The Luigi Social Thread

[BSP]

I can't edit my post and I really want to point this out

@luigisama - i wanted to add to your first thing that addressed: look at Boss' sig. He got that epic zero to death, and he still lost the match. Consistency is huge in SSBB, and Luigi can't confirm it.

 

[DBSammy]

Also anyone tried dthrow to pivot grab? It tends to work well for people that spot dodge and then if they dj then just do your regular follow ups.

DThrow -> Pivot Grab is really good IMO.

 

[boss8]

lucario baby.....

"omg im losing,im stronger now!!"

xD but no johns...i shoulda won that match...that kill got me to hyped...and i just went aggro...shoulda just waited it out...and had him come after me..

why dthrow pivot grab when u can dthrow frame trap uair into nair>utilt>etc?

 

[CRODD]

They can't airdodge or dj out of it?

 

[boss8]

idk what dj stands for im assuming double jump....

and they can airdodge,but by the time they airdodge u have the nair waiting for them ready to start the combo...<nair<utilt<etc

and if they attempt to jump they will just get hit by the Uair<nair<utilt<etc

its called a frame trap for a reason...xD

 

[CRODD]

idk what dj stands for im assuming double jump....

and they can airdodge,but by the time they airdodge u have the nair waiting for them ready to start the combo...<nair<utilt<etc

and if they attempt to jump they will just get hit by the Uair<nair<utilt<etc

its called a frame trap for a reason...xD

Yeah it means double jump and this seems legit, and easier to pull off then doing pivot grabs. Do we have any other frame traps other than jab follow ups? Frame wise we have faster moves with more priory in the air then most other characters. Also any tips on diddys? I don't have much experience against them and might go against one on Saturday

.

 

[CRODD]

Luigi sama said exactly what I was thinking lol. We need more good luigi's to start getting top placements in tournaments.

 

[BSP]

Yeah it means double jump and this seems legit, and easier to pull off then doing pivot grabs. Do we have any other frame traps other than jab follow ups? Frame wise we have faster moves with more priory in the air then most other characters. Also any tips on diddys? I don't have much experience against them and might go against one on Saturday

.

Intercept his Up B with your Down B. It will knock him out of it every time.

Boss is right about the Uair out of Dthrow. An immediate Uair will always lead into something, regardless of what they do.

I was in training mode and I did Dthrow -> Usmash on a CPU MK and it registered as a consecutive hit...I don't remember if we can trust Brawl's consecutive hit counter, but I think that means it's a combo.

 

[yoshq]

http://www.twitch.tv/eschamptv/b/323224190

4:39:00

i done goofed! zinoto rocks my socks. fun as hell though hahaha. totally reignited the fire to play this game hard again.

Zinoto is a Luigi rapist. I hate playing against him.

 

[yoshq]

You're accepting defeat.

You went from ****** with to saying losing doesn't matter, and Big Lou doesn't even play the character anymore. Is there even any point in trying anymore?

You only play the character if good people are placing with him? Fanboyyy... just play for how fun he is. You win some, you lose some, the important thing is you get to a point where you know what games you have the ability to win, and you win most of them. And always improve

 

[BSP]

I'm sorry, but the part about "get to a point where you know what games you have the ability to win" is the deal breaker. Why would you willingly keep playing someone knowing that no matter how much time you put in, there are going to be some MUs you just aren't going to win?

Luigi stops being fun when you are consistently kept out, or you literally can't catch a character. Or if you're fighting .

I'm a fanboy for wanting a better shot at winning?

 

[Bazooka Joe]

I'm sorry, but the part about "get to a point where you know what games you have the ability to win" is the deal breaker. Why would you willingly keep playing someone knowing that no matter how much time you put in, there are going to be some MUs you just aren't going to win?

Luigi stops being fun when you are consistently kept out, or you literally can't catch a character. Or if you're fighting .

I'm a fanboy for wanting a better shot at winning?

I wouldn't say any mu is a sure loss, I think it comes down to knowledge on a subconscious level. You read frames, match-ups, etc and try to practice it consciously, then it starts to get wired in your head. Once that happens, it comes more down to the skill of the player and the reads. Then again, there is characters people naturally do better with. I get my s*** wrecked by Falco as Luigi, but I got two kills with my cape as Mario in one match.

 

[me9595]

http://www.twitch.tv/eschamptv/b/323224190

4:39:00

i done goofed! zinoto rocks my socks. fun as hell though hahaha. totally reignited the fire to play this game hard again.

ive only played zinoto once and im from michigan, but ive only been going to tournaments since like January and i played him in my first pools set, i really want to play him at the next tournament since my diddy is one of my best match ups, but i doubt i can do even close to as well as you did

also thanks for splitting my allegiances, i didnt know whether to root for michigan or luigi

 

[Labernash]

Up-b'ing people's rolls is really easy. Just yell "don't roll chump, don't roll!" once you both land on the ground and stalemate, and walk around, suddenly, they stop attacking as hard. Start dashing at them after a while, and they'll try to roll behind you.

PLING!!!!

 

[BSP]

I wouldn't say any mu is a sure loss, I think it comes down to knowledge on a subconscious level. You read frames, match-ups, etc and try to practice it consciously, then it starts to get wired in your head. Once that happens, it comes more down to the skill of the player and the reads. Then again, there is characters people naturally do better with. I get my s*** wrecked by Falco as Luigi, but I got two kills with my cape as Mario in one match.

When is the last time a beat a notable in tournament? The only reason I wouldn't call the MU unwinnable is because in theory none of them are, but seriously, this one is not far from it imo.

@Labernash - my favorite Up Bs are when I'm about a foxtrot away from the opponent and I just stare them down, and then I dash in and connect an Up B lol.

 

[Player-3]

Yoshq dont get me started on diddys that **** luigis thats my territory to complain about!

 

[Luigisama]

Nair also beats or hits mk up b. I like baiting the up b so I can punish it with Nair and get a kill.

I've come close to beating Jtail's mk with Luigi. Ironically for someone like me who lives in mk breeding grounds I barely play against Mks.

Does shugo count as a notable Mk? Mr.Concon beat his mk. But yeah no Luigis have beaten any notable mks as of recently.

I was in training mode and I did Dthrow -> Usmash on a CPU MK and it registered as a consecutive hit...I don't remember if we can trust Brawl's consecutive hit counter, but I think that means it's a combo.

I've been doing this for awhile and I think it might be a true combo, but might be DI dependent. I think I put info on this in the Mu thread(which I still have to condense).

 

[CRODD]

How far do you think we have come since this post was made?

"09-12-2009, 10:59 PM #20
zhao_guang

Pretty sure the Ike Boards are much more prepared for anything than the Luigi boards

-We've never done a full match-up analysis of each character
-We've never even done a half match-up analysis of half the cast.
-The only topic to consistently get a post a day is our General Discussion.
-Each Luigi whines and *****es about their worst match-ups. With that, each Luigi has different worst match-ups then every other Luigi, but we don't even try to help ourselves, except for an occasional tip, and a few exceptions.
-We have two Luigi players who actually win tourneys/do stuff, and one of them doesn't even play the game. (Boss). The other guy is BigLou. The rest of us just take the d*** over and over.
-I'm on the Luigi boards. -4 in preparation.
-Our video topic is dead.
-The few guides that are written all say the same ****.


So don't even worry about not being prepared, you guys are miles ahead of the Luigi boards XD "
-

 

[Luigisama]

How far do you think we have come since this post was made?

"09-12-2009, 10:59 PM #20
zhao_guang

Pretty sure the Ike Boards are much more prepared for anything than the Luigi boards

-We've never done a full match-up analysis of each character
-We've never even done a half match-up analysis of half the cast.
-The only topic to consistently get a post a day is our General Discussion.
-Each Luigi whines and *****es about their worst match-ups. With that, each Luigi has different worst match-ups then every other Luigi, but we don't even try to help ourselves, except for an occasional tip, and a few exceptions.
-We have two Luigi players who actually win tourneys/do stuff, and one of them doesn't even play the game. (Boss). The other guy is BigLou. The rest of us just take the d*** over and over.
-I'm on the Luigi boards. -4 in preparation.
-Our video topic is dead.
-The few guides that are written all say the same ****.


So don't even worry about not being prepared, you guys are miles ahead of the Luigi boards XD "
-

Some luigis are still complaining about mus and Biglou has stopped using Luigi. lol nice post crodd.

 

[TreK]

I don't see how there's nothing to be discussed. I came across four unanswered question just by playing a bit in this weekend's tournament :

1) Let's look at the different places where we can jab somebody and see if it alters the comboes we can land. Example : if we jab somebody who ledgehopped, is dsmash stagespike guaranteed and on which stage ? If we jab somebody on a platform, is platform drop to fair guaranteed ? If we jab somebody on a slope, downwards or upwards, how does it affect our frame advantage ? If we jab somebody on a moving structure, what can and cannot be done ?

2) Let's look at the different moves we do not need a powershield to punish and how should we do it, because a normal shield is much more reliable. Example : turn around shield to usmash oos works against most dash attacks. And how do we punish these supposedly spammable moves like marth's fair and falco's phantom if we need to, in case our opponent thinks he can win just by being lame ?

3) The matchups that make or break luigi : diddy, olimar, ICs, Snake, Falco, Marth, MK, DDD, Lucario, ZSS, Pikachu. We have to study them because most of the stuff we know about them is 'offstage, the edgeguarder wins. Onstage, they win if they camp'. And I'm pretty sure there is something else to it.

4) There are a couple moves I do not see myself using that much : dtilt or dash attack on the ledge, upair's back hitbox, downwards angled ftilt, etc... And the main reason is that I'm not really sure about what can be done with them. In example, I'm fully aware that if I wanna bair somebody below 30%, I have to full hop it or do it while falling because if I short hop it I'm punishable on hit. But down angled ftilt ? I do not know sheet about this move.

 

[BSP]

Ftilt angled down locks characters who fall on the ground like a jab lock, except it does ~10% per hit

 

[boss8]

^ anyone have a vid of that?

 

[BSP]

I can get one, but the quality will be terrible

 

[boss8]

im tryna find the one that was already one youtube =[...cant find it

 

[BSP]

Well I made one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y08qI3KPCrs&feature=youtu.be

Koolaid went Luigi against some MK a few weekends back and actually got him to last stock in this situation, but didn't do the lock. I was so mad because it would have looked sexy as hell.

My shoryuken did 27%....wow.

 

[Ruinn]

Luigisama, thought you went to impulse man.

 

[TreK]

Well I made one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y08qI3KPCrs&feature=youtu.be

Koolaid went Luigi against some MK a few weekends back and actually got him to last stock in this situation, but didn't do the lock. I was so mad because it would have looked sexy as hell.

My shoryuken did 27%....wow.

Oh god, that's sexy.
I know we can also lock somebody 1 time with a fireball, too. Can we use both locks in a row ? Like tilts until he's out of range, then a fireball, or a fireball that allows us to lead into a couple tilts ?

 

[CRODD]

Well I made one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y08qI3KPCrs&feature=youtu.be

Koolaid went Luigi against some MK a few weekends back and actually got him to last stock in this situation, but didn't do the lock. I was so mad because it would have looked sexy as hell.

My shoryuken did 27%....wow.

Hell yeah, we need more stuff like this

 

[yoshq]

I'm sorry, but the part about "get to a point where you know what games you have the ability to win" is the deal breaker. Why would you willingly keep playing someone knowing that no matter how much time you put in, there are going to be some MUs you just aren't going to win?

Luigi stops being fun when you are consistently kept out, or you literally can't catch a character. Or if you're fighting .

I'm a fanboy for wanting a better shot at winning?

Pick up a different character for those matchups. It's a simple fact that a character's potential simply isn't limitless. You need to make up for their shortcomings with something.

 

[Labernash]

Pick up Kirby for bad MU's.

 

[DBSammy]

Pick up MK for bad MU's.

FTFY.

 

[Coolwhip]

Ftilt lock? lol, that's pretty dope!
What if you can mix it up with a fireball lock afterwards, then a running blind up-b. XD

 

[Luigisama]

I don't see how there's nothing to be discussed. I came across four unanswered question just by playing a bit in this weekend's tournament :

1) Let's look at the different places where we can jab somebody and see if it alters the comboes we can land. Example : if we jab somebody who ledgehopped, is dsmash stagespike guaranteed and on which stage ? If we jab somebody on a platform, is platform drop to fair guaranteed ? If we jab somebody on a slope, downwards or upwards, how does it affect our frame advantage ? If we jab somebody on a moving structure, what can and cannot be done ?

2) Let's look at the different moves we do not need a powershield to punish and how should we do it, because a normal shield is much more reliable. Example : turn around shield to usmash oos works against most dash attacks. And how do we punish these supposedly spammable moves like marth's fair and falco's phantom if we need to, in case our opponent thinks he can win just by being lame ?

3) The matchups that make or break luigi : diddy, olimar, ICs, Snake, Falco, Marth, MK, DDD, Lucario, ZSS, Pikachu. We have to study them because most of the stuff we know about them is 'offstage, the edgeguarder wins. Onstage, they win if they camp'. And I'm pretty sure there is something else to it.

4) There are a couple moves I do not see myself using that much : dtilt or dash attack on the ledge, upair's back hitbox, downwards angled ftilt, etc... And the main reason is that I'm not really sure about what can be done with them. In example, I'm fully aware that if I wanna bair somebody below 30%, I have to full hop it or do it while falling because if I short hop it I'm punishable on hit. But down angled ftilt ? I do not know sheet about this move.

These are very good questions that you brought up and most of what you said is true.
Jab cancel is funny on the ledge because you're opponent is trapped until they jump or sdi.

As for jab on the slopes it is very situational IE castle siege first transformation. I think it makes it easier to do some moves. I can elaborate more on this, but once again remember it's situational and little weird on how jab works on some surfaces. Jab to fsmash lol it's possible.

Luigisama, thought you went to impulse man.

Something came up sorry dude. Besides you the great Zhao and Yoshq who are Ten times better than me were at impulse, but less Luigi techy. lol jk I'm still free with these techs.


as for the locks that are being talked about. I think fireball lock is the best option and if you luigis will be using this in your moveset you will loves stages like PS1 and BF. Also remember who is heavy and who isn't, but just in case you have the opponents who flop instead of teching or jumping to avoid locks be ready to punish them for it with a lock.

An Example that I managed to get, but didn't finish. I've been trying to get these, but I keep missing the chances that I can fireball lock because I don't expect my opponent to edge slip. There are two matches where I almost got fireball locks(mk), but shot the fireball at the wrong time and they might have helped me win the game.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3HtHfBdRn4

 

[Napos]

I enjoy diddy vs MK

 

[CRODD]

Luigisama, is it only 5 fireballs you can do once they edge slip or does it change for each character?

 

[TreK]

Well that's a bit of maths here, but you have to remember that the fireball has to travel all the way to that fatty Dedede before hitting him and that takes some time. He's pushed away with every fireball (and I'm pretty sure he can SDI too), so each fireball will take longer to travel than the previous one, until a cap where the fireball will go through the victim's invincibility frames and the lock will end.

Basically, the farther you are from the locked guy at the beginning of the lock, the less fireballs you can fire. The difficulty : judging it because if you fire one after that cap, you won't be able to upB on his getup.

 

[Luigisama]

I enjoy diddy vs MK

me to I'm not sure why. It's just cool to watch.

Luigisama, is it only 5 fireballs you can do once they edge slip or does it change for each character?

It depends on the character and SDI is involved, but I don't it help much if at the end of the lock the opponent is forced to get up. I think for mk it stops around 60% and snake is around 75%- 80%.

 

[BSP]

Pick up a different character for those matchups. It's a simple fact that a character's potential simply isn't limitless. You need to make up for their shortcomings with something.

Ok, I'll do that.

4) There are a couple moves I do not see myself using that much : dtilt or dash attack on the ledge, upair's back hitbox, downwards angled ftilt, etc... And the main reason is that I'm not really sure about what can be done with them. In example, I'm fully aware that if I wanna bair somebody below 30%, I have to full hop it or do it while falling because if I short hop it I'm punishable on hit. But down angled ftilt ? I do not know sheet about this move.

I didn't say anything about the other moves. My bad.

I think you're better off Dsmashing if you get a chance to Dtilt on the ledge. Since the spiking hitbox for Dtilt is inside Luigi's leg for the most part, I don't think you'll really be able to spike someone hanging on the ledge with Dtilt. Dash attack? Again, I'd just go for a Dsmash.

Up Air's weak hitbox is excellent for chaining into Bair at pretty much any percent. IIRC it actually has 0/0 for its knockback stats...for some reason. When you're chasing in the air, save your DJ so that if you hit with a weak Uair, you can string a Bair with it. Outside of this, I don't think you can do much with it.

I covered Downward angled Ftilt. It's Luigi's best jab-locking move.

 

[BSP]

Edit: woops, forgot I was last <_>

 

[Player-3]

guys why is it that when i play vs mk i do better with luigi than any of my characters

it just seems easier for me