KO smashes and damage dealing Pikmin.

Olimar's job is to land those smashes and Pikmin and get the honest kill - all while avoiding being thrown off the stage completly. You can clearly see the harder job here.

Alrighty, so down to some specifics.
Peach will approach from the air - always (the grabs and smashes should scare off most glidetossing). This does a good number of things for Peach, it helps her:
- mainly avoid Olimar's scary grabs
- avoid smashes
- be in her preferred offense state for dairs, fairs, and landing jabs.

So how can Olimar counteract this? I say the secret weapon Oli has is his purple thrown Pikmin. Hop, throw the fatso, Peach falls, hit her with a smash a grab, whatever. Normal Pikmin will just latch - which Peach can then remove easily while dairing Olimars face in. :D
Purple Pikmin put Princess Peach in her proper place! Mainly the ground.

Although, I'm only thinking in theory with this, but wouldn't the Chain be fantastic in grounding Peach?

Note: NEVER attack Peach from above when she is on the ground. Her up-tilit has god priority. Your feeble dair will be destroyed by the power of love. And nobody wants to that. (Though, I'm wondering if the yellow Pikmin would go through... somebody wanna test?)

Overall, Peach has an easy advantage. Though it's not hopeless on Olimar's part if he plays very smart. 40:60 at Oli's disadvantage.

I agree. I think in the Brawl Match-Up Chart, Peach has a tick against Olimar.
I've only played against a Peach once and I used Snake...

 

[TheWii]

I got a question, when you use side-b do you always jump (SH) or just stand there and use side-b?

Or is just SH side-b the best way all the time even if the opponent is close to you?

Im asking because I got a problem with shorthopping. I can perform it easily when I do a fair but not when I use side-b.

 

[Snail]

I got a question, when you use side-b do you always jump (SH) or just stand there and use side-b?

Or is just SH side-b the best way all the time even if the opponent is close to you?

Im asking because I got a problem with shorthopping. I can perform it easily when I do a fair but not when I use side-b.

Shorthop except against Snake and Sonic. I think...

 

[DanGR]

TheWii- Just practice. If you own melee, practice with fox if you think Olimar's SH is hard. >_> If not, use fox in brawl for practice. After a while, you'll have no problems doing it. Then it's a matter of SHing the pikmin throw while retreating. That's a lil harder than going forward.

Shorthop except against Snake and Sonic. I think...

correct imo. Snake's DACupsmash and sonic's running speed it why. You don't want to get caught in the air against either.

 

[TheWii]

Fox is REALLY hard to shorthop with. I can shorthop and do side-b but then I always go forward because when I try to stay at the same place it always ends up as a full hop.

I never played Fox in Melee, only Link but I will go to training mode in Brawl like you said.