Work In Progress SWF Community Voted Tier List - 3.0 COMPLETE

[Rhinomaster22]

S tier:
A + tier:
A tier:
A - tier:
B tier: ()
C + tier:
C tier:
C - tier:
D tier:
E tier:
F tier:
G tier:

 

[Kaiduru Zeta]

Here's mine. Sorry for the bunch of tiers lol
S:
A+:
A:
A-:
B+:()
B:
B-:
C+:
C:
C-:
D+:
D:
D-:
E+:
E:

 

[Kirby Dragons]

1:
2:
3:
4:
5: ()
6:
7:
8:
9:
10:

 

[jespoke]

The most popular characters to start a new tier with (excluding Diddy) are currently: , , , , ,

I'm bored.

 

[Airpoizon]

Restarting

 

[Phuckyew]

S:
A+
A:
B+
B: ( )
C+:
C:
D+:
D:
E+:
E:

THE ORDER OF THE CHARACTERS CAN NOT BE CHANGED.

From the OP.

 

[Airpoizon]

From the OP.

Oh, well, what should I change?

 

[Bowserboy3]

Oh, well, what should I change?

Click "Edit" on your post, and start from scratch. That would be a good start.

Use this: ()

And go along and split characters into tiers. For example, I might thing that there is a tier gap between Mario and Sonic, so I would press Enter on my keyboard to make a tier gap. Then, I might think the next gap should be between Bayonetta and Mewtwo, so another Enter there etc. Only make gaps. Don't change the order of the characters around, which you did for example in your first post. Even if you think Roy might be 4 places higher for example, you can't move him about. Your task is to just add tier gaps

 

[Airpoizon]

Click "Edit" on your post, and start from scratch. That would be a good start.

Use this: ()

And go along and split characters into tiers. For example, I might thing that there is a tier gap between Mario and Sonic, so I would press Enter on my keyboard to make a tier gap. Then, I might think the next gap should be between Bayonetta and Mewtwo, so another Enter there etc. Only make gaps. Don't change the order of the characters around, which you did for example in your first post. Even if you think Roy might be 4 places higher for example, you can't move him about. Your task is to just add tier gaps

Oh ok, I had no clue, thanks!

 

[Deleted member 269706]

- Top tier/Top 5 tier. All very strong top 5 contenders. Chance that one of the characters in the next tier could switch spots with one of these characters.
- High Tier. All of these characters have a slight edge above the characters below them, something very minor holding them back.
- Mid/low High Tier. Gatekeeper tier. What separates the good characters from the great characters. These characters all have potential to be in the next tier, but have either a lack of results, or lack of representation.
()- High-Mid Tier. Characters that work has been put into, not quite on the next level (yet?). Holding them back: major lack of representation, bad MU spread, flawed design, etc.
- Low-Mid Tier. Largely unexplored and need attention. Have potential, but have yet to show what they're capable of.
- Low Tier. Fundamentally stunted. Characters that have some major flaw (i.e. bad recovery, bad frame data, poor design, poor hitboxes) keeping them from ever becoming great.
- Bottom 5 tier.

I understand that things are bound to change in the next phase of voting but I just wanted to explain why I chose the spots I did. There's a few characters who I think should be in the next/previous tier but there's no reordering for now. Overall though, I feel like this is pretty accurate as to how it should be organized as most characters fit into their respective tiers IMO.

 

[bc1910]

()





Hopefully Bayo can move in the wildcard round; the top row is a pretty solid estimation of top tier/top 10 without her.

 

[DarkAuraful]

Let's see.
T:
H:
M-H:
M:
M-L:
L:
B:

 

[phire_]

Top:
High:
High-Mid:
Mid:
Low-Mid:
Low:
Bottom:
Trash:

EDIT: Disregard this as I wasn't supposed to change the order.

 

[Phuckyew]

Hopefully Bayo can move in the wildcard round; the top row is a pretty solid estimation of top tier/top 10 without her.

I agree, Mewtwo is gunning for that #10 spot.

 

[Frihetsanka]

Spoiler

Top:
High:
High-Mid:
Mid:
Low-Mid:
Low:
Bottom:
Trash:

You're not supposed to change the order of any characters in the tiers at this point in time.

 

[Rhinomaster22]

- Top tier/Top 5 tier. All very strong top 5 contenders. Chance that one of the characters in the next tier could switch spots with one of these characters.
- High Tier. All of these characters have a slight edge above the characters below them, something very minor holding them back.
- Mid/low High Tier. Gatekeeper tier. What separates the good characters from the great characters. These characters all have potential to be in the next tier, but have either a lack of results, or lack of representation.
()- High-Mid Tier. Characters that work has been put into, not quite on the next level (yet?). Holding them back: major lack of representation, bad MU spread, flawed design, etc.
- Low-Mid Tier. Largely unexplored and need attention. Have potential, but have yet to show what they're capable of.
- Low Tier. Fundamentally stunted. Characters that have some major flaw (i.e. bad recovery, bad frame data, poor design, poor hitboxes) keeping them from ever becoming great.
- Bottom 5 tier.

I understand that things are bound to change in the next phase of voting but I just wanted to explain why I chose the spots I did. There's a few characters who I think should be in the next/previous tier but there's no reordering for now. Overall though, I feel like this is pretty accurate as to how it should be organized as most characters fit into their respective tiers IMO.

You, I like this. 10/10

 

[Browny]

Hmm not too many votes here, I've give it one more day before updating again.

 

[NeepKing]

()

 

[atreyujames]

()

 

[Funbot28]

Top TIer:
Upper High Tier:
Lower High Tier:
Upper Mid Tier: ()
Lower Mid Tier:
Upper Low Tier:
Lower Low Tier:
Bottom Tier:

 

[Deleted member]

Top:
High:
Borderline-High: ()
Mid:
Borderline-Mid:
Niche:
Low:

i tried lol

 

[zeldasmash]

()




Yeah.....i didn't read the rules so i didn't know you cannot change the order. My bad everyone.

 

[Deleted member]

Top:
High:
High-Mid: (),
Middle:
Low-Mid:
Low Tier:
Bottom Tier:

did you even read the rules :/

 

[phire_]

Top:
High:
High-Mid: ( )
Mid:
Low-Mid:
Low:
Bottom:

 

[Scamper52596]

1.
2.
3. ()
4.
5.
6.

 

[Browny]

UPDATED

ITS THE FINAL ROUND, then I can sleep.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Spoiler

1:
2:
3:
4:()
5:
6:
7:
8:
9:

-10lol

-3Once again, lol. You guys are eventhubishly overhyping Marth, and it's litertatly to a meme level by this point. Just because Marth got buffed and actually EXISTS in the metagame now doesn't mean he's high tier lol.

+5People are really ignoring his strengths right now, and underrating his matchup spread. Pac-Man has a lot of potential.

I also think +[Number]is just as important as those other three, but we only get three votes and he's the only one that people will actually vote for so.....

Also I may change this vote btw, I will quote the original post and state the change though so people know.

 

[jespoke]

+2 to put him between
+3 to put her between
-2 to put them between


All three are cases where i think they are significantly better/worse than the next in line (,,) and a little better/worse than the following one (

,,)



Edit: marks the exact middle of the roster right now.

 

[Browny]

Spoiler

1:
2:
3:
4:()
5:
6:
7:
8:
9:

-lol

-Once again, lol. You guys are eventhubishly overhyping Marth, and it's litertatly to a meme level by this point. Just because Marth got buffed and actually EXISTS in the metagame now doesn't mean he's high tier lol.

+People are really ignoring his strengths right now, and underrating his matchup spread. Pac-Man has a lot of potential.

I also think +is just as important as those other three, but we only get three votes and he's the only one that people will actually vote for so.....

Vote exactly where you want those 3 to be, not just + or -.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Vote exactly where you want those 3 to be, not just + or -.

We're allowed to do that? Nice.

 

[Frihetsanka]

My thoughts on preliminary tier names:
1: High top tier
2: Low top tier
3: High tier
4: High mid tier
5: Mid tier
6: Low mid tier
7: High low tier
8: Low tier
9: Bottom tier

I'm not voting yet, but I'd like to state that I think Guest XXXX Miis are highly underrated. I get why, many tournaments (including my local scene) ban custom moves for all characters, including Miis. I think that they do benefit a lot from custom moves though, perhaps especially Mii Brawler.

 

[Xandercosm]

Should be in between and .

Should be in between and .

Should be in between and .

I'm assuming this is how it works, right? I get to vote for the places of three characters?

 

[AlphaSSB]

between and
between and
between and

 

[Routa]

between and
between and
between and

 

[Bowserboy3]

I'll be putting my votes on later, but for now, I just want to draw attention to this.

-3Once again, lol. You guys are eventhubishly overhyping Marth, and it's litertatly to a meme level by this point. Just because Marth got buffed and actually EXISTS in the metagame now doesn't mean he's high tier lol.

I honestly don't know what planet you are living on if your basis for Marth's placement is "eventhubishly" overhyped. Just as a point of reference to start, I don't think Marth really needs to be any higher right now. However, Marth is most certainly not overhyped. Marth's buffs made a difference, and you are correct that the buffs alone don't make him a high tier. However, Marth's results and consistency after these buffs show us that he is certainly fine where he is. You cannot ignore how well Marth has been doing after these buffs. Of note, after buffs, he has been getting multiple local GF placements with Pugwest and Mr E, and even False at locals, with things like Mansion Takover and S4@GU, he got 5th at KTAR XVII, 5th at ... (I can't remember the name, a japanese tournament, of note, there was a Bowser in top 5 too, somebody tell me please the name. I'll also mention is in Japan, where Marth has historically been frowned upon), and of more note, there were two Marth's in top 17 at Pound 2016, and four different players in the top 17 at GOML used Marth at some point, two of them (False and Mr E) used him almost exclusively and placed in the top 17, as opposed to using him on a couple of occasions, but even the players considering using Marth shows something about him.

Something also of note, is Mr E beating Nairo in the GF of a recent local tournament. Not only did he beat Nairo's Doc and Robin to reset the bracket (Mr E came from losers bracket), he then proceeded to beat Nairo's ZSS 2-0. Not only a huge monument for Marth beating a ZSS, this isn't just any ZSS. This is THE ZSS, one of the best player in the world. This, once again, shows Marth has the tools to compete.

Here is said match:

Once again, I will reiterate this point; I don't yet believe Marth deserves to be much higher, if at all. If anything, he could POTENTIALLY be 1 or 2 spaces higher, but that's beside the point. What isn't debatable is his current placement, as Marth has consistently shown he DESERVES to be placed where he is. The writing is on the wall now. You can't just ignore everything he has done so far.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

= -9 (between Brawler and DK)

You guys probably missed the discussion in the tier list discussion topic which went on for several pages so I'll break it down in short form here: Corrin's moveset is roughly on par with Ike and Marth's when you break down everything (kill potential, kill set ups, mobility, damage wracking, survivability, etc), but he has the least amount of results out of those three. The majority of his results are secondary usage, and even then not as a consistent secondary. Its a "welp I'm kinda screwed atm, let me try something crazy" type of secondary usage.

When you make the changes Das Koopa is making to how he records results, and don't include secondary usage that didn't record a win, Corrin results fall a lot. Below Ike and Marth. That is not up for debate, that is fact. And because tier lists are a snapshot of the current metagame, you don't get to include future potential. So what you have is one mad overrated character on this list who needs to drop like a bag of bricks because he's doing nothing important. His solo results are few and frequently in areas without many other large names. His solo major/international results don't exist. His secondary usage is questionable at best. People have figured him out and it shows.

There is nothing to back up his current placement. Nothing. (Remember, future potential is not a valid argument for tier list placement because tier lists only consider the now and the recent past) Time to get off the hype train and accept he's one of many mid-tier characters. He's only relevant as a counter pick character because he's a good option against Cloud, Rosalina, Ness, and one other high tier character I'm forgetting from that discussion.

= +5 (between Ike and Luigi) Marth meanwhile, unlike Corrin, is actually doing important stuff results wise! He's frequently getting picked as a secondary option and winning. Leo in Mexico has gone all Marth at tournaments and won. In the US Marths are starting to get like, good placements at majors going solo and are taking off big names like Nairo. The theory for Marth looks good, and his results actually back it up. In the future he could be higher, but no potential allowed for consideration and Ike has more long term results/some better recent results at majors so that's where Marth falls for now.

= -2 (Between Falcon and the Pits). I wish I had more than 3 votes to work with, I'd love to reorganize tiers 4-6 more. But I guess I'll go with this one as my last vote. We keep hearing about iStudying doing well at that one tournament, how he had jet lag for his next bad placing and all of that. But he has never gotten back up there and nobody else is really propping up Greninja. Results aren't matching the hype, positioning needs to be reflected accordingly. Toon Link is for sure doing more atm, Falcon is always kinda on the edge of the radar but he's had more results on the long run.

 

[Wintermelon43]

I'll be putting my votes on later, but for now, I just want to draw attention to this.



I honestly don't know what planet you are living on if your basis for Marth's placement is "eventhubishly" overhyped. Just as a point of reference to start, I don't think Marth really needs to be any higher right now. However, Marth is most certainly not overhyped. Marth's buffs made a difference, and you are correct that the buffs alone don't make him a high tier. However, Marth's results and consistency after these buffs show us that he is certainly fine where he is. You cannot ignore how well Marth has been doing after these buffs. Of note, after buffs, he has been getting multiple local GF placements with Pugwest and Mr E, and even False at locals, with things like Mansion Takover and S4@GU, he got 5th at KTAR XVII, 5th at ... (I can't remember the name, a japanese tournament, of note, there was a Bowser in top 5 too, somebody tell me please the name. I'll also mention is in Japan, where Marth has historically been frowned upon), and of more note, there were two Marth's in top 17 at Pound 2016, and four different players in the top 17 at GOML used Marth at some point, two of them (False and Mr E) used him almost exclusively and placed in the top 17, as opposed to using him on a couple of occasions, but even the players considering using Marth shows something about him.

Something also of note, is Mr E beating Nairo in the GF of a recent local tournament. Not only did he beat Nairo's Doc and Robin to reset the bracket (Mr E came from losers bracket), he then proceeded to beat Nairo's ZSS 2-0. Not only a huge monument for Marth beating a ZSS, this isn't just any ZSS. This is THE ZSS, one of the best player in the world. This, once again, shows Marth has the tools to compete.

Here is said match:

Once again, I will reiterate this point; I don't yet believe Marth deserves to be much higher, if at all. If anything, he could POTENTIALLY be 1 or 2 spaces higher, but that's beside the point. What isn't debatable is his current placement, as Marth has consistently shown he DESERVES to be placed where he is. The writing is on the wall now. You can't just ignore everything he has done so far.

His spot IS high tier so you're argument of him not being high tier but deserving his spot is wrong.

As for results, I agree he has good results, but Duck Hunt and WFT also get those levels of results (Duck Hunt's are mostly in japan) and they aren't up there. I mean, Duck Hunt's theory is worse but WFT's theory is like, a tiny bit worse.

Nairo is inconsistant a lot, espicially in his own region. He's been beaten by a Robin before too, and Robin's litertatly in the spot right below Marth imo. Plus a ton of other upsets.

False used Sheik a little more than Marth at GOML iirc so..... yea. You keep saying than False mains Marth, but he's either a secondary or duo main along with Sheik and Ryu (It's hars to tell at this point) outside of small tournaments where he'll go mostly Marth.

 

[lbrasz44]

+ to between Ike and Luigi. The buffs have been substantial in the fact that he has a solid presence in the meta now (hell, even moreso than Pikachu and Corrin, although they are good characters marred by lack of rep). Consistently reaching the top 16 as either a solo main or primary main really does show his worth considering the size of the roster and the prevalence of many characters that are listed above him. He's a solid sworduser that demands respect whenever you go up against the character.

+ to the end of t6. A character that is on the rise here, while being relevant in Japan. It may be me, but there's probably a reason why he's liked a lot over there (much like Mewtwo a few months ago). Great zoning and trapping, while the character's downside are in recovery and smashes, but that shouldn't matter if one never really gets past the traps in the first place.

+ to where Duck Hunt was at the end of t7. A growing pool of rep for a character that really isn't all that dysfunctional. While her tilts are not that great, her aerials are what I'd argue to be some of the best in the game actually as they give her advantages that the others in t8- and perhaps some characters even higher- don't have (a combo of reach, power, and priority without years of lag), which keeps her relevant in matches.

 

[Bowserboy3]

His spot IS high tier so you're argument of him not being high tier but deserving his spot is wrong.

As for results, I agree he has good results, but Duck Hunt and WFT also get those levels of results (Duck Hunt's are mostly in japan) and they aren't up there. I mean, Duck Hunt's theory is worse but WFT's theory is like, a tiny bit worse.

Nairo is inconsistant a lot, espicially in his own region. He's been beaten by a Robin before too, and Robin's litertatly in the spot right below Marth imo. Plus a ton of other upsets.

False used Sheik a little more than Marth at GOML iirc so..... yea. You keep saying than False mains Marth, but he's either a secondary or duo main along with Sheik and Ryu (It's hars to tell at this point) outside of small tournaments where he'll go mostly Marth.

Sorry, I didn't realise Tier 5 out of 9, placement 31 out of 58 was high tier... Marth isn't even in high tier for a start; he's in the mid tier.

This is for another argument, but Duck Hunt and Wii Fit Trainer have a lot more core problems than Marth, so while they get results, they rarely get in the top placements at major tournaments because of said problems that hold them back. Heck, even Shulk got 13th at GOML, so while Shulk has arguably less results than Duck Hunt, he actually deserves to be higher because he gets more relevant results.

Once again, you're missing my point. False uses Marth and Sheik, so while he does use Sheik usually more than Marth, he does indeed use Marth, not just for counterpick matchups or such (such as like Leo did).

And you can't just discredit such a feat as a Marth beating Nairo as "he's inconsistent". Regardless of consistency, Nairo is officially, the 2nd highest ranked player in Smash 4. That is fact (http://smashboards.com/rankings/smash-for-wii-u.8/league). A Marth managing to beat him is a huge point of record for Marth.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Sorry, I didn't realise Tier 5 out of 9, placement 31 out of 58 was high tier... Marth isn't even in high tier for a start; he's in the mid tier.

This is for another argument, but Duck Hunt and Wii Fit Trainer have a lot more core problems than Marth, so while they get results, they rarely get in the top placements at major tournaments because of said problems that hold them back. Heck, even Shulk got 13th at GOML, so while Shulk has arguably less results than Duck Hunt, he actually deserves to be higher because he gets more relevant results.

Once again, you're missing my point. False uses Marth and Sheik, so while he does use Sheik usually more than Marth, he does indeed use Marth, not just for counterpick matchups or such (such as like Leo did).

And you can't just discredit such a feat as a Marth beating Nairo as "he's inconsistent". Regardless of consistency, Nairo is officially, the 2nd highest ranked player in Smash 4. That is fact (http://smashboards.com/rankings/smash-for-wii-u.8/league). A Marth managing to beat him is a huge point of record for Marth.

Oh, he's at 31st? I thought he was 29th, my mistake then.

As for the core problems, that's litertatly what I said.

The smash 4 rankings on smashboards is NOT fact; Nobody thinks Esam is top 5 or that MVD is top 10, not even themselves. I'm not saying it isn't impressive, but that it doesn't prove Marth is top 25 like you people hilarisualy think now.