Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[KingofPhantoms]

@Diddy Kong Personally I'd want Ganondorf to be fully revamped, aside from Flame Choke and a few moves that already belong to him, like his F-air for example.

@HyperFalcon Toon Link might be able to make use of items from Wind Waker, should he want this version of Link to return and if he's trying to avoid clones, but your idea is good as well. We'd still have a Wind Waker character (or rather the version of a character from WW.) and Sakurai would be able to have a Child Link, which I recall him stating he wants to keep in Smash in some form.

@RaccoonBL I too am a Jigglypuff fan, and I think Smash wouldn't feel the same without her. Though some new moves would be nice, as long as the Jiggs can stay I'm fine with whatever is done to her moveset. (unless she is given even more moves that Kirby has)

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I'm at least interessted in seeing Charizard vs Blastoise on it.

Blastoise is going to loose, but he's still the better pokemon

 

[Diddy Kong]

Why revamp Ganondorf that badly? Some moves could stay. Forward Air, as you said for example as well as Flame Choke. But his Jab is also iconic, and unique since Melee. I'd expect that back to. He had a new Up Smash in Brawl, but I hate it, so that should be replaced. His Down Air should stay to I think. And maybe Back Air to, cause it fits his playstyle good. If he doesn't use weapons, they should keep his Forward Tilt to. Up Tilt should be replaced with something better, but also powerful. Other attacks saved for aerials and specials. Even though I do like Trident and that teleport attack for B and Down B.

I want Jigglypuff back to. But she should be more like Melee. Just make her Forward Air and Back Air stale more, and keep the rest as in Melee. I don't want her gone either actually.

 

[Autumn ♫]

That only applied in 64.

In Brawl, absolutely does not apply. Mewtwo already has a fully portable moveset. In addition, many characters had similar moves to him. His jumping patterns is near identical to Ness/Lucas. His Down Smash is very similar to Samus' regular Down A. His Air Neutral A is such a common style of move that it's ridiculous. And so on. No, they're as easy to put into Brawl as the other. It was solely grandfather clause and nothing more for Jigglypuff in Brawl.

We don't know if she was planned to be in early on or not. With the exception of Dixie, I remember him saying that Sonic cost him a lot of time that couldn't be put into the rest of the planned characters. So Jigglypuff was probably going to be in regardless, but may have been worked on late. That's mind you, what I gathered from the interviews and such. Jigglypuff was clearly not meant to be part of the SSE's story, though. But that's not the same as playable, respectively.

Jigglypuff is more identicle to Kirby, having the same body structure, multiple jumps, and they share some of the same moves, so I think Kirby and Jigglypuff are more simular than Mewtwo and (insert character here) I doubt being part of the original 12 had much to do with it.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I'm fine with his Jab staying, and his F-tilt kick changed enough in Brawl for me, and also greatly resembled the kick attack he uses in the final battle in Twilight Princess. And I agree on the Up Smash, it stunk. If he is to keep any moves that are borrowed from Capt. Falcon, a few aerials (like his D-aerial) and his D-Smash are fine by me. And if I recall right, can't he perform some impressive jumps in Twilight Princess? It'd be nice if he could jump a bit higher and/or farther.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Jigglypuff is more identicle to Kirby, having the same body structure, multiple jumps, and they share some of the same moves, so I think Kirby and Jigglypuff are more simular than Mewtwo and (insert character here) I doubt being part of the original 12 had much to do with it.

Again, first Smash only. Jigglypuff and Kirby have since very much been pretty different while sharing a small slew of similar stuff. They're barely similar, just slightly more than Wolf and Fox are.(which is barely at all) No other reason in Brawl beyond Grandfather Clause. Over Mewtwo? Yes, Jigglypuff wins for being part of the original 12. Otherwise, Mewtwo should've been in instead. He's just not as important as the first characters from the first game.

@HyperFalcon Toon Link might be able to make use of items from Wind Waker, should he want this version of Link to return and if he's trying to avoid clones, but your idea is good as well. We'd still have a Wind Waker character (or rather the version of a character from WW.) and Sakurai would be able to have a Child Link, which I recall him stating he wants to keep in Smash in some form.

To be fair, he has a lot of the same items Link did in TP anyway. Boomerang? Bombs? Arrows? Classic Link has a Fire Rod again. That alone is pretty interesting. To be fair, Toon Link(well, his style in The Minish Cap anyway) did have a Downthrust too. In fact, I do believe that was the first Zelda beyond II to bring it back. Upthrust was a one-time thing though.(not sure if it appeared in the CD-i games, though)

 

[Autumn ♫]

Again, first Smash only. Jigglypuff and Kirby have since very much been pretty different while sharing a small slew of similar stuff. They're barely similar, just slightly more than Wolf and Fox are.(which is barely at all) No other reason in Brawl beyond Grandfather Clause. Over Mewtwo? Yes, Jigglypuff wins for being part of the original 12. Otherwise, Mewtwo should've been in instead. He's just not as important as the first characters from the first game.

I was listing in Brawl, and what I meant by attacks were the A-attacks, not the B ones. Jiggly and Kirby were still pretty simular in Brawl and easier to input than Mewtwo was. The original 12 might have had some influence, but not very much.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Easier programming basically led to the decision of Jigglypuff over Mewtwo, both characters were low priority "filler" characters, but when time is looming over your shoulders you'd go for the easier choice to develop for because there is less risk of wasting resources and time. It's common sense, when you're pressured you'll want to look for the simpler solution instead of adding more pressure.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Jigglypuff vs Mewtwo though?

I really don't know who to choose.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Easier programming basically led to the decision of Jigglypuff over Mewtwo, both characters were low priority "filler" characters, but when time is looming over your shoulders you'd go for the easier choice to develop for because there is less risk of wasting resources and time. It's common sense, when you're pressured you'll want to look for the simpler solution instead of adding more pressure.

Ah, but Mewtwo's mega forms do NOT have pressure. They have steadfast and insomnia. And everyone knows a steadfast person that can work through the night can get more work done

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

Jigglypuff vs Mewtwo though?

I really don't know who to choose.

Jigglypuff side all the way! :D

I will say though, I've never cared for Mewtwo. I don't care one bit if he does or doesn't return.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Mewtwo is going to get in over Jigglypuff.

People are going to be all denial about it, but that's the matter at hand considering the current situations going on. Advertisement seems to be an influence when it comes to Pokemon, and since Jigglypuff is hardly worth talking about compared to other Pokemon like Mewtwo, Lucario, Pikachu, and such, her inclusion is a tad doubtful. Especially considering the risk of being removed was already barely dodged in Brawl, and considering things haven't changed much it's most likely going to be the same situation again. It's a matter of whether or not putting in the resources is worth it.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

To be fair, he has a lot of the same items Link did in TP anyway. Boomerang? Bombs? Arrows? Classic Link has a Fire Rod again. That alone is pretty interesting. To be fair, Toon Link(well, his style in The Minish Cap anyway) did have a Downthrust too. In fact, I do believe that was the first Zelda beyond II to bring it back. Upthrust was a one-time thing though.(not sure if it appeared in the CD-i games, though)

Ah yes, I forgot about the Rod. One of my favorite Zelda items, actually.

According to the Zelda Wiki http://zeldawiki.org/Down_Thrust it had appeared in the two Four Swords Zelda games prior to the Minish Cap. Also, the Ending Blow from Twilight Princess (and Skyward Sword) is visually similar to the Downthrust. (and the Ending Blow had actually first appeared in Wind Waker as then unnamed skill used as a Parry attack against Magtails and Floormasters.)

 

[Big-Cat]

Easiest way to do that is just make him Toon Ganondorf and bring Young Link back(using his style from A Link Between Worlds). If Sakurai is trying to avoid clones, Young Link(I know some call him Classic Link for his ALBW version) can easily use his new Items. I'm not sure if the Child Link version will be a clone this time. Tradition in this case may not apply. His original reason for Villager not being in Brawl is that he's too peaceful. His mind clearly changed, so... I may expect a Child Link, but not necessarily as a clone.

Why not keep Toon Link and use the items from those games? I'm still wanting to see him control the wind.

Why revamp Ganondorf that badly? Some moves could stay. Forward Air, as you said for example as well as Flame Choke. But his Jab is also iconic, and unique since Melee. I'd expect that back to. He had a new Up Smash in Brawl, but I hate it, so that should be replaced. His Down Air should stay to I think. And maybe Back Air to, cause it fits his playstyle good. If he doesn't use weapons, they should keep his Forward Tilt to. Up Tilt should be replaced with something better, but also powerful. Other attacks saved for aerials and specials. Even though I do like Trident and that teleport attack for B and Down B.

I want Jigglypuff back to. But she should be more like Melee. Just make her Forward Air and Back Air stale more, and keep the rest as in Melee. I don't want her gone either actually.

Can we just get Wind Waker Ganondorf?

There was the earlier topic on the lack of "ethnic" characters in Smash. The way I see it, it doesn't matter THAT much in terms of demographic appeal to me. Most of the characters are in a fantasy setting as it is.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I was listing in Brawl, and what I meant by attacks were the A-attacks, not the B ones. Jiggly and Kirby were still pretty simular in Brawl and easier to input than Mewtwo was. The original 12 might have had some influence, but not very much.

Original 12 > A small amount of similar moves.

No, not buying that crap for why Jigglypuff got in instead. Mewtwo was also worked on as well, being the most finished. All his moves were just as easy to make entirely. Jigglypuff's only real reason to get in over Mewtwo was Grandfather Clause and nothing more. Both Mewtwo and Jigglypuff had their similar moves scattered among characters. So neither was hard to remake at all whatsoever in any way. The only thing Jigglypuff actually had over Mewtwo was getting in before him in the first place. That was the easy dealbreaker for Sakurai. Who was more important. Jigglypuff, easily.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I wouldn't count on X Mewtwo being fully playable. Not when either of the other 2 aren't. And X wouldn't be playable if Y isn't. So there's that. I really don't know what they will do with Mewtwo. But it's probably gonna be great anyway, so I won't care as long as he's actually balanced. And plays like Mewtwo.

Y version has it's advantages of at least being a very fast character, and offensive. Most likely powerful to. But they don't have an excuse at all to buff his weight, which was needed. In fact, Mewtwo's weight in Melee really suits Y Mewtwo. Teleport could be buffed, and even have no landing lag, cause of how Y Mewtwo attacks in that movie. Would be a fun way to play Mewtwo at least.

X would just be real powerful, and **** it... Even function as a sort of faster but equally powerful Brawl Ganondorf? With Mewtwo's special moves. I can see the potential in that. No Disable, but a Drop Kick like attack as a much stronger but less ranged Falcon Kick sort of attack. Psycho Cut instead of Shadow Ball, which is lower ranged, but very powerful and has a sweetspot that has very high knockback. Worse Teleport perhaps, but very powerful and reasonably fast regular attacks.

Wouldn't complain with normal Mewtwo to. Been looking forward to see him being revamped and buffed since the longest time. So if it's only him, that would still be awesome.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Ah yes, I forgot about the Rod. One of my favorite Zelda items, actually.

According to the Zelda Wiki http://zeldawiki.org/Down_Thrust it had appeared in the two Four Swords Zelda games prior to the Minish Cap. Also, the Ending Blow from Twilight Princess (and Skyward Sword) is visually similar to the Downthrust. (and the Ending Blow had actually first appeared in Wind Waker as then unnamed skill used as a Parry attack against Magtails and Floormasters.)

Oh, right, that too. Four Swords used the Toon Link style a bit too, notably. So like I said, not odd that Toon Link could do it. Upthrust is still questionable, however.

Why not keep Toon Link and use the items from those games? I'm still wanting to see him control the wind.

Because Toon Ganondorf is the only one needed and Young/Classic Link can use some of those items regardless. Still a Child Link. Young Link/Toon Link could never use an Upthrust. Ness can't use a lot of his specials, etc. Shouldn't matter whatsoever.

I don't know if it's a double post, nor do I care at the moment.

 

[Conviction]

So is this X/Y, whatever is it, Mewtwo anything like the Deoyxs forms?

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I think there are a few things to consider here. Jigglypuff, being a joke in the first game, but having managed to return in the next two installments makes her somewhat iconic, being a full time veteran thus far, and she does have a good amount of loyal fans. The orignal 12 at this point could be considered the face of Smash, and I find Jigglypuff to be important to the series because of this. I won't however deny the fact that Mewtwo and Lucario are both more popular Pokemon than the Jiggs. Sakurai DID say he asks the Pokemon developers "what's hot" and both Mewtwo and Lucario are quite popular right now, not to mention commonly getting promoted by Nintendo, and the 3 starters from the first Pokemon games are rather important to Pokemon as well, Jigglypuff doesn't have much against these three possible Pokemon reps.

There is also the fact at the Jiggs being a fairy type, which I admit does not boost her chances much, but you can't say there is no chance of her getting some new moves at all.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

So is this X/Y, whatever is it, Mewtwo anything like the Deoyxs forms?

Not really

Mega Mewtwo can't equip any items and doesn't learn different attacks based on which mega you get

Also, out of battle he is restored to regular mewtwo and has to actively transform into his mega form in battle

 

[Diddy Kong]

So is this X/Y, whatever is it, Mewtwo anything like the Deoyxs forms?

Y is a sort of Speed form.
X is a sort of Attack form, and has Fighting as a 2nd type.

 

[MargnetMan23]

So is this X/Y, whatever is it, Mewtwo anything like the Deoyxs forms?

They're probably similar to Deoxys in their function in how they focus on different stats and whatever but the way they turn into their forms isn't =P

 

[Conviction]

I see. I guess I'll just have to wait to play X before I comment.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I see. I guess I'll just have to wait to play X before I comment.

X isn't coming out until 2014.

Unless you're talking about the 1992 game for the Game Boy.

 

[MargnetMan23]

X isn't coming out until 2014.

Unless you're talking about the 1992 game for the Game Boy.

Or maybe he's talking about POKEMON X... Just saying.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Who wants to see Mario smacking the **** out of Link (and Peach?) with his Forward Aerial in the next update? Also, we'll get a comment on how it's now as strong as Dr.Mario's was in Melee deconfirming him at the same time.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Or maybe he's talking about POKEMON X... Just saying.

You see this joke?

WHOOOOOOOOOSH!

Right over your head.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

You see this joke?

WHOOOOOOOOOSH!

Right over your head.

What, you don't like short people?

 

[FlareHabanero]

What, you don't like short people?

****ing circus *******.

 

[Conviction]

You see this joke?

WHOOOOOOOOOSH!

Right over your head.

He obviously didn't reach the height requirement for the joke.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

Also, we'll get a comment on how it's now as strong as Dr.Mario's was in Melee deconfirming him at the same time.

Reverse sex kick?

----

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Reverse sex kick?

----

I shall now refer to Samus striking with her gunarm as a Sex Punch.

It made sense in my head...

 

[Diddy Kong]

Sex Punch.

When you combine:

Sex

With:

Punch.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Why not just call it fisting

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Sex Punch.

When you combine:

Sex

With:

Punch.

If anyone still doesn't get it, guns often refer to more than just weapons...

 

[Diddy Kong]

Why not just call it fisting

Called for a Donkey Punch?

 

[MargnetMan23]

You see this joke?

WHOOOOOOOOOSH!

Right over your head.

DAMN YOUR JOKE IS SO NOT FUNNY EVEN WHEN I'M EXPECTED TO GET IT. IT'S EXACTLY THIS KIND OF JOKE THAT I MISINTERPRET THE MOST OFTEN! I ALSO NOTICE I'M TALKING IN ALL CAPS FOR SOME REASON =D

He obviously didn't reach the height requirement for the joke.

What? 5'10 isn't good enough? Damn.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

DAMN YOUR JOKE IS SO NOT FUNNY EVEN WHEN I'M EXPECTED TO GET IT. IT'S EXACTLY THIS KIND OF JOKE THAT I MISINTERPRET THE MOST OFTEN! I ALSO NOTICE I'M TALKING IN ALL CAPS FOR SOME REASON =D

Don't be mad because you can't attract attention enough.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Don't be mad because you can't attract attention enough.

Not my fault that I don't have TM45.

 

[MargnetMan23]

Not my fault that I don't have TM45.

Yeah... But it's in good hands