Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Tree Gelbman]

This is part of it definitely, but for me another reason is how much they’re blending sci-fi and fantasy anymore. I miss the old days where things were simpler. The characters didn’t all look like edgy emo anime characters, there weren’t weird futuristic technology all around, everything was more medieval inspired, with the craziest technology being stream power airships which were literally just normal wooden ships with propellers on top.

The stories were also simpler.

Granted I know one of my favorite ff’s was unfortunately the cause of the current trend(ff6) but it still wasn’t nearly as crazy as now. It didn’t get too crazy till around after 10, and part of 10’s story was even criticizing the over reliance on technology.

To be fair 7 is far more responsible for mixing the science fiction and the fantasy than any installment and it's considered one of the best games ever made.

So it's certainly possible to include both elements and make a stellar or great Final Fantasy.

And to only use a certain style or mixture over and over would just make the series ultimately feel bland, IMO.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Heihachi is the most likely Bandai Namco rep.

Sakurai has spoken of including him.

He's mysteriously absent as well as Tekken content despite the fact Akira is present.

I doubt anyone else is getting in.

They should add Yoshimitsu, just because he reps both Tekken AND Soul Calibur.

The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. Meaning just because his Mii Costume and Spirit have not been shown ((yet)) does not mean they dont exist.

People thought this meant Shadow, Skull Kid, and Isaac were on the roster, because they were "mysteriously missing".

True, but they also thought Chrom and Dark Samus were on the roster for the same reasons, and then they were.

 

[Deleted member]

What did this person say? So I know if I can agree with him or not, based on the fact of what he says pleases me or not.

He said Steve was in, hinted at Katalina (whos from a mobile japan only gacha game), and a Dragon Quest rep

 

[Flyboy]

People , this is very important information here...
I asked Miss. Hitagi if Agumon was a Namco Bandai rep.
And she said this:

View attachment 177063

So this deconfirmes Agumon but confirmes that one of the DLC is a Namco Bandai rep?

My choices: Klonoa, Heihachi or Lloyd

Gotta be Heihachi or Lloyd. Money is on Heihachi but my heart wants Lloyd. Heihachi didn't get promoted from a Mii to an Assist like Akira did, and while I'm sure both Heihachi and Lloyd's outfits are in the game they're both conveniently missing...

Sorry about your boy, but this is still a great find IF Hitagi is as credible as Vergeben claims.

That said, a Bamco rep was a big prediction so this isn't exactly a major revelation and I still have my doubts on Hitagi's Smash credibility.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Heihachi is the most likely Bandai Namco rep.

Sakurai has spoken of including him.

He's mysteriously absent as well as Tekken content despite the fact Akira is present.

I doubt anyone else is getting in.

Most plausible DLC character, yes indeed. Am quite certain he's in as well. Would be kinda cool to see him face off against Ryu and Ken even.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Oh, what has happened now?

 

[ErenJager]

I watched a Papageno's video on DLC speculation... Hitagi came up... Apparently he's back peddled on Steve being playable and now he's saying minecraft content like verge.

Its difficult to stay current on these leakers they post regularly. We'd almost need a thread that chronicles their posts in an op.

With that being said hitagi is an loz to me.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Oh, what has happened now?

Some thing that's always happened. More fake leaks that are being believed because people refuse to learn their lesson.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh, what has happened now?

Home Run Derby rep has been leaked. Pooh’s more likely, but Christopher Robin is the dream.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Heihachi is the most likely Bandai Namco rep.

Sakurai has spoken of including him.

He's mysteriously absent as well as Tekken content despite the fact Akira is present.

I doubt anyone else is getting in.

inb4 Pac-Girl gets in before him, also killing of Ms.Pac-Man in the process

This is part of it definitely, but for me another reason is how much they’re blending sci-fi and fantasy anymore. I miss the old days where things were simpler. The characters didn’t all look like edgy emo anime characters, there weren’t weird futuristic technology all around, everything was more medieval inspired, with the craziest technology being stream power airships which were literally just normal wooden ships with propellers on top.

The stories were also simpler.

Granted I know one of my favorite ff’s was unfortunately the cause of the current trend(ff6) but it still wasn’t nearly as crazy as now. It didn’t get too crazy till around after 10, and part of 10’s story was even criticizing the over reliance on technology.

Cloud looks emo and edgy...but also weeby and blond...that is all for my not so related comment

 

[Deleted member]

Home Run Derby rep has been leaked. Pooh’s more likely, but Christopher Robin is the dream.

Nah, we need Pooh. Christopher Robin would be way too broken for the game to handle.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Some thing that's always happened. More fake leaks that are being believed because people refuse to learn their lesson?

So, business as usual? Alrighty then.

 

[ErenJager]

They should add Yoshimitsu, just because he reps both Tekken AND Soul Calibur.
True, but they also thought Chrom and Dark Samus were on the roster for the same reasons, and then they were.

Well, all things being equal.

Ike was missing his chrom alt colors and samus her dark samus colors were missing.

Which appeared to be a bit more telling.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Oh, what has happened now?

Shantae using Samus’ body committed murder upon Yoshi while Pit and Bayo have finally become friends

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

Some thing that's always happened. More fake leaks that are being believed because people refuse to learn their lesson.

You know, IF (not saying it IS, but IF) the person is true, You'll look silly, right? I'm debating on believing it myself, but just letting you know.

 

[blackghost]

heihachi is a challenge to implement. the way bayonetta and ryu combo in smash almost identical to thier source game. for heihachi thats a problem. Its a problem because tekken combos work on ground bounces. im not saying he couldnt do it but there's a reason im doubtful it will happen. as for 3d elements of tekken allow them to duck or sidestep moves onto the zaxis like a down b to simulate their 3-d source games.

i think a street fighter character (chun-li) is way more likely.

im sticking to my guns: sepiroth, chun-li, elma, and laura. the fifth i'd guess is a pokemon. but those 4 make sense to me. popular charatcers that can be created from a base in game. sephiroth would be a speed character and of course his sword would be smaller.

 

[Deleted member]

Well I suppose if Street Fighter X Tekken turned out the way it did, and Tekken X Street Fighter is NEVER coming out, Heihachi in smash is the next best thing.

 

[KingofKoopas]

I watched a Papageno's video on DLC speculation... Hitagi came up... Apparently he's back peddled on Steve being playable and now he's saying minecraft content like verge.

Its difficult to stay current on these leakers they post regularly. We'd almost need a thread that chronicles their posts in an op.

With that being said hitagi is an loz to me.

He's already been burnt once so i imagine papagenos is playing it safe with leakers now

heihachi is a challenge to implement. the way bayonetta and ryu combo in smash almost identical to thier source game. for heihachi thats a problem. Its a problem because tekken combos work on ground bounces. im not saying he couldnt do it but there's a reason im doubtful it will happen. as for 3d elements of tekken allow them to duck or sidestep moves onto the zaxis like a down b to simulate their 3-d source games.

i think a street fighter character (chun-li) is way more likely.

im sticking to my guns: sepiroth, chun-li, elma, and laura. the fifth i'd guess is a pokemon. but those 4 make sense to me. popular charatcers that can be created from a base in game. sephiroth would be a speed character and of course his sword would be smaller.

Yes but, Piranha Plant...


Piranha Plant not only ends arguements on SOME characters being implimented. It is the end of ALL arguements against ANY character!

 

[SAMation]

After playing a bit of Dragalia Lost, I think I’d be fine with Euden getting in. The game has cute character designs, both male and female, and I’m a sucker when it comes to character designs (Though this’d be funny cus then we’d have two “sword using dragon transforming anime boys who you can name in their original game” in smash).

 

[Deleted member]

Nah, we need Pooh. Christopher Robin would be way too broken for the game to handle.

I’m sure Sakurai could find a way to balance him. It’s like Ridley, if you nerf Christopher Robin too much, it ruins his character. That being said, his inclusion would be received similarly to Bayonetta’s. Christopher Robin would be the best character in the game easily.

 

[Diddy Kong]

So, leakers and Sakurai's words combined, we could narrow down a few characters that are extremely likey at this point.

Steve from Minecraft
Heiachi
Katalina
A Square Rep that might even be Geno, but most likely not

And then 2 more. And if third party content is already so heavily present, I think Rayman makes a lot of sense. The last one I wouldn't know.

Then again, Sakurai said that NINTENDO themselves are making the picks. And why would they add so many characters that aren't their own creations, or owned by them, over Nintendo owned and created characters? That makes me the most skeptical about everything.

But don't take it from me!! Am literally wrong ALL THE TIME.

 

[KingBroly]

I maintain that Fjorm from Fire Emblem Heroes is the most likely pick for DLC out of the 5.

1 - Fire Emblem Heroes is the Top Grossing mobile game Nintendo has, and probably will be for a long time.

2 - Fjorm is currently the titular character for it, being on the game icon, and star of Book 2

3 - She's an Ice Princess who wields a Spear, meaning she'd be the first Spear wielder in Smash Bros.

4 - Sakurai loves Fire Emblem

5 - With Nintendo picking the DLC characters, they would focus on upcoming/current titles when said DLC characters come out for heavy cross promotion. FE Heroes fits that description well, especially since it's such a big money maker for them.

 

[FreeFox]

I am excited about the possibility of a Namco character. There are some pretty nice options. I know that people are throwing around the possibility of Heihachi and while I main the character in Tekken, I dont think it is likely. Mostly because of the dead of the voice actor. I think it is an awkward time for the character.

 

[ErenJager]

Gotta be Heihachi or Lloyd. Money is on Heihachi but my heart wants Lloyd. Heihachi didn't get promoted from a Mii to an Assist like Akira did, and while I'm sure both Heihachi and Lloyd's outfits are in the game they're both conveniently missing...

Sorry about your boy, but this is still a great find IF Hitagi is as credible as Vergeben claims.

That said, a Bamco rep was a big prediction so this isn't exactly a major revelation and I still have my doubts on Hitagi's Smash credibility.

I think Lloyd and Heihachi are seemingly the most likely of the Bamco reps due to their representation in Smash 4.

But we shouldn't count our chickens before they hatch here.

We haven't seen all the Mii costumes yet. They could still be Mii costumes. In fact I think its actually more likely that they're still costumes because a lot of the other costumes are ported over renders from Wii U.

 

[Roberk]

Not once did he say he had no clear moveset potential.

What he really said is that implementing his Tekken moves and what not would proof a challenge in Smash Brothers.

And to be fair he probably considered this with Ryu as well.

Because each of the three fighting game series that are Street Fighter, Tekken, and Smash are VASTLY different in the way they are played and implement so crossing the three over is of course a challenge.

Why do you think Street Fighter X Tekken was going to be a two part thing?

Apparently, lots of people didn't read the "clear" in my post when I was talking about Heihachi's moveset potential. Sure, he has lots of stuff he can do and that's obvious. When Sakurai said that he couldn't translate Heihachi/Tekken's style into Smash, that's basically saying that he couldn't make a Smash moveset for Heihachi.

Does Heihachi have a lot of stuff he can do? Yes. Do it and Heihachi's style translate clearly into a cohesive moveset for Smash? No, or else according to Sakurai, he'd be in.

Moveset potential is how easy a character can be put into Smash. All characters in Smash have their movesets, but some had less clear potential than others (it took Sakurai multiple games to find a way to implement characters like Villager and Pac-Man while characters like Robin "danced in his head".) Heihachi's potential Smash moveset is muddled by being restricted by trying to staying true to Tekken's style, so it isn't a clear moveset for Sakurai to implement.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I will groan such an audible groan if we get Sephiroth in Smash.

SO AUDIBLE.

Sephiroth is the most overrated video game villain of all time. And yes I'm someone who wanted to kick his ass badly after Aerith died, but like....still so overrated.

 

[link2702]

...And to only use a certain style or mixture over and over would just make the series ultimately feel bland, IMO.

That’s just it though, the whole futuristic/sci-fi style has been done to death at this point. Going back to a more traditional fantasy focused style would feel refreshing now.

 

[ErenJager]

He's already been burnt once so i imagine papagenos is playing it safe with leakers now


Yes but, Piranha Plant...


Piranha Plant not only ends arguements on SOME characters being implimented. It is the end of ALL arguements against ANY character!

Sorry, for clarity.
I meant hitagi has back peddled on steve.
Not papa.
I imagine papa had the most current info when he made that video.

 

[beans]

I maintain that Fjorm from Fire Emblem Heroes is the most likely pick for DLC out of the 5.

1 - Fire Emblem Heroes is the Top Grossing mobile game Nintendo has, and probably will be for a long time.

2 - Fjorm is currently the titular character for it, being on the game icon, and star of Book 2

3 - She's an Ice Princess who wields a Spear, meaning she'd be the first Spear wielder in Smash Bros.

4 - Sakurai loves Fire Emblem

5 - With Nintendo picking the DLC characters, they would focus on upcoming/current titles when said DLC characters come out for heavy cross promotion. FE Heroes fits that description well, especially since it's such a big money maker for them.

Honestly wouldnt be mad at her.
We can make more Elsa memes.

That’s just it though, the whole futuristic/sci-fi style has been done to death at this point. Going back to a more traditional fantasy focused style would feel refreshing now.

I would like to see a more "urban" FF. Like TWEWY
We dont really have a lot of those, wich is sad cause, when done right, it makes it stand even more between every other RPG.

 

[Graizen]

Im good, i realy want Agumon , but if i can't have him i will be happy for what i have

 

[CannonStreak]

Shantae using Samus’ body committed murder upon Yoshi while Pit and Bayo have finally become friends

Shhhhh...be careful! Zinith might hear you.

 

[WaddleMatt]

Going on from the Golden Sun talk before, I have some words to say. After seeing the Isaac thread and seeing how positive they were, I decided to try out the original Golden Sun to see what it was all about. In the matter of just 2 days Isaac became my second most wanted character, the game is fantastic and it is an absolute crime this series died. Honestly, Isaac should have been playable in Brawl and if the series continued after the Lost Age I think it would be very well known. Golden Sun sold massivley back in the day before internet was even mainstream fully, imagine if it was like that today? Sakurai knows Golden Sun has a fanbase otherwise he wouldn't have readded his assist trophy in my opinion. Dark Dawn tried to revive the series but due to the fact that the series had been dormant, didn't live up to the standards of the previous entries and was released at the end of the DS's life it did not do great... It is such a shame, I am still playing through the original and it is fantasic from the characters to the gameplay to the music and I sincerely believe if a new entry was made that took place after the Lost Age or the original was remastered it would sell very well.

If any of you have never played Golden Sun please do, I highly regret not playing it earlier. I'm hoping the best for the future of Golden Sun even if it seems unlikely to get a new game, anything can happen and I believe the fans can do it.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I maintain that Fjorm from Fire Emblem Heroes is the most likely pick for DLC out of the 5.

1 - Fire Emblem Heroes is the Top Grossing mobile game Nintendo has, and probably will be for a long time.

2 - Fjorm is currently the titular character for it, being on the game icon, and star of Book 2

3 - She's an Ice Princess who wields a Spear, meaning she'd be the first Spear wielder in Smash Bros.

4 - Sakurai loves Fire Emblem

5 - With Nintendo picking the DLC characters, they would focus on upcoming/current titles when said DLC characters come out for heavy cross promotion. FE Heroes fits that description well, especially since it's such a big money maker for them.

Seems reasonable.

Yet again I think a Fire Emblem characters from 3 Houses is wayyy more likely.

I mean, Fire Emblem Heroes is popular, and made a lot of money. But likely will fail in comparision to Three Houses, because the amount of money you need to pay for the whole game is more than the little bundles of orbs you use in Heroes.

But, Ike and the Black Knight are using their Heroes voices and all. So it's a possibility.

However, I'd be salty as **** if Heroes gets content even if it's non-canon, and Hyrule Warriors doesn't even if it sold like hotcakes and was ported 2 times.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

He's already been burnt once so i imagine papagenos is playing it safe with leakers now


Yes but, Piranha Plant...


Piranha Plant not only ends arguements on SOME characters being implimented. It is the end of ALL arguements against ANY character!

Yea the plant just ended every arguement against every single character in existence

But one problem with the burnt before arguement

And it’s simply Vergeben has Ben burnt as well

 

[Deleted member]

Apparently, lots of people didn't read the "clear" in my post when I was talking about Heihachi's moveset potential. Sure, he has lots of stuff he can do and that's obvious. When Sakurai said that he couldn't translate Heihachi/Tekken's style into Smash, that's basically saying that he couldn't make a Smash moveset for Heihachi.

Does Heihachi have a lot of stuff he can do? Yes. Do it and Heihachi's style translate clearly into a cohesive moveset for Smash? No, or else according to Sakurai, he'd be in.

Moveset potential is how easy a character can be put into Smash. All characters in Smash have their movesets, but some had less clear potential than others (it took Sakurai multiple games to find a way to implement characters like Villager and Pac-Man while characters like Robin "danced in his head".) Heihachi's potential Smash moveset is muddled by being restricted by trying to staying true to Tekken's style, so it isn't a clear moveset for Sakurai to implement.

I’d say the difference is moveset potential is how easy it would be to sit down and write a moveset for a characters, which is different from how easy it would be to actually implement that moveset. To bring the comparison or another game, in Injustice creating a moveset for beast boy would be easy due to his variety of powers. The problem is that the transformations would be difficult to implement as it would mean you would have to constantly switch models. That’s the difference between moveset potential and ease of implementation, from which Heihachi suffers in the latter.
It’s a very pedantic difference, mind you, but a difference nonetheless.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

People are seriously over-estimating how much Piranha Plant changes up the speculation game.

 

[Deleted member]

I maintain that Fjorm from Fire Emblem Heroes is the most likely pick for DLC out of the 5.

1 - Fire Emblem Heroes is the Top Grossing mobile game Nintendo has, and probably will be for a long time.

2 - Fjorm is currently the titular character for it, being on the game icon, and star of Book 2

3 - She's an Ice Princess who wields a Spear, meaning she'd be the first Spear wielder in Smash Bros.

4 - Sakurai loves Fire Emblem

5 - With Nintendo picking the DLC characters, they would focus on upcoming/current titles when said DLC characters come out for heavy cross promotion. FE Heroes fits that description well, especially since it's such a big money maker for them.

Ice powers and a bladed weapon from a mobile game? Is this Katalina?

 

[Deleted member]

Going on from the Golden Sun talk before, I have some words to say. After seeing the Isaac thread and seeing how positive they were, I decided to try out the original Golden Sun to see what it was all about. In the matter of just 2 days Isaac became my second most wanted character, the game is fantastic and it is an absolute crime this series died. Honestly, Isaac should have been playable in Brawl and if the series continued after the Lost Age I think it would be very well known. Golden Sun sold massivley back in the day before internet was even mainstream fully, imagine if it was like that today? Sakurai knows Golden Sun has a fanbase otherwise he wouldn't have readded his assist trophy in my opinion. Dark Dawn tried to revive the series but due to the fact that the series had been dormant, didn't live up to the standards of the previous entries and was released at the end of the DS's life it did not do great... It is such a shame, I am still playing through the original and it is fantasic from the characters to the gameplay to the music and I sincerely believe if a new entry was made that took place after the Lost Age or the original was remastered it would sell very well.

If any of you have never played Golden Sun please do, I highly regret not playing it earlier. I'm hoping the best for the future of Golden Sun even if it seems unlikely to get a new game, anything can happen and I believe the fans can do it.

If Crash, Fortesque, Spyro and Megaman could return, then Golden Sun can do so too.

 

[KingBroly]

Seems reasonable.

Yet again I think a Fire Emblem characters from 3 Houses is wayyy more likely.

I mean, Fire Emblem Heroes is popular, and made a lot of money. But likely will fail in comparision to Three Houses, because the amount of money you need to pay for the whole game is more than the little bundles of orbs you use in Heroes.

But, Ike and the Black Knight are using their Heroes voices and all. So it's a possibility.

However, I'd be salty as **** if Heroes gets content even if it's non-canon, and Hyrule Warriors doesn't even if it sold like hotcakes and was ported 2 times.

It really comes down to the last point, and that's that Nintendo decided who the DLC characters are. Their priorities are not Sakurai's priorities.

 

[Diddy Kong]

It really comes down to the last point, and that's that Nintendo decided who the DLC characters are. Their priorities are not Sakurai's priorities.

That's why am actually optimistic about the DLC characters. Sakurai has had his ways. Am actually curious on what Nintendo would pick for themselves. Which is why I have a hard time believing it'll be all 3rd party characters.