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Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

Katy Parry

The Only Zelda in Indiana
Joined
May 20, 2007
Messages
3,328
Location
Indianapolis, IN
NNID
justysuxx
Watch the Wise One being the AT.

Edit: what if we get a boss? That would be incredible. Who would you guys want to see as a boss character from GS in Ultimate?
 
Last edited:

THE TemporaryFool

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 20, 2018
Messages
106
3DS FC
4355-9441-8851
I honestly don’t understand why Sakuri would have a character be an assist trophy, remove the, the next game, and then have them back by game three. Yes, I know that gray fox from metal gear is that exact kind of character, but that was because snake and all other metal gear content were not present in smash4
 

Teeb147

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
10,624
Relax peeps. There isn't very long now, we'll find out the truth :)
Isaac has pretty good chances and you know it.
 

Bladebreaker

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 26, 2018
Messages
71
I honestly don’t understand why Sakuri would have a character be an assist trophy, remove the, the next game, and then have them back by game three. Yes, I know that gray fox from metal gear is that exact kind of character, but that was because snake and all other metal gear content were not present in smash4
Timing, probably. Dark Dawn came after Brawl, but performed poorly, so he didn't return Isaac (along with a handful of other ATs) for 4, believing that nobody cared any more. Then the Ballot happens, giving Sakurai clear image into the wants and desires of the fanbase. At least, that's my thinking.
 

OpticalBlast

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 9, 2018
Messages
207
Alright, after initially losing hope, I've realized that insiders can be unreliable and that I'm going to wait until the Direct before actually freaking out. I'm not going with high expectations or anything, but at this point, with all the conflicting information and a leak that's undebunkable so far, anything can happen.

Also, I appreciate everyone's optimism in a time like this.
 

Ninetales Commander

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
36
I don't trust you and my reasons were made quite plain already. It is foolish to think that Isaac will be DLC if that wasn't even good enough to get back an assist trophy. And you know what back in Smash 4 he was just as popular and people were so sure that the AT not being there opened the gates for Isaac to be DLC. It didn't happen there it won't happen here. You can hold out hope if you'd like but if popularity didn't make a difference now why is it going to for DLC? No, I'd much rather hedge our bets on AT promotion because at least in that scenario our popularity got him something and that means a whole more than "oh he's not here so he' been saved for DLC.. maybe.. probably.. possibly"
So...what you're basically saying is if he can't get in as an assist trophy then what hopes does he have as a playable character? Well I would agree with you...except for the fact DLC is a thing. If Isaac doesn't show up at all in the base game, it won't be because he was not good enough to even get in as an assist, it will be because they are planning him as DLC. Sure, once Smash Bros Ultimate's life is over and the game is done and Isaac is still not in the game then fair enough, obviously he didn't land enough of an oomph to be given a spot on the roster but you can't say that now unless you happen to be a Time Lord with a TARDIS.
As for what you said about Smash Bros 4, that's a bad comparison, The Smash Bros Ballot actually started late into Smash Bros 4's Lifespan as it only ran for 6 months and during that time they were busy with all the DLC characters and new content. My guess is maybe the ballot was planned to go on for Smash Bros 4 but when it became clear the Nintendo Wii U was a massive flop, they decided to go ahead and end Smash Bros 4 and move all their attention to Smash Bros Ultimate. Point is; The popularity is as strong now as it is back then, you're right about that, but due to circumstances it just wasn't able to be put to good use, something today proves different.
 

DCavalier

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 23, 2014
Messages
99
NNID
cavalierredeyes
Switch FC
SW 5638 2481 3507
We almost there guys.
Just a little longer.
 

EricTheGamerman

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Messages
3,197
My annoyance with the current situation is that people seem to act like bringing Isaac back as an assist trophy is no big deal. That deciding to actively re-include his assist trophy would just make sense all of this content in Smash Ultimate is returning content.

Those people seem to completely disregard the immense popularity of Isaac. Almost this entire hype season, I've seen posts supporting Isaac on Reddit. I see fan artwork of Isaac on all kinds of different places. He consistently performs well on any sort of fan poll or ballot. He's number one according to the Source Gaming exit polls currently of unconfirmed characters, and was number two overall. He got number two on the Reddit fan ballot a few weeks ago, only trumped by the titans of Banjo Kazooie. European polls place him highly. The tweet has been analyzed relentlessly to indicate a Golden Sun reference.

This is all to say, bringing back his assist trophy isn't a nod to an old fan pick. It's actively ignoring one of the most requested, if not currently most requested character in the Smash community. People at GameFAQs will love to dismiss him, and GameXplain at times might not even give him the time of day, but he has this massive presence within the community. And he's had a pretty significant push for character inclusion since Brawl, which gives him a benefit above virtually every other character right now (Except Geno). If the fan demand was so large as to even consider his inclusion in the game in any form, I suspect it was more than enough to make him an actual playable character.

**** it, I'm dying on this hill with you all one way or the other. I may have been a little too overly worried about his chances as from a dead franchise, but the love and support I've seen after the Grinch leak just reaffirms how good of a shot he should really have going into tomorrow's Direct.
 

Geildus

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
2
I’ve been lurking on this thread since you guys hit 500 pages and I gotta say the change from the 50 Cent reference to the Beatles reference was crazy enough. I’ve seen a lot of people lose hope and regain it in mere minutes but I gotta say his chances are through the roof at this point. I’m happy that Isaac has this much support. Here’s to getting our Golden boy tomorrow or possibly Golden boys ;)
 

True Blue Warrior

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 4, 2013
Messages
9,727
Location
United Kingdom
NNID
TrueBlueSM
3DS FC
2036-7619-4276
Updating this support list for the last time until the direct finishes with all the people who have been tagged.

  1. _Sheik
  2. 1/128
  3. 9Blades
  4. ☆Jisatsu☆
  5. *Verrix*
  6. ?!?!?!
  7. Accursed
  8. AceyT
  9. Adeptmune
  10. Agk0001
  11. Aguki90
  12. airConditioner
  13. AirMac1
  14. aldelaro5
  15. alguidrag
  16. Akod
  17. AlliwantisIsaac
  18. Altais
  19. Amberloo
  20. Amtoj
  21. AncientArk
  22. andimidna
  23. Androobie
  24. Aeon Lupin
  25. Apollyon
  26. Aqua Rock X
  27. AquaDork1
  28. AquaSol
  29. Arcadenik
  30. ArkSPiTFirE
  31. Arsenal234,
  32. Arteen
  33. Asian_Charizard
  34. Astraltar
  35. Aureola
  36. Aurora Jenny
  37. AustarusIV
  38. AwesomeCauliflower68
  39. Awesomedude444
  40. aztimh
  41. Backgammon
  42. Baddies are back
  43. Balgorxz
  44. BandannaWaddleDee
  45. Bane84
  46. Banjodorf
  47. bassem6
  48. Bassoonist
  49. Billybae10K
  50. BillyBat
  51. Bingoshi
  52. Bkupa666
  53. Black Magician
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  55. Bladebreaker
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  75. Capita
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  209. Huanchi
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  211. iam8bit
  212. Icana
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  214. Inawordyes
  215. IntelliHeath1
  216. Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur
  217. isaac3000
  218. Isaac4SmashUltimate
  219. Isaac for Smash Pls
  220. IsaacOrRiot
  221. Isaac: Venus Adept
  222. Istry555
  223. ItsRainingGravy
  224. ItsYio
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  310. MainJPW
  311. Malcolm Belmont
  312. MaskO'Gears
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  315. MatthewVenusAdept
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  322. MetalMario128
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  324. Midnight Torch
  325. Miifighters4Smash5
  326. Minato Arisato
  327. Mike Cometa
  328. Mikegamer0608
  329. Mishudo
  330. Monkokaio
  331. MonopolyRubix
  332. MorbidAltruism
  333. Moydow
  334. MrGame&Rock
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  337. Muirkat
  338. Mythzotick
  339. mynameisv
  340. MysticKnives
  341. N1N
  342. N3ON
  343. Nauzgo
  344. Necro Toad
  345. Neo Zero
  346. NessAtc.
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  350. Ninjakid41592
  351. Nintandy
  352. Nintendokusou
  353. NitrusVirus
  354. NNN
  355. NonSpecificGuy
  356. NoOtherPersona
  357. NoR4U
  358. Nossnitro102
  359. Octillus
  360. Oddyesy
  361. oh.glory
  362. OhMyBanana54
  363. Olo
  364. Onassi2
  365. Oniric Spriter
  366. Ookami Ryo
  367. OpticalBlast
  368. OptimisticStrifer
  369. Oracle_Summon
  370. Organization XIII
  371. osby
  372. otarolgam
  373. Oz37
  374. Pacack
  375. Pakky
  376. Papagenos
  377. ParanoidDrone
  378. Pcubed007
  379. Pennate
  380. Phaazoid
  381. PhilosophicAnimal
  382. pholtos
  383. Pizza Robo
  384. P.Kat
  385. Plain Yogurt
  386. Plato Xaiver
  387. Playcube
  388. PlayfulMushroom
  389. POKEMANSPIKA
  390. PokiehlthePoet
  391. Powerman293
  392. praline
  393. ProperlyBasic
  394. proxian
  395. psb123
  396. PSIguy89
  397. PSYNergy
  398. PrinceGal3n
  399. PurpleStuff5
  400. PWN3
  401. Pwnapplez
  402. Pyzlnar
  403. QcSlayer
  404. Q-Long
  405. Quetzal77
  406. R.O.B.
  407. Radical Beam
  408. Radori
  409. Raetah
  410. Rafuki21
  411. Raykz
  412. Raziek
  413. Red Dasher
  414. Red Ryu
  415. ReeseBalaski
  416. RegiGygas117
  417. RenH
  418. Replica
  419. Rethuic
  420. Retroen
  421. RetroMetalSonic
  422. RhymeswithEmpty
  423. Roger Smith
  424. RosaPeach
  425. Royaru
  426. roydgriffin
  427. Royvolution Ream
  428. RumpletrellskiN
  429. Ryan
  430. Ryuji
  431. Ryuutakeshi
  432. Sabrewulf238
  433. Saer2k
  434. Sagittarius
  435. Salocin
  436. sandfall
  437. SanicJan
  438. Sari
  439. Scatmansworld25
  440. Scoliosis Jones
  441. scoobymcsnack
  442. Seb9k+
  443. SebasSancy
  444. Secret Sexytime
  445. Seleir
  446. Seoxys
  447. Sephazon
  448. ShadowGuy1
  449. Shawnullah
  450. sheik93
  451. shellshocker18
  452. Shin F.
  453. Shinhed-echi
  454. Shiny Porygon
  455. Shog
  456. Sidboylol
  457. Silo777
  458. SirCamp
  459. Skeleton o' Fun
  460. SkullKidKing
  461. Skyblade12
  462. Skyfox2000
  463. sman3975
  464. Smash_Handle69
  465. SmashBro99
  466. smashingDoug
  467. smashkirby
  468. Smashmar2
  469. smash puffle
  470. SmashShadow
  471. smashtriforce77
  472. smileMasky
  473. SmilingMad
  474. SMX
  475. Solbliminal
  476. Solfiner
  477. someonetookjacob
  478. SonicLink125
  479. SonicSmasher
  480. SoraSaturn
  481. Sordim522
  482. SorMago
  483. SorrowOfAcheron
  484. SoulofKhaos
  485. Soulsaint
  486. SoupCanMafia
  487. Sparkus
  488. Spatman
  489. Spazzy_D
  490. Speedwagon
  491. spoilerowl
  492. Spootondorf
  493. Sqid
  494. Squirtle/Mario guy
  495. SSBFan
  496. Staarih
  497. StaffofSmashing
  498. Strider_Bond00J
  499. StrikeBlade
  500. SundaeS
  501. SuperBrawler
  502. Superfiremario
  503. SuperNintendoKid
  504. Supersmash77
  505. Superyoshiom
  506. Swampasaur
  507. Sykin
  508. Takasmash
  509. tamagone
  510. TappyBat
  511. TBone06
  512. tbuster766
  513. TCT~Phantom
  514. TeamFlareZakk
  515. Techno1000
  516. Tecnoid
  517. Teeb147
  518. TeenGirlSquad
  519. TehEpicRyuga
  520. TempestSurge
  521. Tetiro
  522. ThatShadowLink
  523. THE 6r
  524. The Curious Volnutt
  525. The One Who Wrote This
  526. Thekewlusername
  527. T-Hell
  528. TheRealHeroOfWinds
  529. TheSeanMan
  530. TheSpaceKing
  531. The Stoopid Unikorn
  532. TheTactician
  533. THE TemporaryFool
  534. thethirdkoopa
  535. TheZoologist
  536. ThirdDay
  537. ThoughtfulWanderer
  538. ThunderOverload
  539. TiaSilvia
  540. TimeSmash
  541. Tinfoil
  542. Tiymako
  543. ToothiestAura
  544. topspin1617
  545. Tornado_Man
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  548. True Blue Warrior
  549. Turmalinium
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  554. Undella2
  555. User Name String
  556. UtopianPoyzin
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  558. Vann Accessible
  559. Vegito2727
  560. Venus of the Desert Bloom
  561. Vintage Creep
  562. Violenceman
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  564. walph
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  566. Warheart_666
  567. Wigglytuff ★
  568. winterofsilver
  569. Wintropy
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  577. xLemmy_KoopaX
  578. xNaz
  579. xpnc
  580. XTremeGamer1234
  581. XxLtxX
  582. Yangfly Leone
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  589. Your Hero
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  592. Yusa
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  598. Zalaresh
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  600. ZanZero
  601. ZarroTsu
  602. ZeldaMaster
  603. ZelDan
  604. ZestyÑ
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  608. Zuppo
 
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Dionaea_floridensis

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 28, 2018
Messages
484
Even if Isaac is an AT (I believe Viriginben. He hasn't missed anything so far) I'm still going to push for him to be fully playable.
 

Sabrewulf238

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 17, 2007
Messages
5,164
Location
Ireland
I was just thinking that it was interesting how the Grinch leak came out basically just a week before this Smash direct.

I can't tell if that's notable or not.
 

Organization XIII

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
2,083
So...what you're basically saying is if he can't get in as an assist trophy then what hopes does he have as a playable character?.
Sort of. What I'm saying is that if his popularity couldn't even get him back his role as an AT then he won't be DLC. Sakurai doesn't plan characters to be DLC so I highly doubt a situation will occur where Sakurai knowing his popularity didn't plan to use Isaac and then makes him DLC. If he's not on base and there's no AT then his popularity didn't matter and it won't be a strong reason for him to be DLC like everyone says. And in fact it'll even be a hindrance for Smash 6 everyone will say "Well Isaac was a popular choice for the last but Sakurai didn't even give them an assist trophy and his series is still dead. No chance he'll be in this game." Unless there's a file proving Isaac was meant to be played and time constraints happened having nothing is far less preferable to having the AT return.
 

TappyBat

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 30, 2018
Messages
596
Watch the Wise One being the AT.

Edit: what if we get a boss? That would be incredible. Who would you guys want to see as a boss character from GS in Ultimate?
saturos and menardi!

Even if Isaac is an AT (I believe Viriginben. He hasn't missed anything so far) I'm still going to push for him to be fully playable.
um veggiebutton's missed a ton of stuff actually. k.rool, chrom, richter, dark samus, isabelle being unique, he said zero would be playble and freaking noctis would be too. plus all the SC6 stuff he's gotten wrong.
 
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LegendOfDragoon

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 7, 2015
Messages
447
Even if Isaac is an AT (I believe Viriginben. He hasn't missed anything so far) I'm still going to push for him to be fully playable.
He also hasn't gotten anything right when he's started it outright, other than Ridley.

He only said snake and icies we're back with no cuts, that's not everyone is here.

He stole Simon from stealth

He didn't get Daisy, chrom, dark Samus, or King k rool.

For the longest time he only said a new Pokemon rep and a few that it wouldn't be.

He still hasn't pinned down a square rep. And he even backed off that one after box theory, saying it could be dlc.

He might have known something at one point. I don't think that's the case anymore.

Edit: I forgot to mention he never definitely started whether Isabelle would be unique or echo

Edit2 he also said Simon would be revealed at e3, so he has been wrong with smash.
 
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THE TemporaryFool

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 20, 2018
Messages
106
3DS FC
4355-9441-8851
Just a thought: what if the grinch leak, vergeben, and every single insider out there are false, and something else entirely happens.
 

spaceperson741

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 25, 2018
Messages
35
I was just thinking that it was interesting how the Grinch leak came out basically just a week before this Smash direct.

I can't tell if that's notable or not.
I think that the more important thing with the timing is how close it is to release, since Nintendo would have to give things out to companies that specialize in marketing (like ACP-PLV) to get stuff ready for release, as people have stated, I think.
 

spaceperson741

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 25, 2018
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Just a thought: what if the grinch leak, vergeben, and every single insider out there are false, and something else entirely happens.
I could very much imagine that scenario. This is Sakurai's love letter to the community, and it wouldn't surprise me if he tried as hard as humanly possible to prevent leaks.
 

Teeb147

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
10,624
Verge aint the only insider, and the others talk in favor of Isaac.

Popularity, leak, insiders. and a freakin growth item in a trailer.
I mean come on. There's a lot going good.

It's going to be what it's going to be, and there isn't long to find out. So if you can, just look forward to finding out finally. :)
Wish you and us all luck, and hope yous enjoy the smash info too :)
 
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D

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Isaac on base roster, Matthew as AT, and Felix as possible DLC Echo Fighter.

I can live with this.
 

Deathcarter

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Messages
1,358
On the topic of Vergeban saying Isaac is an AT, I wouldn't exactly give him a ton of credibility on any content that isn't playable characters. Dude has never commented on ATs, stages, game modes, or any other secondary content before the Grinch Leak so why should we trust him on things like that now? Sure Vergeban was correct that Mimikyu wouldn't be playable but a lot of people thought Mimikyu had too weird a body type to be a playable character so I'm not giving him credit on that.
 
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D

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On the topic of Vergeban saying Isaac is an AT, I wouldn't exactly give him a ton of credibility on any content that isn't playable characters. Dude has never commented on ATs, stages, game modes, or any other secondary content before the Grinch Leak so why should we trust him on things like that now? Sure Vergeban was correct that Mimikyu wouldn't be playable but a lot of people thought Mimikyu had too weird a body type to be a playable character so I'm not giving him credit on that.
It’s pronounced veggie burger

And yeah veggie burger is gonna get demolished tomorrow
 

SonicLink125

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I think that the more important thing with the timing is how close it is to release, since Nintendo would have to give things out to companies that specialize in marketing (like ACP-PLV) to get stuff ready for release, as people have stated, I think.
A leak was sadly inevitable being this close to release. It was only a matter of when. This really feels like the ESRB leak days back in Smash 4. But it's much more wild now.

Still am 95% Real on it. And proud to be part of The Grinch Crew! I hope that becomes a thing after this Direct!
 

Ninetales Commander

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 13, 2018
Messages
36
Sakurai doesn't plan characters to be DLC so I highly doubt a situation will occur where Sakurai knowing his popularity didn't plan to use Isaac and then makes him DLC.
That's definitely not true, Mewtwo was announced before Smash Bros Wii U was released and only a couple of weeks after Smash Bros 3DS came out. He definitely planned Mewtwo to be DLC before the base game was done. In addition, it's likely Roy, Ryu, and Lucas were in development during that time as well so clearly yes, he does plan characters to be DLC before the base game is done.
If it can happen with those characters, it can definitely happen with Isaac.
 

PurpleStrings16

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Joined
Sep 1, 2018
Messages
48
If I can offer thoughts regarding the insiders,

I truly have no clue why it makes sense to listen to them even at a miniscule extent.

There is nothing tangible offered to us. There is nothing we can look at. Nothing to go off of.

We have dealt with leak after leak, rumor after rumor, insider after insider this whole Smash cycle and they are just now being taken into consideration? It truly is not worth your time to ponder their accuracy in my opinion—- especially this close to Direct time. There is so many interesting things happening right now, I can’t even try to focus on boring old vague insider leaks. They are a dime a dozen, bring absolutely nothing new to the conversation, and never did with limited exception to the obvious ones.

You know what we have seen? The Grinch leak. And it looks damn good with Isaac next to a Djinn spawning vines. I would much rather place faith in a leak of that prestige with graphical evidence rather than the word of a stranger on the internet. I would not be ashamed to have been fooled by it, either.

I do not wish to imply leakers cannot have genuine information or that the Grinch leak has to be true, but I think it is important to distinguish the sheer likelihood that random people you do not know have real information about Smash compared to a banner that looks absolutely authentic and speaks for itself.

The Grinch leak not only has far more going for it, it does not even need to be real in order for insiders to fabricate statements.

Don’t let it dishearten you. I’ll say it again, I have a lot of faith in Isaac for tomorrow.

oh hi 68 lurkers. what do you all think? will we be snowglobed tomorrow?
I have a good feeling for ya boi.
 
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Organization XIII

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2,083
That's definitely not true, Mewtwo was announced before Smash Bros Wii U.
If it can happen with those characters, it can definitely happen with Isaac.
I'm very positive they weren't planned to be DLC day one. Which was the point of what I was saying. If Sakurai didn't plan him day one for something then DLC isn't a real option.
 
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Salocin

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 5, 2018
Messages
19
Kind of off topic, but in preparation for the Direct I bought the first two Golden Sun games from the Wii U eShop and I’m really enjoying them!

Isaac being an AT would be...bad, but at least he would be in the game in some form, and he’d have his own HD model which is something. Still hoping against the odds that he’s playable and that Vergeben mixed up Matthew and Isaac when it came to the assist trophy. But whatever happens, happens. Even if Isaac isn’t playable/is AT’d, Ultimate is gonna be an absolutely incredible game....and we can always beg for Felix/Jenna as DLC! ;)
 

Ninetales Commander

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Messages
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I'm very positive they weren't planned to be DLC day one. Which was the point of what I was saying. If Sakurai didn't plan him day one for something then DLC isn't a real option.
I understand what you are saying but the issue I have is it looks like you think you know how Sakurai thinks. How do you know he doesn't consider DLC till after the game? Can you honestly tell me with 100% certainty that when he looked at Isaac he never considered the possibility of saving him for DLC? Truth is, you can't, there is absolutely nothing stopping Sakurai from saving characters for DLC, in fact I would argue that due to how well Isaac did in the ballot, it may actually effect Sakurai's decision on whether or not to save them for DLC. He could simply say "Well, this character has a lot of support in the ballot but I don't think we can fit him into the base game due to time constraints so if the game sells well, we'll put him in 1 of the DLC packs.".
Obviously I'm not stating these as facts, I also don't know how Sakurai thinks but neither do you.
Also, when you say "Day 1" do you mean Day 1 of development? If so, that's right, he likely didn't plan DLC back that far but loads of things change during development and characters get cut. If things can be changed midway into development, so can plans for DLC.
 
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