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Needs to be higher I'm on team Palu. I mean, look at the characters around her. If we're going by representation she outclasses the bottom two tiers. Still don't think she's that good Is there a change of opinion about this character? I don't think she got any buffs? ^^^
Its because all customs are allowed and I think sizes+
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Seriously though, for whatever reason mid-tier is getting pretty crowded.
Huh. That's a bit weird considering nearly all tournaments restrict it to the generic 1111 mii. Also makes it a bit hard to judge since we never get to see miis play.
I'm switch out my mii votes since I know jack about how good they are with all of their tools.+
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Seriously though, for whatever reason mid-tier is getting pretty crowded.
Thanks for pointing that out, I really thought I voted 5 times, I literally would have never noticed that until you pointed that out.
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She won't as you can't move up more than two tiers and just make sure to edit your post with any vote changes!
That's good to know at least. Although votes for Bayonetta are still going to be wasted if people keep voting for her without seeing how people are voting currently.
- I'm aware other people have already voted her up, but I believe she is best in the game. - Results-wise, Ryu has been struggling, but I think in terms of potential, he should move up a tier. His crazy kill power and combo game make me think he deserves a spot in the top 2 tiers. - Similar to Ryu, Yoshi is a solid character and is mainly lacking results. I think he should be placed a bit higher, around where Falcon/Corrin are. - Really don't think she's on the same level as Marth. I honestly think less of her as a character. - THIS IS NOT A DOWN VOTE, THIS IS A COUNTER VOTE. I believe his placement in the tier list is perfect where it is right now and he doesn't need to go up or down. I've seen several upvotes already (and I'm sure that there are more to come), so this vote is mainly to neutralize his placement.
Most people want him in the tier below, your just counter voting the counter voted+
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More people voted him down, actually. I think he's perfect where he is too which is why I voted him up. If you think he should stay where he is, then you should upvote him.+
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Most of Europe is Guest XXXX. People just forget that there is a big smash scene. Oh well.
Might edit the Mewtwo vote later. Not changing Bayo.
Might I question why in your opinion Wii Fit Trainer isn't that good? I'm just legitimately wondering. I mean her MU spread is fantastic with her most being even matches. Her worst matchup isn't even a common character being Kirby. She has a lot of positives such as amazing recovery as well as edgeguarding. Double hitboxes also help her out as well. As well as consistent top 32 results with John Numbers.+
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Seriously though, for whatever reason mid-tier is getting pretty crowded.
Don't forget Waveguider and Wii Twerk Trainer.
My point exactly. Also Rin is there too! Thanks for the add. Also she has some results in Europe. I forget the players name though......
Thing is that most places use guest 1111.
How so, really? I think that nowdays, most people are agreeing they're equal. A lot of their differences even out, and if played properly, Lucina is just as effective. Being right besides him seems like the better placement-
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Undisputable best atm I don't think he is deserving of top 5 yet because characters like Mario and Sheik are outplacing him after meeting him in bracket. For sure she's not above Cloud or Bayonetta
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13th at Super Smash Con
7th at Hyper Sumabato
7th at Sumabato 6
9th at Tipped Off 11
9th at Umebura Tokagi GP
13th at Sumabato Tokagi GP
9th at Umebura Genesis Cup
5th at Glitch
Beating players like DJ Jack, 9B, ikep, Earth, and Motsunabe along the way.
This character clearly has something going for him. In terms of pure high/top level results, he's probably kicking around mid-tier, somewhere Olimar-ish. Sure, his dedicated mains are inconsistent and his theory is bad, but bottom 5? I'd be more inclined to give that spot to Falco now, tbh.
In the current meta, you're probably right. I just have yet to see them as equals. I've always seen her a bit behind him, but there's a good chance I'm wrong.
The main reason why Sonic SHOULD be above those two is not because results, he still gets them and his best main did not even go to Pound and he still got 9th, just like Hyuga. Sonic has good matchup vs Bayonetta, from my knowledge at least, something Fox and Mario don't really have. The results at Pound just show he is still top 10, maybe top 7. Sonic has good MU's, again fromy my knowledge, against the majority of the top tiers. His theory and MU solidify him above Mario. Yes mario has good theory and got results like at Pound, but I feel like Sonic's pro outweigh them. I just want to give my opinion, I hope this does not end up like Roy.+
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Sonic is not better than Mario. Tournament results show this and also I have not seen a Sonic make top 8 as of late. Komorikiri doesn't really use him anymore and Larry also bopped 6WX at Genesis 3 so I can't see him above Mario and Fox. Right below them? Sure.
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I can assure you that Mario has both a better MU spread than Sonic and as good of a MU with Bayonetta (although, I can't speak for Fox on that matter). They both go even (I know that Mario does and I think Sonic does as well). I would say Sonic is below Mario and Fox because of how predictable he becomes. He has a surprising lack of approach options, his combo game isn't nearly as good as Mario or Fox's, he has to fish for kills at kill percents super hard, and his bread & butter U-throw -> U-air/F-air/B-air is too easy to escape with DI. I definitely would put him firmly in the top ten but he's strictly lower than Mario and Fox, in my opinion.
I support you about Mario possibly being above Sonic, but I think more signs point to Sonic having a better matchup with Bayonetta. In fact, along with Diddy, he's supposed to be one of the best. Spin Dash is one of the only neutral game moves not to worry about Witch Time due to its speed and multi hit nature. That's as far as I know, but I don't find it hard to believe that Sonic has a better time with Bayonetta than Mario does. Of course, I'm not implying that Mario can't handle her, but just stating Sonic can handle her better than Mario can.
Your making it seem like sonic is pre path sheik killing levels, which he is not. People say it's hard to kill with Sonic, but it really is not. Also, I'm not saying Mario has a worse MU than Sonic, I'm saying sonic has a better MU against some of the metas bigger threats like Bayonetta and Diddy as mentioned by BowserBoy
I didn't know Spindash could bypass WT. That's sweet. So it potentially is better for Sonic but they both deal with her fine, honestly. I still want to know what Fox's MU with Bayo is...
He may potentially have a better MU with Bayonetta but tell me why he has a better MU with Diddy and others like you say. Also, Rosalina, a character that is potential second best at the moment, is quite a bad MU for both Sonic and Mario (just pointing that out). All I know is that Mario has pretty solid MUs with the top 10-15 but I really don't know too much about Sonic's MU spread.
For an explanation you will have to wait till I am back home, but I know that it is hard for those two to get Sonic off of him. I'm not too good at explaining MU, but I think
Bowserboy3
can explain both.
Not as bad as you would think, has decent tournament results, and shouldn't be that far behind Ness. (This is an edit: it used to be a upvote, but I changed it.) Requires good management to play well, but that's no reason for her to be Tier 5. He deserves to be higher. In my opinion, he can beat a lot of other Tier 5 characters, such as Charizard.
(Though he may not be excellent, I'd think that Charizard is definitely not below Mac or Swordfighter. I agree that he's above Falco, though. (Greninja has been showing a lot of potential after the buffs, and he's been getting pretty common at tournaments. Players like iStudying have really shown the potential Greninja has now.) (Abadango literally just made Mewtwo into a hugely more viable character just by the showing at Pound. If he keeps this up, Mewtwo might just make it into the top end of Tier 2.) (Pikachu is at best bottom of 2; he has very little in the way of consistent results outside of ESAM, and overall he's overhyped IMO.) (IMO, the worst of the heavies, and probably one of the worst characters in the game. Gordos are good, but sadly that's pretty much all Dedede has. Zelda at least has a great Up-B kill move.)
