Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Noipoi]

I like how even after The Grinch stabbed Incineroar he still can't be stopped.

 

[Chrollo.]

So from what I’ve gathered: Grinch is fake but Ken, Shadow, Isaac, and Geno are confirmed in and Incineroar was possibly cut? I missed a lot so if I messed something up let me know please!

We don’t know if The Grinch is fake yet. Mystic said nobody wont tell him if the banner is real or not, they just told him there’s just some oddities and wrong elements which I don’t think refer to characters. Also we don’t know what’s going on with Incineroar, Mystic said he’s in while papagenos said he might be DLC.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Honestly, as the owner of the Smash 4 leaks group, I don't think I deserve to be in the poster. I have been skeptical of this Grinch leak the whole time.

 

[Shroob]

Says the man who posted a no meme to shut up people he disagrees with.

Box is truth.

Although I don't normally agree with King here....



Can we ****ing not.

 

[Z25]

So Ryce thinks Lyold is in?

I'm sorry but why would any insider believe this?

Lyold( no offense to his fans) is more then likely never getting in. Unlike banjo his support has been nowhere on par nor is it close to geno's. Plus his game while a classic I'm told is unfortunately dead.

I can't see him beating sora or geno for the square rep. Nor do I see why anyone would buy it. I think Ryce was probably a false name like we know square was doing.

 

[ExitWound]

So...any other topics we can talk about?

Anybody play the Konami Grinch video game?

 

[Nekoo]

I like how after The Grinch stabbed Incineroar he still can't be stopped.

I told you. That Grinch leak is literally the perfect story for the Heel that Incineroar is. He will make a last second turnabout and become playable.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Steve? being the character that debunks this whole thing would be the best timeline.

I see that you made an error, I fixed it for ya...

 

[NabiscoFelt]

Some interesting developments going on here, but I'd just like to have a moment of non-silence for Box Theory. Between the insiders and the Grinch leak, it appears to have died an unceremonious death, and I think that's a shame. It haunted us for so long, it deserves a couple cheers upon it's demise.

 

[Pyra]

Although I don't normally agree with King here....



Can we ****ing not.

sounds like you both should

box each other

to settle your issues

 

[Omega Tyrant]

I've seen some people "debunk" Papa Geno's theory that Sakurai rushed home from E3 to work on Banjo after he got the rights. It's completely possible he did this. The team could have been working on Banjo before they got permission, we've seen this in the gaming industry before. He could have been working on Bajo since 2015, we don't know. Just because he supposedly got the rights now doesn't debunk the theory.

There was absolutely no way they spent nearly the entire game's development cycle putting resources towards developing a character they did not have the rights to; besides the potential legal issues, that would be an entirely wasted unique newcomer if they couldn't get the rights to use Banjo by the end. It was ridiculous enough when some people argued they started work on Bayonetta before getting her rights to support their theory she was chosen off of <2 weeks Ballot results, such a scenario happening over a 2 year period is just not going to happen. If the Grinch leak is real, Banjo was in the game since the beginning of development with all the legal stuff hammered out for him before it began, while Incineroar not being in the base roster is due to either being low priorty or was deliberately chosen DLC.

 

[Noipoi]

Hey.... Noipoi.
View attachment 173161
Would you add me pwease? (If you can)

You're a Giratina. I'm legally required to add you.

 

[drag0nscythe]

The box is dead and the only person whos even talking about it is you and me, and i'm only even acknowledging your box fetish out of pity..

Boredom i would say.
But you obviously have a issue with it. Fear of the truth.

2 is what is left. We are slowong down for a reason.

 

[Chrollo.]

I like how even after The Grinch stabbed Incineroar he still can't be stopped.

This is literally roid rage.

 

[JustCallMeJon]

I'm so confused

Ryce and Mystic confirmed that Incineroar is in along with Ken.

Also Geno and Isaac is considered to be possible according to those said leakers.

 

[Shroob]

So Ryce thinks Lyold is in?

I'm sorry but why would any insider believe this?

Lyold( no offense to his fans) is more then likely never getting in. Unlike banjo his support has been nowhere on par nor is it close to geno's. Plus his game while a classic I'm told is unfortunately dead.

I can't see him beating sora or geno for the square rep. Nor do I see why anyone would buy it. I think Ryce was probably a false name like we know square was doing.

....Lloyd is Namco tho.

 

[Pakky]

you're the reason I decided to do this I felt bad about leaving you out

You're a treasure man.

 

[Untouch]

I have to imagine with how Steve is posting, he does know someone who works on the banners, it's why he can't be specific.
If he knows someone and they told him it's fake, he can't share it, the amount of people who work on the banners must be incredibly low so it'd really quickly give his sources away.

But that's just a theory... a grinch theory.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Both Vaan and Omni have said that they could make something like this in anywhere from a couple hours to a weekend. The guy who made this leak had days, if not weeks to plan this out, including any potential hints or evidences for it (I'm going to guess some, if not many of them were found and made up by fans though).

It might also just be that artists make art because it's fun, and there doesn't need to be a reason behind it.

Unless Omni or Vaan proves this; I have a hard time believing them. No offense. People can say they can do anything without backing it up.

 

[Onua]

Even if this leak is fake itll go down in history as the greatest bamboozle ever and this ride has been a doozy jeez man
Like this ride has been hilarious and insane and it doesnt look like its stopping until a direct smacks us in the face
If its real we get a dream roster
If its fake itll be the greatest bamboozle of all time

Everyone wins

 

[AugustusB]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/su...nge-of-the-heart.76864/page-282#post-14322330

If it's not the characters, how does he know the banner is fake?
Perhaps he knows who is actually producing the banners?

Lord, this just keeps getting deeper and deeper down the rabbit hole.

He may know promotional items? IDK this is weird.

 

[Chrollo.]

So Ryce thinks Lyold is in?

I'm sorry but why would any insider believe this?

Lyold( no offense to his fans) is more then likely never getting in. Unlike banjo his support has been nowhere on par nor is it close to geno's. Plus his game while a classic I'm told is unfortunately dead.

I can't see him beating sora or geno for the square rep. Nor do I see why anyone would buy it. I think Ryce was probably a false name like we know square was doing.

Lloyd is Namco and he got a Mii Costume in 4 so they definitely know of his popularity since they were throwing Mii Costumes at certain people like Geno and K Rool as consolation prizes of some sort

 

[Nekoo]

So Ryce thinks Lyold is in?

I'm sorry but why would any insider believe this?

Lyold( no offense to his fans) is more then likely never getting in. Unlike banjo his support has been nowhere on par nor is it close to geno's. Plus his game while a classic I'm told is unfortunately dead.

I can't see him beating sora or geno for the square rep. Nor do I see why anyone would buy it. I think Ryce was probably a false name like we know square was doing.

Uhm....Whooopsieees?

Llyod is Namco...And hum...Tales of is Far from dead...

 

[ShadowGamer193]

We don’t know if The Grinch is fake yet. Mystic said nobody wont tell him if the banner is real or not, they just told him there’s just some oddities and wrong elements which I don’t think refer to characters. Also we don’t know what’s going on with Incineroar, Mystic said he’s in while papagenos said he might be DLC.

Interesting...as long as Isaac is in I’ll be happy. Been rooting for him for a while now.

 

[Potato_]

Boredom i would say.
But you obviously have a issue with it. Fear of the truth.

2 is what is left. We are slowong down for a reason.

I honestly have nothing against you or your opinion on the box.

I just want to see your reaction if it ends up not being true. Especially after you were so certain to the point where you were saying people were in denial.

 

[Shroob]

Unless Omni or Vaan proves this; I have a hard time believing them. No offense. People can say they can do anything without backing it up.

Omni made the Rayman leak. I could see him pulling something like this with time.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Boredom i would say.
But you obviously have a issue with it. Fear of the truth.

2 is what is left. We are slowong down for a reason.

Whatever you gotta tell yourself to get your rocks off bud, nobodys shaming you for your box kink.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

can I get a tldr

TL;DR:

• Mystic comes out and says some stuff, among them is:
  • Grinch leak is fake, and will be proven fake in the next two weeks
  • Isaac and Geno near confirmed
  • Ken, Shadow, and Incineroar very likely
  • No word on Mach Rider, Chorus Kids, or Banjo & Kazooie
  • Lloyd is very likely for DLC
  • 108 stages is a yes
  • There will be a large event detailing most of the remaining newcomers and modes
• Ryce says that the Grinch leak is fake because it lacks a character his source told him is in and has multiple characters that his source didn't tell him about at all (his source supposedly told him about the full roster).

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

To everyone who is considering on watching "The Grinch" movie because we are all being mind controlled into it. I suggest you to wear a Smash Bros. shirt or some sort of Smash clothing, so we can identify our brainwashed colleagues.

Watch that movie break 100 Million on opening weekend just because of us...

 

[BluePikmin11]

So Ryce thinks Lyold is in?

I'm sorry but why would any insider believe this?

Lyold( no offense to his fans) is more then likely never getting in. Unlike banjo his support has been nowhere on par nor is it close to geno's. Plus his game while a classic I'm told is unfortunately dead.

I can't see him beating sora or geno for the square rep. Nor do I see why anyone would buy it. I think Ryce was probably a false name like we know square was doing.

Is there a source for the Lloyd stuff? This is the first time I heard of it.

 

[drag0nscythe]

I honestly have nothing against you or your opinion on the box.

I just want to see your reaction if it ends up not being true. Especially after you were so certain to the point where you were saying people were in denial.

It will be boring i am afraid. I stopped caring a long time ago.

 

[JLU51306]

I like to think it’s more akin to infinite monkey’s on a type writer and shakesphere, but we are the monkey’s, the shakesphere is a convincing leak, and the typewriter is our bat**** insane speculations

It was the best of times, it was the blurst of times...

 

[TheBazry64]

The Banner is not real!
This is NO training everybody stay calm!
STAY F****** CALM!

 

[Deleted member]

TL;DR:

• Mystic comes out and says some stuff, among them is:
  • Grinch leak is fake, and will be proven fake in the next two weeks
  • Isaac and Geno near confirmed
  • Ken, Shadow, and Incineroar very likely
  • No word on Mach Rider, Chorus Kids, or Banjo & Kazooie
  • Lloyd is very likely for DLC
  • 108 stages is a yes
  • There will be a large event detailing most of the remaining newcomers and modes
• Ryce says that the Grinch leak is fake because it lacks a character his source told him is in and has multiple characters that his source didn't tell him about at all (his source supposedly told him about the full roster).

Your opinion sucks

 

[TreeBranch]

I'm really conflicted. I feel like so much of the leak is just so Sakurai, but the insiders make it seem totally fake. I really don't know how to feel, but I guess I'll stick to the grinch gang for now

 

[Z25]

....Lloyd is Namco tho.

Lloyd is Namco and he got a Mii Costume in 4 so they definitely know of his popularity since they were throwing Mii Costumes at certain people like Geno and K Rool as consolation prizes of some sort

Uhm....Whooopsieees?

Llyod is Namco...And hum...Tales of is Far from dead...

**** confused him with Chrono.

Also forgot he had a mii costume.

And lyold isn't the main character in later ones is he?

As a Namco rep, i don't see why they'd go with him when Heihachi was literally consider for 4.

 

[doomedtacox]

Here's my optimist scenario:

- Grinch leak is right, but just "outdated", meaning it does not have have the complete art banner.
- Incineroar should also be on this banner
- Sora and Lloyd are the top contenders for DLC so far.
-108 stages is real because of the 5 newcomers from the banner we know of.

But if Incineroar was on the Grinch banner that would be 6 newcomers?

 

[Chrollo.]

Ok Mystic just outright said that the actual banner is fake, but he can confirm or deny any of the other characters. And it also seems like that the problems with the banner aren’t the characters besides the missing Incineroar, it’s a bunch of background elements.

 

[LoopyBlack]

I think I can (maybe) answer this question, and it's an idea I've seen some get close to but never go all the way with. Strap in though, because this'll be a long one, and the scope prevents a concise TL;DR.

First of all, absent official confirmation, we have been told by quite a few anonymous sources that unlike Smash 4, Nintendo/Sakurai are really cracking down on leaks this time around. Most have said over the past few months that Nintendo has been sending out bait to snuff out leakers, which seems to have worked a couple of times.

Before we continue there is something important to cover, and that is how different the landscape is now from 4 years ago. In the years since the ESRB leak Nintendo has gotten really buddy-buddy with fan channels, Gamexplain is a great example. We've also seen the rise of insiders/journalists/leakers/"shills" if you will, who have connections with individuals within companies, which have gotten wind of this.

With that in mind let me present a hypothetical. What if, in addition to sending some fake info to snuff out leaks. Nintendo has also created fake info and sent out this fake info to compromised sectors?

Think of this as the "Death Star II hypothesis". For context, in Star Wars: Return of the Jedi Emperor Palpatine sent out fake info about the status of the new Death Star's super weapon, (specifically that it was non-functional and that the shield generator on the moon of Endor was virtually non guarded, but in reality the weapon was operational and the Empire was fully expecting the rebels) and the rebellion took the bait, especially as Palpatine made the effort to get the information as grueling as it would have been had it been real.

So we could see a sequence of events as follows:

1. Sakurai finalizes a roster for SSBU
2. Sakurai/Nintendo want to prevent leaks, so they "leak" information of their own. In this scenario, banner leak is real so here Incineroar is fake information right from the source.
3. Information gets out just like any other leak (contacts within companies typically), except here it's information that is purposely misleading.
4. "Insiders" get this info, who are able to validate that it originated from Nintendo (because it did) and see no reason to believe otherwise.
5. Info spreads around to reporters like Vergeben and the like, who are also eventually convinced of its authenticity.

The beauty of this, if true of course, is that just like Palpatine's grand plan the false info came from an official source, so there would be no way for journalists to know about whether it was true or not, nor would there be a reason to question it.

What I don't think Nintendo was counting on though was somebody for whatever motivation they had making an Snapchat video of a printed poster (remember, this hypothesis requires us to assume the leak's legitimacy rather than falsehood, and that the person making the video did not design the poster, merely preparing it for an upcoming event, along with Grinch material for whatever that was for). Then said video got screenshoted by friends, one of whom leaked it online.

Nintendo now needs to do damage control, and gets the loose networks to double down on the legitimacy of the false info, resulting in all the confusion with the insiders. Thus the situation we have right now.

Before finishing this post, I would like to make one more observation for now about the background that I haven't really seen properly addressed. I can't remember when, but awhile back I was reading about how an image taken in motion can blur and distort an already burry and distorted image. Add in different lighting to this and you start to lose details that should be there. What I'm getting at is perhaps why things like waterfalls are missing is because of the moving camera, and that if we actually saw the mural in the flesh, we'd see the details that currently seem to be missing.

You touched on the part of this I find most interesting: if they're cracking down on leakers, then why are there so many inside sources relaying Smash info?

 

[Graizen]

You guys don't think there are so much "Insiders" now?

I actualy don't think so. There are not so much Insiders, and thats why people have all the same information.