The Fairy with Fighting Spirit: Lip for Smash! *Play Panel de Pon on NSO!*

[NukeA6]

i'm just going to be honest with you guys.

if steve from minecraft is a playable character in super smash bros ultimate as the rumors say

and panel de pon gets the status quo

i'm not buying this game

end of story

edit: in fact with my current frame of mind i may never buy a smash bros game again until lip is made playable

there are no words at the disappointment and disgust i feel that this could be a thing

Don't worry, Arle Nadja will come and save the day if Lip fails. Still, you shouldn't worry so much about an assist trophy.

 

[ChronoBound]

i'm just going to be honest with you guys.

if steve from minecraft is a playable character in super smash bros ultimate as the rumors say

and panel de pon gets the status quo

i'm not buying this game

end of story

edit: in fact with my current frame of mind i may never buy a smash bros game again until lip is made playable

there are no words at the disappointment and disgust i feel that this could be a thing

Do not worry. We are must likely not getting Steve (but I am confident we are getting Minecraft content in some capacity whether in the base game or as DLC).

Spoiler

Because our remaining fighters are most likely just Incineroar and Ken.

 

[NukeA6]

Spoiler

Because our remaining fighters are most likely just Incineroar and Ken.

Because Vergeben said so? LOL He's not even sure with 90% of his own claims and even he's fallen for the box leak.

 

[N. Onymous]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Kappa/comm...ts_new_game_by_snk_just_announced_in/e5qpg45/

https://www.reddit.com/r/Kappa/comm...ts_new_game_by_snk_just_announced_in/e6angi6/

vergeben says steve could be a thing

 

[zferolie]

Again, do you have any proof that he has legit sources?
If not, it's just conjecture.

i'm just going to be honest with you guys.

if steve from minecraft is a playable character in super smash bros ultimate as the rumors say

and panel de pon gets the status quo

i'm not buying this game

end of story

edit: in fact with my current frame of mind i may never buy a smash bros game again until lip is made playable

there are no words at the disappointment and disgust i feel that this could be a thing

That seems like a bit of an overkill, but yeah i hope steve is not playable. Its hinestly the only terrible choice i can think of them adding. All he does is walk, punch, dig, build, and pick ax. And he would just look so off... i know minecraft is one of the biggest things out there, and the casuals would probably love it, but... it seems like a bad choice.

 

[N. Onymous]

it's the implied insult to panel de pon that minecraft is so much more relevant to nintendo's history than it that steve should be made playable that really, truly stings

i would like to see someone give a legitimate reason as to why steve should be in smash bros over lip, or isaac, or hell, even banjo

a reason that involves actual relevance to nintendo and is not something like "well minecraft sells very well on nintendo platforms" or "b-b-but creeper 3ds"

 

[ChronoBound]

Because Vergeben said so? LOL He's not even sure with 90% of his own claims and even he's fallen for the box leak.

Vergeben is among the few that has been right about Ultimate so far. The only thing he has said relating to those two is that they are the only two that all of his sources are saying are in. Keep in mind he has one "very trusted source" that says that there will be a second Square-Enix character.

There is also the matter of what Sakurai himself has said, where he has already given us two warning that Ultimate is not going to have many newcomers (and less newcomers than Smash 4 and Brawl). He said after Dark Samus and Chrom were unveiled that there were only a few more fighters left to unveil, and this was before K. Rool and Isabelle were confirmed. Only two more fighters is a lot more likely than you think whether you want to accept that or not.

 

[NukeA6]

Vergeben is among the few that has been right about Ultimate so far. The only thing he has said relating to those two is that they are the only two that all of his sources are saying are in. Keep in mind he has one "very trusted source" that says that there will be a second Square-Enix character.

There is also the matter of what Sakurai himself has said, where he has already given us two warning that Ultimate is not going to have many newcomers (and less newcomers than Smash 4 and Brawl). He said after Dark Samus and Chrom were unveiled that there were only a few more fighters left to unveil, and this was before K. Rool and Isabelle were confirmed. Only two more fighters is a lot more likely than you think whether you want to accept that or not.

The stuff he got right were the easy stuff and this does not excuse him for getting tons of things wrong like there being no more DK characters and Zero being playable.

Meanwhile, the Gardevoir and NEOGaf leakers got Dark Samus, Richter Belmont, and Chrom (as a Roy echo) correctly so as far as I'm concerned, they're both more legit than Vergeben.

 

[GoodGrief741]

i'm just going to be honest with you guys.

if steve from minecraft is a playable character in super smash bros ultimate as the rumors say

and panel de pon gets the status quo

i'm not buying this game

end of story

edit: in fact with my current frame of mind i may never buy a smash bros game again until lip is made playable

there are no words at the disappointment and disgust i feel that this could be a thing

Preach. Won’t happen tho.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Don't let pessimism get to you Onymous. :<

 

[ChronoBound]

The stuff he got right were the easy stuff and this does not excuse him for getting tons of things wrong like there being no DK characters and Zero being playable.

Meanwhile, the Gardevoir and NEOGaf leakers got Dark Samus, Richter Belmont, and Chrom (as a Roy echo) correctly so as far I'm concerned and have been more right so as far as I'm concerned, they're both more legit than Vergeben.

Easy stuff? I was at the forefront on the Ridley fanbase, and when Sakurai said, "Ridley is too big. We cannot resize him without making the character losing his identity," it made me realize Ridley would probably never happen in a Smash Bros. game (or at least as long as Sakurai was at the helm). Most speculators believed the same. Hardly anyone talked about playable Castlevania representation in Smash Bros. (these same people believed Rayman, Shovel Knight, and Shantae were all more likely to happen than someone from Castlevania). Most of the community also slept on the likes of Isabelle.

Also, Vergeben never said there would not be a DK newcomer. What happened was that Vergeben (in a personal message to that loz) said someone told him that someone sent a message to him saying there would be no DK newcomer, and Vergeben told loz that it did not sound right and did not believe it. Loz, being very immature (which became more prominent in his behavior throughout August and September), leaked this message. Vergeben also did not say anything about Zero being playable either.

A lot of stuff that gets attributed to Vergeben is not Vergeben (4chan loves to make fake leaks). I always check his post history on GameFAQs to see what he has actually stated.

 

[N. Onymous]

Don't let pessimism get to you Onymous. :<

well its better to be pessimistic most of the time

if you're right you're right

if you're wrong you're pleasantly surprised

verge has been right so far, who's to say he's not right here too?

honestly it's isaac's fans i feel the most sorry for

they're a huge group, so much bigger than ours, and they're getting btfo in favor of this block rubbish too

makes me sad how far this series has fallen

now japan-only or dead franchises aren't worth putting in the game because "no one will recognize them "

amiibo were the worst thing to happen to this series honestly
now you can't be playable unless you're a huge name that can sell collectible figures

i honestly think sakurai needs to step down and let someone else run this show

 

[ChronoBound]

well its better to be pessimistic most of the time

if you're right you're right

if you're wrong you're pleasantly surprised

verge has been right so far, who's to say he's not right here too?

honestly it's isaac's fans i feel the most sorry for

they're a huge group, so much bigger than ours, and they're getting btfo in favor of this block rubbish too

makes me sad how far this series has fallen

now japan-only or dead franchises aren't worth putting in the game because "no one will recognize them "

amiibo were the worst thing to happen to this series honestly
now you can't be playable unless you're a huge name that can sell collectible figures

i honestly think sakurai needs to step down and let someone else run this show

The story of Ultimate for many newcomers is them being added in despite the tremendous odds against them. Of the newcomers that Ultimate has added in, only Inkling and K. Rool were characters that were prevalent on most rosters before the announcement of Ultimate (March 2018).

For Ridley:
- Ridley had been turned down three times already (he had been a popularly requested character since pre-Melee)
- Sakurai himself said re-sizing Ridley would go against the foundation to the character. That is one of the hardest deconfirmations ever.

For Roy:
- Fire Emblem already had four playable characters.
- One of them was a Marth clone (Lucina)
- Lots of popular Brawl veterans were cut (Ice Climbers, Wolf, Snake, Lucas) which made many see Roy as a low priority veteran to return since he was from Fire Emblem and a clone.

K. Rool recently overcame great hurdles:
- Had not been in a game in his own series in 11 years (2007), had not made an appearance in a game outside Smash Bros. in 10 years (2008).
- Missed the two biggest DK titles released since DK64, Returns and Tropical Freeze.
- Sakurai has said he tends to picks characters and franchises with a future when deciding the roster (exceptions typically being game's retro pick)

Chrom too had a lot of things going against him:
- From a franchise that already had SIX playable characters, with only Mario and Pokemon having more playable characters.
- Fire Emblem being among the few franchises where people groan about the possibility of newcomers.
- Awakening being over 6.5 years old, in a series that tends to favor the most recent installments and "faces" to the franchise (Fates, Shadows of Valentia, and Three Houses all came after Awakening).
- Awakening already being represented by Robin and Lucina.
- Chrom being heavily treated as a joke in Smash 4 (see Robin's unveil trailer, and Palutena's guidance for Robin).
- There already being three blue-haired swordsmen in the game.

Even Dark Samus was another character that overcame tremendous odds:
- From a series where people had to beg for 17 years its most popular character next to Samus to be included.
- Made her last appearance in her own series 11 years ago (Metroid Prime 3 in 2007).
- Likely has no future in her own series.
- Most fan requests for a Metroid newcomer went to Ridley (but Sakurai did say she was popularly requested so who knows)
- Barely any Metroid Prime series content in the Smash 4 (the only content it received in Smash 4 was an Assist Trophy of Dark Samus, a trophy of said Assist Trophy, and four track rips, three of which were already in Brawl).
- Only one other Assist Trophy was ever promoted to playable status, and that was Little Mac and Isabelle. An icon from one of Nintendo's oldest series, and the other the present face of one of Nintendo's most popular franchises.
- Metroid, a smaller core Nintendo franchise, had already received a newcomer, and already had three FULLY unique playable characters (which puts it on par with the likes of Kirby, DK, ZELDA).

Ultimate's story has mostly been character inclusion miracles.

 

[GoodGrief741]

well its better to be pessimistic most of the time

if you're right you're right

if you're wrong you're pleasantly surprised

verge has been right so far, who's to say he's not right here too?

honestly it's isaac's fans i feel the most sorry for

they're a huge group, so much bigger than ours, and they're getting btfo in favor of this block rubbish too

makes me sad how far this series has fallen

now japan-only or dead franchises aren't worth putting in the game because "no one will recognize them "

amiibo were the worst thing to happen to this series honestly
now you can't be playable unless you're a huge name that can sell collectible figures

i honestly think sakurai needs to step down and let someone else run this show

Steve won’t get into Smash Ultimate. A game defined by having characters the fanbase has been demanding won’t have the most controversial pick ever. Sakurai has to know that, beyond Banjo being highly demanded and even Master Chief being a better choice, even if Steve didn’t have any competition he would still be heavily disliked.

Steve is the kind of choice that could make sense in Smash 4, where the only thing that mattered is if you were relevant. In Smash Ultimate there’s no room for that sort of boldness.

(Not that I think Steve will ever make it in Smash, they know the sort of backlash they would get and Corrin does not even come close)

 

[N. Onymous]

If Steve is a playable character, then in my eyes that just proves that Sakurai shouldn't be working on the series anymore. He's given a lot of fans exactly what they wanted, but now he'd rather not turn to Nintendo's more obscure properties because of this stupid, idiotic, moronic "no Japan-only/dead franchises" rule that exists purely for the sake of pushing amiibo, so instead he's scraping the bottom of the barrel by putting Steve in the game over any number of more deserving Nintendo characters. And by the time Super Smash Bros. 5 comes out, Nintendo will have put out like fifty new IPs, all of which will be competing with Lip for a slot.

 

[MasterRosie]

Well, I guess having in Smash broke down more floodgates than we would have hoped.
Assuming Steve will be in smash, which I HIGHLY doubt.
There’s no way Sakurai would ignore PdP when it’s been referenced since Melee, and have Steve instantly playable. No way.
Vergeben is speaking nonsense. None of you should believe a word of this.

 

[Jyl]

Here's a topic for every supporter currently here: What got you into supporting Lip in the first place? Was it the potential she had as a fighter? Did you love Panel de Pon and supported Lip from there? Do you love retro choices in general? What is the source of your motivation to see the flower fairy in Smash?

It was during pre Brawl speculation period. I was aware of her series and loved the game. But at that time it was a mere interest; like "it'd be neat if she was playable." Then when I played the game and heard Lip's theme remixed, that was when I gained major interest in PdP and Lip and absolutely believed she should have been in. During that time I played PdP a lot while researching her series. I guess I also felt somewhat bad for her series localization, how she keeps getting shafted in the West (Tetris Attack, planet puzzle league...) and believed it's time Lip gets some Western exposure and wished she was playable in Smash 4.

 

[Flyboy]

Here's a topic for every supporter currently here: What got you into supporting Lip in the first place? Was it the potential she had as a fighter? Did you love Panel de Pon and supported Lip from there? Do you love retro choices in general? What is the source of your motivation to see the flower fairy in Smash?

Well, when I was a kid I was massively into Mario. Still am. I first heard about PdP because TMK did this huge comparison article on Tetris Attack vs. PdP and I loved stuff like that. Fast-forward to now and Lip's been referenced countless times in Smash and I just think that's neat. Earlier this year I realized I majorly supported Arle, and then by reading the Arle thread I realized that you just couldn't have Arle without Nintendo's own Lip. So now I support them both! Really I just think her moveset could be really neat, and I like fairies and magical girls.

 

[MasterRosie]

Although....oh god....just had a sudden vision of Steve holding a Lip’s Stick and grinning.
Grinning very widely...ugh, please, NO.

 

[Jyl]

i'm just going to be honest with you guys.

Well I missed something now did I.
In my opinion after Cloud I'm not too surprised. At this point they are simply adding whoever is massively popular, relevancy to Nintendo being damned. I still believe Cloud and Bayonetta absolutely do not belong in a game celebrating Nintendo's history (but that's a topic for another time).
Seeing another non Nintendo character in favor of Lip, or hell any other forgotten Retro Nintendo character would be a huge blow.
I still won't give up. I'm damn late to the community but even after the final game is released and Lip isn't in it, I'll just keep pushing for her for DLC, Smash 6, etc. I really regret not doing anything for her during Smash 4 time.
Also I simply hate vergenben. He really sounds like he is attention whoring at this point.

 

[Jurae818]

N N. Onymous
Take a breath. Now, in defense of Steve, there hasn't been a game like Minecraft at the time and now. Having played it and being THE only thing I play consistently, it deserves all the attention it gets, seedy underbelly and underage conclave aside. I do have K. Rool and there are many others that I want, but I do not trust these leakers with a five foot pole. Until Sakurai or Nintendo show something officially, you can push it aside and try not to get too invested in it. I was like you with K. Rool, they weren't' getting a single red cent from me unless he was in the base game. Even DLC wouldn't have cut it. I don't wanna think of the grim possibility that the hype and fanservice started and ended with Ridley and K. Rool respectively and there are plenty of others who I'm rooting for (Isaac, Dixie, Lip, Skull Kid, etc.) that I'd love to see get in. I know Sakurai said not to expect too many newcomers, but I'd like to think there's SOME more to come and not just two more reps or two more newcomers and X amount of echoes. I'll be just as angry as you are if that's all we're getting. Absolutely.

In any case, hang in there. The fight ain't over 'til it's over.

 

[Jyl]

I never played Minecraft but looking into it, it's much MUCH more popular than I thought. Especially among the casual crowd.
Casuals would love it if its represented in Smash, I mean they are the loudest part of this fanbase, sadly.

 

[N. Onymous]

I hope it's all just lucky guessers talking out of their bottoms. I want to like this game, I really do, but Steve would absolutely kill all of the goodwill that Sora's built up with Ridley and K. Rool. Stone dead.

...If I as a Lip fan am taking it this hard, just imagine how Banjo's supporters must feel.

I never played Minecraft but looking into it, it's much MUCH more popular than I thought. Especially among the casual crowd.
Casuals would love it if its represented in Smash, I mean they are the loudest part of this fanbase, sadly.

The problem here is that casual gamers and Smash fans, even casual Smash fans, are two completely different groups. Even the most casual of Smash fans still are usually part of the gaming community and play or have played a few other games. The kind of people who play Minecraft only play Minecraft. You know what I'm saying?

 

[Jyl]

I hope it's all just lucky guessers talking out of their bottoms. I want to like this game, I really do, but Steve would absolutely kill all of the goodwill that Sora's built up with Ridley and K. Rool. Stone dead.

...If I as a Lip fan am taking it this hard, just imagine how Banjo's supporters must feel.

Well don't give up man. If anything, this will just make Lip fans stronger. All these support she's getting has to reach Sakurai at some point and will amount to SOMETHING.
Also the thread reached 2000+ posts congrats

 

[pholtos]

I have a more substantial complaint about Steve, beyond the fact that there are so many better choices from series' that should really be added to give their series some limelight.

My essential deciding factor about any newcomer is "what do they bring to the table that isn't essentially already in the game via another character? This is where Lip, Isaac, Geno, Banjo shine and characters like Steve fail.

The only thing Steve can do that would be unique would be to make walls out of blocks, which uhh... yeah no.

 

[Jurae818]

When it comes to Minecraft, Steve is just a very minor aspect of it. You'd be better off repping it with a stage or an assist. The Creeper is the real mascot, An MC stage is ideal for the series. Steve would be an odd choice, but I'd understand why he was added. On the other hand, like you said; pandering to the casuals is a brilliant idea, we all know that worked wonders for the Wii U.

On the note of the actual topic at hand, something told me that Windy would make for a good echo for Lip instead of Furil. Dunno why, but it just popped up in my head.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

If Steve is a playable character, then in my eyes that just proves that Sakurai shouldn't be working on the series anymore. He's given a lot of fans exactly what they wanted, but now he'd rather not turn to Nintendo's more obscure properties because of this stupid, idiotic, moronic "no Japan-only/dead franchises" rule that exists purely for the sake of pushing amiibo, so instead he's scraping the bottom of the barrel by putting Steve in the game over any number of more deserving Nintendo characters. And by the time Super Smash Bros. 5 comes out, Nintendo will have put out like fifty new IPs, all of which will be competing with Lip for a slot.

Would you say that Lip would be an obscure inclusion in Ultimate? So far we have had no Retro or Obscure (WTF) character picks. There is a lot less room for more Obscure characters to get in as we already have these three:

As time goes on so does what is considered Retro. The Super Nintendo is now seen by many as a Retro console and not many SNES characters fit that Retro bill like Lip does.

 

[MasterRosie]

i just find it ironic how people will call a leak like this fake, but apparently, all it takes is Vergeben’s seal of approval for it to be real.
Yes, he’s gotten things right before, but I’m honestly quite tired of people treating every word from his leaks as gospel.
(Also, we are getting SO many conflicting leaks right now, as far as I’m concerned, NONE of them are real.)

 

[N. Onymous]

Would you say that Lip would be an obscure inclusion in Ultimate? So far we have had no Retro or Obscure (WTF) character picks. There is a lot less room for more Obscure characters to get in as we already have these three:

As time goes on so does what is considered Retro. The Super Nintendo is now seen by many as a Retro console and not many SNES characters fit that Retro bill like Lip does.

Lip would absolutely be a fitting "obscure" character choice for Ultimate. Go out and ask anyone on the street if they've heard of Lip from Panel de Pon.

 

[N. Onymous]

Well don't give up man. If anything, this will just make Lip fans stronger. All these support she's getting has to reach Sakurai at some point and will amount to SOMETHING.
Also the thread reached 2000+ posts congrats

I'm never going to give up. I have a gut feeling this game will have DLC, and when (if) that's announced, we'll double down on our efforts and make absolutely sure she makes it in.

 

[MasterRosie]

It would honestly be hilarious if next direct Incineroar pops out of an assist Pokeball.
Vergeben’s credibility would instantly go down the gutter.

 

[Luigifan18]

So... how about that trailer concept I put up?

Something to keep this thread from becoming a salt mine to rival Hallstatt?

 

[Jyl]

I'm never going to give up. I have a gut feeling this game will have DLC, and when (if) that's announced, we'll double down on our efforts and make absolutely sure she makes it in.

That's the spirit. Let me help too.

It would honestly be hilarious if next direct Incineroar pops out of an assist Pokeball.
Vergeben’s credibility would instantly go down the gutter.

I actually thought about this and I really hope it happens in the next direct.
While he was right I don't like how people are treating him as god. I even saw someone who claims to be a huge fan of Vergenbin and said we should praise him... this internet sometimes...we live in a timeline where anonymous people who leaks video games can become celebrities

 

[GoodGrief741]

If Steve is a playable character, then in my eyes that just proves that Sakurai shouldn't be working on the series anymore. He's given a lot of fans exactly what they wanted, but now he'd rather not turn to Nintendo's more obscure properties because of this stupid, idiotic, moronic "no Japan-only/dead franchises" rule that exists purely for the sake of pushing amiibo, so instead he's scraping the bottom of the barrel by putting Steve in the game over any number of more deserving Nintendo characters. And by the time Super Smash Bros. 5 comes out, Nintendo will have put out like fifty new IPs, all of which will be competing with Lip for a slot.

I don’t think, in the hypothetical scenario that Steve gets in, that it would be Sakurai’s doing. That’s more of an executive decision, that would stem from the higher ups at Nintendo (imo).

 

[N. Onymous]

I don’t think, in the hypothetical scenario that Steve gets in, that it would be Sakurai’s doing. That’s more of an executive decision, that would stem from the higher ups at Nintendo (imo).

He has written reviews of Minecraft before that are nothing short of glowing.

 

[GoodGrief741]

He has written reviews of Minecraft before that are nothing short of glowing.

Sure, but he’s also savvy enough not to include such a controversial character unless Nintendo tells him to.

 

[MasterRosie]

The only thing good about Steve from Minecraft being in smash, imo, would be Etika’s reaction. The only thing.

 

[N. Onymous]

Sure, but he’s also savvy enough not to include such a controversial character unless Nintendo tells him to.

Playing devil's advocate, it's entirely possible he doesn't know just how controversial an addition Steve would be. If this leaker is telling the truth, then Isaac will not be playable despite how huge and devoted his support group is. Never discount the fact that he's out of touch with anyone who doesn't have Ridley, K. Rool, or yes, even Waluigi-sized fanbases.

 

[KingofUSA85]

i just find it ironic how people will call a leak like this fake, but apparently, all it takes is Vergeben’s seal of approval for it to be real.
Yes, he’s gotten things right before, but I’m honestly quite tired of people treating every word from his leaks as gospel.
(Also, we are getting SO many conflicting leaks right now, as far as I’m concerned, NONE of them are real.)

Well, Love him or hate him, technically he hasn't been wrong about smash ultimate yet.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Well, Love him or hate him, technically he hasn't been wrong about smash ultimate yet.

Yeah. Best we can hope for is a Fighter Z situation.

It would honestly be hilarious if next direct Incineroar pops out of an assist Pokeball.
Vergeben’s credibility would instantly go down the gutter.

I'd pay good money to see that, even if the trailer is free. I'd immediately demote Incineroar to "maybe in a sequel" at that point.