Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[N3ON]

Wait, you actually read the old thread before you joined in? I think you came in at like May, 2012.

Ah the old days when I bothered everyone with my Victini propaganda along with a few other people. Fun times. Of course I realized that Victini wasn’t getting in by February, 2012 and reacted less than well to it. That thread alone merits a few stories.

But Mr. Pickles, I've always been here.

I think I've come up with the perfect list if we were to have one Pokemon from each generation:

1: Pikachu
2: Pichu
3: Plusle & Minun duo character
4: Pachirisu
5: Emolga
6: Dedenne
7: Mimikyu

I've never seen a more complete-looking list.

...**** me

 

[Starcutter]

Saw a fun game on Reddit and thought I'd share.

Pick one character that debuted on each Nintendo console to be in the next Smash game:

NES: Excitebike

SNES: Dixie Kong

Gameboy: Giovanni

N64: Paper Mario

Gamecube: Louie

Wii: Captain Toad

3DS: Mimikyu

Wii U: Yarn Yoshi

Switch: Springman

NES: Takumaru
SNES: Bandana Dee
Gameboy: Dark Matter
N64: Banjo
Gamecube: Chibi Robo
GBA: Lyn
DS: Neku Sakuraba
Wii: Magolor? Idk
3DS: Lycanroc
Wii U: Alph
Switch: Rex

 

[New_Dumal]

NES: Simon Belmont

SNES: Dixie Kong

Gameboy: Lyndis

N64: Rayman

Gamecube: Tom Nook

Wii: Travis Touchdown

3DS: Decidueye (not a big fan of portable gaming, and most 3ds sucessful games were old franchises. Never played Pokemon, but he looks cool).

Wii U: Shovel Knight

Switch: Springman

(Mobile: Anna, from Fire Emblem Heroes)

 

[Deleted member]

Saw a fun game on Reddit and thought I'd share.

Pick one character that debuted on each Nintendo console to be in the next Smash game:

NES: Excitebike

SNES: Dixie Kong

Gameboy: Giovanni

N64: Paper Mario

Gamecube: Louie

Wii: Captain Toad

3DS: Mimikyu

Wii U: Yarn Yoshi

Switch: Springman

NES: Balloon Fighter.

SNES: King K. Rool.

Game Boy: Prince Sable.

N64: Waluigi.

GameCube: Krystal becase i can't come up with anything else.

GBA: Isaac

DS: ............uh........is there any noticable Nintendo character that debuted on the DS? Im gonna say Starfy (i know he debuted on GBA, but his first game outside of Japan was on the DS)

Wii:...........i have no idea, i can't come up with anything.

3DS: Dillon.

Wii U: Wonder Red.

Switch: That one girl in BotW that gets upset when you step on her flowe-i mean Spring Man.

 

[StormC]

Wait, can we pick characters that first came to Nintendo on that console, even if they didn't originate from it? Because then I'm totally changing either my GBA or GCN answer to Dr. Eggman. Sonic Advance and Sonic Adventure 2: Battle came out the same day in Japan.

 

[Polan]

Mimikyu is totally going to be a Pokeball and I'll eat a shoe if it isn't (don't quote me on this i don't actually want to eat a shoe)

 

[Danpal65]

this

Sorry, but you've brought this upon yourself

Not to be mean to people who want Mimikyu as playable, but I think it would make a really fun Pokéball summon as well.

 

[Deleted member]

Mimikyu is totally going to be a Pokeball and I'll eat a shoe if it isn't (don't quote me on this i don't actually want to eat a shoe)

Your quote will now be part of my signature

 

[Hinata]

NES: Toad

SNES: Crono from Chrono Trigger

Gameboy: Issac

N64: Paper Mario

Gamecube: Midna

Wii: Bandana Dee

3DS: Decidueye

Wii U: Elma

Switch: Rex & Pyra

It wasn't mentioned in the list, but if we had a DS category, I would've chosen Chibiterasu from Okamiden.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Anytime someone on this forum says ''I'll eat a shoe."

The thing they say it against always happens.

You just got us Mimikyu in Smash.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Also keep in mind that the roster was likely decided early-mid 2016, so when Sakurai was picking a Pokemon, it would have been a similar situation to Greninja seeing as SuMo was only just announced early in the year and wasn't released until late in the year.

 

[Deleted member]

But Mr. Pickles, I've always been here.
View attachment 141634


...**** me

Oh I see, you’ve been plotting your dastardly schemes all this time. No wonder why the men love you, you’ve captured their charm.

 

[Deleted member]

You were the one asking a question "Wouldn't the character that fits best in a fighting game be antithetical to wanting a unique character?" Decidueye fits the mold because it's a bipedal Pokemon with enough humanoid traits to work in a fighting game, like the majority of the characters I mentioned before. Greninja got picked when all he had going for him was this picture:

What does it tell me? That Sakurai probably picked him because it was easy and obvious to envision how he would fight in Smash. He could not follow this mold for Decidueye. But if Sakurai defaulted to mascot characters every time, we would have Meowth and Zoroark in this game.

Shame we have one that fits better, eh?

 

[Danpal65]

Anytime someone on this forum says ''I'll eat a shoe."

The thing they say it against always happens.

You just got us Mimikyu in Smash.

Alright, I'm going to make a sacrifice for you all. If everyone's favourite character does not get in, I'll eat every shoe I own

 

[Deleted member]

Anytime someone on this forum says ''I'll eat a shoe."

The thing they say it against always happens.

You just got us Mimikyu in Smash.

Simon Belmont, Balloon Fighter, K. Rool, Waluigi and Isaac will NOT be in Smash, and if they are i will eat 20 shoes!

...............does it still count if it's about characters you want but don't expect?

 

[Hinata]

Alright, I'm going to make a sacrifice for you all. If everyone's favourite character does not get in, I'll eat every shoe I own

What a true hero. Sacrificing himself for the good of the cause.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Shame we have one that fits better, eh?

It was really discomforting to see your avatar/sig no longer Incineroar, let me tell ya.

Sun and Moon actually came out roughly 2 years before Smash Switch, as opposed to X and Y which came out only 1 year before Smash 3DS Wii U. They probably had a lot better concept art, if not more, to go off of when deciding this roster.

 

[StormC]

Shame we have one that fits better, eh?

I wouldn't say better, just differently and equally as well. Incineroar vs. Decidueye will be a test on whether or not Sakurai values type uniqueness in Smash (except for Pikachu/Pichu, every Smash Pokemon fighter has unique typing with no overlap to other Pokemon in the game). Worth noting that Chesnaught and Delphox both could have worked equally as well in Smash but were passed up (probably because Greninja offered the best contrast to Charizard).

And as was said above me, they have more to go off of than concept art.

 

[Staarih]

It may be the Mimikyu-supporter in me, but I feel like Mimikyu would be such a Sakurai-thing to do, being a bit of a quirky, unusual pick. And we all know he can work his magic and make something like... Sunkern work if he wanted to, so moveset/animations shouldn’t be an issue. It really comes down to what Sakurai/The Pokémon company choose to go with, it could be neither Mimikyu nor Decidueye but something completely different (in before Incineroar).

 

[New_Dumal]

I know it may sound stupid but I really think that if Sakurai had to chose a starter from Sun/Moon before the game even releases, he would pick Decidueye.

I mean... look at his competition.
I know a lot of people likes Incineroar, but come on people, please. Also, he had Charizard and Greninja in the Smash4 roster. If the grass type was dull this would not make a difference, but it just adds more bias to the grass starter.

 

[Danpal65]

It was really discomforting to see your avatar/sig no longer Incineroar, let me tell ya.

Sun and Moon actually came out roughly 2 years before Smash Switch, as opposed to X and Y which came out only 1 year before Smash 3DS Wii U. They probably had a lot better concept art, if not more, to go off of when deciding this roster.

There would have been some pretty solid finished gameplay around the time Sakurai started development for this game for sure. Sun and Moon came out in November that year, and we're looking at a June/July sort of area, so there definitely would have been gameplay to demonstrate how Pokémon worked, a benefit Greninja did not have.

 

[Deleted member]

It was really discomforting to see your avatar/sig no longer Incineroar, let me tell ya.

Felt like taking a Kiryu break.

 

[Starcutter]

Seeing as incinaroar is one of my least favourite Pokemon... ever? I'd be a little disappointed if he was in over ones I do like, such as Decidueye and Lycanroc.

I'd still be able to get over it.


Also, between Decidueye and Incineroar, isn't it kinda subjective who'd be the best fit for smash? From a glance, I mean.

 

[Danpal65]

Seeing as incinaroar is one of my least favourite Pokemon... ever? I'd be a little disappointed if he was in over ones I do like, such as Decidueye and Lycanroc.

I'd still be able to get over it.


Also, between Decidueye and Incineroar, isn't it kinda subjective who'd be the best fit for smash? From a glance, I mean.

The way Litten ended up as Incineroar kinda rubbed me the wrong way.

I was super hyped for a four-legged fire type starter, but we got another bipedal one who, for all intents and purposes, is another fire/fighting starter. I know he is technically a dark type, but he just as easily have been a fighting type.

 

[StormC]

Incineroar has definitely grown on me as time goes on and I'd be fine with him in Smash, but my heart is still with the dead owl.

 

[Starcutter]

I still remember the early days when people thought litten was going to evolve into a fire-poison cat. I'd so prefer that.

 

[Deleted member]

I mean... look at his competition.
I know a lot of people likes Incineroar, but come on people, please.

Don't even start. I have absolutely no patience for this.

 

[Starcutter]

I mean, if I'm being completely, 110% legit and honest, the Pokemon I'd be most happy for in smash would be Beedrill.

 

[Arcanir]

Also keep in mind that the roster was likely decided early-mid 2016, so when Sakurai was picking a Pokemon, it would have been a similar situation to Greninja seeing as SuMo was only just announced early in the year and wasn't released until late in the year.

I don't think an SM Pokemon would be in the same situation as Greninja. With XY, when Sakurai created his project plan B2W2 was in its pre-release phase and none of us even knew XY existed, much less a new generation as a whole. SM by contrast was already announced to the public and was probably closer to completion by the time we're guessing the project plan to be done. Theoretically if Sakurai were to pick an SM Pokémon at that exact moment (provided he didn't wait a bit beforehand), TCPi would likely have early plans set for the generation at that point along with finalized designs and potentially models, which would allow for a decision on which Gen 7 Pokémon to go with to be more informed.

 

[StormC]

Midnight Lycanroc is my favorite gen 7 Pokemon and I'd be thrilled for him to be in Smash but I don't think his chances are great. I'd love to be proven wrong. He'd be awesome as an earth-based fighter (sorry Isaac) that is currently lacking and has a very striking, fun design.

I'd be fine with most gen 7 Pokemon. I'm indifferent to Mimikyu though.

 

[N3ON]

I just feel like Litten could've broken the mold a bit and been some neat quadrupedal flaming sabretooth tiger or something, and he just turned into another bipedal "fighter" looking fire starter. I mean thank god he's not fighting type, but he's a wrestler, so it's still very fighty. Just came as a bit of a letdown, we've gotten what like five? relatively humanoid looking fire starters in a row.

Simon Belmont, Balloon Fighter, K. Rool, Waluigi and Isaac will NOT be in Smash, and if they are i will eat 20 shoes!

...............does it still count if it's about characters you want but don't expect?

Shoes aside that's a great lineup of characters.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Gen 7 would have been well under development by the time Sakurai started Smash Switch.

It was announced around the time he started, which means it had been already a project for a while.

In the time since it's release he's had plenty of time to have either decided to add whoever he pleases from that generation.

Hell it's possible since he's been working so long that the game has come and released that he made his original choice, saw the response to another Pokemon and added them in as well.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Both Gen 6 and Gen 7 had disappointed me with who was appearing to be my favorite starter.

In Gen 6, I loved Froakie and Frogadier. The bubble frog concept was super cool, and I really like it. And someone even made this art as a speculation for the third stage, which I also loved:

Spoiler

Greninja kinda disappointed me even though he is very cool.

In Gen 7, I really loved Torracat. Not sure what it was, but that Pokemon was just incredible. On my most recent playthrough of USUM, I took Litten and didn't evolve it past Torracat til very late into the game. I was really hoping for the leaked images to be fake, and Torracat to evolve into a quadruped panther/sabertooth tiger, but instead we got the leg-day-skipping wrestler. Not that I don't like Inciniroar, I just would've preferred something else.

 

[JamesDNaux]

I don't think an SM Pokemon would be in the same situation as Greninja. With XY, when Sakurai created his project plan B2W2 was in its pre-release phase and none of us even knew XY existed, much less a new generation as a whole. SM by contrast was already announced to the public and was probably closer to completion by the time we're guessing the project plan to be done. Theoretically if Sakurai were to pick an SM Pokémon at that exact moment (provided he didn't wait a bit beforehand), TCPi would likely have early plans set for the generation at that point along with finalized designs and potentially models, which would allow for a decision on which Gen 7 Pokémon to go with to be more informed.

It was further along in development, yes, but the point was that no post-release promotion/popularity from SuMo would have any effect on the roster. He'd still be picking a Pokemon in the dark, not concept art like Greninja specifically.

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

From what I understand, the five characters considered the most because of recent appearances likely are Captain Toad, Dixie Kong, Decidueye, Spring Man, and Rex and Pyra, correct?

I’m going out in a limb and say most of these won’t be on the roster. I’m seeing a repeat of last game where use applied Brawl’s selection process to argue that K. Rool, Ridley, Mewtwo, and Mega Man were shoe-ins (which I was guilty of) and only one got in the base roster while the other became DLC. Likewise, the five I mentioned above are considered obvious but all of these could hypothetically not get in for good reasons. I think we’ll see Rex and Pyra on the base roster with Spring Man as DLC but the other three would genuinely surprise me.

This depends on what you consider based on "recent appearances." Bandana Dee and Celica could also be characters people often consider because of recent appearences.

 

[Starcutter]

Every time we talk about Pokemon, I have to talk about wanting a quick, rushdown based quadruped character. The ones we have right now are both kinda campy and slow. I want one that's top 5 fastest in the game. Dusk Lycanroc is literally perfect for what I want in a new smash character.

Either him or Amaterasu.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Every time we talk about Pokemon, I have to talk about wanting a quick, rushdown based quadruped character. The ones we have right now are both kinda campy and slow. I want one that's top 5 fastest in the game. Dusk Lycanroc is literally perfect for what I want in a new smash character.

Either him or Amaterasu.

Amaterasu is my favorite Pokemon
But anyways, within the same vein, Wolf Link & Midna would be really cool, too.

 

[Starcutter]

Amaterasu is my favorite Pokemon
But anyways, within the same vein, Wolf Link & Midna would be really cool, too.

Yeah, Wolf Link should also fit that description but I personally have little attachment to him. I guess he was in BOTW so that's a thing

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Eevee makes more sense of a quadruped rep. Can also a be rush down and you get the chance to evolve into the various forms.

Everyone is going to go ''BUT OVERREPPED GEN 1"

But that's the sad truth. Eevee is probably the most famous quadruped Pokemon.

 

[Arcanir]

It was further along in development, yes, but the point was that no post-release promotion/popularity from SuMo would have any effect on the roster. He'd still be picking a Pokemon in the dark, not concept art like Greninja specifically.

Even so, I don't know if I'd say it's akin to Greninja. Post-release could potentially not be an option, but pre-release period would still allow at the very least a fair chunk of SM Pokémon to be exposed to the public, and from there you can gather initial response and reception of those Pokémon to make a decision if you desired. By comparison, Greninja would have no such option, he was reliant on the whims of those behind the scenes, those who weren't in the know were otherwise completely in the dark.

I think a better comparison here would be Lucario. Brawl's roster was decided around the time his movie released in Japan, and at that time there is no guarantee that the fans would've been able to watch his movie before he was chosen (especially western fans). Nonetheless, they still were exposed to him due to the pre-release hyping him up and showcasing his design and blurbs on his character, and thus fans would be familiar with him and could form impressions and opinions on him that could theoretically be gathered and assessed before a decision was made.