The Old Diddy Social/General/Q&A Thread

[Player-1]

yeah, it's definitely not +3 I promise you that.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

More +sex

 

[Zinoto]

I meant playing the match up wrong

Example: The DDD/Wario match up is in DDD's favor unless he decides to not chain grab or grab release

The match up is +3 even when you take CPs into account. You could destroy him with one banana and the match up only gets worse with two. He has no way of forcing an approach and Diddy can live for a really long time if he doesn't get killed early by a smash attack or a 9.

camping aggro is different from not using a move entirely or guaranteed kill setups bro

diddy/GW is definitely not +3, especially since all of his smashes will be relatively fresh since he has to poke you out just to get in. One read at like 80-90 and diddy is dead. He can bucket break and live alot of diddy's kill moves as long as a heavy character could as well.

^^ This

The match up is most definitely not +3. +2 is even kinda stretching it. Saying the MU is +3 is saying that does just as bad in the MU as does. If the is smart, he can mess us up pretty badly, but that usually comes from a good read. His attacks send us in all kinds of awkward directions, and he can get really early kills. He can be really mobile (like Vinnie) and can bucket break to live up to like 140. +1 seems like a solid placing.

Discussions like this should be in the MU thread, but it seems really inactive. Is this gonna be revived at any point, or did we just call it quits? I wouldn't mind running the discussion if Disqo Bunny is busy with school or something (not to bash you at all Disq, I know how busy people can be and I understand). Everyone comes here for MU advice, but we can direct these discussions towards that MU discussion section and fill that up.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

Bowser should be +4. I don't see a top Bowser ever beating a top Diddy. If G&W can get a guaranteed F-smash or U-smash out of Diddy's roll, then I might agree with you. Other than that, Diddy shouldn't really be falling for any kill moves that will kill him at low percents.

 

[-Googs]

Theres a chance that a G&W gets lucky with a reads our roll out of sheer luck, and that's death past 80... soooo...+3? LOL no.

 

[Player-1]

I doubt you've ever played a good Bowser, Jebus. That MU isn't +4, Bowser's have it as +2, I think it's +3

 

[SaveMeJebus]

I doubt you've ever played a good Bowser, Jebus. That MU isn't +4, Bowser's have it as +2, I think it's +3

I've played Zigsta before. That match up should be +4 for us.

 

[Player-1]

automatically beating Zigsta makes it +4? ok.


Zigsta is good, but he's nowhere near Kingkong's level IMO.

 

[-Googs]

I've played kingkong on a regular basis, our favour +2 maybe 3. NOT 4. He has a strange trip animation and can up+b OoS a lot of our ****

 

[SaveMeJebus]

automatically beating Zigsta makes it +4? ok.


Zigsta is good, but he's nowhere near Kingkong's level IMO.

I never said me beating Zigsta makes this match up in our favor. I'm not even on the list of best Diddys though. What does that tell you about the match up?

 

[Player-1]

What does that tell you about the match up?

that it's bad for bowser which we already knew...?

 

[SaveMeJebus]

Then what's the difference between a +3 and a +4 to you?

 

[Player-1]

+4 i'd say is like ICs Vs ganon is +4, and Diddy Vs bowser is definitely not that bad.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

+4 i'd say is like ICs Vs ganon is +4, and Diddy Vs bowser is definitely not that bad.

Not an example. What makes a match up +4 and not +3

 

[-Googs]

Jebus come to impulse in Toronto, Mk banned national in the summer. I really want to play you offline to see if you retardedness translates into gameplay.

 

[Player-1]

whatever makes ICs vs ganon +4 and Fox vs Pika +3

 

[ChocoNaner]

Jebus come to impulse in Toronto, Mk banned national in the summer. I really want to play you offline to see if you retardedness translates into gameplay.

Jebus is anti-ban lol :I

ichu:

 

[GDX]

canada MK banned tourney? will it have other fighting games too? like marvel/AE/KOF/SCV?

and also, just subtract 2 from jebus matchup number to get the actual amount. if he thinks MK shouldnt be banned he must think we are even against him, so it works both ways

 

[Vega4]

^^ This

The match up is most definitely not +3. +2 is even kinda stretching it. Saying the MU is +3 is saying that does just as bad in the MU as does. If the is smart, he can mess us up pretty badly, but that usually comes from a good read. His attacks send us in all kinds of awkward directions, and he can get really early kills. He can be really mobile (like Vinnie) and can bucket break to live up to like 140. +1 seems like a solid placing.

Discussions like this should be in the MU thread, but it seems really inactive. Is this gonna be revived at any point, or did we just call it quits? I wouldn't mind running the discussion if Disqo Bunny is busy with school or something (not to bash you at all Disq, I know how busy people can be and I understand). Everyone comes here for MU advice, but we can direct these discussions towards that MU discussion section and fill that up.

Agree, lot of this match-up info here is lost after a couple of days. I should be in their respective character's topics, but somobody should open topics for every character, so we can discuss without limitations.
By the way, I put here a video of me vs a Wario (in our national tournament) looking for some advises, but nobody did

Here is the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eiKL4OKZAQ

Someone take a look and give advises please, I don't know, Zinoto, Player-1, GDX, Jebus, Tige, Nagahari,... anybody? xD

 

[-Googs]

I'm not sure, but its sticked in tournament listings, check it out dude!

 

[vato_break]

jebus has top tier player wins, he just likes being a hipster arguer(argues points that no one agrees with). I think bowser is plus +3, +4 would mean he wouldn't be able to touch you at all, in theory. Also, i'm still new when it comes to some diddy stuff but, whats best thing to do vs a player who reacts to bananas throws? mindgaming--baiting or waiting maybe? or maybe don't focus on throwing bananas?

 

[Player-1]

react better.

 

[Luigi player]

whats best thing to do vs a player who reacts to bananas throws? mindgaming--baiting or waiting maybe? or maybe don't focus on throwing bananas?

Both?! Vary your timing also, and generally just don't be predictable and play it safe (like e.g. after throwing you could shield if you're worried he will insta-throw it back).

 

[vato_break]

i have trouble vs this lucario who reacts really well and plays with bananas well. I can beat him with snake but i dont want to rely on having to go that character. its just ******** to fight lcario man :l

 

[Zinoto]

Agree, lot of this match-up info here is lost after a couple of days. I should be in their respective character's topics, but somobody should open topics for every character, so we can discuss without limitations.
By the way, I put here a video of me vs a Wario (in our national tournament) looking for some advises, but nobody did

Here is the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eiKL4OKZAQ

Someone take a look and give advises please, I don't know, Zinoto, Player-1, GDX, Jebus, Tige, Nagahari,... anybody? xD

You were just playing too stiff. That Wario was being a lot more mobile and got control of your bananas way too much. If he didn't take them, he ate them. Also, you were pinned to edge and took so much damage there. I like how you picked it up the second game, but you lost the momentum towards the end after the fart. You gotta figure out different ways of coming back to the stage. Also stop using mfk so much. I think you wanted to beat out his bite, but you got punished more times than you probably had hoped for. Wario is gonna ALWAYS bait your bananas, take them, and then mess you up. It's the only thing he can do to win. You have to be more fluid in your play style. I always look at vids of ADHD for creativity and vids of Gnes for matchup mentality. All the spot dodging and rolling just limits what you can do (especially OoS options).

Summary:

1. Keep your bananas under your control.
2. Don't be predictable with your recovery, GET BACK ON STAGE.
3. Be fluid, a stiff is a dead .
4. Don't be afraid of the other player. Lots of spot dodges and rolls insinuate that you are afraid of their attacks. Shield them and punish them.

Also, i'm still new when it comes to some diddy stuff but, whats best thing to do vs a player who reacts to bananas throws? mindgaming--baiting or waiting maybe? or maybe don't focus on throwing bananas?

players usually have this problem when they are throwing the bananas at the opponent too much. Roller (one of the IC mains here in MI) told me that bananas should be thought of as traps, not projectiles. That mentality really helped me progress, you should consider it as well. If they always react to it, throw it at the ground/air and punish whatever they normally would do. Z-drop the banana, react to their reaction, or whatever it takes to get the upper hand. But remember think of them as traps rather than projectiles.

This is especially true with Lucario. He is gonna try and put the banana behind him so that you have to through him to get it. Trap him. Limit his options to close to none and punish the only one left.

 

[Player-1]

Roller (one of the IC mains here in MI) told me that bananas should be thought of as traps, not projectiles.

This is a good way to think about it and you're going to start getting MUCH better punishes it with it. Like, half of my playstyle is throwing out super unsafe things that suddenly become safe because I have a banana out in a certain place making it safe. Wait til vids of me vs 4god come out from this past tournament, I had a good amount of good banana setups and stuff in the set.

 

[vato_break]

that makes sense because i would actually have more sucess when i tried dribbling to bait him to do something, ground instant thowing helped a bit too. Thanks, i'll try to do that more.

edit: eyes just opened lmao, i need to do this a lot more.

 

[Player-1]

oh btw, backward glidetoss down to stutterstep fsmash is pretty good.

Another thing, if bananas are going to fall on an opponent's shield (after it has already hit it or the opponent or something else or w.e) just wait for it to land to punish, seriously, people rush it way too much, just start charging a smash and the opponent will be like "wtf are you doing" *banana lands* "of ****". Those are the kinds of traps people need to look out for.

 

[Vega4]

@Zinoto, thanks for all those advises, I'll keep it in mind.

@P-1, what is stutterstep fsmash?

 

[Player-1]

initiate a dash and fsmash immediately and you get slightly more/less range depending on if you dash forward or backward. you pretty much just press control stick and c stick at the same time.

 

[SaveMeJebus]

players usually have this problem when they are throwing the bananas at the opponent too much. Roller (one of the IC mains here in MI) told me that bananas should be thought of as traps, not projectiles. That mentality really helped me progress, you should consider it as well. If they always react to it, throw it at the ground/air and punish whatever they normally would do. Z-drop the banana, react to their reaction, or whatever it takes to get the upper hand. But remember think of them as traps rather than projectiles.

This is especially true with Lucario. He is gonna try and put the banana behind him so that you have to through him to get it. Trap him. Limit his options to close to none and punish the only one left.

This doesn't really work because he doesn't react to a banana throw in the same way every time. Sometimes he'll shield grab it, sometimes he'll F-air you which also catches the banana at the same time and sometimes he'll shoot out a fully charged aura and trade hits with the banana. He does most of these things on reaction so it's very hard for you to commit to anything.

 

[Vega4]

This doesn't really work because he doesn't react to a banana throw in the same way every time. Sometimes he'll shield grab it, sometimes he'll F-air you which also catches the banana at the same time and sometimes he'll shoot out a fully charged aura and trade hits with the banana. He does most of these things on reaction so it's very hard for you to commit to anything.

That's why you have to mix all your stuff...

 

[SaveMeJebus]

That's why you have to mix all your stuff...

Pretty much anything you can mix up gets punished by all those options.

 

[Zinoto]

This doesn't really work because he doesn't react to a banana throw in the same way every time. Sometimes he'll shield grab it, sometimes he'll F-air you which also catches the banana at the same time and sometimes he'll shoot out a fully charged aura and trade hits with the banana. He does most of these things on reaction so it's very hard for you to commit to anything.

You're not being too specific. I named a couple of things, there's no way none of these can work.

Of course a player won't react the same way every time (if they did we'd win all of our match ups). Each player plays differently with different styles. What gives such an edge on character is that we have SO many potential mixups that can keep the game in our favor for pretty much the whole match. is a decent character, but he has a lot of short comings that we can exploit. I don't really like it when people say things "don't work" because everything works (if you can input the commands it works), but it may not be appropriate for that situation. So when you say "this doesn't really work" are you generalizing that none of what I stated will ever work?

The reason why I made the distinction that bananas should be used as traps is because when you think of this way two things happen. 1) You stop mindlessly throwing them at your opponent and 2) You take away your opponents options and can get good punishes in. If can do a lot of things, why not take some of those options away? If he's in the air he can't shield, run, or spot dodge. If they like to avoid bananas by staying in the air, they've already limited their options so you know what you can cross off your mental list of what they will do. If they want to use fair to catch the bananas, they have cool down time (which can be punished) and cannot use any attacks that use the A-button. So again you know what you can cross off your list. shielding the bananas works the same way.

You will never be able to know 100% what someone will do, but if you limit their options you can make it very likely that you will guess right. That's what makes this game fun, being able to read 10 moves ahead and outplay your opponent.

I'm curious now, what would you do to beat since you think this "doesn't work"?

 

[GDX]

^^ went in so hard came out the other side covered in holy juice

 

[ChocoNaner]

Zinoto went in all the way mangz :I

May The God be with you good sir, you will need Its assistance for the impossible challenge you have set for yourself I:

ichu:

 

[Gnes]

I think i just figured out our new metagame. I might not quit diddy after all.

Hope be to the diddy gods.

 

[Player-1]

rofl you were going to quit diddy? what a bad player.


lern2infinite guys, I've been infiniting so many people recently it's pro.

 

[Gnes]

Dude our metagame's been stale for far too long. Can u blame me? I'll revolutionize toonlink while I'm at it.

 

[GDX]

Did you finally figure out how to play aggro?