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[Wyoming]

But sans is in smash. I couldn’t even tell if he’s a costume or not. It looks like an actual fighter model

Playable and costume are different. Yes it is technically Sans, but the moveset remains Mii Gunner.

But yeah, the only indie I think has a shot at this point is Reimu, but the lack of accessibility here will be a factor unless they plan to use Smash to promote it. Indies do not seem to be considered for playable status yet for this game after the Sans costume reveal.

 

[Lamperouge]

Why do people think Silver the Hedgehog and Rosalina are somewhat similar? Like, I don't see it but then again, I wear glasses so I'm almost blind.

You don't remember when Silver was also separated from his mother in space and adopted an army of star children?

Let's not forget that moment in the Mario series when Rosalina was desperately fighting to save her future just like...you guessed it, Silver the Hedgehog.

I don't know what I'm doing

 

[Cosmic77]

For now, I'd prefer the indie characters just stay as Spirits, ATs, and Mii Costumes. Three of the biggest ones (Shovel Knight, Shantae, Sans) are already represented in a way that feels satisfying. Most of the indie characters outside those three franchises honestly don't feel "big" enough to warrant be adding in Smash. That goes in both popularity and the success of their franchises.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Heads up folks, there will not be a stinger at the end of this new trailer. Didn't want you guys staying up late and being disappointed but tune if you want to see some new gameplay clips.

— Arc System Works America (@ArcSystemWorksU) October 12, 2019

At least we'll see Axl gameplay

 

[Michael the Spikester]

See you guys later. Gonna be gone for most of the day.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

For now, I'd prefer the indie characters just stay as Spirits, ATs, and Mii Costumes. Three of the biggest ones (Shovel Knight, Shantae, Sans) are already represented in a way that feels satisfying. Most of the indie characters outside those three franchises honestly don't feel "big" enough to warrant be adding in Smash. That goes in both popularity and the success of their franchises.

I feel like the only one of those “big” indies left is Cave Story. The original indie darling.

Well, that and Cuphead.

 

[Wyoming]

For now, I'd prefer the indie characters just stay as Spirits, ATs, and Mii Costumes. Three of the biggest ones (Shovel Knight, Shantae, Sans) are already represented in a way that feels satisfying. Most of the indie characters outside those three franchises honestly don't feel "big" enough to warrant be adding in Smash. That goes in both popularity and the success of their franchises.

I feel like the smash circle is the only place that considers Shantae to be a big indie title.

 

[Noipoi]

No indies No indies No indies

 

[Lamperouge]

Heads up folks, there will not be a stinger at the end of this new trailer. Didn't want you guys staying up late and being disappointed but tune if you want to see some new gameplay clips.

— Arc System Works America (@ArcSystemWorksU) October 12, 2019

At least we'll see Axl gameplay

Not my first choice for a Mega Man character in GG, but he'll do.

 

[Cosmic77]

I feel like the smash circle is the only place that considers Shantae to be a big indie title.

That's why I grouped her with the other two. Her franchise isn't on the same level, but obviously she's been requested more than almost every other indie rep.

I feel like that's enough to at least take her as a somewhat serious contender.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Oh we're talking about indies?

Reimu stands as the strongest candidate right now imo. I would love to see bullet hell mechanics incorporated in a fighter.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

Oh we're talking about indies?

Reimu stands as the strongest candidate right now imo. I would love to see bullet hell mechanics incorporated in a fighter.

I’ve only ever heard of her in the Smash setting. Are you sure she’s actually popular?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Oh we're talking about indies?

Reimu stands as the strongest candidate right now imo. I would love to see bullet hell mechanics incorporated in a fighter.

Idk she earts dirt according to twitter, we can't promote that in a children's game featuring the guy who bombed billionares

 

[Noipoi]

I’ve only ever heard of her in the Smash setting. Are you sure she’s actually popular?

That’s because Touhou is ginormous in Japan, not in the West. It’s huge over there.

 

[Wunderwaft]

I’ve only ever heard of her in the Smash setting. Are you sure she’s actually popular?

I'll look up one of my earlier posts explaining how big she is.

Shrine Maiden of Danmaku

Chance: 45%
Touhou is a video game franchise with multiple genres ranging from bullet hells, fighting, and most recently platforming, but it's mostly well know for it's Shmup games. It's made by one guy named ZUN, he makes the Shmup games by himself, from the bullets, to the character designs, to the music. The series started since the PC98 era, but it gained it's fame and popularity during the Windows era. It has a long legacy of over two decades and it's still going strong.

So what makes this series special? Well, it's insanely popular in Japan, and it also has a decent following outside of the country. The series has consistently had special conventions dedicated to it every year with tons of attendance. It has been a major pillar for the Doujin community in Japan and it continues to have notable attendance every year at Comiket, which is the largest Japanese convention. Touhou had a huge impact on the Doujin scene in Japan and is pretty much a pop culture icon there. The amount of fan made content created is ridiculous, so much so that it won a Guinness World Record for it's prolific content. The series has been an inspiration for many video games, most notably Undertale, with Toby Fox claiming so. There are tons of references to Touhou ranging from TV appearances to video games, here's a list of them.

With the appearance of the Sans Mii costume I believe Touhou has a good shot for Smash since it doesn't seem too niche for Smash anymore. It also helps that it's representing a genre that hasn't appeared in Smash yet, the Shmup genre. ZUN has been more lenient with the series recently, letting it crossover with Kirby in Taiko no Tatsujin which was made by Bandai Namco for the 3DS. Not to mention he finally released Touhou in a Western store like Steam. So perhaps ZUN might approve of a Smash proposal if Nintendo ever approached him.


Want: 100%
Reimu is one of my top five most wanted characters and I believe she'd be a unique and fun addition to Smash. Her grazing mechanics and flexibility with projectiles would make her a floaty glass canon fighter that prioritizes stage control and denying opponent movement. I have a long history with the Touhou series and I enjoy the games very much. I love the setting of the series, the characters, the games, and especially the music. I'd love to see the inclusion of Touhou in Smash and I hope it happens one day.


Prediction: Jin Kazama: 19.4%

Nomination: Steve x5

Idk she earts dirt according to twitter, we can't promote that in a children's game featuring the guy who bombed billionares

She only eats dirt because no one donates to her shrine. It's not her fault she lives in poverty.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I’m just curious as to when we’ll see more about Terry.

Then, the chaos that would ensue if Pick #5 doesn’t get shown.

 

[BlueMonk]

honestly sora and kingdom hearts kind of bore me, I've never been interested in KH

I don't really get how Reimu is somehow the indie character with the strongest chance to get in smash now. I get that DQ sort of increased the chances of japan-centric franchises getting into smash, but 2hu is really on another level in that regard

 

[Lamperouge]

@Bolderousness I finally got the boat in DQ2.

In what order do you personally think I should tackle the rest of the game? From what I understand, I have the freedom to explore any part of the world and collect the items that I need, but I don't want my *** handed to me by monsters that far exceed my current capabilities. (Hero is currently LVL 16, Sigurd is 14, and Lynda is 8.)

 

[Noipoi]

I’m just curious as to when we’ll see more about Terry.

Then, the chaos that would ensue if Pick #5 doesn’t get shown.

Fairly sure he’ll be shown off before November 15th. Just because I don’t think they’ll want to release a Smash presentation the same day as a Pokémon game.

Or maybe he’ll be shown after. Who knows.

 

[Slime Master]

People like to say ultimate gave us a bunch of big fan requests and use that to say we'll get more and while the premise is largely accurate, I feel like the characters we got that support it bar maybe Banjo all have some kind of presence outside of the smash bubble (K. Rool and Ridley were both major villains for a long time, so I suspect there were some people who thought they were "missing" even if they didn't spend a lot of time in smash speculation). I'm a lot less sure you can say this about Isaac, Geno, Shantae, etc., which leaves me to believe they're not all that likely.

Of course, this isn't even based on anecdotal evidence, just a hunch I had that I thought I'd share since it doesn't seem to get brought up often.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

That’s because Touhou is ginormous in Japan, not in the West. It’s huge over there.

How well has that worked for Katalina?
He can't JUST pick characters that are exclusively popular in Japan. He sells to a global audience. He needs to recognize global popularity.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I’m just curious as to when we’ll see more about Terry.

Then, the chaos that would ensue if Pick #5 doesn’t get shown.

All I know is that KoF is a fast ass game so Terry will probably reflect that and have the drag down up airs

 

[Cutie Gwen]

How well has that worked for Katalina?
He can't JUST pick characters that are exclusively popular in Japan. He sells to a global audience. He needs to recognize global popularity.

I mean, he kinda has. Even with Hero, the 8 skin was chosen as the west adores DQ8

 

[Deleted member]

@Bolderousness I finally got the boat in DQ2.

In what order do you personally think I should tackle the rest of the game? From what I understand, I have the freedom to explore any part of the world and collect the items that I need, but I don't want my *** handed to me by monsters that far exceed my current capabilities. (Hero is currently LVL 16, Sigurd is 14, and Lynda is 8.)

You got the boat? Well I started exploring all of Tantegel. Visited the Dragonlord's castle first and proceeded to explore every single landmass and town afterwards. When you find the golden key (talk to a specific dog in a town I don't remember the name of), that's your clue to revisit every town and potentially get an orb from two imps. Talk to every NPC and try to piece together ways to progress.

If you're afraid of dying, dump all of your money in a bank before exploring unknown lands. The world shouldn't be too bad unless you step onto the endgame area, but you will have to get stronger regardless.

There's going to be a point where Sigurd is going to get bedridden, so let me know when that happens and I'll point you to where to go. It's kind of a jerk move.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

People like to say ultimate gave us a bunch of big fan requests and use that to say we'll get more and while the premise is largely accurate, I feel like the characters we got that support it bar maybe Banjo all have some kind of presence outside of the smash bubble (K. Rool and Ridley were both major villains for a long time, so I suspect there were some people who thought they were "missing" even if they didn't spend a lot of time in smash speculation). I'm a lot less sure you can say this about Isaac, Geno, Shantae, etc., which leaves me to believe they're not all that likely.

Of course, this isn't even based on anecdotal evidence, just a hunch I had that I thought I'd share since it doesn't seem to get brought up often.

This would make sense if it weren't for the fact that they had that HUGE ballot asking the fans exactly who they want. And it makes the most sense to give your audience what they want. Because people will buy what they want without having to be convinced. As opposed to things they don't, where you have to convince them.

 

[Z25]

I’m just curious as to when we’ll see more about Terry.

Then, the chaos that would ensue if Pick #5 doesn’t get shown.

Absolutely the first week of November. They aren’t going to let anything potentially overshadow Pokémon or be overshadowed.

It will be a smash direct with terry, fighter five, and a free fighter for having NSO,(geno?) calling it now.

 

[Deleted member]

I’m just curious as to when we’ll see more about Terry.

Then, the chaos that would ensue if Pick #5 doesn’t get shown.

Pick #5 is probably being revealed with Terry or at the VGA. It's gonna happen before end of the year, especially as Christmas is coming up.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I mean, he kinda has. Even with Hero, the 8 skin was chosen as the west adores DQ8

Which is good. And I applaud him. And it's what made the Hero/Banjo double reveal so strategic.

I don't think I'd be opposed to Remy or whatever her name is, but I think that it would be smart to reveal her alongside someone like DoomSlayer or Crash Bandicoot (who people forget was just as popular in Japan as in the states, so he's not a one-region pick like most people like to make him out to be).

Absolutely the first week of November. They aren’t going to let anything potentially overshadow Pokémon or be overshadowed.

It will be a smash direct with terry, fighter five, and a free fighter for having NSO,(geno?) calling it now.

This is what I want. Very much so (and I think it would be smart to roll Kazuya (or any Tekken character's reveal) into Terry's gameplay trailer. Check my support thread for Kazuya to learn some details.

 

[BZL8]

Sakurai's cat doesn't like the noise generated by Hagibis' winds.

強い風切り音でキャットが不安げです pic.twitter.com/MmVAKMzRRF

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) October 12, 2019

 

[Wunderwaft]

This would make sense if it weren't for the fact that they had that HUGE ballot asking the fans exactly who they want. And it makes the most sense to give your audience what they want. Because people will buy what they want without having to be convinced. As opposed to things they don't, where you have to convince them.

Didn't Sakurai say in his book that he won't use the ballot as a reference anymore because it's been used heavily throughout Ultimate's development? Either way it seems the DLC is a whole different beast that won't rely on polls. Joker, Hero, and Terry should be a testament to that.

 

[Slime Master]

This would make sense if it weren't for the fact that they had that HUGE ballot asking the fans exactly who they want. And it makes the most sense to give your audience what they want. Because people will buy what they want without having to be convinced. As opposed to things they don't, where you have to convince them.

That's more or less what I was trying to get at, K. Rool and Ridley did well on the ballot because they have a presence with a larger audience than the likes of Geno, so that's why we got who we got.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

Didn't Sakurai say in his book that he won't use the ballot as a reference anymore because it's been used heavily throughout Ultimate's development? Either way it seems the DLC is a whole different beast that won't rely on polls. Joker, Hero, and Terry should be a testament to that.

That, from my perspective, seams like an extremely stupid business decision. Giving your fans what they want will be a much easier sell than giving them what they don't, plain and simple.

 

[Noipoi]

That, from my perspective, seams like an extremely stupid business decision. Giving your fans what they want will be a much easier sell than giving them what they don't, plain and simple.

Sometimes fans don’t know what they want, tbh.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

That's more or less what I was trying to get at, K. Rool and Ridley did well on the ballot because they have a presence with a larger audience than the likes of Geno, so that's why we got who we got.

Ridley yes. But K. Rool has been basically abandoned by the Donkey Kong games. And let's not forget that Metroid is mostly popular in the states and even there it's never been a historically high seller, which is why it struggles so much as a series.

Sometimes fans don’t know what they want, tbh.

That statement irritates me. So god damn much. Sure, people can become fans of something if they're exposed to it for the first time. But that is not grounds to ONLY give them things they aren't asking for. It's grounds for a mix of both at the very least.

 

[Deleted member]

Sakurai's cat doesn't like the noise generated by Hagibis' winds.

強い風切り音でキャットが不安げです pic.twitter.com/MmVAKMzRRF

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) October 12, 2019

Sakurai and his cat better be safe! I don't know what I'd do if they weren't maybe like go up there and kick the weather's ***. /s

Seriously though I hope Sakurai and his family, friends and cat are safe.


Also when did Sakurai say he wouldn't use the ballot results anymore? Cause A) He gave us Banjo B) He said he wants to please the fans more and C) I won't believe your word until given evidence and even then it wouldn't effect Geno as they already know he's popular without the Ballot.

 

[Wunderwaft]

That, from my perspective, seams like an extremely stupid business decision. Giving your fans what they want will be a much easier sell than giving them what they don't, plain and simple.

I'm not disagreeing with you about fan picks. I do like fan picks but it seems Nintendo and Sakurai are going with a different direction in the DLC. There's not much we can do about it.

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

Reimu in Smash?

Sees how broken Touhou characters are in the fammade Rivals characters

Yeah, you know what? Maybe we don't want Bayo's second coming.

 

[Noipoi]

Gimme all your monkeys

 

[BlueMonk]

Has there ever even been a localized Touhou game? From what I'm seeing it took until 2017 for a game to get released in the west and it was kept in Japanese. Like, with DQ and KoF getting in I can see why people would talk about 2hu, but Sakurai still wants people to at the very least have a way to play the games. Remember that he wouldn't have put Lucas in Brawl if he had known Mother 3 would never get localized.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I'm not disagreeing with you about fan picks. I do like fan picks but it seems Nintendo and Sakurai are going with a different direction in the DLC. There's not much we can do about it.

Considering we don't actually know the results of the ballot, and how popular Dragon Quest and SNK are in specific regions, it is very possible that they placed high in those regions. Hero and Terry could be ballot picks specifically from Japan and Mexico/Latin America the way Banjo was from America and the UK.