Guide The Mario Match-Up Discussion Thread

[-PM-]

Me, being the falcon main I am. I know a bunch about this matchup.

As far as combos go, they can both combo the living hell out of each other so we'll call that even. The matchup generally revolves around either character having really good gimps. Falcon could potentially kill you at anything over 20% with a knee and a ledge grab. Everyone knows mario can just cape poop captain falcon.

The matchup comes down to who has the most control and what map you're on. I'll go out to say that the best CP against falcon is FoD, mario can use the platforms to his advantage and falcon literally gets stuck on them when he's trying to do anything. Also most of the time falcon can't do dropzones on those platforms. The worst map to take falcon would be DL64, falcon has so much room, platforms, and a lot of room to down-b recover. Lots of room = dropzones, grab combos, platform combo's, and nair camping. In all honesty i'd say its about even or 45 - 55 falcon.


Just throwing my change in the bag.

 

[n0ne]

yeah i support what PM said. Im a R.C.D. main also. its A LIITLE BIT in R.C.D.s favor. because of his speed. but mario manages well against him. Mindgames are a must for both for correct aproaches

 

[MarioMariox2]

Avoid WDing too much since Falcon's knee has this ability to home in on opponents WDing close-mid range.

U-air blind -> Cape.

 

[Blanky]

i do pretty good in this match up. u-air works really well against most of falcon's approach, and can also lead to a good combo. if you shield an fsmash, or dsmash, you want to WD OOS towards him and grab or smash depending on percentage because it usually pushes you back so you wouldnt be able to shieldgrab, this also goes for shielding a knee if it's not a soft knee.
i also like to d-throw or u-throw and tech chase or jab/fire reset to rack up damage. if you catch him off the ledge, bair until he up-b's and either cape, edgehog, or fsmash depending on his position.

it's a really fun match up and almost even! just gotta watch out for that knee. also, if he catches you in a combo, i prefer not to double jump. it usually leads to your death haha.

 

[Eggz]

ganon mario is so fun

 

[A2ZOMG]

Ganon vs Mario is my 2nd or 3rd most hated matchup as Mario. I think Ganon hard counters Mario personally, and I deliberately pick Ganon against other Mario mains since the Mario ditto is a pretty dumb matchup to deal with lol.

Like you can do big damage to Ganon, but he just never dies unless you F-smash him at high percents...

 

[n0ne]

oh but reverse uair ***** marios recovery, even if hes fireballing to get back to stage.
EVEN WORSE if he capes.

The true way to kill ganon at mid % is leave him without a jump when edgehog.
Else, we are talking bout he is gonna die like at 200%.

I main Ganon also and i play the match both ways... Mario gets hurts bad agains Dorf but with grab mixups and a few tomahawks hhere and there (because almost EVERY DORF likes to shield grab) then mario can show his moves too.

 

[Lordydennek]

I agree the falcon mu is about 55 45 too.
on a side note i think doc goes even with CF-gimp power is better than ours
that was fast lol
shall I post it?

are we going on to ganon now? after saturday i will be able to give you a good argument. Im playing a good one this sat

 

[Blanky]

man i hate the ganondorf match up. but once i find an opening i feel it's easier to approach with a shffl'd uair and any other move. it's hard for the ganon to react. also you can cg with d-throw at reallyyyy low percents, and after that just d-throw and job for another grab.
he can **** your recover with uair, but you can **** his just as easy.

 

[n0ne]

.......

Ive always thought that Plumber had better time vs Falcon than Doc.
Docs fair and bair aside, Mario has better grabs, and Docs uair is actually a bit crappy. Maybe its just me.

But vs Ganon, i really think doc is better than Mario. Really.

 

[-PM-]

the shffl'd uair approach would be good if every mario didn't already do it. The guy I play with ***** my mario and every time I try to Shffl uair him he jabs me right in the nose. Its so sad :'[ In other news. Just bait him to do something stuipd, i've noticed gannons get frustrated easy so just be the *** hole throwing fireballs at someone who can't throw something back.

In this matchup I just go for ****ty gimps and throw fireballs cause i'm a *******. That or play falcon. har har.

60-40

Edit: Doc is leagues better against gannon, leagues.

 

[Lordydennek]

ok so falcon is 55 45...Ill go post that

on ganon. Im not so sure its that bad. Ill try some stuff out this weekend and get back to you

 

[condemned_soul]

The guy I play with ***** my mario and every time I try to Shffl uair him he jabs me right in the nose. Its so sad :'[ In other news.

I wanna play him.....bring him out some time dude. we have a smashfest every Tuesday till like midnight.

oh and bring that ganon player also. i need practice against ganon anyway.

 

[M@1funk$hun]

holy crap you guys finished falcon in one day? I don't check this thing in 24 hours and you make me edit it again! good stuff! I'll post 55-45 on this board
Next Matchup


PEACH

 

[condemned_soul]

well we kinda always talk about falcon so we would/should know the MU ratio

 

[M@1funk$hun]

trufax
also I figured we'd go peach cuz we were talking about it in the general chat thread, so I guess we can just kinda transfer that stuff over to here/continue that discussion

 

[-PM-]

I wanna play him.....bring him out some time dude. we have a smashfest every Tuesday till like midnight.

oh and bring that ganon player also. i need practice against ganon anyway.

I was talking about that gannon player XD, whenever I uair approach to much he jabs me in the face.

as for peach i'll throw out 60 - 40 for now and leave facts out.


Waiting for deliberation.

 

[-PM-]

errrr interweb

 

[A2ZOMG]

Peach is boring, probably 6/4 in her favor. She's sorta a mini-Falco that you can kinda **** with F-smash, except actually killing her is harder and more random. Vs Peach is pretty much a spacing war.

3 Jabs -> F-smash at low percents is legit, not that it combos, but it gives you space extremely well and people tend to get hit by it anyway. Stages with platforms are favorable, just make sure you don't bite her D-smash.

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I find fireballing a lot in this matchup is very effective
which I suppose fits in to your spacing war thing
and maybe it's just the peach I play, but I always get under her
uair works for me in that matchup

 

[n0ne]

this is actually a very complex MU. Everything (I think?) is in favor of peach. Cant explain right now, strip club time

 

[Lordydennek]

65 35 in peachs favor.
she has 40000x more options
just got done with the tourny. good ****.
doc is >>>> than mario againt ganon.
I'd say the mu is bout 60 40 ganon maybe 55 45 jusdginf from my matches. doc is solidly better against him tho so id say its 60 40

 

[A2ZOMG]

Personally I'm of the opinion that Ganon beats Mario 65/35...and beats Doc about 55/45ish. It's a really dumb matchup and it depends highly on how hard you're able to punish him when you get in. Mario only has damage combos on Ganon for the most part, so I think he loses pretty badly since killing Ganon is FRUSTRATINGLY difficult, and F-smash spacing isn't as good vs Ganon as it is against other characters since his F-air basically outranges your F-smash and you can't really do dumb stuff like crouch baiting it like you sorta can against Marth. While Doc doesn't have to worry quite as much with his B-air edgeguard sealing the deal a fair bit more reliably.

Vs Peach, she does pretty much outclass Mario, except Mario's F-smash is REALLY REALLY GOOD for spacing and Mario's Cape and Fireballs give him more options for keepaway (catching Turnips is good too, really underused tactic that can be very rewarding). Plus random Up-smashes, while not exactly the safest option ever, can at least keep Peach honest with her spacing when she's in KO range.

 

[M@1funk$hun]

pro tip
to catch a turnip easier, crouch and right before you think it's gonna hit you, perform a dtilt
ull catch it

 

[StealthyGunnar]

Peach is gay and stupid.

Ganon has Fair.

 

[Lordydennek]

still after you begin to combo ganon its over

 

[M@1funk$hun]

yeah peach is hard to combo, which is where Mario excels

 

[-PM-]

still after you begin to combo ganon its over

Still a carefull gannon never gets hit and out ranges the hell out of mario.

 

[Lordydennek]

perhaps. you can trick them up tho. and dont underestimate the ballz

 

[Bamesy]

Ganon is a boring character for everyone in the game. He's just like a Brawl character but at a faster pace and there's combos. Space moves, take long to die, 1 strategy that just works really well. That's why it's so easy to be decently competitive with Ganon. :/ At least it's difficult to actually be good with him where you can threaten to win against actual good players cause he has slowness hurdles. lol

Peach is fun. I played some friendlies with a beastly Peach at a tourney this weekend and when I resorted to platform camping on Battlefield, I had the advantage. Any time I tried other things, he would be able to get that floating fortress/edge craziness that makes Peach own Mario. Just pick her off with everything. You have the speed in mobility that she lacks so using that to your advantage by using the platforms around her slow floating and Mario can do just fine.

I'd say it's even.
Ganon is dull. If I had ANY Ganon exp, I bet I could figure out how to get around his linear wall. Such a boring character. Unless you can be really innovative with him like a warrior or something, he really takes less brains and creativity than anyone else in the game by a long shot. I won't even care what the match up is like until I fight an interesting player with him. lol

 

[Lordydennek]

I hope no ganons see that...

so final on peach is 60 40 or 65 35

and ganon final is 60 40 or 55 45

 

[A2ZOMG]

I'm a Ganon user myself (as mentioned earlier, I use Ganon against other Mario users), and I don't particularly disagree with Bamsey. However I will say Ganon does have a lot of room for creativity, despite for the most part not being too tech skill intensive.

 

[j3ly]

i played qlex in tournament, he used a shed load of no impact lands -> isai drops, ledgehop no impact land -> down B. spammed bair alot, did a load of auto cancels and SH aerial -> DJ. ran off a platform, autocanceled a move onto the floor into no impacts and stuff like that

so beautiful to watch and play against. also alot reverse upB oos

i found spacing a bair against his shield -> waveland behind (uair during slide) -> FH nair/dair poked every single time. same with the other ganons too

 

[Lordydennek]

so 60 40 then? Ganon def has an advantage i just dont know for sure by how much

 

[condemned_soul]

wait mario can only platform cancel his nair right?

 

[Lordydennek]

you can platform cancel any aerial

vote on numbers

 

[-PM-]

60 40 peach.


theres my vote.

 

[StealthyGunnar]

63 - 35 peach. She dmsash all dai

 

[j3ly]

you can platform cancel any aerial

vote on numbers

wrong, you must be thinking of a different technique. mario can only platform cancel nair in the traditional sense... there is some weirdness with bair and uair combined with a dash attack on the teeter of a platform. as long as there is an enemy there, those 2 platform cancel.

but yeah only nair platform cancels really

ill give it 60/40 in peaches favour, cause she edgeguards mario **** well

 

[Lordydennek]

ooo I see what youre saying. like when u jump up to a plat. im talking about using an aerial and sliding off the edge. you can platform cancel any aerial in that game that way with any char.

my vote is 65 35 peach.

vote on ganon too guys.

mine is 60 40 ganon