The New Match-up Chart

[Zen Yore]

LOL ur dum jiggly sucks at spacing
what will you do after a kirby drill

ggkthxbainore etc

 

[MattNF]

LOL ur dum jiggly sucks at spacing
what will you do after a kirby drill

ggkthxbainore etc

>implying I would get hit by a kirby drill attack

but srsly if a kirby tries approaching with dair then I'll use nair

and we can play "what if" all day

what if kirby got grabbed in the **** tent? it's pretty much a guarantee he loses a stock assuming you don't *** up

gg zenbore

 

[Zen Yore]

bleh ill assume my jiggs is a noob just to avoid a bunch of flaming

 

[Nintendude]

Fox > Ness
Fox >> Luigi
Falcon = Jiggly
Link = Jiggly

 

[NixxxoN]

I think Kirby = Ness

Kirby has a hard time dealing with Ness DJC. A defensive DJC spamming Ness can annoy the **** out of Kirby

 

[firo]

I think Kirby = Ness

Kirby has a hard time dealing with Ness DJC. A defensive DJC spamming Ness can annoy the **** out of Kirby

I think this is a bit of a hard matchup for Ness. Utilt, fsmash, and dair really hurt Ness, and he can be edgeguarded with ease. Kirby has a pretty easy time of getting him off the stage. Kirby can be killed at pretty low percents by Ness, though. Its definitely worth discussing.
Ness v Yoshi should be sorted out, however.

 

[MattNF]

I think Kirby = Ness

Kirby has a hard time dealing with Ness DJC. A defensive DJC spamming Ness can annoy the **** out of Kirby

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

I think this is a bit of a hard matchup for Ness. Utilt, fsmash, and dair really hurt Ness, and he can be edgeguarded with ease. Kirby has a pretty easy time of getting him off the stage. Kirby can be killed at pretty low percents by Ness, though. Its definitely worth discussing.
Ness v Yoshi should be sorted out, however.

Me and ThalliumFan played like 10 competitive yoshi matches a few pages ago

Yoshi = Ness

 

[Deleted member]

Yoshi> Ness

Ness SUX

 

[Daedatheus]

I think Kirby = Ness

I don't know... all it takes is one hit to get Ness off the stage (aerial -> utilts -> bair/weak hit nair -> bair) and then Ness is a cinch to edgeguard.

 

[DMoogle]

I don't know... all it takes is one hit to get Ness off the stage (aerial -> utilts -> bair/weak hit nair -> bair) and then Ness is a cinch to edgeguard.

This is the case for most vs. Ness.

Although I think that a lot of people here are underestimating Ness (probably partly because very few play him well), he's definitely at a disadvantage vs. Kirby.

FWIW (not much for the people here), in the lower levels of play (everything below the 5s), I think Kirby and Ness are the two best characters over all.

 

[Fireblaster]

FWIW (not much for the people here), in the lower levels of play (everything below the 5s), I think Kirby and Ness are the two best characters over all.

No one cares about the noobs. All that matters is that the Ness has to be far more skilled than the kirby player to win.

 

[Nybb]

DK > DK

Seriously, fthrow-fair = too good

 

[DMoogle]

No one cares about the noobs. All that matters is that the Ness has to be far more skilled than the kirby player to win.

Yeah pretty much.

 

[NixxxoN]

I think this is a bit of a hard matchup for Ness. Utilt, fsmash, and dair really hurt Ness, and he can be edgeguarded with ease. Kirby has a pretty easy time of getting him off the stage. Kirby can be killed at pretty low percents by Ness, though. Its definitely worth discussing.
Ness v Yoshi should be sorted out, however.

Although Kirby's utilt is a massively overpowered move, its not enough to stop a good spamming Ness player. We have a priority clash here. Whoever times some moves better, he wins. I think Ness is has about as priority as Kirby in utilt and dair, and much much more in uair.

 

[firo]

Although Kirby's utilt is a massively overpowered move, its not enough to stop a good spamming Ness player. We have a priority clash here. Whoever times some moves better, he wins. I think Ness is has about as priority as Kirby in utilt and dair, and much much more in uair.

Kirby's hitboxes are much larger than Ness's for the most part. Although an extremely well timed dair can get through a utilt, it is much easier for a Kirby to hit a Ness than the other way around. A Kirby that is using a dair can only be hit by a Ness using uair if Ness is just the right distance away to avoid the drill and get his big head in. Not to mention that Ness has a really hard time approaching due to Kirby's fsmash and backwards utilts.

In terms of Yoshi v Ness, I have played many matches with Sheer and Boom's Yoshi and have come to a different conclusion. I'd definitely be willing to play, record, and post some Ness v Yoshi matches with someone to be analyzed.

 

[t3h Icy]

Some Agreement:

Kirby = Jigglypuff to Kirby > Jigglypuff
Fox > Ness to Fox >> Ness
Luigi = Samus to Luigi > Samus

Debating:

Ness = Yoshi to Ness ? Yoshi
Link = Jigglypuff to Link ? Jigglypuff

 

[NixxxoN]

Link is tricky to judge matchups because of his sh¡tty recovery... he does way better on the large stages. For example I would say Link > Jiggly on Hyrule and Link < Jiggly on dreamland. Jiggly has a hard time to approach link but once she does it, link can be easily comboed to death. Although Link's spam works well vs Jiggly

BTW, looks like Ness has gone from overrated on the old tier list to underrated right now IMO.

 

[Deleted member]

Ness can still kick butt

but he is still at a disadvantage against a lot

 

[MattNF]

Some Agreement:

Kirby = Jigglypuff to Kirby > Jigglypuff

I haven't seen anyone post a valid reason why Kirby is better in that matchup

seems like this thread is turning into a popularity contest instead of a debate

 

[DMoogle]

...experience.

 

[t3h Icy]

I haven't seen anyone post a valid reason why Kirby is better in that matchup

seems like this thread is turning into a popularity contest instead of a debate

Priority, Range, Edgeguarding, Survivability.

Jigglypuff has about even comboing ability, Rest and they're about even with Speed.

 

[MattNF]

Priority, Range, Edgeguarding, Survivability.

Jigglypuff has about even comboing ability, Rest and they're about even with Speed.

The combo ability is not equal. Kirby can barely do any combos to jigglypuff, while on the other had, she can 0-to-death him with ease.

Both characters are light and easy to edgegaurd, so I don't know what you mean by "survivability".

Range? How exactly does Kirby have more "range" than jigglypuff?

Priority doesn't really affect this matchup. Again, Kirby can't play the same annoying way against Jiggly like he can against other characters.

Jigglypuff also has better aerial maneuverability and she can teleport so they're not equal with speed either.

 

[Surri-Sama]

jiggly has more aerial agility? LOL

no way man, j00r crazy!

and jiggly and kirby haz = recovery?


LOL!


i aint mad, i r laughin xD


no one is offering you a good arguement because your being to silly

 

[Zen Yore]

MattNF thinks the only kirby player is matts

 

[NixxxoN]

lol at kirby/jiggly being easy to edgeguard. When they are at high height, you simply can't stop them from coming back.

Also, Jiggs flies smoother than Kirby.

 

[Surri-Sama]

floating is not > Normall jumping/ flying

kirby flies, not floats...floaty sucks for approaching, and teleport can be worked around...dont approach on a horizontal axis?

which also forces jiggly to use her crappy Nair with floaty speed and such vs kirby's...umm...everything?

 

[t3h Icy]

Updated:

Kirby = Jigglypuff to Kirby > Jigglypuff
Fox > Ness to Fox >> Ness
Luigi = Samus to Luigi > Samus

Debating:

Ness = Yoshi to Ness ? Yoshi
Link = Jigglypuff to Link ? Jigglypuff
Samus = Ness to Samus ? Ness

For the crazy Luigi people, he managed above both Link and Ness, but the difference between the three of them is so minuscule that more accurate numbers in the match-ups could easily shift the ranks. Fox and Kirby climb a little bit higher and Samus spirals downward a little bit more. I'm also adding Samus/Ness, but in my opinion it's equal, maybe somewhat advantageous for Ness.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

Updated:

Kirby = Jigglypuff to Kirby > Jigglypuff
Fox > Ness to Fox >> Ness
Luigi = Samus to Luigi > Samus

Debating:

Ness = Yoshi to Ness ? Yoshi
Link = Jigglypuff to Link ? Jigglypuff
Samus = Ness to Samus ? Ness

For the crazy Luigi people, he managed above both Link and Ness, but the difference between the three of them is so minuscule that more accurate numbers in the match-ups could easily shift the ranks. Fox and Kirby climb a little bit higher and Samus spirals downward a little bit more. I'm also adding Samus/Ness, but in my opinion it's equal, maybe somewhat advantageous for Ness.

I posted the Yoshi/Ness thing before...so no comment outside of the matchup being even

I agreed before with the the Link = Jigglypuff. As said, on Hyrule, Link is probably slightly better, on dreamland, Jigglypuff is better.

Samus and Ness. Hmm, I personally like Samus vs Ness...but the matchup is really difficult to win. Ness's priority is too much. Its barely in Ness's favor, like 55-45 Ness

 

[MattNF]

crappy Nair

noob jigglypuff alert

and jiggly and kirby haz = recovery?

When they're both coming back from a high area, they're hard to kill. When they both approach the ledge from near or below, they're both easy to kill.

MattNF thinks the only kirby player is matts

Anyway, I'm glad icy took the time to debate my arguments instead of proving my point about this being a popularity contest run by noobs.

Oh wait.

No wonder why Isai never posts in these topics

 

[Surri-Sama]

when i said crappy nair i meant vs most of kirbys attacks, especially HIS Nair, and even more so his Bair...and even more so again most of his attacks....and last but not least, his Utilt

Nair as an approach starts to become iffy when every time you try to start teh uber 0-death your getting out prioritized by a smart, slow playing kirby

 

[firo]

When was it decided that Fox >> Ness? If that's the way that it's going to be, it might as well be Mario >> Ness and Kirby >> Ness, since they are harder matchups.

 

[t3h Icy]

Any changes are not permanent, etc.

If you're unhappy about a match-up, debate about it. And MattNF, it's not a popularity contest, so don't have a fit because you aren't getting what you want. Surri's and other's points are stronger than your's, and you're the only one agreeing for Kirby = Jigglypuff. Again, if the argument turns the other way, I can change it in a pinch.

And I was a bit quick with Fox >> Ness, but look, now I've sparked a discussion about it. I'm no Ness player, but I would assume that Fox is one of the harder match-ups for Ness. Otherwise, post why, and let the other players agree/disagree with you.

 

[DMoogle]

I find Fox to be Ness' hardest match-up besides Pika for sure. Fox's short-hopped aerials just **** Ness in priority. Ness' u-tilt works OK, but when it fails it leaves him wide open because of the long cooldown time.

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

when kirby and jiggly are having an air battle, kirby almost always wins by having more priority. noob kirbys will stay on the ground in this matchup.

 

[MattNF]

when kirby and jiggly are having an air battle, kirby almost always wins by having more priority. noob kirbys will stay on the ground in this matchup.

Of course. But air priority isn't the only thing that matter. Kirby still has problems doing long combos among other things. He dies very quickly against good Jigglys (which I doubt most of you here have played)

Surri's and other's points are stronger than your's

So talking in half-***** leet speak like a 12 year old is stronger now?

jiggly has more aerial agility? LOL

no way man, j00r crazy!

and jiggly and kirby haz = recovery?


LOL!


i aint mad, i r laughin xD

looks like this topic has become a joke

I don't plan on posting in here anymore lol OH WELL

inb4 "u mad"

 

[Deleted member]

When was it decided that Fox >> Ness? If that's the way that it's going to be, it might as well be Mario >> Ness and Kirby >> Ness, since they are harder matchups.

Fox might be easier at your level

but it gets harder and harder the better the fox gets

 

[NixxxoN]

People cant say "disagree", they flame instead

 

[t3h Icy]

Debating:

Ness = Yoshi to Ness ? Yoshi
Link = Jigglypuff to Link ? Jigglypuff
Samus = Ness to Samus ? Ness
Fox >> Ness to Fox > Ness

I don't plan on posting in here anymore

Later.

 

[earthadept]