Sorcerer's 11 Open

[osieorb18]

Hon this is just the beginning

I dont end up as a top poster of 90% of games I play for nothing

Hopefully while interacting with people in conversations that they start in addition to just spewing questions into the thread.

Also, Wiisp Heh, Emiko, Valerie. I think you know why I'm tagging you here.

 

[Z25]

funnier6 How do you read Z25 and Wiisp (including Lore's content, within reasonable context of course) at the moment?

Since your here, what do you think of wiisp based on their posts since you were also on the lore wagon and wiisp doesn’t seem to understand the wagon or why it’s still going. How’s that look in your eyes?

ZZ5, I would never tell you not to play. Every one is welcome to join us. I have Pythag in my bottom four so I have already considered his low presence.

i didn’t mean that personally towards you, it’s just a complaint I’ve seen thrown around by people in the past few games and so I threw that part in there in case there was any response like that.

 

[osieorb18]

I’m not asking you to do anything. What’s the point in telling me this?

You were defending yourself against people scumreading you.

 

[Z25]

Dude KoD was in that game

I WAS THE ONE SCARRED

Also I'm sorry please forgive

Is KoD a player or a acronym I’m unfamiliar with?

 

[osieorb18]

I think his read on Lore feels close a to policy lynch, even if he doesn't want to believe that
its pretty much toe and toe on how he would treat my behavior on the past, but it doesnt really say much about his alignment

I was inspired to try to read Lore and Z25 based on something Phraze said in some early one of the games I played with her, to the effect of (memory-based paraphrase):

You can get a lot of information if you analyze why someone is scumreading you incorrectly.

I suppose that would irk you, though.

I feel like you're doing your own little manipulative stunt here, though, and I recognize that. Pondering how much I should hold that against you. For the most part, there's not enough meat to your posts yet to give me something juicy to latch onto your exact alignment, so most of my read is still based on Lore being scummy AF.

 

[ranmaru]

I also have played with Phraze in EIMM. She's cool.

 

[Raxxel]

Raxxel I am curious on how your reads have updated up to now.

Biggest update? I really, REALLY am not liking ExLight's content all too much. It's insanely defensive, a little whiny, and overall reactive. I get that they're new here, but they have mafia experience elsewhere and an experienced town player should not be this concerned about initial reads on them this early into the game, reads that are the most likely to shift and change in the snap of a finger. I especially do not enjoy their jump to the conclusion that someone was trying to paint them as scummy. It's paranoid behavior. If not Z, right now they are my next lynch candidate.

I need more out of Wiisp. I've never been in the situation where I basically have to consider the content of two players from the same slot. I'm not quite stuck with the same dilemma for Kary since Mamboo didn't do anything. For Kary I disagreed with their attack on UP but I think their jump ahead to scum analysis has me think they're null at worst.

 

[osieorb18]

I also have played with Phraze in EIMM. She's cool.

Totally off-topic, but Phraze is... a good friend and nice person if you know her well enough and are considerate enough to approach her in such a way that you don't stick her too hard into your own mental box of expectations.

 

[ExLight]

Is KoD a player or a acronym I’m unfamiliar with?

King of Domaria or something
twas a player
a very eccentric player

what about the time we went from virtually 4 scum members to 0 in one night before -Lo because we nightkilled our own scumbud for acting like a maniacal egocentric douche

he's the scumbud we shot

 

[osieorb18]

I need more out of Wiisp. I've never been in the situation where I basically have to consider the content of two players from the same slot. I'm not quite stuck with the same dilemma for Kary since Mamboo didn't do anything. For Kary I disagreed with their attack on UP but I think their jump ahead to scum analysis has me think they're null at worst.

How do you feel about the fact that both Kary and funnier have pretty much just been spamming the thread with questions and not contributing much in the way of reads?

 

[ExLight]

It's insanely defensive, a little whiny, and overall reactive

hi that's me in a nutshell
do you want me to link you some other games

 

[osieorb18]

King of Domaria/QUOTE]

Dominaria?

 

[ExLight]

Dominaria?

prolly
he comes from a forum that is kinda related to Magic
he was in a championship
kind of a meme

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

How can you possibly tell that

Because I did a google search of osieorb18. It’s literally not hard at all, and not a point to dwell on.

This is a really heckin crazy post

I dont know the context but

You just dont say these types of things as a player in a game to a potential sub

Also Xiv is striking me weird on this page giving me that gross overly helpful but never actually doing anything vibe

Its probably just because RVS but ehhh we'll see

You don’t know the context. I will not play with Brindor and the post is for OOG reasons.

What exactly feels forced here? Ex or Xiv? what exactly feels forced? The joke? How is that anything but a joke? Are you taking it seriously?

The joke felt forced. Is this surprising to you? It helped get a conservation going. Exhibit hamtaro.

Yeah I mean its not like there are 9 other players to prevent one person from giving a noob a biased impression mmmm

If you’re nice to a newbie they have a biased impression of you whether you like it or not. Speaking from experience.

Thats funny cause I feel like you dont have any grasp at all on my meta and probably little to none on Ex except that you find yourselves similar

I read an game Osie was in. I barely remember the details. Of course I wouldn’t be able to perfectly grasp somebody’s meta, but I at least wanted to know how they played.

I think the first one does have bearing and I dont see why you disagree

Literally it was OOG responding to a non player and this is the second time you’ve brought it up. It. Doesn’t. Matter. Read Jungle Republic if you want, I don’t care if you do or not.

So their way of talking feels like a cop out that should be worth considering

But that's okay because I found the rest of the context

And I really

really

REALLY

Dont see how that was poor wording at all nor how you interpreted that as asking for a cop check in that direction

It’s not okay because Z25 literally used the term “cop out” and I interpreted as copcheck. That is completely feasible.

All of this probably isn’t even that related to the game but if you say that I’m “kinda sketch” or whatever based on these blatant early game misinterpretations then I’m going to be very upset. But to each their own.

 

[osieorb18]

hi that's me in a nutshell
do you want me to link you some other games

My only possible reaction to this is:

 

[funnier6]

This (parking your vote) is anti-town as they aren't going to change their style and they have plenty of content in them. The fact they make multiple haikus in a single post makes up for the brevity.

Parking your vote gives you an excuse not to look for scum.

This is another example of how I feel like Xiv is just color commenting in a CWAC way

Like, okay, yes, what youre saying there is true. But why is there no question why is there no action

There should be a hey do you really think this is worth parking your vote over? Type thing in there somewhere

I just dont really see what you were accomplishing by this cause it just feels like youre informing him and the thread at large that hes making an anti town move and that you dont particularly care

My vote was during the random voting stage, and I'm town.

That last point is debatable

It's almost as if pressure is a thing, and I can choose to no longer park my vote as time progresses.

Parking and pressure are two different things hi yes and you most certainly did not make this come across as pressure

I'ma hold off answering Osie's question for the moment cause I cant remember how I felt when I first read these posts and I feel like I read them as an extension of red text whats his face dude because he was saying stuff about your haikus that I agreed with so I'm not positive who I was even thinking of when I first said that a town read on Lore

Dunno, might figure it out as I go

were the 90% games before you met me or

A lot of them yeah

But you know I mean top three which still happens all the time and would happen even more often if I didnt die before day three all the time

Is KoD a player or a acronym I’m unfamiliar with?

A player and you dont want to know

 

[Raxxel]

Since your here, what do you think of wiisp based on their posts since you were also on the lore wagon and wiisp doesn’t seem to understand the wagon or why it’s still going. How’s that look in your eyes?

i didn’t mean that personally towards you, it’s just a complaint I’ve seen thrown around by people in the past few games and so I threw that part in there in case there was any response like that.

I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt at the moment. I assume they've yet to completely read through the thread and understand the interactions that have currently landed their slot in the position it is in. It feels unfair to be judging someone's slot based off its previous occupants actions that they had no control over, but said actions are still relevant since they were taken with the knowledge of that slot's role.

Can you name me your top 3 town reads?

 

[ExLight]

in that game he kinda wanted to bus the entire team but we had an unkillable "player" that would insta win if we took too long and we couldn't have time to be bussing around when we could win by gettin one mislynch but he kept trying to mislynch me so I pulled a last second gambit and shot him in the night then claimed some crazy kind of PGO but his delayed lover survivor that he didn't post-mortem vanillize decided to avenge him and out the entire scum team so we looost

*inhale*
that was a wild game

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

That last point is debatable

Naturally. Anybody can be town, and anybody can be scum. Nobody is off the chopping block.

You want to address my wall at you yet?

 

[ExLight]

My only possible reaction to this is:

funnier6 which games should I link
do you think Magic and MSP are enough

 

[osieorb18]

funnier6 which games should I link
do you think Magic and MSP are enough

That was not a happy reaction...

 

[ExLight]

That was not a happy reaction...

 

[Raxxel]

How do you feel about the fact that both Kary and funnier have pretty much just been spamming the thread with questions and not contributing much in the way of reads?

I think questions are actually more valuable than reads. They involve more engagement and really are way more telling of a mindset than a read since it's much harder for scum to come up with actual questions given they naturally have less investment in someone's mindset. Reads are important, but I think questions are more so since they lead to far more development in a game. If they're good anyway. Bad questions, like easily answered ones or easy, safe ones however, are a scum tell.

 

[funnier6]

Naturally. Anybody can be town, and anybody can be scum. Nobody is off the chopping block.

You want to address my wall at you yet?

Obviously not

funnier6 which games should I link
do you think Magic and MSP are enough

I think you'd do better to rely on me than let them see your past games XD

Though really I think MtG would be good

I'd never inflict MSP on anyone

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

Biggest update? I really, REALLY am not liking ExLight's content all too much. It's insanely defensive, a little whiny, and overall reactive. I get that they're new here, but they have mafia experience elsewhere and an experienced town player should not be this concerned about initial reads on them this early into the game, reads that are the most likely to shift and change in the snap of a finger. I especially do not enjoy their jump to the conclusion that someone was trying to paint them as scummy. It's paranoid behavior. If not Z, right now they are my next lynch candidate.

I need more out of Wiisp. I've never been in the situation where I basically have to consider the content of two players from the same slot. I'm not quite stuck with the same dilemma for Kary since Mamboo didn't do anything. For Kary I disagreed with their attack on UP but I think their jump ahead to scum analysis has me think they're null at worst.

Yeah but you see I do like ExLight’s content, so we’re going to have a point of contention concerning it. I’ve been associating ExLight far too much with my play because a lot of our philosophies line up and I can see exactly why ExLight is doing what he is, and that’s because certain lynched seem too “easy” or “obvious” to be correct, in a sense. So, they are considering many other possibilities such as me being sorc and probably some others, etc etc. You’ll have to quote me where he says that somebody is trying to paint somebody him as scummy, but I wouldn’t doubt if that was the truth.

 

[ranmaru]

I like the way you think, Raxxel.

 

[ranmaru]

I'll have a case on Z25 later, going over some points that were missed. I haven't eaten in 3 days and I'm too out of it to do much right now.

I'm curious why you haven't brought this out yet.

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

I think questions are actually more valuable than reads. They involve more engagement and really are way more telling of a mindset than a read since it's much harder for scum to come up with actual questions given they naturally have less investment in someone's mindset. Reads are important, but I think questions are more so since they lead to far more development in a game. If they're good anyway. Bad questions, like easily answered ones or easy, safe ones however, are a scum tell.

I asked this to ExLight as well but am curious to see what you say. Is somebody asking “too many questions” townie, scummy, or NAI?

 

[ExLight]

I'd never inflict MSP on anyone

MSP had both my town and scum playstyle tho
but would be so weird without the scum chat hmm

 

[Wiisp]

Alright I have one question for you. Have you actually read the thread?

Because if you did the answer should be pretty obvious as to why your slot had those votes coming into this. Lore came into the game aggressive over osie’s haiku formatting of their points and got more and more tired of it because they thought it was bad for a player to use that format with as little info as it gave. They vote threatened osie and make a continuously aggressive push towards osie to be the lynch because of hiatus. Obviously that’s a horrible reason to try to start and wagon and their anger towards it made them look entirely anti town. Then because osie didn’t listen they rage quit the game and here you are now.

Im willing to unvote if I see more content from you. I already said I had a few other lynch candidates based on actions which you would also know if you read the thread and I’m not someone dead set on your slot. Plus I’m not the only one on so your just voting me because i had a wagon. Which I don’t fault you but going by that logic I should be sticking to my vote to preserve my slot. Which I don’t think needs to happen when we can easily discuss other potential lynch candidates today with the time we have left.


Ok you keep saying this, but that’s literally your only reason. Honesty a lot of your content has been osie interactions more then anything else. Yet you could continually are trying to push people towards me with this weaker reasoning. Also you don’t need to directly interact with someone to get a good read for them. Their posts speak for themselves and quite frankly I don’t think any of Ex’s are really great which I’ve explained plenty at this point.

so I cant ask questions because the answers are in the thread? ok
and I have this enormous amount of pressure on me because of a slot I replaced into, I honestly do not care, I will work at my own pace, and if I I am lynched today, ohh well?

jesus man, like I don't know what you want me to say? do you want me to solve the game right now? will that suffice? I am not a god, and there isnt anyone obnoxiously wolfy

like let me breath

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

You were defending yourself against people scumreading you.

I was? I don’t recall; what post are you referring to?

 

[Z25]

I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt at the moment. I assume they've yet to completely read through the thread and understand the interactions that have currently landed their slot in the position it is in. It feels unfair to be judging someone's slot based off its previous occupants actions that they had no control over, but said actions are still relevant since they were taken with the knowledge of that slot's role.

Can you name me your top 3 town reads?

This is true and I have similar thoughts currently but I still want to hear more from them especially if they aren’t caught up, I’d like more when they are.
Right now they are still the same:

osie
Utopian
You.

Ive found all three of you to have some pretty strong content and pointed out why I fee these three are strong toe sets in my earlier reads list. The content and interactions have all been seemingly pretty town oriented and offered a lot in terms of expanding discussion here

 

[Raxxel]

Yeah but you see I do like ExLight’s content, so we’re going to have a point of contention concerning it. I’ve been associating ExLight far too much with my play because a lot of our philosophies line up and I can see exactly why ExLight is doing what he is, and that’s because certain lynched seem too “easy” or “obvious” to be correct, in a sense. So, they are considering many other possibilities such as me being sorc and probably some others, etc etc. You’ll have to quote me where he says that somebody is trying to paint somebody him as scummy, but I wouldn’t doubt if that was the truth.

because his thought of process was with the intent of painting me as super scummy even if he didn't say it out loud

I get that every player has their own quirks and personalities that may clash with the traditional behavior of a town player. But stuff like this kinda goes beyond just being attached to a personality. You can be a bit defensive, sure, but Ex actively attacked a player based off a conclusion they jumped to. They in general seem to just want to shut down any scum speculation around them altogether.

 

[ExLight]

You can be a bit defensive, sure, but Ex actively attacked a player based off a conclusion they jumped to. They in general seem to just want to shut down any scum speculation around them altogether

hi you're strongly scumreading me and I'm not shutting it down
this argument is a fallacy

 

[Pythag]

How do you feel about the fact that both Kary and funnier have pretty much just been spamming the thread with questions and not contributing much in the way of reads?

What if they are good questions?

Didn’t you earlier speak on how you judge by content?

Xivii’s content, while terse almost always got me thinking.

Funnier and Ex seem to keep having nostalgia moments and it gets in the way more than anything else.

Also
Read lists on D1 I also find to be kinda annoying because they benefit the town so little and benefit the mafia so much more. (IMO)

 

[osieorb18]

I think questions are actually more valuable than reads. They involve more engagement and really are way more telling of a mindset than a read since it's much harder for scum to come up with actual questions given they naturally have less investment in someone's mindset. Reads are important, but I think questions are more so since they lead to far more development in a game. If they're good anyway. Bad questions, like easily answered ones or easy, safe ones however, are a scum tell.

...

It's really easy to come up with questions when most of your questions are "Hey Julia, what's your read on Mary?"

It's also a super easy question to respond to. Either:

"I like, totally, like think that Mary is, like, (not) very fetch this game. Like, totally (not) fetch."

or

"I like, totally, don't know, like, what Mary's game really is. She's like, totally, like, mysterious or something, lol."

 

[Raxxel]

I asked this to ExLight as well but am curious to see what you say. Is somebody asking “too many questions” townie, scummy, or NAI?

Completely depends on the questions. If the questions are too safe, easily answered through some reading, or ultimately are irrelevant, then I think it's scum indicative. If I think the questions are actively helping progress the game, pressuring players, or helping understand a player's reasoning better, then I think it is town indicative.

 

[Wiisp]

Hopefully while interacting with people in conversations that they start in addition to just spewing questions into the thread.

Also, Wiisp Heh, Emiko, Valerie. I think you know why I'm tagging you here.

no not really?

 

[ranmaru]

Questions are good because they can help you develop reads.

"Why did you do x?" is much better than "Are you town?"

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

I get that every player has their own quirks and personalities that may clash with the traditional behavior of a town player. But stuff like this kinda goes beyond just being attached to a personality. You can be a bit defensive, sure, but Ex actively attacked a player based off a conclusion they jumped to. They in general seem to just want to shut down any scum speculation around them altogether.

I completely disagree. Ex saying that Pythag’s intent was to make him super scummy may be incorrect, at least it is to me. But, that’s ExLight’s interpretation of the events, and doesn’t make him more or less town or scum. I also wouldn’t call it an attack. What it does tell is that Pythag and ExLight are probably not aligned, but that information can’t do many favors on D1 without any flips.

ExLight wanting time “shut down any scum speculation” is your interpretation and you’re free to believe that.