Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[LiteralGrill]

You guys know that there's a thread especially for roster predictions right?

Also, I am saddened stage discussion went on so quickly. Speaking of hazards and stuff on stages, here's a cool little chart from Brawl:

Edit: Use the second Spoiler. Seriously, Crashboards gets on the nerves at times.

Spoiler

Static (No Hazards) - 3
Static (With Hazards) - 5
Dynamic (No Hazards) - 17
Dynamic (With Hazards) - 18

Battlefield
Final Destination
Temple
Mario Circuit
Norfair
75m
Mario Bros
Jungle Japes
Delfino Plaza
Mushroomy Kingom
Mushroomy Kingom 2
Frigate Orpheon
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Lylat Cruise
Pokemon Stadium 2
Castle Siege
Smashville
Skyworld
Shadow Moses Island
Yoshi's Island (Melee)
Rainbow Cruise
Luigi's Mansion
Big Blue
Pokemon Stadium
Hanenbow
Rumble Falls
Bridge of Eldin
Halberd
Port Town Aero Dive
Wario Ware
Distant Planet
New Pork City
Summit
Pictochat
Onett
Corneria
Brinstar
Pirate Ship
Spear Pillar 1
Spear Pillar 2
Flat Zone 2
Green Hill Zone
Green Greens

Whatcha think the spread might be for Sm4sh?

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

No, Lil'mac will be put in the game because he represents Nintendo's past, he is a character that can have a move-pool made easily for him, and is 1st party character. If you forgot, Nintendo wanted to make the focus on their companies' characters rather than too many 3rd companies. There.

I think Mario represents Nintendo's past a lot better than Little Mac, appearing in every single console generation. Even being in game systems OTHER than Nintendo made with Donkey Kong.

 

[Salty the SLUG]

I think Mario represents Nintendo's past a lot better than Little Mac, appearing in every single console generation. Even being in game systems OTHER than Nintendo made with Donkey Kong.

I don't mean to be rude, but could you re-phrase the second sentence?

Besides, yes, Mario has been in every generation as the star of the show. Mario is a bad character to compare to an average character like Lil'mac. It's like comparing Link to Excite-Bike.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Replies in green:

When has Waluigi ever been in a Wario game? Never. He can't be a Wario rep, end of story. It just doesn't work that way no matter what.
That's not to say he can't be in one, but you do have a valid point, no he hasn't been in a main Wario game. However, in every Mario sports spinoff, Waluigi is paired with Wario, he was made for that reason. And Wario is just as much a Mario character as he is his own, he originated in Mario, does it really matter if Waluigi gets in as a Mario rep or a Wario rep? Take out Wario and do you even have a reason to put Waluigi in the game?

Too bad you added two regardless of fanon. And you forgot Kamek, Shy Guy, and Baby Bowser for possible Yoshi reps. They're all notable from his series.
I don't like putting down people's opinions, but the likes of Shy Guy is pretty much like adding a Goomba. Baby Bowser would be even worse than Bowser Jr. imo, and Kamek is pretty much useless without his broom, and a flying character in Smash would be broken as hell.

...So why is Toon Link and Sheik in there? And I guess Zero Suit Samus wasn't removed, right? Yeah, this doesn't make sense. Toon Ganondorf is Ganondorf's more notable incarnation, where he is more than a lame death-to-all villain. He has personality, and he's the latest version thus far to be released. Of course, I do get that Sakurai may do the same to Zelda, Sheik, and Ganondorf as he did to Link. So this is forgivable.
Toon Link is there because, as I said in my post, the roster had no cuts. I don't understand what Sheik has to do with that, unless you think I mean transforming characters, which I don't, Sheik and ZSS are great in their own rights and shouldn't be removed. What I meant was, I don't like characters like a "young" Link and Dr. Mario, which is the same person but taking up another slot, transforming characters share a slot.

Toon Ganondorf being more notable is your opinion, just like some people prefer OoT Ganondorf. His toon version would just stick out horribly compared to Link and Zelda, the main trio should all fit to the same style, with Toon Link just being the odd one out since he's a Link clone in the first place.

Isaac should be in the first as well. He's pretty notable and a swordsman that isn't all swords. He also never uses magic either anyway. Just psychic-elemental powers. But eh. As for F-Zero, there's Black Doom, Pico, Samurai Goroh, and Jody Summers for most notable characters.
I'd be completely fine with Isaac and an F-Zero character, but seeing as I don't know much about either, and I just threw this together with my own knowledge, I didn't include them in the first one.

More villains means a more rounded out roster, actually. It means the heroes have actual rivals/opponents besides more heroes. 64 lacked any Villains, and that wasn't cool.(Mewtwo, Bowser, and Wolf were all planned for 64. They're all considered villains for the most part.) The bosses were all we got, and you could argue Giant DK was based upon Cranky Kong, who is a villain. Master Hand is kind of Neutral in the series, like Mewtwo is, but eh. Metal Mario was just an odd clone showing off how much Super Mario 64 rocked.
I'm neutral towards villain reps, they're nice and all, but they aren't required. Hell, could've thrown Guige in the second one instead of Ninten. The only two I see as really important are King K. Rool and Ridley, since those two series have been severely under-repped since 64..

Some of the characters I threw in weren't personal choices either, since I was pretty content with Brawl's roster (besides K. Rool and Ridley not being in it) I'm not too worried about newcomers, so I just put my small favorites in and mostly filled it with what other people seem to want. The row of Rareware characters in the second one was all major want though, M$ can burn in the deepest depths of hell.

 

[aleckermit]

The term you're looking for is Wishlist. None of those cuts besides Snake is ever going to be realistic at all. Child Link will stay. R.O.B. saved Nintendo's butt and has zero reason to be cut. Lucario has no reason to leave anymore now that he's hyper relevant again(although this could happen, I guess.) Why would he cut Mr. Game & Watch at all? He reps his own series, meaning he's both unique and you're killing a series... to add Waluigi and Bowser Jr., Geno, and Paper Mairo, but still no Toad? O_o

I like some of the choices, but this can't be a prediction. Predictions have to have a legitimate chance of happening. You killed it with some super bad cuts that will never happen.(Snake and Lucario are the only ones with a ghost of a chance at best. And I wouldn't call them likely for being cut either)

R.O.B. was a "No way!" kind of character. I believe he will remain a Brawl exclusive. Game & Watch has had two games now and isn't a popular favorite, cutting him allows for new retro characters like Little Mac & Geno (ya I'd consider him retro). I seriously doubt Toad, Bowser Jr. has his paint attack among many other unique qualities and Waluigi could be a sports character (attacks based on Mario sports games since that's where he originated).

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

Sorry to get off-topic, but I think the battery on my laptop is dying.
It's flashing orange-red over and over and it shut down by itself once today....

Don't know if I'll be able to keep my computer anymore...I'm scared.
Sigh.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

@Capps: I don't consider either Mushroomy Kingdom hazard free. You can't fight well on there and you have to concentrate more on the stage itself than the characters, or at least quite a lot of the time. To me, Hazards are anything that makes it a challenge to concentrate on the characters over the stage. Delfino Plaza doesn't have this issue most of the time, though.

I'll go through the list later, but it's much more skewed for me. Basically, most of the game has a lot more hazards(I mean this as harder to fight the character than the stage in total, and many moving stages have this problem in general, but both Mushroomy Kingdoms are the worst at this...) in stages than without. Or at least it's skewed in favor of hazards on average(okay, it already is even on your list, but still). I don't like that. I know 64's course had every stage but one with a hazard, but a lot of them were mostly fighting the player. Peach's Castle in 64 is kind of the only one that's more stage than player fighting at best. Congo Jungle lacks any actual hazard. The rest are pretty equal in that regard, with some slightly more hazardy than others.

@Aleckermit: I'm sorry, but there is no way the 4 other Mario characters you listed is more important than R.O.B. or worth putting in over him and Mr. Game & Watch. Not realistically. They're very important to Nintendo. Bowser Jr. is just a new villain. Paper Mario is still Mario. Waluigi is... do I need to explain how of little importance he is? Geno is a third party rep and does not outweigh 1st Party characters, or even 2nd Party.

@JamesDNaux: I can't reply that way. Please multiquote.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Here's my roster prediction:

Total: 48

Cuts:
Mr. Game & Watch
Snake
Toon Link
Lucario
R.O.B.

Newcomers:
Paper Mario
Geno
Black Shadow
Villager -confirmed-
Ridley
Mewtwo (new form)
Rayman
Bowser Jr.
Skull Kid
Mega Man -confirmed-
King K. Rool
Isaac
Andy
Wii Fit Trainer -confirmed-
Little Mac
Goose (from Pilotwings 64, seems very likely as a Pilotwings stage has been shown and Goose is the most recognizable of the Pilotwing characters)
Dillon
Waluigi

Welcome to the boards, but-

A prediction? An unlikely one, this is what you would consider a wishlist.

I find Bowser Jr. likely, but why is K. Rool so close to the Mario section instead of the DK section on the roster? The positions of some characters is unusual.

Geno is unlikely, but would be awesome. I personally don't think Skull Kid could bring much to Smash, but that's just me.

Mr. G&W is unlikely to be cut because of his uniqueness, and since he is the only rep for G&W, that would be cutting a series as whole.

R.O.B. brings a lot into Smash, it's the first robot you can play as in Smash, has a good and unique moveset, is technically the only character in Smash from real life, and it saved Nintendo during the North American Video Game Crash 1983.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I don't mean to be rude, but could you re-phrase the second sentence?

Besides, yes, Mario has been in every generation as the star of the show. Mario is a bad character to compare to an average character like Lil'mac. It's like comparing Link to Excite-Bike.

Mario has been on the Atari

He's the thing, when they say they want to bring back characters from the past with Smash, they mean characters like Takamaru that haven't had a game since the NES, not Little Mac who had a game come out recently. The perfect example would be Pit since he hadn't had a game since the gameboy and being in Smash revived his series with a great new game

Little Mac being in Smash would not revive his series, since his series is in no need for revival.

 

[LiteralGrill]

R.O.B. was a "No way!" kind of character. I believe he will remain a Brawl exclusive. Game & Watch has had two games now and isn't a popular favorite, cutting him allows for new retro characters like Little Mac & Geno (ya I'd consider him retro). I seriously doubt Toad, Bowser Jr. has his paint attack among many other unique qualities and Waluigi could be a sports character (attacks based on Mario sports games since that's where he originated).

As much as this isn't the thread for it, why cut G&W? He carries a unique playstyle, and out of every single character is the EASIEST to port over, he's flipping 2D! They might even be able to get away with an exact port fro Brawl it's so easy, it'd be a waste NOT to include him.

 

[LiteralGrill]

@Capps: I don't consider either Mushroomy Kingdom hazard free. You can't fight well on there and you have to concentrate more on the stage itself than the characters, or at least quite a lot of the time. To me, Hazards are anything that makes it a challenge to concentrate on the characters over the stage. Delfino Plaza doesn't have this issue most of the time, though.

I'll go through the list later, but it's much more skewed for me. Basically, most of the game has a lot more hazards(I mean this as harder to fight the character than the stage in total, and many moving stages have this problem in general, but both Mushroomy Kingdoms are the worst at this...) in stages than without. Or at least it's skewed in favor of hazards on average(okay, it already is even on your list, but still). I don't like that. I know 64's course had every stage but one with a hazard, but a lot of them were mostly fighting the player. Peach's Castle in 64 is kind of the only one that's more stage than player fighting at best. Congo Jungle lacks any actual hazard. The rest are pretty equal in that regard, with some slightly more hazardy than others.

Our definition of hazard is very different then, but no big deal on that one.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

R.O.B. was a "No way!" kind of character. I believe he will remain a Brawl exclusive. Game & Watch has had two games now and isn't a popular favorite, cutting him allows for new retro characters like Little Mac & Geno (ya I'd consider him retro). I seriously doubt Toad, Bowser Jr. has his paint attack among many other unique qualities and Waluigi could be a sports character (attacks based on Mario sports games since that's where he originated).

So because a character is a WTF character, they can't come back?

Game and Watch has a LOT of fans, Little Mac isn't retro with Punch-Out!! Wii, and Geno is 3rd Party.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Here's my roster prediction:

I see Rayman and Skull Kid and want to like you, but then I see you cut mother****ing Game & Watch, R.O.B. and Snake, and want to say GTFO.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Our definition of hazard is very different then, but no big deal on that one.

Fair enough.

But yeah, keep in mind what I meant for reasonable tourney stages. Delfino Plaza and Port Town Aero Drive are fine since there's more than enough Character fighting with not very much interference from the course. Mushroomy Kingdom 1 and 2 are trash for characters and remotely unplayable. Dynamic doesn't matter to me. It's whether the characters outweigh the course or not when it comes to a tourney viable stage. I guess I should rephrase what I mean; Lack stuff that makes it hard for characters to fight eachother instead of the course. Hazard was yeah, a bad term to use, agreed.

 

[Salty the SLUG]

Mario has been on the Atari

He's the thing, when they say they want to bring back characters from the past with Smash, they mean characters like Takamaru that haven't had a game since the NES, not Little Mac who had a game come out recently. The perfect example would be Pit since he hadn't had a game since the gameboy and being in Smash revived his series with a great new game

Little Mac being in Smash would not revive his series, since his series is in no need for revival.

Who said they wanted to revive his series? Mario is a the top of the STAR list, and Lil'mac... well he's no where near the top. Lil'mac still represents Nintendo's retro era, even with his new, re-polished game. In fact, it seems like the game was just updated and re-released on the Wii, so it wasn't really a sequel. Yes, Takamaru is another good character to use.

 

[Arcadenik]

As much as this isn't the thread for it, why cut G&W? He carries a unique playstyle, and out of every single character is the EASIEST to port over, he's flipping 2D! They might even be able to get away with an exact port fro Brawl it's so easy, it'd be a waste NOT to include him.

Errr.... Mr. Game & Watch's model is actually 3D... the 2D is an optical illusion.

 

[LiteralGrill]

Fair enough.

But yeah, keep in mind what I meant for reasonable tourney stages. Delfino Plaza and Port Town Aero Drive are fine since there's more than enough Character fighting with not very much interference from the course. Mushroomy Kingdom 1 and 2 are trash for characters and remotely unplayable. Dynamic doesn't matter to me. It's whether the characters outweigh the course or not when it comes to a tourney viable stage. I guess I should rephrase what I mean; Lack stuff that makes it hard for characters to fight eachother instead of the course. Hazard was yeah, a bad term to use, agreed.

But technically you "fight against the stage" on EVERY stage. I think you just want less intrusive stage elements yes?

 

[FlareHabanero]

The point is that Chrom has a lot of similarities with Ike, and that the characters give off similar vibes. Habanero, if he has the time can articulate this to you.

R-right.

Well, the deal with Chrom is that his general design is supposed to borrow characteristics from the other Lords, with most of the inspiration coming from Ike. His daughter meanwhile takes inspiration from Marth. Basically when you put the two together, it's supposed to give off vibes of Marth and Ike respectively, the two most well known and popular Lords in the series. You can tell from a design standpoint alone, and it was probably done so in order to highlight the most well received characteristics of a Lord character. Chrom himself also borrows form skills shared with Ike, such as Aether, and also boasts similarly distributed stats and stat growths. However, believe it or not, the similarities end there. Chrom and Ike have different back stories and motives, and their personalities were different with Ike generally being more rough due to his mercenary ties. It's also worth mentioning that unlike other Lords Chrom is capable of being reclassed into other classes aside from the typical Great Lord or equivalents.

Also, you might be wondering why I dislike Chrom so much if that is the case. Well to simply put into words, Chrom hasn't proven anything notably special. Yes he's a Lord which is all fine and dandy, but there are at least a dozen of them through out the series and they tend to be more colorful. There is of course the very notable problem of the character creating a negative sense of redundancy, which can easily create a sense of disappointment for veterans of the series and create a bad image of the Fire Emblem franchise for newcomers. There is just that lack of excitement for a character that feels like one big beaten horse, and in a franchise that has a very notable sense of diversity in play that is going to be an issue.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Errr.... Mr. Game & Watch's model is actually 3D... the 2D is an optical illusion.

It's not an optical illusion, they just pulled a Donkey Kong Country. When Rare made that game, they made everything with 3D models and then flattened them into sprites, which is why the games looked as good as they did. Game & Watch is a 3D model that was flattened and made to move frame-by-frame.

You can see some of his original 3D and fluid animations when he gets grabbed, as it'd be awkward if he moved normally when grabbed.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

...Mr. Game & Watch, Ice Climbers, and R.O.B. already represent the retro section. They also were added in before having a new game specifically starring them on a non-retro system.

Little Mac is not a retro character since his Wii game. He can't represent that correctly. And yes, their latest game where they're the main character does matter. Also, R.O.B. doesn't have to be counted as retro(since he did appear in Mario Kart DS before Brawl), since Pokemon Trainer is a Kanto-based character, although only his Pokemon originate from Red and Blue, since his design is from a Gen III game.(not Retro at the time, I guess?) His Pokemon are actual retro additions too. Technically.

Little Mac is a starring character in a Wii game. He no longer holds a retro status due to that. Of course, he'd still be great to get in, but he can't count for retro at this point. Maybe if he was in a GameCube game(which fyi they count as retro since they're going to be the Wii U VC. Retro games are pretty much ones of the VC, or two consoles/systems below the latest released system for the purpose of Nintendo themselves. And yes, it is pretty much that way, since Virtual Console games are all retro games). Yes, I know seeing a GameCube game as retro is totally a WTF idea. But that's... what it is now.

@Capps: Yes.

@JamesDNaux: Could you redo your quote from earlier? I can't actually reply to green lettering. Just multiquote please. I do remember you speaking of the whole "species" argument, but that applies fully to Pokemon anyway. Jigglypuff had no movie appearances even during 64, so she really is not another Jigglypuff, despite her anime popularity. Also, Pikachu is based upon Ash's, yes, but still is a generic one. Just remember, regardless of what they're based upon, all the Pokemon characters are generic species. Even the Pokemon Trainer himself is not a specific Trainer either. He's just loosely based upon Red(with a personality quite similar to Ash too, and his lineup is based around Ash's, even though Ash never had an Ivysaur, but Bulbasaur at one time DID avoid becoming one, so he could've legitimately to note).

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Kamek is pretty much useless without his broom, and a flying character in Smash would be broken as hell

We already have Meta Knight, Pit, and Charizard, Kamek could glide just like the three of them, he wouldn't be broken because of that. Plus, Meta was apparently the only "broken" character in Brawl. Kamek has a wand too, so he's not useless without his broom.

I don't like putting down people's opinions, but the likes of Shy Guy is pretty much like adding a Goomba.

At least the amount of Shy Guy species and types have a number of things that could be used in a moveset, but it may be too similar to Villager in that regard, and it's still a generic enemy, not much of chance for those reasons.

The only two I see as really important are King K. Rool and Ridley, since those two series have been severely under-repped since 64.

Agreed, but Medusa was a major villain in both the first Kid Icarus and a major one in Uprising. In most cases, villains should be in before a second hero/heroine, unless it's like the case with Earthbound/Mother.

 

[augustoflores]

I would very much like to borrow Habanero's Sig for a whole day.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

At least the amount of Shy Guy species and types have a number of things that could be used in a moveset, but it may be too similar to Villager in that regard, and it's still a generic enemy, not much of chance for those reasons.

I see how it is, King.

I hope you're proud of yourself... lol

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Agreed, but Medusa was a major villain in both the first Kid Icarus and a major one in Uprising. In most cases, villains should be in before a second hero/heroine, unless it's like the case with Earthbound/Mother.

To be fair, it's repping a different game with Mother 3, and Ness isn't in that game. That's actually justified.

This doesn't apply to other series, though, save Fire Emblem, I guess. This would explain its lack of villains. But this does not apply to Kid Icarus at all.

Keep in mind I'm saying Medusa is probably a neater choice that helps show off villains(the female thing is a plus). I'm not saying Palutena's bad, but Medusa is kind of a good choice too. I never meant either was a more perfect one, of course.

Also, as I noted earlier, generic character isn't good enough of a reason. Villager, Pokemon Trainer himself, all the Pokemon(none of them are specific ones, even if they're loosely based upon some), prove the whole thing wrong. Also, I hope that wasn't an argument for Toad... there's multiple specifics Toads, and the one from Super Mario Bros. 2 is not a regular Toad in the race. He had a separate name in Japan, so he's unique anyway.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I would very much like to borrow Habanero's Sig for a whole day.

Ahh good choice my friend.

For a total of 3,000 Bells, you can have this signature gift wrapped to go. Is this a deal?

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I see how it is, King.

I hope you're proud of yourself... lol

Nah, lol.

I'd actually love if I could play as a Shy Guy, but it's unlikely.

General Guy would still be better if had all that stuff his followers use...

 

[JamesDNaux]

We already have Meta Knight, Pit, and Charizard, Kamek could glide just like the three of them, he wouldn't be broken because of that. Plus, Meta was apparently the only "broken" character in Brawl. Kamek has a wand too, so he's not useless without his broom.

At least the amount of Shy Guy species and types have a number of things that could be used in a moveset, but it may be too similar to Villager in that regard, and it's still a generic enemy, not much of chance for those reasons.

Agreed, but Medusa was a major villain in both the first Kid Icarus and a major one in Uprising. In most cases, villains should be in before a second hero/heroine, unless it's like the case with Earthbound/Mother.

Kamek doesn't glide though, he flies on a broom, restricting that to only a recovery move takes away half of his character. He may have fans, but he's never really been that big of a character, maybe if he was at least somewhat differentiated from a regular Magikoopa, like even his design being different.

I just don't see generic enemy type characters getting in, might as well make items into playable characters. This isn't Mario Kart after all.

Medusa was only a major villain until [collapse=SPOILER]She got killed halfway through the game and replaced with a bigger villain.[/collapse]And villains getting in before secondary characters, well, you answered that already, plus Falco, Diddy Kong, etc.

 

[Salty the SLUG]

Ahh good choice my friend.

For a total of 3,000 Bells, you can have this signature gift wrapped to go. Is this a deal?

I'll give ya a Red Snapper! (If you get it, you get a gold star)

 

[augustoflores]

ecchhh!! i'm down 3,000 Bells! damn this economy!

 

[KingofPhantoms]

To be fair, it's repping a different game with Mother 3, and Ness isn't in that game. That's actually justified.

This doesn't apply to other series, though, save Fire Emblem, I guess. This would explain its lack of villains. But this does not apply to Kid Icarus at all.

Keep in mind I'm saying Medusa is probably a neater choice that helps show off villains(the female thing is a plus). I'm not saying Palutena's bad, but Medusa is kind of a good choice too. I never meant either was a more perfect one, of course.

Also, as I noted earlier, generic character isn't good enough of a reason. Villager, Pokemon Trainer himself, all the Pokemon(none of them are specific ones, even if they're loosely based upon some), prove the whole thing wrong. Also, I hope that wasn't an argument for Toad... there's multiple specifics Toads, and the one from Super Mario Bros. 2 is not a regular Toad in the race. He had a separate name in Japan, so he's unique anyway.

It'd be cool to play as a female villain for once.

You do have a point on the Pokemon and Pokemon trainer though, and no, it's not an argument against Toad at all.

Ahh good choice my friend.

For a total of 3,000 Bells, you can have this signature gift wrapped to go. Is this a deal?

3,000 Bells?! Tis a great deal Augusto!

Have anything else for sale Habanero?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

General Guy would still be better if had all that stuff his followers use...

I already have their stuff, I'm just not in Smash yet.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Have anything else for sale Habanero?

This out of context /feg/ comment.

This is about 1,600 Bells.

 

[Arcadenik]

Also, as I noted earlier, generic character isn't good enough of a reason. Villager, Pokemon Trainer himself, all the Pokemon(none of them are specific ones, even if they're loosely based upon some), prove the whole thing wrong. Also, I hope that wasn't an argument for Toad... there's multiple specifics Toads, and the one from Super Mario Bros. 2 is not a regular Toad in the race. He had a separate name in Japan, so he's unique anyway.

I think it doesn't matter if the playable Toad in Smash is Kinopio (THE Toad) or Kino (A Toad), you are still playing as Toad regardless.

 

[Opossum]

R-right.

Well, the deal with Chrom is that his general design is supposed to borrow characteristics from the other Lords, with most of the inspiration coming from Ike. His daughter meanwhile takes inspiration from Marth. Basically when you put the two together, it's supposed to give off vibes of Marth and Ike respectively, the two most well known and popular Lords in the series. You can tell from a design standpoint alone, and it was probably done so in order to highlight the most well received characteristics of a Lord character. Chrom himself also borrows form skills shared with Ike, such as Aether, and also boasts similarly distributed stats and stat growths. However, believe it or not, the similarities end there. Chrom and Ike have different back stories and motives, and their personalities were different with Ike generally being more rough due to his mercenary ties. It's also worth mentioning that unlike other Lords Chrom is capable of being reclassed into other classes aside from the typical Great Lord or equivalents.

Also, you might be wondering why I dislike Chrom so much if that is the case. Well to simply put into words, Chrom hasn't proven anything notably special. Yes he's a Lord which is all fine and dandy, but there are at least a dozen of them through out the series and they tend to be more colorful. There is of course the very notable problem of the character creating a negative sense of redundancy, which can easily create a sense of disappointment for veterans of the series and create a bad image of the Fire Emblem franchise for newcomers. There is just that lack of excitement for a character that feels like one big beaten horse, and in a franchise that has a very notable sense of diversity in play that is going to be an issue.

I appreciate that you kept this civil. I do have a question, though.

If, let's say, Chrom got in (alongside Marth and Ike, at least) and was given a completely unique moveset, would you still be heavily against him? In all honesty, I'm just curious, since you've been known to look at things from a gameplay perspective.

 

[JamesDNaux]

It'd be cool to play as a female villain for once.

Just makes me hate M$ even more, Grunty would have been perfect, villain, female, and ugly, that'd keep the feminists off our backs.

 

[Big-Cat]

I'll give ya a Red Snapper! (If you get it, you get a gold star)

These attempts at subtlety are sub par.

 

[Salty the SLUG]

These attempts at subtlety are sub par.

I wasn't trying to be subtle. It was a joke...

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It'd be cool to play as a female villain for once.

You do have a point on the Pokemon and Pokemon trainer though, and no, it's not an argument against Toad at all.?

I didn't mean you were making that argument. But yeah, Toad definitely should have the spot before Geno, Waluigi, or Paper Mario. Bowser Jr. is arguable, though. I think they could both get in at the same time. I like Waluigi the most of that list, but come on, Toad just got playable again, not the crappy recolors in NSMB, but the original playable Toad, in Super Mario World 3D. Enough. Said.

Also, you have no idea how much I wish they had actually put in a specific Trainer, but it's clearly Sakurai makes all the Pokemon characters generic while having influences from specific ones. The name of Pokemon Trainer and his exact basic Trophy outright confirmed his style. Even with Mewtwo, he didn't specifically add the one from the movie, just a Mewtwo with a masculine voice influenced by it. His moveset isn't even that similar to the first movie, anyway. Does it even have Shadow Ball in the second movie?

@Arcadenik: Actually, it does. His name on the Japanese screen would determine that. He has two different names, so whatever it is on there determine if it's the race or the specific character.

@Opossum: Probably yes. I don't find anything interesting about Chrom at all. Ike, Roy, Marth, Hector, Lyn, all more interesting. Either more unique, not Ike 2.0, or different weapons. Just making him unique alone wouldn't do it. Adding in somebody besides the latest Lord would do it for me.

 

[aleckermit]

I listened to what you guys had to say, here's my new roster prediction:

Swapped Pac Man for Rayman (Pac Man is the most likely 3rd party character to be added), cut Geno, cut Andy, cut Dillon, added Game & Watch.

I'd bet money R.O.B. will not return.

 

[IsmaR]

I'd flesh out said **** fantasies, free of charge.