The Official Dark Samus for Brawl thread!

[The Bino]

I have to agree with MarsBitrona's poitn. The thing about Metroid games is that they are about Samus. She really doesn't interact with anyone else. I don't see why they should have anyone besides Samus and probably Ridley to represent Metroid for the simple fact that the games are about how Samus is a lone bounty huner-esque person........ thing. If they add Ridley, I don't see why they would need a Samus clone also. I know a lot of you don't think Dark Samus would be a clone, but let's get serious for a moment. Dark Samus is not an original design. It is Samus' suit, but dark. And the shoulder pads look funky. That's all. How boring would it be to have multiple characters that look the same but have different moves. I say, why not just make everyone Mario with different hats and move sets. I don't think Dark Samus is important enough to be in brawl, not to metnion it isn't exciting enough.

Well lets put this plain and simple, Sakurai said this (not exact don't quote me): I would like to have more representation from the Metroid Franchise

Now who would get the spot is the question, now lets look at facts, Mother Brain would be a candidate, main boss in 2 games and she probably wouldn't get it, Ridley, has one of the best shots, since he is not just an enemy but a simple to Metroid Franchise, lets look at the Super Metroid Cover, what do we see, i believe it is Samus Shooting Ridley, look at the opening scene, i see Ridley again being shot by Samus, regardless of how we look at it, Ridley has a fairly good shot

Now look at Dark Samus, Dark Samus really is a representation of Prime Series, reason for that is because in Metroid Prime

Spoiler

you had to defeat the giant as$ Metroid at the end of the game called Metroid Prime, when defeated after 3 transformations she is dying on the ground, Samus walks over to her and she stabs Samus through the Phazon suit that Samus was wearing, she rips off the Phazon Suit and Samus goes back to wearing the Gravity Suit... At the end of the game Metroid Prime is laying on the ground in a big pool of Phazon, then u see an thing shoot out and it takes form of a Hand, come MP2: Echoes, that HAND that we saw, or should've seen if beaten on Hard and 100%, takes for into a manipulation of Samus except its still after Phazon, which is what Metroid Prime itself was after to begin with.... except it is in the form of a look a like of Samus, only with the covered from head to toe with Phazon, as well as can use the Phazon as a weapon as the Phazon Suit had did in the final battle against MP in the 1st Metroid Prime, u following me here.... now as i explained earlier, at the end of MP2: Echoes if u beat it 100%, u see a cut scene for MP3, u think u destroyed DS but u see a cluster of Phazon out in space, and it reforms and becomes Dark Samus again.....

now if u still think that Dark Samus doesn't deserve the spot that ur just ignorant, its clear as day that DS is a representation of the Metroid Franchise to date......

For starters, Metroid Prime Hunters and Metroid Prime Pinball are Prime games. They're spin-offs of the spin-off..

I honestly didn't know that Metroid Prime was a spin-off if it TAKES PLACE BEFORE METROID 2, can anyone explain that to me....

Spoiler

the original story was that THERE WAS AN INFESTATION ON A PLANET, SAMUS WENT AND TOOK CARE OF THE PROBLEM, or so she thought, BUT THEN SHE FOUND OUT THAT LATER THERE WAS A HOME PLANET FOR THE METROIDS, SHE WENT AND DESTROYED THAT AS WELL, but than with the Metroid Hatchling she brought for studies to help mankind, Ridley arrived again, and boom the story line continued of the 1st game again with Mother Brain controlling everyone else

 

[Red Exodus]

I don't get how Prime 1 and 2 are considered spin offs to him either, but it's his opinion so I'm not gonna jump down his throat. Personally I considered all of the Metroids other than the ones on DS part of the series. Also, Ridley and DS are the only feasible bosses they can use, include SA-X if you want since you consider Prime a spin-off.

And so what if Samus is a loner, what does that have to do with Brawl? It's not gonna make DS, Ridley and Samus buddies anyway so as far as the story is concerned it won't be affected.

Why do you care about Samus' representation anyway? Prime is the main [or prime, te-he-he] Metroid now, and you consider that a spin off so that shouldn't affect you at all.

 

[MarsBitrona]

Describing what Dark Samus is does absolutely nothing to prove how she's a worthy character for Super Smash Bros. I'm not saying that Dark Samus is a bad character, I'm saying that she's not right for Smash Bros. Adding Dark Samus to Brawl just to have more Metroid characters is a bad idea because... well, look at my earlier post.

I honestly didn't know that Metroid Prime was a spin-off if it TAKES PLACE BEFORE METROID 2, can anyone explain that to me....

The Prime series is a self-contained series with its own numbered sequels that was based on the other Metroid games, but has no impact on the overall story of them. I'm pretty sure that's what a spin-off is. Just because it has a place in the overall timeline doesn't mean it isn't a spin-off.

edit: I'm hearing alot of claims that Metroid Prime is what the Metroid series is now. However, Nintendo has said that it will be a trilogy and Metroid Prime 3 is the last Prime game. Egad! They might actually have to make a sequel to Metroid Fusion!

 

[The Bino]

Red Exodus - Exactly i was just giving pure examples on why it's not considered a spin off or anything of the like... and when i brought SA-X i was making a joke bout that lol

Ok so we have a Metroid Queen in the 2nd Metroid and this is Metroid Prime which takes place before Metroid 2, i think that there are things here that should be clicking together, me being a huge fan of Samus and all of the Metroidness i would have to disagree with you yet again, ur saying that Dark Samus isn't right for Brawl cuz she is a mear clone of Samus, which i explained in my earlier post on WHY Dark Samus isn't a mear clone of Samus.... which should make her a rather good contender in Brawl, hell if ur gonna argue that DS shouldn't be in Brawl then u must disagree that Tails (from Sonic) shouldn't get into Brawl as well is Sonic makes it, cuz Tails is a mear clone of Sonic, that's basically what im hearing as well.... hell don't allow MegaMan into Brawl cuz he uses blasters as well as Samus, uh oh that's another clone of Samus must not let him in it either

 

[Red Exodus]

Just because Prime is the main Metroid right now doesn't mean it will be forever, just like the older Metroids, it's time will pass and a different/new-side of the story will be used.

To me, DS has more of an impact that most bosses in Metroid. It's more aggressive, in-your-face boss than the typical locked-in-a-lair-filled-with-minions boss. Now the reason I like DS is because it's different from Samus. If there was never Metroid Prime 1 or 2 I would only want Ridley since SA-X is Samus' suit with a single celled organism inside and it's the only choice feasible other than Ridley [based on my no Prime scenario].

This is why I like DS, not because of more representation, but because of the possible movesets and playstyles you could have with it.

 

[The Bino]

I may have phrased things wrong when i posted when i was talking bout how i want DS in the game, now i am saying that Brawl is taking pretty much the most recent game/graphics and running with it, to make it seem more up to date IMO, but that doesn't mean that anyone is excluded or anything that's just my take on it

On Dark Samus being a in ur face boss, now i agree with it whole heartedly, i loved my battles against Dark Samus, for two reasons

1 - I never knew what DS was gonna do, so spontaneous in the beginning, then it kind of repeated itself

2 - Pure hottness battle, always kept me going to get that next hit before i got hit or anything, plus it always pulled out some hot moves on Samus which i thought was refreshing to me, i wasn't getting another battle wit DS and it was the same thing as the last on

 

[Framerate]

I may have phrased things wrong when i posted when i was talking bout how i want DS in the game, now i am saying that Brawl is taking pretty much the most recent game/graphics and running with it

Kinda like Kid Icarus and Metaknight?

The thing is, just like Blood Falcon shouldn't be in the game even though he's a different character than Cpt. Falcon, DS wouldn't make a good brawl character. I'm not saying Dark Samus isn't cool, of course she's kick ***. I just think that she is too much like samus to be a seperate character. This has no relation to tails and sonic, considering sonic is a freaking fast hedgehog, while tails is a fox that flies using his 2 tails.

 

[GenG]

Metaknight is recent, he even appears in Kirby's Squeak Squad which I think it wasn't released yet in the US.

 

[The Bino]

Kid Icarus, they are using the most recent game for him, back in the NES days, just updated his graphics to make him look more 3d instead of leaving him in the 8bit era

 

[El HP]

Pit resembles his look from Kid Icarus of Myth and Monsters.

 

[Y34HDUD3!!!]

I agree with you guys, DS is one of my fav bosses of all time.
Dunno why some people still don't agree with the idea....

 

[Stryks]

@ framerate:

Any chance the guy who made the thread or a mod can place this on the 1st post?? anyway...

Heres a cool vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6g6-lZvLxE&NR=1
Dark samus at 1:56
Phazon shield at 2:43
Phazon spreader up close and personal 2:46-2:48
Phazon dive: 2:50-2:52
Possible super at 2:54-3:01

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQ6asxblxNA
Phazon slicer 0:24-0:27
Phazon missile x2 0:43-0:45
Phazon shield 0:48-0:50
Phazon spreader: 1:02-1:04
Invisibility 1:06

Cant tell what moves he does while invisible

1:28 takes off invisibility
1:35-1:54 Boostball charge (could be like yoshis <>B or jigglys b move)
<does the same moves and abilities>
2:38-2:42 Phazon dive (best for an upb move, maybe able to guide the directon of the attack a la fire fox)

Now if ANY n00bs goes and say they'll be clones, ill shoved this whooper in their face! XD
I dont have much time left, so i couldnt look for the final battle, just put dark samus final on youtube, ull find it, some moves like the charge-and-shoot-2-phazon-beams could be the B move or something...

Yeah dark samys and samus are so similair... [/sarcasm]

 

[Framerate]

The same reason they are taking Doc out is the reason why I don't think Dark Samus will be in Brawl. Doc is a fantastic character, not to mention his music rocks, but he is just another form of Mario. Why would they put another version of Mario in brawl if they can simply add a different character from the Mario series, like Wario or Waluigi. Simply put, why would they add dark Samus, a different form of Samus, if they already have two forms of Samus (Don't forget about zero suit!!!!!). So they have two samus' with different move sets, but they want more Metroid characters. They could choose DS, but why go for another version of samus if they could use Ridley. He's been in multiple games, he is one of if not the main enemy of samus, and he reappeared in melee. I think signs are pointing to ridley as #3 for brawl. Now chances are DS will show up as a trophy, or a color swp of samus, or maybe even an enemy in 1p mode. I just don't see her as a seperate character.

 

[Stryks]

No no NO!! Dark samus AINT samus, how the hell can samus fight herself 3 times in a Metroid game?! dark samus is metroid prime using samus phazon suit as a body, thus they look similair, yet theyre obviously not the same person, its like puting fox vs fox in a star fox game, ********...

Get ur facts straight: samus aint dark samus, nor they have the same moves, DS has altered moves and some moves amus herself doesnt have, also she can use phazon instead of the usual punches and kicks, she floats, never touches the ground, is a tad faster, but they can make her slower, more powerful and maybe a little heavy or lighter idk...

 

[Red Exodus]

ZSS isn't a whole character, she's a transformation, therefore there's only 1 Samus in Brawl, Samus, who can transform into ZSS. DS =/= Samus. Play the dam game before you make such a unfounded statement. Doc = Mario, obviously. But Samus =/= DS, we've been through the whole phazon powered, animal instinct thing DS has going on.

 

[Framerate]

No no NO!! Dark samus AINT samus, how the hell can samus fight herself 3 times in a Metroid game?! dark samus is metroid prime using samus phazon suit as a body, thus they look similair, yet theyre obviously not the same person, its like puting fox vs fox in a star fox game, ********...

Get ur facts straight: samus aint dark samus, nor they have the same moves, DS has altered moves and some moves amus herself doesnt have, also she can use phazon instead of the usual punches and kicks, she floats, never touches the ground, is a tad faster, but they can make her slower, more powerful and maybe a little heavy or lighter idk...

Did you read my post?

Dark Samus is a version of Samus, just like Doc is a version of Mario. Doc is not Mario, he is a doctor. Mario is not a Doctor. If he were, he would be called Doctor Mario. I understand this. I understand that Dark Samus is not Samus. They are seperate versions of a certain personality. I've never said they were the same thing. The point i'm trying to make is that Dark Samus is a great boss in the series, but just isn't Brawl material. She was designed to be samus' suit without Samus, a stronger form of Samus. She was designed to be like Samus. The fact that you can't distinguish wether she'd be faster or slower, heavier or lighter, just mean sthat she really isn't that much different from Samus. You have to go out of your way, fudge the truth a bit, just to make her different from Samus. And for what? Just because she makes a good boss fight? So does Ridley, and he has fricken wings.

 

[Red Exodus]

The funniest thing is the only reason people say DS is another version of samus. Now if they called it Metroid Prime instead of DS then people would be like, 'hell yeah, MP and Samus ftw'.

And you keep going on about this 'brawl material'. What is that exactly? I'm sure people said ICs and G&W weren't Melee material, but look at them now.

 

[Stryks]

Ridlye deserves the shot more, wanted to make that clear, but we can always have another character, now who do u think deserves the shot after ridley?

There are only a handful of character out there that deserve the shot, dark samus being the main one, the guy is the main boss of the saga that brought metroid back from the dead, she has an arsenal of moves that samus herself can use, shes more than version of samus, that like saying y.link and adult link (who are dif. versions), dark samus and samus are not, they look similair, but thats it...

Obviously i cant tell u if dark samus is faster, heavier or anything, in MP samus is a tad slow, in melee shes faster, just like mario, he jumps over high in all of his games, yet he has pretty average jumpin in melee...

 

[Framerate]

Actual, even if they called it Prime, I would still think it was a bad character choice.

And for the record, I think IC and G&W are completely smash bros material. They are original and truly represent an important Nintendo franchise.

 

[Stryks]

ICs is an important nintendo franchise? WTF? Yeah and metroid is what? seriously ds has more thant enough to become a real powerful fighter in smash...

 

[Framerate]

Sorry for the double post.

Ridlye deserves the shot more, wanted to make that clear, but we can always have another character, now who do u think deserves the shot after ridley?

There are only a handful of character out there that deserve the shot, dark samus being the main one, the guy is the main boss of the saga that brought metroid back from the dead, she has an arsenal of moves that samus herself can use, shes more than version of samus, that like saying y.link and adult link (who are dif. versions), dark samus and samus are not, they look similair, but thats it...

Obviously i cant tell u if dark samus is faster, heavier or anything, in MP samus is a tad slow, in melee shes faster, just like mario, he jumps over high in all of his games, yet he has pretty average jumpin in melee...

I agree a lot with what you are saying. If Nintendo decides to go for more Metroid Characters after Ridley, I would say DS has one of the strongest, if not the strongest shot. I just don't know if they are gonna go farther than Ridley. That's the real debate for me. Will they add DS just to have another character? Will they be able to pull it off? Dumb question, Nintendo can pull anything off.

 

[Stryks]

Sakurai stated he wanted to better represent the metroid series, u think with samus/zamus and ridley would do it? SF is bound to have 4 characters, and it aint such an important series in comparison with metroid, i can actually c 5 metroid characters in brawl (4 if u dont consider zamus)...

 

[Framerate]

I rock with these double posts -_-

ICs is an important nintendo franchise? WTF? Yeah and metroid is what? seriously ds has more thant enough to become a real powerful fighter in smash...

Heck yes IC is an important franchise, just as much as Earthboud, Balloon Fight, and Kid Icarus.

 

[Stryks]

Lol I cant believe what im hearing, true their classics, but I hardly consider them as important as mario, zelda or metroid...

 

[Framerate]

Sakurai stated he wanted to better represent the metroid series, u think with samus/zamus and ridley would do it? SF is bound to have 4 characters, and it aint such an important series in comparison with metroid, i can actually c 5 metroid characters in brawl (4 if u dont consider zamus)...

I don't know where this quote is coming from, a link might help. But i'm pretty sure he was just trying to justify why he would add Samus without her suit, considering the lone goal of playing as Zero-Suit Samus has been saught after for so long. Why would he give that up so easily, without some reasoning. I do need to see this quote for myself though.

 

[Framerate]

Lol I cant believe what im hearing, true their classics, but I hardly consider them as important as mario, zelda or metroid...

I never said they were as important, i just said they were important.

 

[Red Exodus]

Yeah, they were good for their time but now they're pretty much dead.

I can only see DS after Ridley, other than those 2 they'd have to turn to hunters, which is a pretty slippery slope.

 

[Framerate]

Haha, hunters. :D


See, Nintendo is gonna pick the characters that best represent the franchise, and if they think DS is the best candidate, fine by me. I'm just saying that, following recent trends (Pit's revival from a dead franchise WTF) I don't think DS has a good chance. I'm just trying to say that the odds don't look likely. There is a chance, oh boy is there a chance. I just don't think it's likely. And i think i used "just" in just about (haha) every sentence here. Woot English.....

 

[Zarasai]

yes bit pit may be much more than just a character addition. from what everybody ive heard from is saying, roy was added to advertise the fire emblem series (which later released a gamecube game, outside of japan even).
Suppose they are doing something similar. Maybe sakurai is trying to establish how much of a fanbase pit still has, realizing it is now a dead series. Now take smash bros - if you keep up with nintendo's last 3 systems, you probably play or have played smash bros. If they want to increase pit's popularity, this is definitely the way to do it. maybe sakurai or the other developers or somebody else along the lines at nintendo is considering a revival of the kid icarus series. to me this would be the best way to get the character out in the open.

also, look at people's more current reactions - many people who havent played any early nintendo systems probably havent even heard of the games unless they happened to read the melee trophy. at the bieginning people probably never expected that, but now pit has already become suddenly more popular with the smashbros crowd.

 

[Deleted member]

Mhmm. Usually the characters in 'Brawl have a big boost in popularity simply by being acknowledged. The same could happen with Dark Samus, and the 'Prime series, in Japan. You never know. Maybe Sakurai plans to Marth the Japanese.

 

[OysterMeister]

If you're looking for some reason for the inclusion of DS, OUTSIDE of the "she's the best/only choice after Ridley" argument, then consider this:

Metroid Corruption is supposed to be the game that will prove the Wii is capable of outstanding FPS controls. It's a very important game from what is quickly becoming a core Nintendo franchise (right up there with Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda). Now, if what little has been revealed of the game is any indication: Dark Samus will be ALL OVER this thing. From what I hear, she's the main antagonist, planting evil phazon things all over the galaxy and just generaly forcing Samus to follow and hunt her down.
A role this major in a game this important, combined with the popularity and significance DS already has from her other appearance, just might be enough merit to land DS a spot of her own on the "worthy for Brawl" list.


Oh, and just to clarify, Dark Samus is the "dark" Samus in name and color only. Unlike most other dopplegangers, DS doesn't reflect any aspect of the real Samus' personality, so far as I can tell. She just looks like Samus because the whole "cloned from Metroid Prime with Samus' Phazon suit" thing was a nifty way to tie the first two games together.

 

[Y34HDUD3!!!]

SPoiler tags, please.
I think it would be simpler for Sakurai to put DS instead of Ridley because of the size.
I know Ridley can be made smaller, but isn't he supposed to be a big-***, scary-looking space dragon?

 

[Stryks]

^^^
My answer: Ridleys size in the melee intro

 

[Tiamat]

SPoiler tags, please.
I think it would be simpler for Sakurai to put DS instead of Ridley because of the size.
I know Ridley can be made smaller, but isn't he supposed to be a big-***, scary-looking space dragon?

It would be simpler for Sakurai to put DS instead of Ridley because DS looks just like Samus. Even if she isn't a clone, I doubt there'll be that much effort needed to make her character model and most of the basic animations.

Of course, whether something is simpler to do or not isn't the only factor for a character being included. I think a big-**** scary looking space-dragon would provide a good chunk more variety to the roster than a hovering explosive armoured humanoid, and Ridley's more major to the series as a whole (rather than just the Prime series alone) than Samus is. But in terms of simplicity and ease of programming, yes, DS would be a lot easier to add than Ridley, far as I can tell.

 

[Stryks]

Still some things would still be hard, dark samus floats, and does she doenst run, attack or grab or anything like samus, if she were an unclone character (something that IS possible) for her a moves, she wouldnt throws fists or kicks, but more like use phazon to attack, the phazon would have about y.link's swords range or something...

 

[Tiamat]

Still some things would still be hard, dark samus floats,

I don't know much about animating characters, but I'm pretty sure that programming someone to just float around is probably one of the easiest things to animate, ever. Mainly because you don't have to actually ANIMATE anything (no legs and arm movement when you're just hovering around). It's not like Sakurai doesn't have experience with programming hovering anyways (example: Mewtwo)

and does she doenst run, attack or grab or anything like samus, if she were an unclone character (something that IS possible) for her a moves, she wouldnt throws fists or kicks, but more like use phazon to attack, the phazon would have about y.link's swords range or something...

It can't be that much different than what either Mewtwo, Zelda, or Ganondorf did in Melee, I think.

 

[Stryks]

Yeah true I guess, also a lot of people are saying that they will get confused by the color if someone else is using a samus
Solution:

Give Dark samus like lighting or something, comin out of its body, it wouldnt do damage, just like a detailed for its character, just imagine like in DBZ, ull get it...
Also with diferent animations, it would be way too hard to get confused with the characters...

 

[The Bino]

also to add to the lets add Ridley in.... here's a quick fact that you should know if u follow Metroid at all

Ridley is in Metroid Prime 3: Corruption

Should be interesting how its implemented seeing how we went from Meta Ridley in Prime, i wonder what it'll have now lol should be quite intrigueing if u ask me

Stryks - Nice thinking bout the Lightning with the DBZ, hottness pure hottness, Ill take a Dark Samus SSJ2 please lol

 

[Deleted member]

If you're looking for some reason for the inclusion of DS, OUTSIDE of the "she's the best/only choice after Ridley" argument, then consider this:

Metroid Corruption is supposed to be the game that will prove the Wii is capable of outstanding FPS controls. It's a very important game from what is quickly becoming a core Nintendo franchise (right up there with Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda). Now, if what little has been revealed of the game is any indication: Dark Samus will be ALL OVER this thing. From what I hear, she's the main antagonist, planting evil phazon things all over the galaxy and just generaly forcing Samus to follow and hunt her down.
A role this major in a game this important, combined with the popularity and significance DS already has from her other appearance, just might be enough merit to land DS a spot of her own on the "worthy for Brawl" list.


Oh, and just to clarify, Dark Samus is the "dark" Samus in name and color only. Unlike most other dopplegangers, DS doesn't reflect any aspect of the real Samus' personality, so far as I can tell. She just looks like Samus because the whole "cloned from Metroid Prime with Samus' Phazon suit" thing was a nifty way to tie the first two games together.

Fantastic contribution, I agree with everything you said.

Dark Samus really can't be a clone, people who know nothing of the Metroid series just don't get it. He/It's a seperate entity to Samus completely, s'not like Dark Link. Dark Samus has no connection bar the suit.

 

[Chief Mendez]

also to add to the lets add Ridley in.... here's a quick fact that you should know if u follow Metroid at all

Ridley is in Metroid Prime 3: Corruption

Should be interesting how its implemented seeing how we went from Meta Ridley in Prime, i wonder what it'll have now lol should be quite intrigueing if u ask me

Are you sure about that?

A Ridley clone (or another Meta...same difference) was in the E3 '06 (among other places) demo, in which said clone dies...for all we know he could've just been in there for the demo. Or maybe that is in fact the begining of the game, and Ridley's the first boss, never to be heard from again after defeating him.

Anyway, he's (probably) not going to play a central role.