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Mario is still more viable than his Brawl counterpart though. That increased air mobility really helps.I honestly don't think Mario is as good as some people say he is. I personally thinkand maybe
WHY do people keep saying this? It's like its a new trend or something. It just popped up in the last month and it's really annoying.I honestly don't think Mario is as good as some people say he is. I personally think
That and generally having faster moves. Mario was one of the worst characters in Brawl, so yeah.
Of course he is. He is miles better than his Brawl counterpart but I personally think people overrate him sometimes. Well, not anymore though, I've seen people place Mario much lower now so I guess people are catching on. Ally and Mew2King were saying how even Villager is better which I don't really disagree with really.
Mario is still top 15 at worst. He'll fall, but not as hard in Melee where he went from top tier to low-mid. He practically has the tools to take on every character in the game, even if his top tier MUs are more iffy.
Yeah I agree, he is Top 15. Still has the power to take on most of the top tiers but can still easily lose to them.
, he's okay., he's okay., he's okay., arguably, he's just OK.is still an iffy matchup. is another iffy one and one you'll run into far more often: Mario can neutralize Cloud's very easily with Cape, Limit version or not, and he can combo Cloud very easily, as Down Throw>Up Tilt is an option that works from the get go and he can get 2-4 Up tilts very easily, and then you have all of the usual followups after the Up Tilts after Down Throw. But then, there's the fact that Cloud outranges Mario with absolutely every single move in his arsenal, making approaches difficult, and Cloud can force approaches with Limit. Cloud also has no difficulty killing very early, and Rage Stage 2 Cloud kills Mario easily in 40% at worst with Finishing Touch. He can also do Combos on Mario very easily, and even though everybody gimps Cloud easily, he also gimps everybody pretty easily as well, and Mario suffers a lot from that consdiering his recovery actually doesn't go as far as you convince yourself it does, and since Cape isn't a recovery option anymore and FLUDD is unreliable as a recovery, Mario's SOL to mix up his recovery if he's low.
: Is an explanation needed?: Up air into boost kick can kill early: Janky Luma kills which can end your stock early as well as a great neutral game.: Banana shenanigans will end your stock with 2nd best neutral game if not the best: Speed can be overwhelming with good neutral: Can kill you extremely early with true shoryuken kill confirms and trades hits with many moves: Up air into shuttle loop can kill early: Has kill confirms and really fast: Quick attack is a get out of jail free card to reset to neutral and a great combo starter and really fast with amazing frame data on tilts and smashes.: Can edgeguard extremely well with his ability to fight offstage with no fear due to his recovery and can kill you really early with Bowling Ball as well as being the best zoner in the game.
It's not like it is the end of the world for Mario. I don't know if he's going to completely drop him or try to get a new main entirely and work Mario as a secondary, but that doesn't mean Mario sucks, all of sudden.
Exactly, I don't remember seeing anybody say Mario wasn't top 10 until the Ally situation(like how noone thought Pit and Villager were A/A+/A-/S Tier until Genesis 3, no longer ignoring Japan)
You could probably say the same thing with Rosalina as well. Despite of her high tier spot, she doesn't completely dominate against all the lower tier characters, as we have fighters like Link, Shulk, Little Mac, and Zelda, who do give her some trouble. This is especially true against Little Mac, whose ground game can really murder Rosalina if she's not careful.I think Mario's lack of specialty really hurts him, sometimes.
He's not good against
He's not good against
He's not good against
IMO he isn't even that good against
Mario is that, okay against everything but not exactly good against anyone. Funny how he has no good matchups, but arguably a few bad ones. Even after the ridiculous undeserved nerfs,
That's just an opinion of a long-time Mario main, though. This is how I feel but it's not like this is the end all-be all opinion on Mario.
+1+1 -1 -1 +1
We aren't voting right now. We are voting in Febuary
The last tier list was the second one.
Xandercosm
said on the matter.
Oh okay, thanks ....joined just a few days ago and still getting used to posting. Can the pre edited version of my post be deleted? Its happened like twice now when I go edit a post. (I use mobile if that makes a difference)
Woo!I'm backing Mario in top ten. This is one of the few instances in which I can say I agree with everything
We voted for them like asap. It won't matter in the end like if we overrated Bayo at the start, she will drop later on in the voting. Plus, I feel like we have enough cloud stuff at this point for a tier placement.
Seeing as I main Marth, I thought I would add input. I agree, in fact I would still go as far to say that it is still slightly in Marth's favour (albeit only the slightest). Compared to Brawl where Marth slaughtered him, Mario can handle him on stage a lot better now. Mario has a lot better options on stage, and Marth's great options, such as Forward Air and Forward Throw aren't as abusable anymore (Forward Air still works, but not in every instance like before). Marth actually has a couple of better options than in Brawl. His Up Tilt is a better option than in Brawl thanks to it's reliable upwards launch angle and it increased range, and gives Mario a lot of trouble up close, as Marth can punish and trap landings very well. Speaking of which, Marth's aerials still outrange all of Mario's in the air, so Marth still has better options in air to air combat. And this brings me to the meat and potatoes; Marth still destroys Mario off stage. He still has every option to best Mario off stage. His Forward Air and Back Air are too big for Mario to deal with off stage, Nair is even bigger and has a longer lasting hitbox, and can catch his air dodge when used correctly. If Mario has had to use his jump before recovering, Down Tilt on stage can seal the stock right then if it hits when tippered (on a side note, I pulled this on a Mario the other day - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0i1bYkiyUwg. A tipper Down Tilt would have also worked fine in that situation, and would have been easier to land, but hey, who goes for the reliable stuff?)I think Mario's lack of specialty really hurts him, sometimes.
Even after the ridiculous undeserved nerfs,
Actually I end up doing this way too often by accident when I use Lucina, so I guess it's not that bad of an option?
Yes, Lucina can do this too, but the fact that she can't tip the Down Tilt makes that option less effective (or that, it will seal the stock later than Marth would), so her Forward Smash works a a great substitute (again, no tipper means no insanely early kill, but it works great nonetheless). The fact that they can hit ledge hanging opponents with Forward Smash is a great positive. If that was removed, that could have been a game changer. I've finished opponents off who are hanging on the ledge waiting for me to stop swinging my sword about, and then tipper Forward Smash'd them while hanging when their invincibility is gone.
I forgot about that set. Just another example of Mario's power.
Zero might have been able to survive that if he didn't DI into the top platform. Just saying.
Diddy Kong is way higher than that.S:
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Since people were posting their tier lists earlier, time to spruce things up. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)