Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[ShadowGamer193]

My theory is that it’s because it is real and they don’t want to ruin their relationship with Nintendo. The other theories were just about character numbers, but these are actual concrete characters with photo evidence.

 

[KingBroly]

Is this referring to their video on Ridley being able to make it into smash (which also at Daisy at the beginning) which was publicized not looking before E3's Nintendo showing this year?

It's not just that, though. Kirby's Epic Yarn on 3DS, FF7, 9, 10, 10-2 and 12 on Switch. Isabelle as a newcomer. Mario Tennis Aces, etc. And that's not including Shadow the Hegehog, which he also guessed.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Please explain me this.

The theory is that Gameexplain has recently got a lot of Nintendo related predictions right the last few months, to a scarily accurate degree, suggesting someone has big insider info.

Then this leak comes along and they immediatly try to debunk it, at first claiming Banjo Kazooie's art in the leak is ripped straight from Smashified. This was immediately proven wrong and they were made fun of heavily. Since then they've done a few topics/videos covering it, but all of a sudden....they stopped.

Like stop stopped, they refuse to talk about it.

The rumor is that Nintendo or his source told them to stop. It's probably a stretch though but who knows exactly

 

[Cosmic77]

In other news, Ridley is almost at 200 votes!! Anyone want to be the Space Pirate's 200th?

None of these arguments have any relevance to what I'm saying.

-Verge has been wrong about non-Smash content on a regular basis.

-The only things unique to him, as far as I understand it, are Isabelle and Ken. He got Simon from ___Stealth, insiders had made rumblings about Ridley long before he did, as far as I'm aware someone else that had posted on reddit said Snake was in, etc. I'm willing to argue that if he's wrong about Incineroar that he was legitimately just very lucky in choosing the right people to piggyback off of.

-The Gematsu comparison doesn't work. There were numerous characters solely unique to that leak that no one else had ever brought up.

You can't exclusively look at his track record in a vacuum and ignore that he's bungled SC6 and DBZF. I'm sure he has some legit sources since he's able to not step in mud with the sheer frequency people like Liam do, but this bizarre comparison to Gematsu is ridiculous and the idea that he's infallible is a low form of e-celeb worship.

Keep in mind I think this leak is fake. I just don't think "vergeben is confident in incineroar" is a good argument (because it objectively isn't)

I wasn't responding to you. I was explaining why the reasons listed for why Verge couldn't be trusted with Ultimate weren't valid points. Not predicting a character doesn't mean someone is wrong, hence why I used Gematsu and Rosalina as an example.

As of right now, none of his claims with this particular game have been wrong so far. I'm not looking at DBFZ or any other game.

 

[kirbsmash]

Sure, I want Inceniroar and sure, I may be a little heartbroken that it might not be in the game.

But.....I am happy with Smash, and my main wanted are already in; (Ice Climbers!!! Simon too, heck even Chrom!! )
If I were to say this leak is real....I don't care? All the newcomers looked awesome, and I am happy to play the game.

I want the game; not the characters. I want to smile as I played all the time with this game.

Opinions are each to their own, but I am happy, and everything, whatsoever is for the best or worse,

The loss of this one character won't make stuff worse. At worst, I'll be sad for an bit. I'll change my mood as I played the game.
Because of one thing.

Fun. I'll have fun with this game.

 

[Jgt044]

Seeing people say "Sakurai has done so much" means one thing to me. We genuinely don't deserve this man. He doesn't like making sequel after sequel yet he does it, he puts up with the abyssmal fans and he knows it's all his career will basically be that people care about. He's a talented as **** game designer and I was a bit disappointed he confirmed Ultimate was his next project cause he makes That Good ****: The Game

I disagree with the idea he hates doing smash games lol. I mean he's been working on 5 smash games atm and seems to be proud of his achievements overall. Sure the fans can be a pain at times, but I think Sakurai understands that, in the end, nothing they say matters. Millions of people are going to be playing the game when it comes out and it will bring lots of joy in their lives. In the end, I think Sakurai believes it's worth dealing with some hate if it means he'll be able to accomplish that goal.

Call me too optimistic if you want, but that's how I view it lol.

 

[KMDP]

Please explain me this.

Basically, Gamexplain are suspiciously quiet about the Grinch Leak, when when the ESRB leak happened they were all. over. that. ****.
---
I'd like to say that Andre's comment of "So people really think there won't be at least one new Pokémon, huh? " is incredibly arrogant.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Yeah, the Discussions really would be obvious they know regardless, because if they know if it's real or fake already, then they're gonna either need to make a script for a discussion video, which they don't and lack of experience in that would make it obvious

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

This is true but it could be a coincidence as well?

Trademarks are renewed every 10 years.

 

[Durnt]

I'm losing my mind with this ****.
We're just teeter-tottering between irrelevant points now.

In the end it'll just continue like how rumors and all other such will be im just glad im not looking at the leaks would ruin the experience like spoiled ice cream...

No one wants soiled ice cream unless you are into that then I am sorry. I don't kink shame...

 

[perfectchaos83]

But these tradmarks are too on the nose for it to be so.

Maybe Nintendo wants to revive the Eternal Darkness franchise?

They could be too on the nose because they based these characters on their trademarks being renewed.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

So what business do you even have with specifically targeting the Incineroar fanbase?

I'm not. I'm just addressing someone who expressed the idea that only Team Real would be complaining if they lost and that no one on team Fake would.

That's just simply false. There are people who would flip a lid if the leak turned out to be rreal and Inceneroar didn't make it in. I'm not even targeting his fanbase as a whole. Just those who might whine if he doesn't get in.

Both teams have their certain members.
Chillax man. I've got nothing against any faction here. I'm the last person to generalize.

 

[Z25]

So I decided to be the first one to draw fanart of the Smashboards Anime (Noipoi's poster is official material, don't @ me)

Spoiler

View attachment 172770

@Zinith and @Noipoi embark on a rescue mission to save Incineroar from the grasps of the evil Chadnondorf but they get a little lost. Will they succeed? I dunno.

Made me think of this:

Which is officially owned by nintendo so when the hell is this banger getting in smash.

 

[Deleted member]

This guy is simultaneously positing that GameExplain could be ignoring the leak because they know it's fake and that they could be ignoring the leak because they know it's real.

Andre is one of those people who is firmly sticking to Incineroar being in the game. Is all of this because GameXplain knows it's real? Or do they know it's fake?

I don't know.

But no matter what, they have information. And their actions have been sketchy.

— Joey (@JoeyTheGamer101) October 27, 2018

....but how could that be unless the argument is that "yes it's real, but there's still more"?

 

[Tree Gelbman]

lol you could twist this argument around to argue the opposite: GX could be ignoring the leak because their sources at nintendo have already told them "its fake" and they probably don't want to help it spread and inflate expectations

I could see this....HOWEVER.

There have been a bunch of fake leaks for Smash Ultimate.

Have they not covered them? Why would Nintendo specifically say ''It's fake" to them on this one?

Why would they not want to control other scenarios? Like that new item leak? If Nintendo is in cohoots with them on controlling information you'd think there'd be more oddities in the way they discuss Smash Ultimate.

I'm still not Team Real or anything. Just a thought I had.

 

[TVDart]

lol you could twist this argument around to argue the opposite: GX could be ignoring the leak because their sources at nintendo have already told them "its fake" and they probably don't want to help it spread and inflate expectations

Only issue with this argument is that they've already covered tons of fake leaks in the past. If they were covering exclusively fake leaks, what makes this one any different? The amount of effort put into this one would make it into some incredible discussion videos.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Almost asking for an update about the leak, but seems that nothing changed in the last 24 hours, am I right?

http://i.4cdn.org/v/1540678062784.png

That was found on the leak

But team fake as usual gives arguements against it

I’m still assuming fake for safety reasons but I’m leaning toward real

 

[SlickWylde]

The biggest problem I have with people at the moment is that they're hounding these people for their opinion, only to get mad at them when their opinion isn't what they wanted to hear.

Agreed. People are going out of their way to find an enemy. We might have #TeamFake and #TeamReal, but we're all really on #TeamSmash

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I disagree with the idea he hates doing smash games lol. I mean he's been working on 5 smash games atm and seems to be proud of his achievements overall. Sure the fans can be a pain at times, but I think Sakurai understands that, in the end, nothing they say matters. Millions of people are going to be playing the game when it comes out and it will bring lots of joy in their lives. In the end, I think Sakurai believes it's worth dealing with some hate if it means he'll be able to accomplish that goal.

Call me too optimistic if you want, but that's how I view it lol.

Oh no, there is no way he doesn't feel immense pride by having all these beloved cast together as the idea of aaaaaaaall this together would be a bigass pipedream

 

[Durnt]

"I spent all night debating on whether a smash leak was real or not. What did you do?"

"Sleep with my wife in our big bed."

Good man you are doing most of these people a great service. imma go play a dead game! =D

 

[Pyra]

If I had insider information, and I was a face of a news outlet trusted by Nintendo, I'd probably not say anything personally
I mean, I'm not anyone at GX, but between Nintendo's trust and how absolutely rabid many people are being about this leak, it's better to abstain when you're speaking through the context of your outlet.

Of course, I probably wouldn't directly address a group of inflamed denizens of the internet by comparing them with a rather politically controversial group of people.

But I don't have insider information so whatever

 

[Deleted member]

I got this fantastic print of King K. Rool at LA Comic Con this weekend! The artist is PixelatedTakkun if anyone wants to check him out. I can't wait to main the kremling king soon!

View attachment 172773

Did they have any prints of the Inklings? That K. Rool one looks amazing. I'm also looking forward to playing as the Kremling King.

Also, we're close to a month away, guys! We're almost there! :D

 

[KingBroly]

Basically, Gamexplain are suspiciously quiet about the Grinch Leak, when when the ESRB leak happened they were all. over. that. ****.
---
I'd like to say that Andre's comment of "So people really think there won't be at least one new Pokémon, huh? " is incredibly arrogant.

I think GameXplain dug themselves into a hole they can't really get out of at this point. They are either wrong on this, which would heavily damage their credibility, or are correct, and are basically just another media arm for Nintendo without disclosing it, given the recent string of "predictions" that have come from them.

 

[Untouch]

I have a feeling that if Nintendo was trademarking for characters, they would have kept it hidden.
The Pokemon trademarks never pop up in databases for trademarks because they aren't published right away. (I believe so anyways).

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I have a feeling that if Nintendo was trademarking for characters, they would have kept it hidden.
The Pokemon trademarks never pop up in databases for trademarks because they aren't published right away. (I believe so anyways).

I mean, you legally have to do them at a certain time or it's public domain.

 

[ZoroCarlos]

Made me think of this:

Which is officially owned by nintendo so when the hell is this banger getting in smash.

Thanks, you just made me imagine what an Incineroarette would look like. Thanks. THANKS. (lol)

 

[Graizen]

This one is good

 

[Chrollo.]

If I had insider information, and I was a face of a news outlet trusted by Nintendo, I'd probably not say anything personally
I mean, I'm not anyone at GX, but between Nintendo's trust and how absolutely rabid many people are being about this leak, it's better to abstain when you're speaking through the context of your outlet.

Of course, I probably wouldn't directly address a group of inflamed denizens of the internet by comparing them with a rather politically controversial group of people.

But I don't have insider information so whatever

we all know that you work on the localization team at nintendo of america so just confirm if tetris block is playable or not toaster

 

[Untouch]

I mean, you legally have to do them at a certain time or it's public domain.

I may be wrong, but I believe it's possible to make trademark renewal and registration private.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

It's not just that, though. Kirby's Epic Yarn on 3DS, FF7, 9, 10, 10-2 and 12 on Switch. Isabelle as a newcomer. Mario Tennis Aces, etc. And that's not including Shadow the Hegehog, which he also guessed.

Well then, it would seem that the plot thickens.

 

[N3ON]

I personally don't understand why people put so much weight on Verg's credibility in the first place, considering how badly he botched the predictions for DBFZ, I was there during all the speculation for that, AND the DLC. Vergeben's "leaks" were brought up time and again, yet Radditz and Zarbon never showed up. And Android 21 did indeed become playable. And this isn't a case of something that can be brushed aside as "they're delayed for later DLC" when team behind the game is small and strapped for time to meet dedlines. If the characters were finished or planned, they would have launched with the game like Vergeben said they would. Yet, now he's saying they're FOR sure gonna be season 2, alongside SS4 Goku, Jiren, Gogeta, and Ultra Instinct Goku. Despite that most people have caught onto the fact that the DBFZ DLC sets all come with a certain theme attached to them.

I have zero reason to believe a single word Vergeben says.

Because he seemingly employs different sources and a stronger vetting system for Smash leaks than he does elsewhere. For Smash, not since getting things right has he gotten them wrong. It's because his method for leaking Smash is more akin to professional procedure whereby you obtain multiple unrelated testimonies to verify a claim before you move forward with publishing it. Whereas his method with non-Smash stuff is more haphazard, presumably because there's less fervour surrounding that stuff, and I guess less at stake, reputation-wise. I don't know. It does hurt his reputation nonetheless to be wrong about that other stuff, clearly, and I would employ the same level of diligence to all his claims if I were him, even if that means making fewer of them. But it doesn't negate him being right about Smash.

But as with Emily and any leaker, never have I advocated putting immutable faith in any unsubstantiated claim. He also still comes off smug as a bug in a rug and regularly gets baited by GameFAQs into defending his honour like a twelve-year-old. Which can be off-putting.

Having this conversation is funny though because I also remember arguing with you towards Gematsu's validity after the fact as well.

She backed it at all up. That's on her. The burden of proof is on the leaker's claims.

Don't support something if you don't think it's real yourself.

Well right now the burden of proof is on you to substantiate her corroboration of those two Eurogamer claims. Though again, that still wouldn't greatly alter her laudable batting average, as far as leakers go.

Everything else I already addressed in the post you quoted.

 

[Das Koopa]

As of right now, none of his claims with this particular game have been wrong so far. I'm not looking at DBFZ or any other game.

But you should, lol. You're ignoring that most of what he's said isn't even his own and you're ignoring that claims made within the same timeframe as Smash has been wrong. There's not some universal force that dictates "It only matters game-by-game!". That's not how it works.

 

[TVDart]

The biggest problem I have with people at the moment is that they're hounding these people for their opinion, only to get mad at them when their opinion isn't what they wanted to hear.

People are literally going up to each other's throats right now. Everyone is allowed to have an opinion on the matter, and it's easy to forget that in a debate.

 

[SushiRoll]

I've been looking into Team Fake's arguments since I'm leaning more to being indecisive these days and I have one big issue with Team Fake's argument of the whole leak being a gigantic hoax: Why doesn't ACP or whatever the name of the company Eric currently works for deny being involved with Smash like Marina did and kill the leak? That's basically the thing backing Team Real's legitimacy more than anything especially since we know both Eric Bricard and the company itself have been contacted by the community. Can anybody on Team Fake explain this discrepancy?

You mean they're NOT going to break nda?

 

[Pyra]

we all know that you work on the localization team at nintendo of america so just confirm if tetris block is playable or not toaster

Alright fine, Tetris Block IS playable, but for the western releases, the jiggle physics has been toned down a bit and the swimsuit alternate costume includes a longer skirt.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I don’t know what side you guys are on but

No matter what the opposing team saids stick with your gut

If your wrong your wrong

Oh to point this out about the new discovery of clones in those prints

If they are beta test wouldn’t that mean incineroar or whatever could be added or something?

 

[Chrollo.]

I have a feeling that if Nintendo was trademarking for characters, they would have kept it hidden.
The Pokemon trademarks never pop up in databases for trademarks because they aren't published right away. (I believe so anyways).

sun and moon got leaked a day before their announcement because of a trademark iirc

 

[Fatmanonice]

For people that believe the Grinch leak is 95%+ likely to happen, please tell me what will be your reaction if all we end up getting is Incineroar and Ken? Will you go ballistic and flame Sakurai for having a "crappy" roster? (Note. I think the present roster is fantastic, and I actually would be fine if there were not even any more newcomers for the base game. I just want to know what the single players consists of this time around).

-2 of the 4 characters that people really want in this leak have already been implied by a number of sources (Shadow and Geno), leaving only Isaac and Banjo as the big notable characters here without a lot of hints towards them anyways (arguably just Banjo if you believe that plant item is from Golden Sun)

-DLC

So, that said, it largely boils down to two (maybe even just one) big fan favorites not making the initial roster by most people's forecasts. Worst case scenario is that they have to wait another year only for things to not pan. Given this was by far the shortest speculation season since Melee, I think people would survive.

 

[Fenn]

What predictions have gameexplain gotten right? (I don't watch them all to much, just trying to catch up)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I may be wrong, but I believe it's possible to make trademark renewal and registration private.

Maybe it's cause of Japan but they put up trademarks before the trademarked media is revealed to the public and shown to shop owners for stock orders that always leak