Snake's Flaws

[Kuro~]

Pit, marth, sonic and others. Diddy's medium banana glide tosses allow him be a threat at medium and short range. Characters' pick up range of items is also a factor in now well then control bananas. G&W has a great glide toss and amazing kill moves so why doesn't he **** diddy. His pickup range sucks. Its so bad he has to get close enough to be in danger of slipping on the banana. Zss and falco probably have the greatest control of bananas outside of diddy. And snakes banana control is worse than average. Captain falcon, ganon and zelda and link all have better item control than snake and those are just listed as characters whoms option in general are pretty bad. All of snakes throws are laggy, no real powerful ways to follow up after a banana hit.

edit: post 500 ahhhhhh

Wth...no. First off nowhere in that post did i say the glide toss range was the factor i was taking into account. Each of the characters i listed are good with banana's because of their other abilities with them. IC's are amazing with banana's cuz it gives them an OoS option against moves that wouldnt normally be able to be grabbed thus a free grab. Wario is good with them cuz they are like tires but he so many legit follow ups with them and can use them for free aerials and wafts. Marth is good with them cuz they help him with shield pressure, being safe, zoning, and baiting. Pit is amazing with them cuz his pick up range is ridiculous and he can play keep away with the banana's all day and they lead to easy grabs and juggles and fsmash. near same reasons for sonic. GaW loses to diddy largely because of diddy's amazing anti-air options and his OoS options.

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

Wth...no. First off nowhere in that post did i say the glide toss range was the factor i was taking into account. Each of the characters i listed are good with banana's because of their other abilities with them. IC's are amazing with banana's cuz it gives them an OoS option against moves that wouldnt normally be able to be grabbed thus a free grab. Wario is good with them cuz they are like tires but he so many legit follow ups with them and can use them for free aerials and wafts. Marth is good with them cuz they help him with shield pressure, being safe, zoning, and baiting. Pit is amazing with them cuz his pick up range is ridiculous and he can play keep away with the banana's all day and they lead to easy grabs and juggles and fsmash. near same reasons for sonic. GaW loses to diddy largely because of diddy's amazing anti-air options and his OoS options.

So Marth being amazing is the reason why top Marths get beat to hell and back by diddys. Go ask them how they feel about diddy. Im not going to argue with you about pit cause I don't know anything about that gay character. IC I see your point but I've never seen an IC handle bananas well. Wario is good at avoiding bananas .

 

[Kuro~]

So Marth being amazing is the reason why top Marths get beat to hell and back by diddys. Go ask them how they feel about diddy. Im not going to argue with you about pit cause I don't know anything about that gay character. IC I see your point but I've never seen an IC handle bananas well. Wario is good at avoiding bananas .

Not really, there's a wide spectrum of opinions. I frequent(ed) the marth boards for a long while and use to use him myself. Uhhh 2-djeff is pretty dam legit with banana's just sayin...Wario is good with bananas as well not just avoiding them...

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

I don't like how this is turning into a diddy discussion. Look snake sucks with bananas and is #2. Go ask each characters boards how well their character deals with bananas or items all together as neither of us is an expert about any character. Bye

 

[Ralph Cecil]

While that is true it is also true that while does not win every MU he has a fighting chance in everyone of them and it's all the advantages that I listed that make him have those even MUs. No character completely walls out snake where as some characters that you mention like lose hard to and . is #3 probably cause there aren't that many great s and is low as he is cause there are so many s

I'm not sure because i've never done it, but Olimar sounds rather hard for Snake.

I think there are about as many great Diddy's as there are Snakes that I can think of off of the top of my head.
Snake Diddy
1.Ally 1.ADHD
2.Razer 2.Gnes
3.Fatal 3.Lie
4.Bizkit 4.Felix
5.MVD 5.AZ
6.MikeRay4 6.Big Lou?(I think I heard some things about him having a rather good Diddy as well)

So Marth being amazing is the reason why top Marths get beat to hell and back by diddys. Go ask them how they feel about diddy. Im not going to argue with you about pit cause I don't know anything about that gay character. IC I see your point but I've never seen an IC handle bananas well. Wario is good at avoiding bananas .

Actually yeah, Marth is quite amazing. Based off of match-up ratios averaged out Marth has the second best. Also if you don't mind, what top level Marths got ***** by a top level Diddy?

 

[2-DJeff]

IC do shut down diddy if the have a nana that if the ic is skilled enough to make magic

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

IC do shut down diddy if the have a nana that if the ic is skilled enough to make magic

I said I don't know much about IC handling of bananas as I said. But I can see IC limiting diddy's option if you nab a banana and the potential setups.

Actually yeah, Marth is quite amazing. Based off of match-up ratios averaged out Marth has the second best. Also if you don't mind, what top level Marths got ***** by a top level Diddy?

But do you know whom Marth does not do well against and we go even with .... MK. Which is why he is as low as he is. I believe it was kadaj vs gnes. It was a easy 3 stock when they played previously and the marth tried game 1 as marth and got 3 stocked again and switched to mk.

 

[Ralph Cecil]

Yeah I know lol, you already mentioned his MK stuff, & I knew myself already.

After looking at the Marth boards, they still kind of look like they're ok with the mu. Also I can't seem to find any recent matches of top Marths vs. Diddy Kongs. >_< So I don't really know how well that actually works out.

 

[_Kadaj_]

Never played Gnes in tournament lol

Never have been 3 stocked by a Diddy either xD

 

[2-DJeff]

but you lose to diddy kadaj

 

[Kuro~]

I don't like how this is turning into a diddy discussion. Look snake sucks with bananas and is #2. Go ask each characters boards how well their character deals with bananas or items all together as neither of us is an expert about any character. Bye

You called me out. So i backed up my words. End of story.

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

Never played Gnes in tournament lol

Never have been 3 stocked by a Diddy either xD

My bad, but I know it was a high level marth. While you are here kadaj could you tell us if Marth or you have a hard time with bananas.

 

[_Kadaj_]

It's no problem.

The bananas aren't too big of a problem, it's more so when they are just standing and doing nothing, or camping with walls sets up. Dealing with that is extremely difficult

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Ugh, Diddy MU as Snake is ********.

I specifically picked up Jigglypuff because of Diddy.

 

[Ralph Cecil]

I love the Diddy mu. ^_^

 

[ForwardAirRage!]

thought snake was good at the diddy MU??

 

[Ralph Cecil]

It's most commonly seen as even(That I know of), but some people have a hard time with it on both ends.

 

[ForwardAirRage!]

I hear most diddys complain about the Snake vs diddy MU. or at least say its difficult, don't know of many snakes hating it. then again i only know a few snake mains including you. XD

 

[Ralph Cecil]

That I know of you've met 3 people who play Snake(Myslef, Infern, & Links24), & have talked to 2(Myse;f, & Links).

 

[ForwardAirRage!]

yea :O imo i just dont think diddy really opposes a threat. other than the juggling but everyone does that to snake. and tripping of course is annoying but diddy does that to everyone. snake just seems like he might have a slight advantage. from what ive seen anyway. but what do i know...ima yoshi main CX

 

[Ralph Cecil]

It's mainly about stage control with those two, & they both do it so well.

 

[ForwardAirRage!]

well yea i guess with that MU it would be which character got that right stage? such as FD for diddy and like Battlefield for snake (starter wise). so i guess i could see it being even in some ways...

 

[Attila_]

then you've never played a proper diddy.

you can't camp, cause he'll set up. he can approach you better than any character in the game. he can juggle the hell out of you. he has a frame safe combo into a finisher at kill percents. he controls the stage better than you ever will.

and he does really well on bf, too. hmmmmm

 

[False]

I wreck Diddys. This is the only mu where my aggressive style really fits.

 

[Kuro~]

Meh i still think snake diddy is 55:45. Just based on characters. I mean...it could be argued to a 50:50 pretty easy...but i think snake wins slightly...most high level snakes don't lose to too many high level diddy's.

 

[SAX]

By the way, wario 3/4 charged fart is the best kill move in the game. Just sayin.

 

[Kuro~]

By the way, wario 3/4 charged fart is the best kill move in the game. Just sayin.

Haha that was in my head during that whole conversation...i just kept out of it honestly if a move kills b4 100 or close to it...and is semi-viable to land. Im happy~

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

By the way, wario 3/4 charged fart is the best kill move in the game. Just sayin.

once again situational is not the best.

 

[etecoon]

snakes everything is situational though

this thread makes me sad but not as sad as rereading that BBR topic, LMFAO

 

[SAX]

once again situational is not the best.

-sigh-
This makes me wanna stop posting on the boards.

End of discussion. I apologize for bringing this argument back up. So before you come back with a response saying how "ignorant" I am or something like that, just don't even bother. No one cares. People are just going to laugh at you.
Kbye

Inb4defensiverespose

 

[2-DJeff]

No actually game and watches fsmash is better but not the best. it kills everyone under 100. Its normal speed. You don't have to wait to use it. Start up lag is bad but the ending lag is good.

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

-sigh-
This makes me wanna stop posting on the boards.

End of discussion. I apologize for bringing this argument back up. So before you come back with a response saying how "ignorant" I am or something like that, just don't even bother. No one cares. People are just going to laugh at you.
Kbye

Inb4defensiverespose

If you are going to say something and call me an idiot or ignorant myself. Defend your statement.

How many seconds is that uber kill move available for before it turns to the not as good Waft, as I understand it the move is not as disjointed as full Waft, i believe it is still 5 frames which is very good. Waft is up there on best kill moves but the semi charged waft is too situation to be the best kill move in the game. I respectfully await your response or anyone that has the same opinion to defend SAX's point.

 

[2-DJeff]

Yo sax its good but not the best. And shark full waft is the worst out of all of them knock back wise and speed wise. It deals a lot of damage though but I rather just get the kill

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

Yo sax its good but not the best. And shark full waft is the worst out of all of them knock back wise and speed wise. It deals a lot of damage though but I rather just get the kill

This is the kind of response I am looking for, thanks jeff. I didn't know there was different frame for each of the waft charges except the first charge where it only trips you.

 

[Kuro~]

Sax was just trollin...it was a joke...a farce. lol

 

[2-DJeff]

I doubt it will

 

[SAX]

If you are going to say something and call me an idiot or ignorant myself. Defend your statement.

How many seconds is that uber kill move available for before it turns to the not as good Waft, as I understand it the move is not as disjointed as full Waft, i believe it is still 5 frames which is very good. Waft is up there on best kill moves but the semi charged waft is too situation to be the best kill move in the game. I respectfully await your response or anyone that has the same opinion to defend SAX's point.

Okay, so are we talking about the best Reliable/spammy kill move, or are we talking about the best kill move that kill at the lowest percent?

And I am Defending my statement by saying 3/4 charged fart kills at 70 percent, and snakes utilt doesn't.

And sorry for kinda calling you out. I had a bad night. Personal issues.

And no kuro im not trolling lol

 

[Kuro~]

Okay, so are we talking about the best Reliable/spammy kill move, or are we talking about the best kill move that kill at the lowest percent?

And I am Defending my statement by saying 3/4 charged fart kills at 70 percent, and snakes utilt doesn't.

And sorry for kinda calling you out. I had a bad night. Personal issues.

And no kuro im not trolling lol

I assumed you knew they were talking about utility,availability, AND kill %...so i assumed you were trolling the way your post looked...and you like to troll about wario but ya if it's kill % then 3/4 charged waft still doesnt win but it is one of like top 3 or so. But it's not as available or utile as say, fox's usmash or snake's utilt or mk's SL as far as gimps.

 

[Ralph Cecil]

I still think Fox's u-smash is better because of the mobility, & it could be possibly charged for a mix up or something.

 

[napZzz]

my eyes are bleeding after reading the past 2 pages....zzzzz