[SPOILER ALERT] - The Sevens Squares. - A Square-Enix general support threads.

[Deleted member]

How to rep Super Mario RPG and Kingdom Hearts with one character

Spoiler

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

I think it would be funny if after all the debate about the legality issues re: Disney and Sora, he was just revealed alongside Donald and Goofy as like his Final Smash or something. And Sakurai was just like "yes well, there's no way we could do Sora without Disney characters, after all that's the entire draw of Kingdom Hearts! *laughs*"

 

[shocktarts17]

So I wanted to discuss the "does DLC need to have worldwide appeal to be successful?" question and break it down using some fictional numbers to help make things clearer, because frankly I understand things easier when I can work with the numbers.

So lets say there are 3 million Smash owners right now and roughly 40% of its sales are from Japan, so around 1.3 million. Then lets look at Dragon Quest's popularity in Japan and see that it's consistently selling several millions of copies each game and suggest that most likely around 75% of the Smash fans in Japan are also Dragon Quest fans. So even if not a single person outside of Japan buys the DLC you could potentially be getting almost 1 million DLC sales right there, which is probably more than some other characters could get worldwide. Now add in the fact that the last several Dragon Quest games have both sold almost 1 million each over seas to the other 2 million Smash owners and you're likely to have at least a 25% overlap between Dragon Quest fans and Smash fans overseas, so that's another 500,000 right there. Then adding in people who have no experience with the game but thing the design is cool or just want to have all the characters and it's not hard to picture the Dragon Quest DLC selling well.

Adding all of this to the fact that like other have said you get the bonus of potentially raising the awareness in the west about a game that could clearly sell well (see Japan) if it was more known and it's just further reason to select a Dragon Quest character.

Of course all the numbers here are made up but it's not hard to see how Dragon Quest could still sell even if it's only popular in Japan just because of how popular it is in Japan.

 

[Kotor]

Exactly, why are people hatin’ on RPGs in Smash, when it’s not the most represented genre in the game. If anything platformers are the most represented genre in Smash.

People are still scarred by the number of FE characters added to Smash 4.

 

[Deleted member]

Happy 20th Smash Bros anniversary you Square Enix ****ers

 

[Ovaltine]

People are still scarred by the number of FE characters added to Smash 4.

It's such a misconception, too, that it's about FE as a whole, yet people do stretch it that way. FE actually has a lot of potential for huge, amazing movepools full of lances, magic, axes, and heck, even different kinds of blades that can entirely change a move set. The problem isn't FE, but the fact that we have four hecking Marth clones.

 

[ZelDan]

It's such a misconception, too, that it's about FE as a whole, yet people do stretch it that way. FE actually has a lot of potential for huge, amazing movepools full of lances, magic, axes, and heck, even different kinds of blades that can entirely change a move set. The problem isn't FE, but the fact that we have four hecking Marth clones.

Basically how I feel. I don't really have any issue with FE's representation interms of its quantity, but through it's playstyle. On top of 4 of the characters being pretty similar, there's also the fact that 3 of them come from Awakening. Yeesh.

One FE character I would have liked was Lyn. yeah, she's another Sword user, but I think she would be alot different from the "4 Marths" and Ike. She'd probably be the agile, stylish, technical or tricky type. It'd also be cool because her game was the first one to actually be localized outside of Japan, so it would have been nice to see that get more recognition.

 

[Deleted member]

Basically how I feel. I don't really have any issue with FE's representation interms of its quantity, but through it's playstyle. On top of 4 of the characters being pretty similar, there's also the fact that 3 of them come from Awakening. Yeesh.

One FE character I would have liked was Lyn. yeah, she's another Sword user, but I think she would be alot different from the "4 Marths" and Ike. She'd probably be the agile, stylish, technical or tricky type. It;d also be cool because her game was the first one to actually be localized outside of Japan, so it would have been nice to see that get more recognition.

I think Hector would be cool too

 

[shinhed-echi]

It's such a misconception, too, that it's about FE as a whole, yet people do stretch it that way. FE actually has a lot of potential for huge, amazing movepools full of lances, magic, axes, and heck, even different kinds of blades that can entirely change a move set. The problem isn't FE, but the fact that we have four hecking Marth clones.

I'm not an expert in FE. But there's also the fact that all of them share the exact same facial expression in Smash.

When Corrin was announced I was like "oh... Yet another depressive looking fire emblem swordsman...."

At least female Corrin now smiles, and I think female Robin too. Oh and Roy is angrier I guess.

 

[Flyboy]

The thing is, all the FE characters, even the clones, play totally differently. There's a lot of subtle variation among Marth and Lucina with how zoning and tactics work, and Roy and Chrom have totally different kits from Marth entirely and Chrom even has different specials and stats. I'm actually really loving Robin for her zoning and resource management playstyle. For all the easy hate they get, they all play SO differently. Maybe it helps that I enjoyed Roy a lot in Melee and I really like Awakening as a game.

It's not the weapon that affects how a character controls, but their kit. For the hard-on the Smash fandom has for Hector there's no guarantee that mechanically an axe-user would really be that different from anyone else.

And therefore! I actually hate that the Erdrick fans are being tasked to "prove" why Erdrick, as a sword-wielding RPG hero, would be different from the other sword users when the other sword users are already different from each other!

 

[Oblivion129]

What's it like to play #DragonQuest in virtual reality? We traveled to Tokyo to try it ourselves and give you a special tour of #VRZONE SHINJUKU! #DQXI #DQVR pic.twitter.com/HtibIqgwKe

— DRAGON QUEST (@DragonQuest) January 21, 2019

This is interesting. Dragon Quest VR and looks like the final boss is Zoma, which is the main villain of Dragon Quest III.

 

[Deleted member]

People are still scarred by the number of FE characters added to Smash 4.

I feel that its more than likely that for many people JRPGs are pretty much unknown to them, at least it seems so with the Smash fanbase. Curiously 2 of the most popular characters here are from Nintendo JRPGs, which could also mean that the fanbase doesn't seem to like to stray from Nintendo a lot.

 

[Rumble Red]

Y'know what franchise doesn't have any sword guys? That other strategy series that Intelligent Systems made. Shame we couldn't have gotten someone from that.

This is interesting. Dragon Quest VR and looks like the final boss is Zoma, which is the main villain of Dragon Quest III.

That exhibit (or whatever you'd call it) has been around for a while, but it's interesting that they're still bothering to put together stuff like this video. Doesn't necessarily mean anything, but this long after DQXI's release I'd have expected a return to dead silence. That's how it's usually gone.

 

[Deleted member]

Y'know what franchise doesn't have any sword guys? That other strategy series that Intelligent Systems made. Shame we couldn't have gotten someone from that.

Codename S.T.E.A.M.? Gotta say its an interesting idea, but I dont know how it would translate. Plus its a bit obscure and didnt sell well, surprised that it got one track in Ultimate so it was kind of nice.

 

[PsySmasher]

Basically how I feel. I don't really have any issue with FE's representation interms of its quantity, but through it's playstyle. On top of 4 of the characters being pretty similar, there's also the fact that 3 of them come from Awakening. Yeesh.

One FE character I would have liked was Lyn. yeah, she's another Sword user, but I think she would be alot different from the "4 Marths" and Ike. She'd probably be the agile, stylish, technical or tricky type. It'd also be cool because her game was the first one to actually be localized outside of Japan, so it would have been nice to see that get more recognition.

Now this is what I’m talking about.

I’ve wanted Lyn ever since Smash 4’s DLC, and that was before I ever gotten into the series.

But since she, along w/ Black Knight and Tiki, are already AT, I’ve been personally pushing for Anna (possibly in her Heroes incarnation) and Edelgard.

If we do get a new FE character in DLC, I hope they at least add more variety to the FE cast so maybe people would be less apprehensive about FE in Smash.

 

[Flyboy]

Not to go all Fire Emblem in the Squeenix thread but Anna would be my absolute favorite and I love her. She could use any weapon in the series canonically and she's been in every game. Variety, series rep, and a fun fun character.

And that's why 2B should be the Square rep because she has a million weapons yeah that's how I'm staying on topic

 

[Deleted member]

Instead the thread name should be "The Square thread" so that we can discuss anything related to squares while staying on topic

 

[Rumble Red]

Codename S.T.E.A.M.? Gotta say its an interesting idea, but I dont know how it would translate. Plus its a bit obscure and didnt sell well, surprised that it got one track in Ultimate so it was kind of nice.

Is that where we're at now?

I knew the Wars series was dead, but I didn't realize it was that dead.

 

[Untouch]

Sakurai's interview strengthens my thoughts on how DLC was picked.
He mentioned that ARMs and Xenoblade 2 were revealed too late, and they were revealed early 2017.
So I think that characters and series who were in the spotlight late 2016 were the characters picked. Joker fits this as Persona 5 was released September 2016.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

The thing is, all the FE characters, even the clones, play totally differently. There's a lot of subtle variation among Marth and Lucina with how zoning and tactics work, and Roy and Chrom have totally different kits from Marth entirely and Chrom even has different specials and stats. I'm actually really loving Robin for her zoning and resource management playstyle. For all the easy hate they get, they all play SO differently. Maybe it helps that I enjoyed Roy a lot in Melee and I really like Awakening as a game.

It's not the weapon that affects how a character controls, but their kit. For the hard-on the Smash fandom has for Hector there's no guarantee that mechanically an axe-user would really be that different from anyone else.

And therefore! I actually hate that the Erdrick fans are being tasked to "prove" why Erdrick, as a sword-wielding RPG hero, would be different from the other sword users when the other sword users are already different from each other!

That's why I hate when people crap on sword boys/girls they can have alot going for them but with the limited thinking of some people they'll just be generic but they won't your just not good enough to think of something cool

 

[3DSNinja]

am I the only one who would actually love it if Black Mage got in as a second FF rep

 

[Deleted member]

am I the only one who would actually love it if Black Mage got in as a second FF rep

Nope

 

[Deleted member]

am I the only one who would actually love it if Black Mage got in as a second FF rep

If its Vivi, sure.

Is that where we're at now?

I knew the Wars series was dead, but I didn't realize it was that dead.

Sorry mate, that was the first non-FE IS tactical franchise that came to my head. I played it the other day so it was fresh on my head.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

am I the only one who would actually love it if Black Mage got in as a second FF rep

It we got more FF music then absolutely

 

[Flaxr XIII]

Codename S.T.E.A.M.? Gotta say its an interesting idea, but I dont know how it would translate. Plus its a bit obscure and didnt sell well, surprised that it got one track in Ultimate so it was kind of nice.

God I wish Codename STEAM did better. So many interesting ideas just thrown away to 3DS obscurity.

 

[Teeb147]

Now this is what I’m talking about.

I’ve wanted Lyn ever since Smash 4’s DLC, and that was before I ever gotten into the series.

But since she, along w/ Black Knight and Tiki, are already AT, I’ve been personally pushing for Anna (possibly in her Heroes incarnation) and Edelgard.

If we do get a new FE character in DLC, I hope they at least add more variety to the FE cast so maybe people would be less apprehensive about FE in Smash.

Well Edelgard would use an axe (and possibly some magic)
If they time it right for the release, it wouldn't be another corrin case.

Spoiler

I'd also be ok with Lyn even if she's a sword user, but other than that, FE has too many sword users, we need the variety now

 

[Potatu]

am I the only one who would actually love it if Black Mage got in as a second FF rep

You're not alone. Although some people could argue Vivi would be better, i wouldn't mind either of them. A Black Mage mii costume would be rad!

 

[Luigi The President]

am I the only one who would actually love it if Black Mage got in as a second FF rep

Is he gonna bring Steiner with him and be a tag-team character?

 

[Masked Marshmallow]

What are you guys's personal thoughts on the 7 square characters? Which of them would you guys like to see in smash? I'll just share mine:

Geno - I've been a Geno supporter for years, and I hoped to see him in the base roster for this game. As for DLC, I don't see him getting in. Maybe if there's a Round 2 of the fighter's pass. But not for this one. I'd still love to see him getting in, as an old fan of the character.
Sora - My most wanted for this DLC, and second favorite of the 7. I believe that while small, he still has some chances of being in, since both Disney and Nomura are ok with his inclusion in Smash. I've recently picked up some KH titles for the first time and have been enjoying them a lot, which is partly responsible for my want for him. I'm also hyped for KH3.
Crono - While I haven't played Chrono Trigger yet, I've heard a lot of praise for it. I'd be ok with him mostly because he'd make a lot of people happy and Crono is often overshadowed by other characters. I feel sympathy for these types of characters.
Sephiroth - The one I believe is the least likely, mostly because of how FF was treated this game. No new content at all, so I doubt Square would allow more FF content in the game. Also, exploring other franchises would be more interesting anyway.
Erdrick - While I have nothing against him, I kinda hope it's someone else, mostly because I'm getting tired of people being overly defensive when it comes to Erdrick and some people outright ignoring every other character's chances. If he does get in, I hope his moveset is at least interesting.
Slime - Second most wanted for this DLC. While I haven't played any of Erdrick's games, I have played the whole Slime games trilogy as well as some of the Dragon Quest Monsters titles, which makes it easy for me to imagine a moveset for it. I also believe that Sakurai could create a really interesting and creative moveset for it, just like he was able to make a creative moveset for PP.
Luminary - Just like Erdrick, I haven't played his game yet. But knowing Dragon Quest, he'd probably play the similarly to Erdrick. My opnion on him is the same as Erdrick's without the "I hope its someone else" part, since his supporters seems to be more accepting than Erdrick's, but still not my most wanted.

 

[Starblax]

All I said is that it's an extra layer of complication. In that they'd have to work with SE & Disney at the same time, rather than just SE.
I wasn't even going to debate against sora, so you're bringing this on yourself..People have also said that Disney is strict on copyrights and likes to control projects. Nintendo likes to be in control too, so it's just to say there's possible challenges whether or not they worked on a few things. Also, Nintendo partners much more with Universal, which is in competition with Disney.

So, think of it how you will, I'm not saying it can't happen, simply that it can be a bit more complicated.

Ah, my bad.

I get what you mean and I agree, I just thought that you meant it won't happen because of Disney.

 

[Teeb147]

What are you guys's personal thoughts on the 7 square characters? Who would you guys like to see in smash? I'll just share mine:

Geno - I've been a Geno supporter for years, and I hoped to see him in the base roster for this game. As for DLC, I don't see him getting in. Maybe if there's a Round 2 of the fighter's pass. But not for this one. I'd still love to see him getting in, as an old fan of the character.
Sora - My most wanted for this DLC, and second favorite of the 7. I believe that while small, he still has some chances of being in, since both Disney and Nomura are ok with his inclusion in Smash. I've recently picked up some KH titles for the first time and have been enjoying them a lot, which is partly responsible for my want for him. I'm also hyped for KH3.
Crono - While I haven't played Chrono Trigger yet, I've heard a lot of praise for it. I'd be ok with him mostly because he'd make a lot of people happy and Crono is often overshadowed by other characters. I feel sympathy for these types of characters.
Sephiroth - The one I believe is the least likely, mostly because of how FF was treated this game. No new content at all, so I doubt Square would allow more FF content in the game. Also, exploring other franchises would be more interesting anyway.
Erdrick - While I have nothing against him, I kinda hope it's someone else, mostly because I'm getting tired of people being overly defensive when it comes to Erdrick and some people outright ignoring every other character's chances. If he does get in, I hope his moveset is at least interesting.
Slime - Second most wanted for this DLC. While I haven't played any of Erdrick's games, I have played the whole Slime games trilogy as well as some of the Dragon Quest Monsters titles, which makes it easy for me to imagine a moveset for it. I also believe that Sakurai could create a really interesting and creative moveset for it, just like he was able to make a creative moveset for PP.
Luminary - Just like Erdrick, I haven't played his game yet. But knowing Dragon Quest, he'd probably play the similarly to Erdrick. My opnion on him is the same as Erdrick's without the "I hope its someone else" part, since his supporters seems to be more accepting than Erdrick's, but still not my most wanted.

There's so many characters that I could want in, but I don't know if they're 'likely'.

I think that having DQ heroes as alt skins to Erdrick (along with the female one) would do fine for that series, including slime somewhere but not as a character.
Then there's Tifa, which could work just because Cloud is in.
Terra is another one, and she was mentioned for before they decided on Cloud.
Geno, of course. And while I like Kingdom Hearts and wouldn't mind Sora, he's not a favorite of mine to want in smash.
Bubble Bobble is technically SE, so that could be a fun idea, but I also kind of doubt anything like that. Maybe as a dlc assist trophy.
Chocobo could also work for FF. Black mage would be fine too, but I prefer blue & red mages
Star Ocean and Valkiryie Profile are great series too, but I think it might not be popular enough. I'd mention Secret of mana but I doubt it'd make it in smash as well (even if pretty well known). There's quite a few other series' that would be fun to add.

And finally, the ones nobody expects, Max and Chloe from Life is Strange :O

 

[Deleted member]

Erdrick - While I have nothing against him, I kinda hope it's someone else, mostly because I'm getting tired of people being overly defensive when it comes to Erdrick and some people outright ignoring every other character's chances. If he does get in, I hope his moveset is at least interesting.

I'd like to apologize if I myself have ever come off like that. Honestly my hopes aren't up that much for him, despite what seems to be pointing in his favor I'm trying to not set myself up for potential disappointment.
But, at times it's hard to not be defensive when you have people saying "literally who" from one person and "generic anime swordfighter" from another and "shill pick" from another and "why isnt it x character" from another. Of course, I don't want to discredit those who don't like him at all but sometimes like I said it's hard supporting him lol

 

[Potatu]

I'd like to apologize if I myself have ever come off like that. Honestly my hopes aren't up that much for him, despite what seems to be pointing in his favor I'm trying to not set myself up for potential disappointment.
But, at times it's hard to not be defensive when you have people saying "literally who" from one person and "generic anime swordfighter" from another and "shill pick" from another and "why isnt it x character" from another. Of course, I don't want to discredit those who don't like him at all but sometimes like I said it's hard supporting him lol

I have to admit, i've been hard on Erdrick in the past (calling him generic, a Goku/Gohan-look-a-like etc), but i've changed my mind. I still prefer Slime as the DQ rep, mainly for the moveset potential, but it seems Erdrick is really the definitive choice as the DQ rep. But the reasons why i would welcome Erdrick is to make DQ fans happy, you guys have been very kind (and patient, for putting up with heated debates) here in the Square thread and it would also make DQ finally big in the west.

But i realized something else: once DQ is in Smash, SE finally have their big boys in the game, those being Cloud as the FF representative and Erdrick as the DQ representative. What this means is that smaller guys like Geno and Neku have more of a chance to get in in the future. I'm sorry for this long post lol.

 

[Ovaltine]

I'd like to apologize if I myself have ever come off like that. Honestly my hopes aren't up that much for him, despite what seems to be pointing in his favor I'm trying to not set myself up for potential disappointment.
But, at times it's hard to not be defensive when you have people saying "literally who" from one person and "generic anime swordfighter" from another and "shill pick" from another and "why isnt it x character" from another. Of course, I don't want to discredit those who don't like him at all but sometimes like I said it's hard supporting him lol

wtf naw

You are like, the most reasonable person here, or at least one of the most reasonable. Hell, if I were in your place, I'd be rather defensive, too. Even then, you're very tactful and honestly a nice person. You're fine.

 

[Luigi The President]

I'd like to apologize if I myself have ever come off like that. Honestly my hopes aren't up that much for him, despite what seems to be pointing in his favor I'm trying to not set myself up for potential disappointment.
But, at times it's hard to not be defensive when you have people saying "literally who" from one person and "generic anime swordfighter" from another and "shill pick" from another and "why isnt it x character" from another. Of course, I don't want to discredit those who don't like him at all but sometimes like I said it's hard supporting him lol

At this point I'd completely understand if you hopped on a bus and physically fought those people

 

[StormC]

It's now dawning on me that the speculation cycle for Fighter Pass characters will be longer than the one for the game itself.

Hope y'all are getting cozy.

 

[Deleted member]

wtf naw

You are like, the most reasonable person here, or at least one of the most reasonable. Hell, if I were in your place, I'd be rather defensive, too. Even then, you're very tactful and honestly a nice person. You're fine.

That's what I try to be, so I'm glad that I'm successful in that lol

At this point I'd completely understand if you hopped on a bus and physically fought those people

Where's the bus going?

I have to admit, i've been hard on Erdrick in the past (calling him generic, a Goku/Gohan-look-a-like etc), but i've changed my mind. I still prefer Slime as the DQ rep, mainly for the moveset potential, but it seems Erdrick is really the definitive choice as the DQ rep. But the reasons why i would welcome Erdrick is to make DQ fans happy, you guys have been very kind (and patient, for putting up with heated debates) here in the Square thread and it would also make DQ finally big in the west.

But i realized something else: once DQ is in Smash, SE finally have their big boys in the game, those being Cloud as the FF representative and Erdrick as the DQ representative. What this means is that smaller guys like Geno and Neku have more of a chance to get in in the future. I'm sorry for this long post lol.

I thought the same thing actually. Once the big franchises are in then the little guys have more of a shot, which I think will be interesting to see in the future. Neku would be awesome, I don't see him talked about a whole lot.

 

[Luigi The President]

That's what I try to be, so I'm glad that I'm successful in that lol

Where's the bus going?

I thought the same thing actually. Once the big franchises are in then the little guys have more of a shot, which I think will be interesting to see in the future. Neku would be awesome, I don't see him talked about a whole lot.

To said people

It's now dawning on me that the speculation cycle for Fighter Pass characters will be longer than the one for the game itself.

Hope y'all are getting cozy.

A LOT less mentally taxing after the Squenix rep tho
Once Geno's deconfirmed I can be much more relaxed

 

[Deleted member]

To said people


A LOT less mentally taxing after the Squenix rep tho
Once Geno's deconfirmed I can be much more relaxed

I thought you meant fighting them *on* the bus but that works too.

 

[SSGuy]

I'd like to apologize if I myself have ever come off like that. Honestly my hopes aren't up that much for him, despite what seems to be pointing in his favor I'm trying to not set myself up for potential disappointment.
But, at times it's hard to not be defensive when you have people saying "literally who" from one person and "generic anime swordfighter" from another and "shill pick" from another and "why isnt it x character" from another. Of course, I don't want to discredit those who don't like him at all but sometimes like I said it's hard supporting him lol

If it means anything, I think majority of us only hate Fire Emblem characters and not just anime sword characters as a whole. There is a big difference between someone like Link or Cloud compared to Corrin. If Erdrick gets in, I think a lot of people will welcome him.