Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[NonSpecificGuy]

Are there actually any 3rd parties that can stand up to the wow factor of Cloud or Snake. Like, seriously, those characters may be some of the most controversial additions but they're also the rep that made the biggest media splash. Is there really anyone else who could top or equal them?

 

[FUNT1MER]

Which is exactly why Skylanders seems to be cancelled and Crash Bandicoot is now listed alongside Call of Duty on Activision's website under their major franchises due to the success of N. Sane Trilogy, right?

Eh 1/2 ain't bad huh?

Are there actually any 3rd parties that can stand up to the wow factor of Cloud or Snake. Like, seriously, those characters may be some of the most controversial additions but they're also the rep that made the biggest media splash. Is there really anyone else who could top or equal them?

Maybe Steve jk

 

[Zerp]

Are there actually any 3rd parties that can stand up to the wow factor of Cloud or Snake. Like, seriously, those characters may be some of the most controversial additions but they're also the rep that made the biggest media splash. Is there really anyone else who could top or equal them?

Sonic, but he's already in.

Steve but unironically, while many in the Smash fanbase dislike him I highly doubt that would or could reduce his media presence if he was added, Minecraft is a absolute juggernaut in terms of how iconic it is and how much merchandise it sells, Steve getting in Smash would make the rounds for sure.

 

[Oddball]

I know Miecraft is huge, but I never hear talk about Steve himself as a character. Is he really that big or is he just the guy you play as in that game everybody loves?

Still, if you're loooking for Great Characters fromtriple A rated games that have rabid fanbases that have lasted decades ... there's not many of them left.

Maybe Lara Croft? Pyramid Head? SubZero or Scorpion?

 

[Opossum]

I know Miecraft is huge, but I never hear talk about Steve himself as a character. Is he really that big or is he just the guy you play as in that game everybody loves?

Still, if you're loooking for Great Characters fromtriple A rated games that have rabid fanbases that have lasted decades ... there's not many of them left.

Maybe Lara Croft? Pyramid Head? SubZero or Scorpion?

Considering all of the Steve merchandise that sells really well, I'd say there's actual popularity toward the character in addition to the game.

 

[Arcadenik]

I just want Simon Belmont and Banjo-Kazooie.

 

[FUNT1MER]

I just want Simon Belmont and Banjo-Kazooie.

Rare ware characters or maybe master chief are more likely in my eyes due to their history. That's one of the reasons I feel bomberman and spyro and crash are enevitable (yes I misspelled that no I don't care) Sakurai has a respect for older characters and although the nes and snes have dominated the retro category I think it's time to include N64 the original Xbox and ps1 as retro.

 

[Delzethin]

Are there actually any 3rd parties that can stand up to the wow factor of Cloud or Snake. Like, seriously, those characters may be some of the most controversial additions but they're also the rep that made the biggest media splash. Is there really anyone else who could top or equal them?

At this point...probably not. Someone like Master Chief would feel more like a shark jump to most. The likes of Banjo & Kazooie might match them for '90s kids...but only for '90s kids. At this point, I don't know what utter shockers they could pull...not that they need to, as long as they keep the interesting newcomers coming.

Also worth mentioning that Mega Man did match them in hype when he was first revealed. The collective internet lost their minds (in a good way) over seeing the Blue Bomber in Smash.

 

[WB97]

Are there actually any 3rd parties that can stand up to the wow factor of Cloud or Snake. Like, seriously, those characters may be some of the most controversial additions but they're also the rep that made the biggest media splash. Is there really anyone else who could top or equal them?

Here's some characters I think have the potential to cause big media splash in the event they were included in Smash Bros. (This does not take into account how likely each of these are, just who'd attract a lot of media attention and drama)

Solid Snake returning
Dragon Quest representative (In Japan anyway)
Steve from Minecraft
Resident Evil Protagonist
Ezio (Assassin's Creed)
Lara Croft
Crash Bandicoot
Spyro the Dragon
Kratos (God of War)
Master Chief
WoW Representative
Diablo Representative
StarCraft Representative
Tracer (Overwatch)
Kazuya/Heihachi/Jin
Dovahkiin
Monster Hunter (in Japan anyway)
Scorpion
Sora (Kingdom Hearts)
Non-Video Game Origin character

There's probably some I have missed. Once again, not seeing these are likely to happen or that I want all of these to happen. These are just characters that would cause media attention and drama in the same way Snake and Cloud did

 

[Schnee117]

Are there actually any 3rd parties that can stand up to the wow factor of Cloud or Snake. Like, seriously, those characters may be some of the most controversial additions but they're also the rep that made the biggest media splash. Is there really anyone else who could top or equal them?

Without going to Microsoft for Steve or Master Chief, the Dragonborn would probably elicit a reaction around the level of Snake or Cloud. Maybe a Blizzard character as well.

 

[nirvanafan]

Out of curiosity...are there any realistic third-parties characters you guys are hoping DON'T get into the next Smash Bros? (inb4 everyone replies Steve from Minecraft XD)

I know I am a little late to this but it is an interesting topic. I would have to say a monster hunter or dragon quest rep for me. I would be ok with Steve given minecrafts impact on gaming. I was also surprised so many people said banjo kazooie although I am a big fan of classic rare so I will probably never understand how someone could not be excited for banjo getting in smash.

 

[FUNT1MER]

I know I am a little late to this but it is an interesting topic. I would have to say a monster hunter or dragon quest rep for me. I would be ok with Steve given minecrafts impact on gaming. I was also surprised so many people said banjo kazooie although I am a big fan of classic rare so I will probably never understand how someone could not be excited for banjo getting in smash.

Let's be real here minecraft is one of the reasons developers have early access and is one of the reasons gaming commentary is so popular. That is what minecraft contributed to the gaming community.

 

[Deleted member]

Without going to Microsoft for Steve or Master Chief, the Dragonborn would probably elicit a reaction around the level of Snake or Cloud. Maybe a Blizzard character as well.

Arguably, I'd say the biggest reaction would be someone like Tracer due to how huge Overwatch has become, but the complete lack of a Nintendo presence really kills the odds.

EDIT: If we want to talk other characters that haven't appeared on a Nintendo system yet, even if the likes of Shovel Knight and Shantae are "bigger" indie choices for Smash, I would say someone like Sans would cause a larger splash simply due to how widespread a name Undertale has become, even if the overall fanbase is not quite so favorable...

 

[WB97]

Arguably, I'd say the biggest reaction would be someone like Tracer due to how huge Overwatch has become, but the complete lack of a Nintendo presence really kills the odds.

EDIT: If we want to talk other characters that haven't appeared on a Nintendo system yet, even if the likes of Shovel Knight and Shantae are "bigger" indie choices for Smash, I would say someone like Sans would cause a larger splash simply due to how widespread a name Undertale has become, even if the overall fanbase is not quite so favorable...

That bit about Undertale could also apply to a Five Night's at Freddy's representative.

 

[Opossum]

Arguably, I'd say the biggest reaction would be someone like Tracer due to how huge Overwatch has become, but the complete lack of a Nintendo presence really kills the odds.

EDIT: If we want to talk other characters that haven't appeared on a Nintendo system yet, even if the likes of Shovel Knight and Shantae are "bigger" indie choices for Smash, I would say someone like Sans would cause a larger splash simply due to how widespread a name Undertale has become, even if the overall fanbase is not quite so favorable...

The funny thing is that Sans would actually be eligible for a hypothetical PSASBR sequel, of all things, due to the recent release.

Papyrus would be better anyway. Nyehehe.

 

[PeridotGX]

Papyrus would be better anyway. Nyehehe.

Wouldn't it be Frisk/Chara? But I digress.

What characters do you think could be alternate costumes/late time clones ala /.

All I can think are Yarn Yoshi for , Shadow Mewtwo for , and maybe make 's Claus alt called so.

 

[WB97]

Wouldn't it be Frisk/Chara? But I digress.

What characters do you think could be alternate costumes/late time clones ala /.

All I can think are Yarn Yoshi for , Shadow Mewtwo for , and maybe make 's Claus alt called so.

I could see Daisy being this for Peach potentially.

(Before anyone asks, I am not a memoryman3 alternate account. )

 

[Deleted member]

That bit about Undertale could also apply to a Five Night's at Freddy's representative.

True. Though I would argue that an Undertale character would probably get more positive feedback than a FNAF character even if Springtrap would be kickass.
I also bring up Undertale because Nintendo apparently had been in talks with Toby Fox about having a port long before we got the PS4 port, meaning Nintendo has shown interest in the game.

The funny thing is that Sans would actually be eligible for a hypothetical PSASBR sequel, of all things, due to the recent release.

Papyrus would be better anyway. Nyehehe.

Do you want to have a bad time? :V

That is if we'd ever GET a PSASBR sequel.

Wouldn't it be Frisk/Chara? But I digress.

A hypothetical Undertale character is a bit of a confusing point.
Would it be the protagonist or one of the more popular/iconic characters like Sans or Papyrus?

 

[WB97]

True. Though I would argue that an Undertale character would probably get more positive feedback than a FNAF character even if Springtrap would be kickass.
I also bring up Undertale because Nintendo apparently had been in talks with Toby Fox about having a port long before we got the PS4 port, meaning Nintendo has shown interest in the game.

Best we can hope for right now would be an Indie Platform-Fighter in my opinion. Think the very idea of an Indie Game representative in Smash happening will depend on which Indies performed well enough on the Ballot. (Think FNAF characters may have performed well amongst younger Nintendo fans though, given FNAF was a very prominent thing during the Ballot's run and they came up on Miiverse a lot)

 

[Luminario]

Wouldn't it be Frisk/Chara? But I digress.

What characters do you think could be alternate costumes/late time clones ala /.

All I can think are Yarn Yoshi for , Shadow Mewtwo for , and maybe make 's Claus alt called so.

I'd like to see Paula and Kumatora alts for and . They make more sense using Ness and Lucas' specials and FS anyway. Kumatora might be too tall to fit as a Lucas alt though.
Also Brittany for .

 

[Oddball]

Kazuya/Heihachi/Jin

Personally, I'd think including a character from King of Fighters or Dead or Alive would get more hype than Tekken would.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I'm still convinced that Wireframe Mac was super close to being a clone instead of an alt. I mean Little Mac has 16 ****in colors!

Granted that could just be a random ass thing that happened. I wonder if he were though what would be his unique traits? Doubt it'll happen in a future game but you never know.

 

[WB97]

Personally, I'd think including a character from King of Fighters or Dead or Alive would get more hype than Tekken would.

The commercial success gap between Tekken and those two franchises is far too great for that to be the case IMO. Tekken is the most commercially successful fighting game franchise of all time, more so than Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat. (Look it up if you don't believe me), and when you look up who the most popular fighting game characters are, those lists tend to be dominated by characters from those three titles. Not to mention if you compare the Google Trends data of these IP you will find that Tekken dominates both KoF and DoA very easily and is more in the ball-park of Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat.

 

[Wolfie557]

In each of you guys' opinion how likely, on a scale of 1-100, is an Arms character and an Inkling.

I'd say 100 for Inkling and like a good 60 for an Arms character just because that's a relatively fresh IP while Splatoon has been around for a bit longer.

99 for inkling, 35 for arms.

Arms is still pretty new but their chances increase as time goes on imo.

Regarding Rabbids I think they would have to fight as a large group, rather than a single member of there species. It just seems to be the best way to represent them.

And thats why they would make a great AT and nothing else.

But I'd play the heck out of a Rabbid in Smash

 

[Deleted member]

To me, these are my most realistic choices for third party;

*Ubisoft (Rayman or Ezio)
*Level 5 (Jibanyan or Professor Layton)
*Bethesda (Dragonborn)
*Indies (Shovel Knight or Shantae)

Most of those choices have a strong history on Nintendo consoles, and the Dragonborn would be used to promote Skyrim/Online for Bethesda.

 

[FUNT1MER]

I'm ok with semi clones but actual clones should either become pallet swaps like Lucina or have their movesets completely rewritten like ganandorf. I understand that creating a whole movement from scratch is a huge undertaking but if we are expecting smash 5 and not a port this isn't a impossible goal.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm still convinced that Wireframe Mac was super close to being a clone instead of an alt. I mean Little Mac has 16 ****in colors!

Granted that could just be a random *** thing that happened. I wonder if he were though what would be his unique traits? Doubt it'll happen in a future game but you never know.

Literally the only thing I can think of is a change in Final Smash from Giga Mac to something else.

Giga Mac has unused palettes for each of Mac's palettes (even the hoodie, which he wears like how Hulk wears his signature purple pants) except for the wire frame colors.

EDIT: Correction, he has unused palette folders. These palettes were custom made.
Giga Mac only has the standard 8 as opposed to the 16 Little Mac has.

 

[Arcadenik]

I'm still convinced that Wireframe Mac was super close to being a clone instead of an alt. I mean Little Mac has 16 ****in colors!

Granted that could just be a random *** thing that happened. I wonder if he were though what would be his unique traits? Doubt it'll happen in a future game but you never know.

I'm just glad Wireframe Mac didn't become a separate character if that was the case. On the other hand, I still wish Alph was a separate character. Alph could have been an Olimar clone with nothing but Rock Pikmin (they could be Purple Pikmin reskinned with Rock Pikmin models).

 

[Nauzgo]

I'm ok with semi clones but actual clones should either become pallet swaps like Lucina or have their movesets completely rewritten like ganandorf.

Why? Are you so offended by having another character slots? As long as it makes people happy and it doesn't require much effort, I'm totally fine with clones. Alph for example should have gotten his own spot too, like Arcadenik said. I think he was even planned though. Same goes for Yink and Pichu, I don't understand the hate. It's cheap bonus content.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm just glad Wireframe Mac didn't become a separate character if that was the case. On the other hand, I still wish Alph was a separate character. Alph could have been an Olimar clone with nothing but Rock Pikmin (they could be Purple Pikmin reskinned with Rock Pikmin models).

.....you want an Olimar that only uses Purple Pikmin?

Do you not understand the concept of "balance"?

 

[Autumn ♫]

I can only imagine the salt that would happen if Wireframe Mac did become a clone instead of an alt. I'd say way more than Dark Pit got. Also, if you want an OP Olimar, White Pikmin only would do that.

 

[Arcadenik]

.....you want an Olimar that only uses Purple Pikmin?

Do you not understand the concept of "balance"?

Yes, I want an Olimar that only uses Purple Pikmin.

I figure it could be balanced by making Alph slow and heavy due to the Rock Pikmin's weight... and his Rock Pikmin would not fly very far when thrown just like Purple Pikmin.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

This is why we aren't in charge of balancing, people.

Nothing but the purple Pikmin equivalent would make Alph bonkers and not in a good way.

 

[APC99]

I feel like Pikmin is difficult to make another character for because, besides Rock Pikmin, Olimar kind of covers every base. I hate to bring up the MvC Infinite way of character selection, but in this case, it's true: The captain is, by all means, a function. They don't carry different stats or abilities, the gameplay stems from the types of Pikmin themselves. And with Olimar using 6/7 Pikmin types, there's not much wiggle room for another character unless you base them entirely around the missing Pikmin type (which, as already mentioned, has more cons than pros) or pulling inspiration from other parts of the game to create an identity, which in the case of Pikmin, there isn't much to pull from.

Maybe Pikmin 4 will introduce something that completely changes up the status quo and provides inspiration for a new Pikmin character. But for now, Olimar (with Alph as an alt. costume) covers the majority of what the Pikmin series offers a game like Smash.

 

[Diddy Kong]

How we feeling about Alm around here? He's that one Fire Emblem character that seems very overlooked. Same with Celica.

 

[AEMehr]

How we feeling about Alm around here? He's that one Fire Emblem character that seems very overlooked. Same with Celica.

Celica is definitely the more interesting of the two. You can reintroduce Pichu's self-harm gimmick but on a character who can potentially deal out some massive damage when utilizing those attacks.
Similar to Robin on paper, through utilizing magic and swordplay, but can be very different in execution.

Whether we even see a character from Shadows of Valentia really depends on when the next Smash project started. Even then, we don't really know how the team feels about adding another Fire Emblem fighter if the game still is a port.

 

[PeridotGX]

How we feeling about Alm around here? He's that one Fire Emblem character that seems very overlooked. Same with Celica.

I don't think his chances are great. Sakurai always goes for the newest characters in the FE franchise, and as we can see with Greninja he'll go out of his way to do so. I really don't think theirs going to be a 3-4 year gap between FEs.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Celica is definitely the more interesting of the two. You can reintroduce Pichu's self-harm gimmick but on a character who can potentially deal out some massive damage when utilizing those attacks.
Similar to Robin on paper, through utilizing magic and swordplay, but can be very different in execution.

Whether we even see a character from Shadows of Valentia really depends on when the next Smash project started. Even then, we don't really know how the team feels about adding another Fire Emblem fighter if the game still is a port.

Celica would've been real interessting if it wasn't for Robin already being there.

The concept of VoC-styled magic system is cool. But I doubt it would be anything more than a semi-clone based potential of Robin. The exact animations of the sword would be what would make Celica mostly different. Guess Up B and Down B need something else too, but nothing drastically.

If that's the case, might as bring in Alm. At least, that's what I think.

 

[Opossum]

Alm and Celica, huh? Sadly I don't think they're too likely based on the fact that FE16 is already in development, making them a case of missing the boat. Then again, Sakurai seems to like Gaiden, considering it has a few songs in Smash.

That being said, they're some of my most wanted characters. The full movesets aren't done yet, but here are the specials and general gameplay ideas I had for them!

Alm

Neutral: Anti-Fliers - Alm pulls out a bow and takes aim. However, it is pointed slightly upwards. Unlike Link's or Pit's, Alm's bow fires in an arc, making hitting with it harder. However, if it hits an aerial opponent, they will be sent straight downward. How far downward is determined by how long the button was held. This move has notable end lag afterward as Alm needs to reequip Falchion, but is a high risk, high reward move.

Side: Double Lion - A two strike move. The first, if it hits with its small hit box, has Alm quickly swipe the opponent, momentarily stunning them if it connects. Alm can follow this up by hitting side special again, causing him to slam down the Falchion from overhead for massive damage, but also hefty recoil. A move that could either help Alm flee to safety while the foe is stunned, or hit harder at the risk of the stun wearing off and Alm receiving recoil.

Up: Windsweep - Alm leaps straight up with the Falchion thrusted skyward. Does little damage, but Alm has super armor on the way up, referencing the Windsweep ability which prevents enemy counters.

Down: Subdue - Performed in a similar way to a Counter move, Alm strikes the opponent, but notably does no knockback, only damage.

Final Smash: Scendscale - If foes are in range of the attack's start up, a cutscene plays, based on Alm's in-game cutscene when activating this move. Visually, they're essentially the same. The move then ends. Unlike in Shadows of Valentia, this move does not cause recoil damage to Alm.

Alm's general gameplay revolves around having lots of moves that deal large sums of damage, but not a lot of knockback. Alm has no trouble racking up percentages, but actually killing is a bit of an issue for him, as besides his smashes his only kill moves are Double Lion's second hit, which had massive recoil and requires precision to use, and Anti-Fliers, which is also difficult to hit with. He's pretty damn fast though.


Celica

Neutral: Fire (Ragnarok) - Celica charges up a fire ball that shoots forward before exploding. At full charge, this becomes Ragnarok, which is incredibly powerful, doing roughly 35% damage and quite a bit of knock back, but at the expense of Celica taking hefty recoil damage. Chargeable and storable, but Celica continues to take more damage the longer it is stored, so releasing it sooner is recommended.

Side: Seraphim - Celica clasps her hands together as she is bathed in a flash white light. A giant ball of white light descends from the sky once the side special is input again, or until ten seconds have passed, causing it to fall automatically. A trap-styled spell to catch goes off guard once they forget where it was summoned from. Celica is only damaged with this move if the move hits the opponent, unlike Ragnarok.

Up: Excalibur - Celica summons a gust of razor wind around her as she ascends. Nearby foes get cut by the wind, though Celica also takes minor damage from this move (less than five percent).

Down: Mila's Turnwheel - Celica kneels and enters a praying stance. If this move is held for five seconds without breaking, Celica's damage percentage will reset to how it was thirty seconds prior to use. Celica must be on the ground in order to use it.

Final Smash: Ragnarok Ω - If foes are in range of the attack's start up, a cutscene plays, based on Celica's in-game cutscene when activating this move. Visually, they're essentially the same. The move then ends. Unlike in Shadows of Valentia, this move does not cause recoil damage to Celica.

Celica mainly relies on her spells, with a few moves utilizing the Beloved Zofia, like her jab. She takes a variant of Pichu's self damage gimmick, but better executed. Celica does more self damage the more potent her spells are, but can reliably kill using them. Her issue stems from her being the epitome of a glass cannon, as she can't take hits well at all, especially when using her higher recoils spells.

If you want visuals for their Final Smashes, have a look here at this short clip. Bonus Triangle Attack too.

 

[Luminario]

Celica can also be added in as a quick Robin clone. Take out the tomes and throw in self-damaging spells, remove the Levin Sword, switch up the FS and other minor animations and voila~ a character with a unique mechanic with little fuss. I'd like her to be more unique, but I'll take what I can get.