Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Tree Gelbman]

We've been over this 97 times, children.

Villager does not cover his whole franchise.

There are 6 or 7 games in his franchise, each adding new stuff all the time.

Also Isabelle and Tom Nook are Nintendo all-stars whether you very much like it or not.

More so than any Xenoblade character or bandana wearing furry things or even a Toad wearing a flashlight on it's head.

Please try again.

 

[Starcutter]

Yeah, that's true. Just mentioning it for the sake of conversation.

And your guess is as good as mine. Maybe people think 4chan is just some place that game devs can't possibly ever look at.

I think they post on 4chan since it's completely anonymous, that way it's less likely they'd be caught.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I think they post on 4chan since it's completely anonymous, that way it's less likely they'd be caught.

I mean with a company the size of Nintendo however I very much doubt you could be completely unanimous when leaking something.

 

[vaanrose]

People on the 4chan thread asked the leaker to post more, and all they got was radio silence (for reference's sake, when people asked the ESRB leaker to post more, he did).

Not saying it has any effect on the legitimacy of this leak one way or the other, just food for thought.

Worth remembering the guy who actually posted the ESRB stuff to 4chan was NOT the guy who filmed the videos. In point of fact the ESRB leaker had no idea how that kid even got the videos in the first place, he had given it to a couple people, and they gave it to a couple people, etc. Despite my best efforts, I never could fully track the chain of custody, but by the time the videos were posted to 4chan several different groups had acquired them. There's even one video that never got posted publicly, because the 4chan kid never got it.

All this to say, if it's legit, it's possible the guy doing the leaking isn't even the same guy who filmed it. It's what happened last time.

 

[HyruleHero]

Well ain't that just a super convincing video, the pause layout is different and spring boy isn't a little mac model (could be another character I just thought it would be little mac), you can see this if you look at little macs stance in smash 4. though deciduye not moving is a bit dubious and the stage doesn't look complete with how the stage is floating in the air. Guess only time will tell.

Spoiler: Little Mac stationary

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Bandana Dee is far from obvious. Isabelle yes. She's pretty obvious.

I don't know why Bandanna Waddle Dee was considered obvious even in Smash 4. People keep saying Kirby needs more characters, after we had already gotten two in Brawl. I mean, we have Kirby, King Dedede, and Meta Knight. That's as good as it gets. I'm not using the "We don't need more characters" argument. I'm just saying those ARE all the characters.

People also keep bringing up that Bandanna Waddle Dee is his own character and somehow he's just as much a main character as the previous three because he's playable alongside them in two games.

The problem for people like me isn't that he's not his own character, but that he's inspired by an enemy and retains the design of one. He's an actual character, but that doesn't change the fact that he's a Waddle Dee, just with a spear and a Bandanna.

I think Kamek is a very deserving character, but the reason I don't bring him up on the subject of likely characters is because I acknowledge that even though he's his own character and he has traits that set him apart of other Magikoopas, like his broom and his army of Toadies, I still acknowledge that he is based on a generic enemy.

 

[Hinata]

Worth remembering the guy who actually posted the ESRB stuff to 4chan was NOT the guy who filmed the videos. In point of fact the ESRB leaker had no idea how that kid even got the videos in the first place, he had given it to a couple people, and they gave it to a couple people, etc. Despite my best efforts, I never could fully track the chain of custody, but by the time the videos were posted to 4chan several different groups had acquired them. There's even one video that never got posted publicly, because the 4chan kid never got it.

All this to say, if it's legit, it's possible the guy doing the leaking isn't even the same guy who filmed it. It's what happened last time.

Ah, I didn't know all the intricacies of the ESRB leak, so that's valuable information.

 

[Wyoming]

Boxers having similar stances isn't an argument I will entertain. It seems to be the same in ARMS.

As for the pause layout being different.......new games tend to change some things.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

To continue with interesting things with the leak.

Anyone notice the Arms Series symbol next to Springman's Icon? It's just a fist. It's not his character's logo nor for the logo for the Arms series (which is present on the stage itself).

Also there's a screen in the background on the stage. You see it when it's paused. It looks like it's showing footage unrelated to the match which is different than usual screens on stadium stages in smash.

I'm really hoping this is real. That icon thing is really weird and I'm not sure about the screen...

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Decidueye is pretty stiff. He doesn't even seem to have any movement going on at all. You'd think he'd at least do something while idle.

 

[Wyoming]

Decidueye is pretty stiff. He doesn't even seem to have any movement going on at all. You'd think he'd at least do something while idle.

He looks towards the camera at one point, no?

 

[NintenZ]

We've been over this 97 times, children.

Villager does not cover his whole franchise.

There are 6 or 7 games in his franchise, each adding new stuff all the time.

Also Isabelle and Tom Nook are Nintendo all-stars whether you very much like it or not.

More so than any Xenoblade character or bandana wearing furry things or even a Toad wearing a flashlight on it's head.

Please try again.

I mean in all fairness, while I understand what you are trying to prevail, Toad in general is an All-Star, and I believe that Captain Toad could qualify as one since he is a main, leading Toad, and one Nintendo is really pushing these days.

 

[Hinata]

Anyone notice the Arms Series symbol next to Springman's Icon? It's just a fist. It's not his character's logo nor for the logo for the Arms series (which is present on the stage itself).

Sakurai's made weird decisions regarding series symbols before. Remember when Mega Man's symbol turned out to be a gear, and Cloud's symbol was just two Fs?

 

[Tree Gelbman]

The screen behind Spring Man when the footage is paused seems to simply have a picture of Spring Man in it.

The symbol for the Arms series is what appears to be a Toaster.

 

[_Sheik]

Well ain't that just a super convincing video, the pause layout is different and spring boy isn't a little mac model (could be another character I just thought it would be little mac), you can see this if you look at little macs stance in smash 4. though deciduye not moving is a bit dubious and the stage doesn't look complete with how the stage is floating in the air. Guess only time will tell.

Spoiler: Little Mac stationary

The guy who recorded the video probably plugged in a second controller to ensure Decidueye remains idle. (You can see the player 2's blue color behind Decidueye's icon and percentage)

 

[vaanrose]

Decidueye is pretty stiff. He doesn't even seem to have any movement going on at all. You'd think he'd at least do something while idle.

I think his Idle variant is probably the weakest animation in the video. That turn is very abrupt and looks a little too linear for my tastes. I also agree with the notion that Deciduoye should be standing at more of 3/4 view to show off it's face, as it doesn't have the strongest profile silhouette. But that's hardly actual evidence against the leak.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Decidueye is pretty stiff. He doesn't even seem to have any movement going on at all. You'd think he'd at least do something while idle.

I remember how some fighters heavily lacked any kind of idle animations, especially back in Melee.

 

[NintenZ]

I do find it kinda sketchy though that the characters demonstrated are from such recent games, like you’d think the ones demonstrated would be from game’s a little more in line with the project plan date.

 

[Deleted member]

Decidueye is pretty stiff. He doesn't even seem to have any movement going on at all. You'd think he'd at least do something while idle.

Decidueye is normally stiff.
That's just its design.

 

[Deleted member]

Smashified makes models instead of static imagery now, stands to reason someone of similar talent could do the same. These are crazy days we live in.


But now they have the luxury of DLC, and Spring-Man seems a desired enough character to make sense as standalone content. Doubt it’ll be an issue.

That is why I don't see us getting last-minute characters outside of clones anymore. Spring Man is either on the roster from the start or he's not in at all.

I think there are many more generic and uninspired designs than spring man in the video game industry.

I'd say it's pretty unfair to consider Snake a generic design just because he's a white human male. In fact, I would say he is unique among video game characters. As others have said, having a fairly generic design doesn't make one an uninspiring character.

I'll be honest, I actually really dig Spring Man's design, toothpaste hair and all.

Though Helix, Min Min, and Lola Pop also rank pretty high for me.

Yeah I'll say he looks pretty cool. Supposedly, ARMS has designs influenced by Dragon Ball, which is always a plus for me.

The most telling thing about #TeamFake isn't even any flaws or things we've nitpicked.

It's that Nintendo hasn't snatched this down already.

For those wondering, I uploaded the video around 2:30 p.m. with the hope of getting a take down notice. I even got someone to retweet the video to Nintendo of America. The longer the video stays up, the less likely it is to be real. If nothing happens before the end of tomorrow, I will take down the video and assume it is fake.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Sakurai's made weird decisions regarding series symbols before. Remember when Mega Man's symbol turned out to be a gear, and Cloud's symbol was just two Fs?

You'd think someone trying to make it look real would use one of the actual icons from Arms.

 

[Polan]

If this is fake, I hope whoever did this comes out and posts all the models and assets that they used. They look so damn good and it would be criminal to not be able to use them.

 

[Inawordyes]

The only thing that aesthetically displeases me is the idle. It’s way too fast and weird, and as far as I know (not having played ARMS myself) doesn’t match his actual idle in that game.

But there are so many “this is so obviously wrong” things that are actually pushing me towards real simply because so much seems and looks believably like placeholder.

 

[Hinata]

The only thing that aesthetically displeases me is the idle. It’s way too fast and weird, and as far as I know (not having played ARMS myself) doesn’t match his actual idle in that game.

As far as "not matching his actual idle", his actual idle has his arms spread wide apart due to the way ARMS works, and I don't think that'd translate well into Smash.

Other than that, it matches Spring Man's idle of "bouncing back and forth".

 

[Senselessbreak]

I mean with a company the size of Nintendo however I very much doubt you could be completely unanimous when leaking something.

Not true. 4chan is extremely protective about the identity of its posters and Hiro has taken a strong stance against releasing info like that. Especially to private companies like Nintendo. They have no law authority, and breaking NDAs is a civil matter not a criminal so Nintendo is pretty much SoL if the leakers properly hide their selves. The NSMB rom leaker a while back got busted because he included pics of his receipt and it was backtraced to him.

 

[Blargg888]

Yeah I'll say he looks pretty cool. Supposedly, ARMS has designs influenced by Dragon Ball, which is always a plus for me.
For those wondering, I uploaded the video around 2:30 p.m. with the hope of getting a take down notice. I even got someone to retweet the video to Nintendo of America. The longer the video stays up, the less likely it is to be real. If nothing happens before the end of tomorrow, I will take down the video and assume it is fake.

I find it really funny that for once, somebody is hoping to get a strike by Nintendo on their Youtube video.

It makes sense in context, but the irony is still kinda funny.

The only thing that aesthetically displeases me is the idle. It’s way too fast and weird, and as far as I know (not having played ARMS myself) doesn’t match his actual idle in that game.

But there are so many “this is so obviously wrong” things that are actually pushing me towards real simply because so much seems and looks believably like placeholder.

I'm not on either side of the real or fake argument yet, but I agree that the idle is a bit janky. It feels too unnaturally stiff. I feel like Springman's knees should bend a little bit more, and his jumps should have more visible impact.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

One thing to think about is that, if the stage is made original for Smash, comparing it to ARMS isn’t going to make a difference.

There is nothing, to me, that makes me completely feel like it’s fake.

Only thing is that I think some of the animations are wonky/janky.

 

[_Sheik]

Compared to those guys, Spring Man's design is actually pretty good.

However, compared to these guys:

Spoiler

I can't help but feel like Spring Man's design falls a bit short.

To me it's just as good. All fifteen designs from ARMS scream creative cohesion and effort.

...and by fifteen I mean that the fifteenth one is Biff; Dr Coyle always looked like an uninspired Samus/Bayonetta hybrid and it still makes me sad she's what the wave of DLC ended on. Just my opinion though

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I know we have nothing else to discuss, but I really can't believe that people would do anything other than instantly dismiss these "screenshots" as fake.

 

[Hinata]

There is nothing, to me, that makes me completely feel like it’s fake.

I'm in a similar situation. I'm still skeptical, but there's a lot of factors supporting this leak now.

 

[Senselessbreak]

The screen behind Spring Man when the footage is paused seems to simply have a picture of Spring Man in it.

The symbol for the Arms series is what appears to be a Toaster.

Pretty sure the footage is just an static image in the actual Arms game.

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

If the leak was real that would have some interesting implications.

For starters, having Springman helps Rex's chanes a lot. After all, if Sakurai is willing to put a character as recent as Springman, there really isn't much of a reason to ignore Xenoblade 2 for a character. Especially since that game was in development since 2014.

Decidueye would also have interesting implications. I think that would make the chance of a FE switch character less likely. If they won't use a pokemon from gen 8, I don't see them using a FE switch character.

This is all assuming the leak is real which we don't know. I think I might be on team fake for now. Even if there are compelling reasons to think it could be real.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Did they rip Decidueye's idle animation from Banjo-Kazooie?

 

[Wyoming]

I know we have nothing else to discuss, but I really can't believe that people would do anything other than instantly dismiss these "screenshots" as fake.

I mean, nobody here has said they believe in the screenshots

 

[HyruleHero]

I know we have nothing else to discuss, but I really can't believe that people would do anything other than instantly dismiss these "screenshots" as fake.

Why would anyone assume its true to begin with, thats like someone saying 1+1=3 and you just believe it because they made a convincing argument, you have to look at facts before you draw a conclusion.

 

[A Distant Demon]

My biggest complaint is the feet. They dont move at ALL even though he is hopping. He SHOULD have his feet change once the pressure is reduced on his toes but even midair they are full on bent. Not to mention they blatantly clip through the ground quite obviously.

The only thing way I can this not being fake is that this would have to be a very early build. That, or Spring Man isnt making the base roster. As-is that is unacceptable lol. And TBH I dont expect an early build to leak, but that's just me

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I'm more inclined to believe the video than the Ice Climber and Mario images.

But the video could just as easily be fake as well.

It's just more fun and engaging to discuss then repeat history and us going in a merry go round of why this character is better than this or that character isn't getting in, or why you can save 20 percent on you car insurance by switching to Geico.

 

[Troykv]

Oh wow! Leaks! Real or fake...

We finally have something to actually talk about xD

Or in my case, see other people talk about.

 

[TheDukeofDorks]

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the size of the stage in the Spring Man "leak". That thing is tiny! How are you supposed to have 4 player matches on a stage that small?

 

[vaanrose]

My biggest complaint is the feet. They dont move at ALL even though he is hopping. He SHOULD have his feet change once the pressure is reduced on his toes but even midair they are full on bent. Not to mention they blatantly clip through the ground quite obviously.

The only thing way I can this not being fake is that this would have to be a very early build. That, or Spring Man isnt making the base roster. As-is that is unacceptable lol. And TBH I dont expect an early build to leak, but that's just me

He's springy. It isn't really so much that he's hopping as it is he's bouncing. And when he jumps for real the feet do change. Real or fake, I see what the animator was going for.