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Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

Arsenal234

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 29, 2018
Messages
128
Hey guys, I'm a primary frequenter of the Bandana Dee thread. (My most wanted)

I just wanted to stop by and say I'd like to be added to the support list. Originally I wasn't too sure about Isaac but now I'm sure I want him in. Dark Dawn was the first game I played, and although people might think that's a sin on its own a lot of the game has stuck with me pretty positively. I even grinded to get all my party members to level 99 to beat the optional bosses.

Overall the game was pretty fun, and I'm sure I'll eventually get around to the other two entries. In the meantime I'd really be interested in seeing Isaac join, but I have a few questions.

1. Who would his echo be? Felix or Matthew?
2. Would his moveset only use Venus Psynergy?
3. What's his stage going to be? Possible Assist Trophy?
4. Could his appearance in Dark Dawn be an alternate costume?
5. How exactly could Djinn work in his moveset?
6. How much would his sword (sol blade?) appear in his moveset?
Always good to see another supporter for Isaac. To answer your questions:

1. Felix
2. Depends on what Sakurai wants to do
3. Venus lighthouse, maybe Alex as an assist?
4. Dark dawn Isaac is significantly taller and older than Isaac from the first games so I doubt it.
5. I was thinking he would set 1 of 4 djinn to him as his down B (similar to Shulk's arts). When the djinn is set, his down B would change to a different move, giving him 4 different moves as his down B all revolving around djinn.
6. Jab ,tilts, some aerials. Leaving all of his smashes, 3 of his special moves, other aerials, and all of his grabs as psnergy.
 

Arsenal234

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 29, 2018
Messages
128
Before passing judgment?


But jokes aside, originally I was neutral about it, but considering he's one of the highest and final contenders I wouldn't want to end up thinking he's just another generic anime swordsman or something.
You are better than most people on the internet. A lot of people don't do any research into a character's moveset potential, they just look a a picture of Isaac call him "blonde Marth" and proceed to hate on him. I respect that you actually played a Golden Sun game, and thought about the character before passing judgement.
 

Organization XIII

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 10, 2015
Messages
2,083
I'm sorry to my fellow Andy fans but well Paper Mario is my third most wanted after Isaac and Banjo so I hope you won't think less of me as I vote against Andy.
 

FooltheFlames

needs hugs~<3
Joined
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Messages
951
Location
Ashley's Haunted Mansion!
dang!
Y'all might just hit 500 pages here soon... I thought that was impossiblez~
I do hope Nintendo has some secret ninjas about, so they can see all the love and support Isaac gets around here (^ ^)
 

pholtos

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 15, 2018
Messages
404
The most wanted newcomers up until Smash 4's announcement were:

S-tier:
Ridley
Mewtwo
Mega Man
K. Rool

A-tier:
Little Mac
Isaac
Roy
Palutena
Bowser Jr.
Hmm... One of these things is not like the other... one of these isn't currently in Smash... Let's fix that! :3
 

XenoWarriorX

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Messages
2,278
Before passing judgment?


But jokes aside, originally I was neutral about it, but considering he's one of the highest and final contenders I wouldn't want to end up thinking he's just another generic anime swordsman or something.
I'm at least glad you did your research man. :>

Welcome to the thread.
 

FooltheFlames

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Umm... I just checked the Supporters list BUT my name doesn't appear to be on it??? :confused:
I'm pretty sure i asked to be on it several hundred pages back (before or right after the 8/8 direct)
Maybe I wasn't clear enough before, but I remember saying his moveset ideas has me getting hyped as heck for and would be cool to see him playable in Smash.

So I would like to officially ask to be on his supporters list plz Embarrass
 

Isaac: Venus Adept

Smash Lord
Joined
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Messages
1,583
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Weyard
Hey guys, I'm a primary frequenter of the Bandana Dee thread. (My most wanted)

I just wanted to stop by and say I'd like to be added to the support list. Originally I wasn't too sure about Isaac but now I'm sure I want him in. Dark Dawn was the first game I played, and although people might think that's a sin on its own a lot of the game has stuck with me pretty positively. I even grinded to get all my party members to level 99 to beat the optional bosses.

Overall the game was pretty fun, and I'm sure I'll eventually get around to the other two entries. In the meantime I'd really be interested in seeing Isaac join, but I have a few questions.

1. Who would his echo be? Felix or Matthew?
2. Would his moveset only use Venus Psynergy?
3. What's his stage going to be? Possible Assist Trophy?
4. Could his appearance in Dark Dawn be an alternate costume?
5. How exactly could Djinn work in his moveset?
6. How much would his sword (sol blade?) appear in his moveset?
1. Felix makes more sense since the first two games are really both Isaac and Felix's stories from their perspectives and Felix is more visually distinct

2. His moveset would most likely heavily focus on Venus Psynergy since he is of course a Venus Adept but mixing djinns in Golden Sun gives Isaac access to new spells from different psynergy types so he can have a few non venus attacks in there

3. Venus Lighthouse is the most likely option for a stage since Isaac is connected to Venus and the elemental lighthouses are the main focal points of the original GBA games being the most memorable locations of the series. Jenna would make sense as the assist trophy as she is the bridge between the three protagonists (Isaac's wife, Felix's sister and Matthew's mother) as well as being a fan favorite character with her own theme

4. Isaac in Dark Dawn is much older with a bigger build than how he appeared in the GBA duolagy so that's unlikely. Having Matthew as an alt costume like Olimar has Alph to represent Dark Dawn is more likely

5. There are different ways I think they can incorporate djinn. He can have a move dedicated to a toggle to switch between djinn to alter the elemental properties of some of his attacks. A full fledged class system may be abit too complex for Smash so maybe it I think that is the best way they can do it. They can also implement more straightforward djinn spells like Flint

6. Sol Blade I would like as his standard weapon. Forward Smash is Ragnarok and fully charged forward Smash is a scaled down critical unleash being Meggido of course. He really only needs his sword for very few attacks like a leaping jab or dash attacks. I would prefer Isaac using some of the few sword focused psynergy spells like quick strike as a dash attack. It should be in less than 10% of his moveset imo
 
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KHJason95

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After Brawl's release Geno collapsed, and K. Rool expanded massively. However, I personally remember K. Rool gaining a lot of requests after Diddy Kong's confirmation in August 2007, and he was a big deal for the remaining few months of pre-Brawl (from the end of August to the end of January).

The most wanted newcomers up until Smash 4's announcement were:

S-tier:
Ridley
Mewtwo
Mega Man
K. Rool

A-tier:
Little Mac
Isaac
Roy
Palutena
Bowser Jr.
I was one who voted for ROY to return!
 

KMDP

Smash Legend
Joined
Jun 18, 2018
Messages
12,199
You are better than most people on the internet. A lot of people don't do any research into a character's moveset potential, they just look a a picture of Isaac call him "blonde Marth" and proceed to hate on him. I respect that you actually played a Golden Sun game, and thought about the character before passing judgement.
I mean, everyone knows all sword-wielders are the same.

These guys? -> :ultlink::ultmarth::ultike::ultrobin:ultcorrin::ultshulk::ultcloud::4miisword:
All identical in every conceivable way.
---
dang!
Y'all might just hit 500 pages here soon... I thought that was impossiblez~
I do hope Nintendo has some secret ninjas about, so they can see all the love and support Isaac gets around here (^ ^)
We're only about 3 pages away from surpassing the Smash 4 Isaac thread.

And like N3ON said, it'll be in half the time.
 
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Jupiter Ivan

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Messages
527
Question: Best case scenario. Isaac is revealed. Felix as an echo (or better yet, a semi clone now that we know that’s an option). Venus Lighthouse as the stage. Tens of music tracks both remixes and original. Garet, Ivan, Mia, Jenna, Sheba AND Piers make appearances as ATs. Saturos and Menardi as bosses. What will your reactions be?
 

LuminoZero

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 18, 2015
Messages
182
That's not best case for me. I want Sveta as an AT. Give me that, and I'll throw money at the game, amiibo, paid service, whatever.
 
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FooltheFlames

needs hugs~<3
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We're only about 3 pages away from surpassing the Smash 4 Isaac thread.

And like N3ON said, it'll be in half the time.
You guys are crazy! crazy loyal :awesome:
If they had secret ninjas about, Bomberman might be playable...
I often wonder why he wasn't shown as playable 1st along with Inkling & Ridley... it surely couldn't be licensing or moveset issues. In Bomberman Hero/64 alone he does way more than just bomb stuff, besides how misleading the name can be.
I do hope future DLC has him, Waluigi, and Ashley playable!
 

JaidynReiman

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JaidynReiman
You guys are crazy! crazy loyal:awesome:

I often wonder why he wasn't shown as playable 1st along with Inkling & Ridley... it surely couldn't be licensing or moveset issues. In Bomberman Hero/64 alone he does way more than just bomb stuff, besides how misleading the name can be.
I do hope future DLC has him, Waluigi, and Ashley playable!
Because they chose Simon instead. I thought that much was obvious.
 

TempestSurge

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 20, 2014
Messages
832
Exacly. Steve would be a horrible pick because Sakurai already knows that Banjo would be the better pick.


Also, Vergeben said this was a possibilty...

But didn't he say that he wanted to wait until he's absolutely sure that what he's saying is legit. Yet, here is he, saying that Steve might be legit despite not knowing if he was.
Along with Gen 7, Square, and Ken. Steve will mark the fourth character claim by Verge. So that's three uniques alone, I'd say we're due for some reveals real soon. Some of these characters are reaching, got to see it to believe it levels.
 
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Q-Long

Smash Lord
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Question: Best case scenario. Isaac is revealed. Felix as an echo (or better yet, a semi clone now that we know that’s an option). Venus Lighthouse as the stage. Tens of music tracks both remixes and original. Garet, Ivan, Mia, Jenna, Sheba AND Piers make appearances as ATs. Saturos and Menardi as bosses. What will your reactions be?
Them all making it as ATs and those two as bosses would be awesome. Though I doubt it would happen.

If the party members all make appearances, I think it would be for a Final Smash or assist trophy where they work together or something
 

Xenigma

Smash Lord
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Question: Best case scenario. Isaac is revealed. Felix as an echo (or better yet, a semi clone now that we know that’s an option). Venus Lighthouse as the stage. Tens of music tracks both remixes and original. Garet, Ivan, Mia, Jenna, Sheba AND Piers make appearances as ATs. Saturos and Menardi as bosses. What will your reactions be?
Ironically, I think that's actually a pretty poor scenario: sure, we'd be thrilled, but everyone else would be annoyed that Golden Sun got so much extra development time when more popular/relevant series have gotten far less, and I don't think that kind of resentment would be good for the fandom. Personally, I like to keep my hopes relative to what GS "deserves" at this junction: playable Isaac, a Golden Sun stage, a dozen or so music tracks. Anything else (Felix echo/AT, S&M boss, ???) is just gravy at that point, as we'd have won the battle of Golden Sun deserving playable status in Smash.
 

MeatOfJustice

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Messages
493
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Chile
Golden Sun The Broken Seal_1537472252197.png


- Oh Wise One, what is happening in there!?
- Aurora Borealis?
- Aurora Borealis! At this time of year, at this time of day, in this part of Angara, localized entirely within Sol Sanctum!?
- Yes.
- May I see it?
- No.
 
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VexTheHex

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 30, 2018
Messages
567
Which is what F-Zero fans are perfectly fine with when it comes to Black Shadow. They just want a 2nd character who would fit the heros vs villains archetype that Ultimate seems to be going for.



The reason Ninten is supported is because Echos are so easy to produce and would not cost much in labor costs and resources. It would easily fit the newcomers for the trilogy of the series. (You could also argue that Duster is supported for a new take on a moveset as well, but Ninten is more prominent since he would complete the protagonist representation of each game in the series)



The Metroid part is right, but many would love to have Krystal bring her own original moveset that no other Star Fox character has.



The issue is that Smash Brothers has multiple franchises that spans the entirety of Nintendo's history. To have the roster mainly support Pokemon, Kirby, Mario and Fire Emblem characters is a disservice to the vast pool of franchises that exists in Nintendo's family and library.



How do you think they are "getting torn down"? Do you believe the general Smash fan base wants the roster to mainly consist of Pokemon, Fire Emblem and Mario characters? Smash is a great way for Nintendo to introduce/reintroduce long forgotten franchises and breathe life back into old franchises.

You cannot tear down Pokemon, Kirby, Mario and Fire Emblem because not getting new characters would not effect their series at all; whereas, series like Golden Sun would benefit immensely from Smash recognition. Fire Emblem needed that boost to kick off in the States.



The Reboot Cast depends on what the goal of the Reboot itself is. Is it about Nintendo's history and the franchises it picked up over the years? Well there goes the majority of the Fire Emblem, Pokemon, Kirby and Mario casts; especially, if the roster space is extremely limited. If you need one character to represent each franchise that Nintendo owns then you can bet that big Nintendo series like Mario would be severely neutered in size.
If they're going reboot which is very possible with the naming of this one (how do you top Ultimate?), I easily see Mario, Pokemon, and Fire Emblem taking large blows. :ultmario::ultluigi::ultpeach::ultbowser: - There's the base for them. I could see us getting Toad or Waluigi as two long term popular ones that were left out for this entire stretch. Yoshi and Wario could also be left in as they are there for their own surviving series.

Fire Emblem? :ultmarth: and maybe :ultike:? Overall it's one that could suffer the most from a reboot. Chrom and Lucina were padding. Roy and Corrin were marketing. Robin isn't the most popular in smash, but they could scrape by possibly as they can stand their ground outside of that with Awakening's success.


Pokemon... that's a tough one. Depends if they decide to rep multiple gens or go with Gen 1. Jigglypuff is the weakest link. PT could stick but with starters varying in Gen... like Charizard, Piplup, and Grovyle. Only :ultpikachu: would be safe. Lucario, Greninja, and anyone added this time would be in a rough spot and may be cut, depends if Game Freak feels like keeping them in some spotlight or not.

I'd be worried about Pit, Ice Climbers, ROB, Wii Fit, and the like that are only fading in the background as time passes. If we get a reboot, they could be the first to do down. And that does include picks like Takamaru, Lip, Isaac, or Saki if they got in. Part of me is worried they'd just fall in the next installment without being successfully revived. Out of them, Isaac has the best shot at it. But it could also go the way of Kid Icarus where there is nothing planned after the "revival" which is pretty depressing in the end. This overall could also be why Starfox didn't see Krystal added as the series is on thin ice.
 
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Q-Long

Smash Lord
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Ironically, I think that's actually a pretty poor scenario: sure, we'd be thrilled, but everyone else would be annoyed that Golden Sun got so much extra development time when more popular/relevant series have gotten far less, and I don't think that kind of resentment would be good for the fandom. Personally, I like to keep my hopes relative to what GS "deserves" at this junction: playable Isaac, a Golden Sun stage, a dozen or so music tracks. Anything else (Felix echo/AT, S&M boss, ???) is just gravy at that point, as we'd have won the battle of Golden Sun deserving playable status in Smash.
Golden Sun : Upsoaring confirmed!
 

Oracle_Summon

Smash Hero
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Jul 31, 2013
Messages
5,059
If they're going reboot which is very possible with the naming of this one (how do you top Ultimate?), I easily see Mario, Pokemon, and Fire Emblem taking large blows. :ultmario::ultluigi::ultpeach::ultbowser: - There's the base for them. I could see us getting Toad or Waluigi as two long term popular ones that were left out for this entire stretch. Yoshi and Wario could also be left in as they are there for their own surviving series.
Only :ultmario: would be needed unless you are adding :ultluigi: to represent the Luigi's Mansion series. Why would you add Waluigi and Toad they are not as important as Mario to the Mario series.

Fire Emblem? :ultmarth: and maybe :ultike:? Overall it's one that could suffer the most from a reboot. Chrom and Lucina were padding. Roy and Corrin were marketing. Robin isn't the most popular in smash, but they could scrape by possibly as they can stand their ground outside of that with Awakening's success.
Only :ultmarth: would be needed as he is the face of the franchise.

Pokemon... that's a tough one. Depends if they decide to rep multiple gens or go with Gen 1. Jigglypuff is the weakest link. PT could stick but with starters varying in Gen... like Charizard, Piplup, and Grovyle. Only :ultpikachu: would be safe. Lucario, Greninja, and anyone added this time would be in a rough spot and may be cut, depends if Game Freak feels like keeping them in some spotlight or not.
If you are going by who is only needed according to roster size then you would have to choose one character per season, but that is only if your roster picks are going against one character per franchise.

I'd be worried about Pit, Ice Climbers, ROB, Wii Fit, and the like that are only fading in the background as time passes. If we get a reboot, they could be the first to do down. And that does include picks like Takamaru, Lip, Isaac, or Saki if they got in. Part of me is worried they'd just fall in the next installment without being successfully revived. Out of them, Isaac has the best shot at it. But it could also go the way of Kid Icarus where there is nothing planned after the "revival" which is pretty depressing in the end. This overall could also be why Starfox didn't see Krystal added as the series is on thin ice.
It depends on the reboot type you are considering. Not once has the type of reboot been addressed your example. What is being rebooted? What is the goal for franchises?
Note: To Clarify I am establishing the one character to represent a franchise rule.
 
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pholtos

Smash Journeyman
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Aug 15, 2018
Messages
404
I'd be worried about Pit, Ice Climbers, ROB, Wii Fit, and the like that are only fading in the background as time passes. If we get a reboot, they could be the first to do down. And that does include picks like Takamaru, Lip, Isaac, or Saki if they got in. Part of me is worried they'd just fall in the next installment without being successfully revived. Out of them, Isaac has the best shot at it. But it could also go the way of Kid Icarus where there is nothing planned after the "revival" which is pretty depressing in the end. This overall could also be why Starfox didn't see Krystal added as the series is on thin ice.
The way I see it, is if a series gets in Smash, it should keep at least one rep in all future installments. (If possible)
I could imagine that upsetting some fans here and there but that'd also mean no series gets cut just for the sake of trimming the character count in future games.
Mario and Pokemon I can imagine having multiple, while on the other hand, mother could be dropped to one, star fox to one, etc.
 

Ura

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With Incineroar, Steve, and Geno being rumored, i'm starting to get really scared for Isaac.

After that tweet post-8/8 Direct, i'm going to be cheesed if it turned out to be nothing.
 

LuminoZero

Smash Apprentice
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Oct 18, 2015
Messages
182
With Incineroar, Steve, and Geno being rumored, i'm starting to get really scared for Isaac.

After that tweet post-8/8 Direct, i'm going to be cheesed if it turned out to be nothing.
The Rathalos picture keeps me sane. It's too many references to just be all coincidences.
 

XenoWarriorX

Smash Champion
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Aug 11, 2018
Messages
2,278
With Incineroar, Steve, and Geno being rumored, i'm starting to get really scared for Isaac.

After that tweet post-8/8 Direct, i'm going to be cheesed if it turned out to be nothing.
Steve won''t get in. I KNOW he won't. Not before Banjo.


Cmon, have more faith in isaac.
 

ThoughtfulWanderer

Smash Lord
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Messages
1,054
With Incineroar, Steve, and Geno being rumored, i'm starting to get really scared for Isaac.

After that tweet post-8/8 Direct, i'm going to be cheesed if it turned out to be nothing.
The Steve rumor is really just Verge saying that the content could "potentially" be a playable character, and it's something he's never been definitive on from the moment he first leaked Minecraft content.

I don't like how it's so vague and wishy-washy, but for right now, it means nothing.
 

Ura

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The Rathalos picture keeps me sane. It's too many references to just be all coincidences.
Exactly. The way that pic was done has way too many nods to Golden Sun to pass it off as a coincidence or "just a MH reference". You don't tease your fanbase like that and leave them with nothing.
Steve won''t get in. I KNOW he won't. Not before Banjo.


Cmon, have more faith in isaac.
I dunno about you but I can. Steve being in would in theory attract the Minecraft audience to Smash which, while it makes me cringe makes all the sense in the world business wise.

Of course it doesn't have to have any barring on Isaac's chances of course but with Sakurai's "I hope you're not expecting too many new challengers" comment I can't say Isaac being included in addition to the 3 characters I mentioned. Unless he was the first character announced as DLC. Dunno how likely that is.
 

VexTheHex

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Messages
567
Only :ultmario: would be needed unless you are adding :ultluigi: to represent the Luigi's Mansion series. Why would you add Waluigi and Toad they are not as important as Mario to the Mario series.

Only :ultmarth: would be needed as he is the face of the franchise.

If you are going by who is only needed according to roster size then you would have to choose one character per season, but that is only if your roster picks are going against one character per franchise.

It depends on the reboot type you are considering. Not once has the type of reboot been addressed your example. What is being rebooted? What is the goal for franchises?
You're going too extreme. There's very little reason to think the Roster would drop to 64 level character count. Mario, Peach, and Bowser are faces of Nintendo and should be in over pretty much anyone else. Luigi also has his own series and his own very large fan base. I didn't see Isaac, Geno, Krystal, or Takamaru representing the Online features? Did you? No. Not even Pikachu or Kirby. It's extreme to say Peach and Bowser should be cut.

Even a reboot is likely going to introduce some new people. And yes, Super Mario would likely be first in line.

Toad has been wanted since even Melee but got doomed as Peach's move. If they reworked the entire cast that remains, it's possible Toad could get freed. Waluigi dwarves pretty much every remaining potential newcomer's popularity.

2.7 million views...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQ0iTDafXuM


True. Ike however built himself an empire in both Smash and FE. The series is huge and alive, it can stomach 2-3 characters even in a reboot with 4 being the push. Depends how Three Houses does and if the series stays afloat, I highly doubt it'll drop below 2 though.

Reboot being to rebuild the franchise. The roster count is getting high and may be too much to maintain if it's meant to be improved upon even more. And the ones to fall won't be the literal faces of Nintendo. The ones that will go down will be the dead series or series scrapping by.


The way I see it, is if a series gets in Smash, it should keep at least one rep in all future installments. (If possible)
I could imagine that upsetting some fans here and there but that'd also mean no series gets cut just for the sake of trimming the character count in future games.
Mario and Pokemon I can imagine having multiple, while on the other hand, mother could be dropped to one, star fox to one, etc.
Even :ultrob: and :ultwiifittrainer:? I feel we may lose some series if they reboot. Even :ultolimar: could end up in trouble depending on Pikmin 4. :<
 

XenoWarriorX

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Exactly. The way that pic was done has way too many nods to Golden Sun to pass it off as a coincidence or "just a MH reference". You don't tease your fanbase like that and leave them with nothing.

I dunno about you but I can. Steve being in would in theory attract the Minecraft audience to Smash which, while it makes me cringe makes all the sense in the world business wise.

Of course it doesn't have to have any barring on Isaac's chances of course but with Sakurai's "I hope you're not expecting too many new challengers" comment I can't say Isaac being included in addition to the 3 characters I mentioned. Unless he was the first character announced as DLC. Dunno how likely that is.
The minecraft crowd, while very passionate, isn't nearly as big as it used to be.

I'd also like to point out that Sakurai wouldn't go to microsoft for a charcter that had only strated having history with the Wii u.

Banjo was at least a Nintendo character at some point.

And even if they did pick steve, i don't think anyone in the samsh community would be happy with hom over Banjo. And Banjo was also pretty high on the ballot,

But either way, this doesn't kill Isaac's chances either way. B E L I E V E.
 
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LegendOfDragoon

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Messages
447
Because they chose Simon instead. I thought that much was obvious.
Simon definitely has the stronger history with Nintendo at the very least (Nothing against Bomberman, it would be hard for anyone to compete with the Castlevania history with Nintendo.
 

MeatOfJustice

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Steve being in wouldn't mean Banjo won't. If you're going to ask for MS characters, why not go all out (without spending too much, of course)?
 

VexTheHex

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567
Steve being in wouldn't mean Banjo won't. If you're going to ask for MS characters, why not go all out (without spending too much, of course)?
Similar mindset as what happened with Geno and Cloud. The hardcore wanted Geno, but the general current and wildly popular pick would be Cloud/Final Fantasy. The 3rd party series could easily prefer marketing their #1 instead of some dormant character they don't care about anymore. Banjo could make it in, but it's possible they'd rather him be DLC to make the extra bucks.
 

pholtos

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Even :ultrob: and :ultwiifittrainer:? I feel we may lose some series if they reboot. Even :ultolimar: could end up in trouble depending on Pikmin 4. :<
Yeah, even them. By itself, one character from each current series based on how the website divides them up is only 32 at present. That by itself is between Melee and Brawl totals characterwise. Naturally some series' will have more than 1 but hopefully that puts things into perspective.
 

Confirmation

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Messages
648
This Steve stuff is hilarious. Remember:

Vergeben has leaked 3 characters so far and stated his sources don't invalidate Box Theory. Now we have a 4th, meaning something has to give. Either Vergeben is sucking as much attention out as he can and dropped Box Theory as quick as he could when it was beginning to bite him, or he got a bombshell of new information in the last 2? days that leads to this conclusion.

Remember that Sakurai doesn't care about marketing choices. He had the option of choosing any FF character, many of which would probably be more appealing to current consumers, and he went with the one he viewed as an icon and that *fans* wanted. It would be unlikely how he's acted in the past to cheese Banjo supporters like that and go with a popular character nobody asked for.
 

Oracle_Summon

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 31, 2013
Messages
5,059
You're going too extreme. There's very little reason to think the Roster would drop to 64 level character count. Mario, Peach, and Bowser are faces of Nintendo and should be in over pretty much anyone else. Luigi also has his own series and his own very large fan base. I didn't see Isaac, Geno, Krystal, or Takamaru representing the Online features? Did you? No. Not even Pikachu or Kirby. It's extreme to say Peach and Bowser should be cut.
What is the hypothetical roster size for you?

Even a reboot is likely going to introduce some new people. And yes, Super Mario would likely be first in line.

Toad has been wanted since even Melee but got doomed as Peach's move. If they reworked the entire cast that remains, it's possible Toad could get freed. Waluigi dwarves pretty much every remaining potential newcomer's popularity.

2.7 million views...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQ0iTDafXuM
But popularity does not matter here, only franchises with relevancy. The other question is why does Rosalina get cut but Waluigi gets added? What does Peach and Bowser add to the roster that Mario doesnt fulfill already?


True. Ike however built himself an empire in both Smash and FE. The series is huge and alive, it can stomach 2-3 characters even in a reboot with 4 being the push. Depends how Three Houses does and if the series stays afloat, I highly doubt it'll drop below 2 though.
Ike is the symbolism of when Fire Emblem itself start failing as a Franchise. Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn marked when the series started stagnating in sales. Or does that not apply here?

Reboot being to rebuild the franchise. The roster count is getting high and may be too much to maintain if it's meant to be improved upon even more.
What exactly do you mean by "rebuilding the franchise" and what is the roster cap size?

And the ones to fall won't be the literal faces of Nintendo. The ones that will go down will be the dead series or series scrapping by.

Even :ultrob: and :ultwiifittrainer:? I feel we may lose some series if they reboot. Even :ultolimar: could end up in trouble depending on Pikmin 4. :<
So if what I am understanding is correct, this would be the final roster:

Mario Series: :ultmario::ultluigi::ultpeach::ultbowser:
Pokemon Series::ultpikachu:
Fire Emblem Series: :ultmarth::ultike: (only if being the face of when Fire Emblem failed does not go against him) :ultlucina: (if most popular and face of when the franchise prospered and that is only if you get to choose one Awakening character).
Kirby Series: :ultkirby::ultmetaknight::ultkingdedede:
Zelda: :ultlink::ultzelda::ultganondorf:
Splatoon: :ultinkling:
Metroid (only if you don't count Metroid as a struggling series): :ultsamus::ultridley:
Animal Crossing (only since they are getting to be quite popular): :ultvillager: and Isabelle.

I don't know what to put for third parties as I do not know the criteria you are looking for them.

So all in all, if I understand you correctly your roster would be: :ultmario::ultluigi::ultpeach::ultbowser::ultpikachu::ultmarth:(:ultlucina:/:ultike:):ultkirby::ultmetaknight::ultkingdedede::ultlink::ultzelda::ultganondorf::ultinkling::ultsamus::ultridley::ultvillager: (Isabelle included). No Third parties added as I cannot detail the condition of their series.
Edit: I added no more Nintendo series because the future of their success is uncertain.
 
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XenoWarriorX

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 11, 2018
Messages
2,278
Capcom and Konami

that's all I'm going to say
Snake was in brawl.

Simon was in ultimate.

Mega man was 4 (Base)

Ryu was in 4 (DLC)


This Steve stuff is hilarious. Remember:

Vergeben has leaked 3 characters so far and stated his sources don't invalidate Box Theory. Now we have a 4th, meaning something has to give. Either Vergeben is sucking as much attention out as he can and dropped Box Theory as quick as he could when it was beginning to bite him, or he got a bombshell of new information in the last 2? days that leads to this conclusion.

Remember that Sakurai doesn't care about marketing choices. He had the option of choosing any FF character, many of which would probably be more appealing to current consumers, and he went with the one he viewed as an icon and that *fans* wanted. It would be unlikely how he's acted in the past to cheese Banjo supporters like that and go with a popular character nobody asked for.
EXACTLY.
 
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