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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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GaroMaster

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You know, there is always discussion regarding whether if K. Rool or Dixie should get in, but Cranky has the most potential to truly surprise us.
What if the Dixie/Cranky situation ends up exactly like that situation surrounding Chrom and Robin? The scenario in which we all expect Dixie, but Sakurai puts in Cranky because he finds him to be more unique. Likewise, Dixie would be a Lucina type of deal where she is a last minute clone.
I just wonder. What would you guys think of that outcome? How likely do you think it could happen?
It's not the exact same deal since Dixie would still be playable, but she wouldn't exactly get the treatment that she deserves as a playable fighter.
 
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NintenRob

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Now that things have returned somewhat to normality, I want to bring up a character for Discussion. Lara Croft

She's is easily the most iconic women in gaming and one of the most iconic Third Party characters not in Smash period. She's had three live action movies. She admittedly doesn't have a strong history with Nintendo. But neither does Cloud and Snake. Speaking of Cloud, she's owned by Square Enix, so we already know they're willing to let their IP in Smash. 6/7 of the third party characters are incredibly iconic. And the only exception only got in because of the Ballot.

I can definitely see her as third party character no one sees coming like Cloud, Ryu, Snake and Bayonetta
 

Polan

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Bradli Wartooth

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You know, there is always discussion regarding whether if K. Rool or Dixie should get in, but Cranky has the most potential to truly surprise us.
What if the Dixie/Cranky situation ends up exactly like that situation surrounding Chrom and Robin? The scenario in which we all expect Dixie, but Sakurai puts in Cranky because he finds him to be more unique. Likewise, Dixie would be a Lucina type of deal where she is a last minute clone.
I just wonder. What would you guys think of that outcome? How likely do you think it could happen?
It's not the exact same deal since Dixie would still be playable, but she wouldn't exactly get the treatment that she deserves as a playable fighter.
I mean I'd probably be kinda disappointed, but still glad Dixie was in the game. DKC2 was my favorite game when I was really little and Dixie was my favorite to play. Of course my personal bias sees potential for a mostly unique moveset, but I wouldn't be shocked if she was a clone. If that's the case, I really hope she's a Wolf-like clone with fairly significant changes while maintaining the Diddy Kong base/inspiration.
 

mario123007

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No lie, XBC 1 and 2 have some of the best soundtracks in gaming history.....yet XBCX's soundtrack was so bad you are better playing the game on mute.
Haha, totally disagree if you only talk about the music itself. This is from someone who listens to Xenoblade Chronicles X and Hiroyuki Sawano's music daily by the way.
I get that some GREAT music often get misplaced in the game.

And I really hope you don't think that Sawano's musics are bad.... Especially the vocal ones... Because of you do, then sorry, I might have to get on you like a ton of bricks. .. Just saying.

Many XCX music are really really good, especially those orchestra plus rock soundtracks.

So in my opinion all Xenoblade soundtracks are good, but I think X nails over Xenoblade Chronicles and Xenoblade Chronicles 2, if you solely look at the soundtrack

Swamp Sensei Swamp Sensei and hold up Swamp, I saw you post about XCX music stage pick post. I may have yet to play Xenoblade Chronicles X, but listen to its music soundtrack Daily. However, I don't have time to make my music pick for nowm
 
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Godzillathewonderdog

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Now that things have returned somewhat to normality, I want to bring up a character for Discussion. Lara Croft

She's is easily the most iconic women in gaming and one of the most iconic Third Party characters not in Smash period. She's had three live action movies. She admittedly doesn't have a strong history with Nintendo. But neither does Cloud and Snake. Speaking of Cloud, she's owned by Square Enix, so we already know they're willing to let their IP in Smash. 6/7 of the third party characters are incredibly iconic. And the only exception only got in because of the Ballot.

I can definitely see her as third party character no one sees coming like Cloud, Ryu, Snake and Bayonetta
She wouldn't be able to use realistic guns which makes up most of her weaponry including the duel pistols she's best known for using.

Her and her games are also unpopular in Japan, which hurts her chances. Sakurai has also shown more interest in representing Japanese games.
 

Superyoshiom

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Haha, totally disagree if you only talk about the music itself. This is from someone who listens to Xenoblade Chronicles X and Hiroyuki Sawano's music daily by the way.
I get that some GREAT music often get misplaced in the game.

And I really hope you don't think that Sawano's musics are bad.... Especially the vocal ones... Because of you do, then sorry, I might have to get on you like a ton of bricks. .. Just saying.

Many XCX music are really really good, especially those orchestra plus rock soundtracks.

So in my opinion all Xenoblade soundtracks are good, but I think X nails over Xenoblade Chronicles and Xenoblade Chronicles 2, if you solely look and hearthe soundtrack

Swamp Sensei Swamp Sensei and hold up Swamp, I saw you post about XCX music stage pick post. I may have yet to play Xenoblade Chronicles X, but listen to its music soundtrack Daily. However, I don't have time to make my music pick for nowm
Different strokes for different folks. Sawano's music works great for dramatic hype action whereas Shimomura can do environmental and ambience tracks perfectly. I do love the battle themes from XC and XC2 more than X though.
 

Swamp Sensei

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Different strokes for different folks. Sawano's music works great for dramatic hype action whereas Shimomura can do environmental and ambience tracks perfectly. I do love the battle themes from XC and XC2 more than X though.
I dunno.

I think Sawano was able to make some great environmental tracks for things like Primordia, Oblivia, Sylvalum and Noctilum.

You're right that his weaknesses is on the quiet emotional side, though.

That said, XCX as a whole had some really high highs and low lows.

Uncontrollable, Theme X and Minor Boss Battle are all some of my favorite tracks from the franchise.
 

Godzillathewonderdog

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I think it's possible Sakurai will make Dixie a unique character, going all out with a hair based moveset. However I think it's more likely Dixie would be a semi clone sharing several moves with Diddy, while also having a lot of unique moves, (mainly swinging her ponytail for several attacks).

I think Dixie being a semi clone would make it more likely for K. Rool to be added along with her. If that's the case then I'll take it.
 

mario123007

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Different strokes for different folks. Sawano's music works great for dramatic hype action whereas Shimomura can do environmental and ambience tracks perfectly. I do love the battle themes from XC and XC2 more than X though.
I admit I was a bit biased there. So yeah, you are right lol.
And most Sawano's music really need to listen for a while to get in favor of it, but not for everyone of course.

As for normal battle themes, eh, for me Mechanical Rhythm is the best, next is Black Tar, EX. 01, Battle Theme 3 for XC2, Battle Theme 1 for XC2 and then XC Battle 1...being my least favorite. It sound great but it doesn't sound like a battle theme at all....
 

Hinata

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Uncontrollable, Theme X and Minor Boss Battle are all some of my favorite tracks from the franchise.
I'm part of the camp that feels like X's soundtrack was sorely lacking, but Uncontrollable is absolutely a jam. It's easily in my top 5 favorite songs from the Xenoblade series.

Primordia's day theme is ****in' amazing too.
 
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Fenriraga

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Okay, so I'm gonna try something a little bit different. Let's talk about music. In particular, I'm gonna give you guys a challenge.

And to make it a little interesting, I'm going to give you a game I don't think many of you have played.

Let's imagine, that Xenoblade Chronicles X gets a stage. It can be any location from the game you want but the important thing its that its a stage from that game.

Point is, you are in charge of picking the music tracks for that stage. But there are some requirements...

  1. There must be 10 tracks total.
  2. They must all be from Xenoblade Chronicles X.
  3. 3 of them must be remixes of some sort. You will need to specify which ones get the remixes.
  4. EXTRA CREDIT: If you want, you can pick one extra track from a Nintendo series that you don't think will ever get a stage that would fit on the stage.
Now, that's kind of daunting, especially if you don't know Xenoblade Chronicles X. I'm a nice guy though, so I've compiled several tracks that are prominent in the game and put them in the spoiler below. I've even included links so you can listen to them and small descriptions of when they play.

Be warned, the official names in the Xenoblade Chronicles X OST suck balls.

For example, Tatsu's theme is named "z39b20co13mi01cal09

Still, with my descriptions, you should be able to figure out which tracks are which.

This is the main theme of the game. Theme X is remixed is several tracks.

This is the title theme of the game. As you can tell, it remixed a bit of the Main Theme.

This is the theme of New Los Angles. It's the main town in the game and where most of your non exploration/combat gameplay happens.

This is the theme of the Ma-non Ship. The Ma-non are aliens that are friendly to humans. Eventually more friendly alien species start to live in the ship as its protected.

This is the normal battle theme. It plays whenever a non important battle is happening.

This is the people's favorite. This is the theme of tyrant battles or special optional enemies that are hard to take down. If you played the first Xenoblade Chronicles, you can compare this to You Will Know Our Names.

Of course, such a popular song has an instrumental version included as well.

This is a story important boss battle theme. This will play in boss battles that don't have their own themes.

This is the boss battle theme for sidequests. You'll honestly hear this one a lot more as there are a butt ton of sidequests.

This is the theme for one very important boss fight in the story. Saying who or what it is would be spoilers.

Yes the title is German. And yes those are attempts at German lyrics. This is the music that plays whenever you use Overdrive which is essentially your limit break. Those can last a long time, so the song's length is appropriate.

Yeah an instrumental version exists too. Unlike the Uncontrollable instrumental, this version replaces the vocals with synth. Sounds pretty neat.

This is the final boss theme. Fun Fact, this was played in an early trailer for the game.

This is the theme for Primordia. It's the game's first area and is a grassy but mountainous area.

This is the song that plays whenever you're in a cave or underground. There are a lot of caves.

This is the theme for Noctilum, the game's second area. It's an area that filled with dense rain forests and waterfalls.

This is the theme for the game's third area, Oblivia. It's a dry arid landscape that's mostly rock.

This is the song that plays when you're in Sylvalum, the fourth main area. It's a desert covered in crystals and mountains.

This is the theme for Cauldros. This is the game's final area and it is filled with lava, enemy bases and acid.

This is the theme that plays whenever you're flying in your skell. Skells are the mechas you can pilot in the game.

Tatsu's theme! Cause everyone loves Tatsu, amirite?

Hope you guys like the challenge. If you do, I'm willing to do more in the future, but let's start with this.


Tagging some people I know like Xenoblade Chronicles and people who like video game music.

@Opossum
@theoria
mario123007 mario123007
@Aetheri
@Bebe Mignon
@Venus of the Desert Bloom
@Final Smash Gamer

Have at 'em folks.
Yes hi I am Xenobluud fan I can't hear you I can't see you.

Anyway, my stage will go with the idea of this stage being a "tour" of sorts, flying around all of Mira ala Lylat Cruise and such. Because X has too many vibrant locations to be locked down to one location.

On that note:
-Field Melody (Not remixed, The section of the planet you are currently in will play that area's respective field theme, will all be the Day variations)
-XCX Medley (Remixed, consists of portions of Noctillum, Black Tar, Skell Battle Theme and Main Theme)
-Black Tar
-Uncontrollable (Remixed)
-Wir Fligen (Remixed)
-MONOX
-Don't Worry
-In The Forest (X ->Z Version)
-z29ba2t0t1l301e17 (Skell Battle Theme, god I hate these names)
-The Way Feat. Sayulee (Because there always has to be that ONE song that is out of place in a Smash Battle, It's a Vocal Version of Theme X and ITS SO GREAT.)

For Extra Credit, A Custom Robo Melody or remix of any form. Seriously, an X stage is just ASKING for Custom Robo music.

...


Seriously, this song is SO GOOD but gets overlooked because of how sparingly it's used in the actual game. Such a lovely piece.
 
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Senselessbreak

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Also did anyone see what the Arms producer said about getting a character in Smash?

I think the correct reaction is to say ‘I can’t answer that!’. Another thing I’d say is that Arms is so young — it’s only a year old — that maybe it’s too early to think about that. But I think it’s absolutely fantastic that there are people out there talking about Arms characters in that way.
 
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NintenRob

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She wouldn't be able to use realistic guns which makes up most of her weaponry including the duel pistols she's best known for using.

Her and her games are also unpopular in Japan, which hurts her chances. Sakurai has also shown more interest in representing Japanese games.
I could see them styling her dual pistols into something a bit more appropriate, nothing drastic, but enough. Like how Bayonetta and Fox both use guns. As for other moves, maybe her climbing axe, bow and her raw fighting skills?

As for her popularity in Japan, yeah that does hurt chances. It's not like she's unknown there, one of the sales figures I found did have her debut at number two, with Monster Hunter Stories at number 1, which obviously it wasn't going to top.

I still think her status in gaming overall is enough to make her at least a consideration.
 

mario123007

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You're right that his weaknesses is on the quiet emotional side, though.
Emotional side is his weakness eh?
I personally think you haven't hear much of his other tracks from other media, animes, and Japanese drama.
Just check these out, these emotional soundtracks are lit:
So, Sawano is actually a GOD when it comes to emotional music, just that XCX he couldn't make music like that due to the game's theme and setting.
Imagine Sawano makes music for another story driven Xenoblade Chronicles game, that will be something.
In XCX only The Way, So Nah, So Fern were good and touching.
 
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Blargg888

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I honestly still believe the best middle ground for Captain Toad would be to just make them unable to double jump.
They could have it be part of his reveal trailer, with Captain Toad putting on a smaller pack or something to reduce weight and allow him to jump. Then he notices that it's still too heavy, and removes a bit more, then he can double jump. It could be a funny little moment to acknowledge his canonical inability to jump.

Kinda like how in Little Mac's trailer they had Doc teaching little Mac how to jump with the whole jump rope thing, or how he was doing sit-ups on a ledge in order to gain the strength to grab the stage ledges and climb up them.
 

Swamp Sensei

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He's just giving a non-commital answer to avoid breaking any NDAs.
Which makes me think we are getting one. I'd be shocked if Springman isn't on the base roster...but if hes not hes instantly a top contender for DLC
Actually I disagree heavily.

Also did anyone see what the Arms producer said about getting a character in Smash?
Look closely.

He's specifically saying that ARMS is a little new and its too early to be thinking about that.

I see that as a very bad sign.
 

Lyndis_

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Look closely.

He's specifically saying that ARMS is a little new and its too early to be thinking about that.

I see that as a very bad sign.
I see that as something they were going to say regardless.

All of it was very "it's not a yes, but it's not a know" and I don't think it points towards anything except that it's possible.
 
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Superyoshiom

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Actually I disagree heavily.


Look closely.

He's specifically saying that ARMS is a little new and its too early to be thinking about that.

I see that as a very bad sign.
Besides ARMS, it's not like we got any new high-profile characters recently. Now I'm not the most hyped guy about Spring Man (personally I find more interesting options like Min Min) but the fact of the matter was that unlike some new IP's that released around Smash 4 like The Wonderful 101, this game was put near front and center of the Switch's marketing close to launch. Much of the general public knows about this game thanks to the January direct and it has sold over a million units on a system with a small install base. I'm not saying to take his words with a grain of salt, but I wouldn't say an ARMS rep is super unlikely.
 

Fenriraga

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Besides ARMS, it's not like we got any new high-profile characters recently. Now I'm not the most hyped guy about Spring Man (personally I find more interesting options like Min Min) but the fact of the matter was that unlike some new IP's that released around Smash 4 like The Wonderful 101, this game was put near front and center of the Switch's marketing close to launch. Much of the general public knows about this game thanks to the January direct and it has sold over a million units on a system with a small install base. I'm not saying to take his words with a grain of salt, but I wouldn't say an ARMS rep is super unlikely.
I don't think anyone's saying an ARMS rep is very unlikely.

They just aren't as likely as some people like to believe they are.
 

N3ON

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ARMS guy's statement would be basically what you have there whether or not an ARMS character is in the upcoming game. It's supremely ambiguous.

You see those kinds of statements on both sides, it may indeed be too early for ARMS, or he may, wisely, not wish to give a statement liable to stoke the flames.

What we can make of these comments is nothing imo.
 
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Delzethin

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Who said that Midnight Lycanroc is cooler than Midday Lycanroc. I saw a video that had a move set concept for how both could be implemented into the same move set a la transformation/tag out down special, and I’d want that. Other than that a quadruped will be more unique, IMO.
Was it Delzethin Delzethin 's video?
Alas, this is what I get for trying to take it easy for a couple days with the newest video finished, I miss important conversation.

At this point, I think the most likely scenario is either the Dusk form since it's been set up as the big prominent one, or some kind of multi-form stance system concept. While playable Pokémon in Smash are technically from the games, they do draw inspiration from their anime counterparts. If the concept of an earthbending fighter with a lot of different forms to choose from catches Sakurai's eye like I think it might, it'd make sense to stick to the form that's been most prominent in the anime, had a special reveal all to its own, and wound up as Ash's signature 'mon for Alola.

Seriously, did you know that last part? I've realized not many people do!



I admit, my original character concept is outdated. I should do something about that...
 
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Gestahl

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I wouldn't be surprised if shantae became a skin for a new dixie kong character, both having hair-attacks you know and both being female.
 

N3ON

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I wouldn't be surprised if shantae became a skin for a new dixie kong character, both having hair-attacks you know and both being female.
should k. rool be a yoshi skin, both being male green reptiles?
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Okay, so I'm gonna try something a little bit different. Let's talk about music. In particular, I'm gonna give you guys a challenge.

And to make it a little interesting, I'm going to give you a game I don't think many of you have played.

Let's imagine, that Xenoblade Chronicles X gets a stage. It can be any location from the game you want but the important thing its that its a stage from that game.

Point is, you are in charge of picking the music tracks for that stage. But there are some requirements...

  1. There must be 10 tracks total.
  2. They must all be from Xenoblade Chronicles X.
  3. 3 of them must be remixes of some sort. You will need to specify which ones get the remixes.
  4. EXTRA CREDIT: If you want, you can pick one extra track from a Nintendo series that you don't think will ever get a stage that would fit on the stage.
Now, that's kind of daunting, especially if you don't know Xenoblade Chronicles X. I'm a nice guy though, so I've compiled several tracks that are prominent in the game and put them in the spoiler below. I've even included links so you can listen to them and small descriptions of when they play.

Be warned, the official names in the Xenoblade Chronicles X OST suck balls.

For example, Tatsu's theme is named "z39b20co13mi01cal09

Still, with my descriptions, you should be able to figure out which tracks are which.

This is the main theme of the game. Theme X is remixed is several tracks.

This is the title theme of the game. As you can tell, it remixed a bit of the Main Theme.

This is the theme of New Los Angles. It's the main town in the game and where most of your non exploration/combat gameplay happens.

This is the theme of the Ma-non Ship. The Ma-non are aliens that are friendly to humans. Eventually more friendly alien species start to live in the ship as its protected.

This is the normal battle theme. It plays whenever a non important battle is happening.

This is the people's favorite. This is the theme of tyrant battles or special optional enemies that are hard to take down. If you played the first Xenoblade Chronicles, you can compare this to You Will Know Our Names.

Of course, such a popular song has an instrumental version included as well.

This is a story important boss battle theme. This will play in boss battles that don't have their own themes.

This is the boss battle theme for sidequests. You'll honestly hear this one a lot more as there are a butt ton of sidequests.

This is the theme for one very important boss fight in the story. Saying who or what it is would be spoilers.

Yes the title is German. And yes those are attempts at German lyrics. This is the music that plays whenever you use Overdrive which is essentially your limit break. Those can last a long time, so the song's length is appropriate.

Yeah an instrumental version exists too. Unlike the Uncontrollable instrumental, this version replaces the vocals with synth. Sounds pretty neat.

This is the final boss theme. Fun Fact, this was played in an early trailer for the game.

This is the theme for Primordia. It's the game's first area and is a grassy but mountainous area.

This is the song that plays whenever you're in a cave or underground. There are a lot of caves.

This is the theme for Noctilum, the game's second area. It's an area that filled with dense rain forests and waterfalls.

This is the theme for the game's third area, Oblivia. It's a dry arid landscape that's mostly rock.

This is the song that plays when you're in Sylvalum, the fourth main area. It's a desert covered in crystals and mountains.

This is the theme for Cauldros. This is the game's final area and it is filled with lava, enemy bases and acid.

This is the theme that plays whenever you're flying in your skell. Skells are the mechas you can pilot in the game.

Tatsu's theme! Cause everyone loves Tatsu, amirite?

Hope you guys like the challenge. If you do, I'm willing to do more in the future, but let's start with this.


Tagging some people I know like Xenoblade Chronicles and people who like video game music.

@Opossum
@theoria
mario123007 mario123007
@Aetheri
@Bebe Mignon
@Venus of the Desert Bloom
@Final Smash Gamer

Have at 'em folks.
The 6 which don't need to get remixed:
The 3 which should get remixed:
And the wild card one:

:V
 

Superyoshiom

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All this talk of Xenoblade Chronicles X music got me listening to THEMEX again. It's honestly just as epic as I remember it, and whether or not we get a stage from X, we need this song in the game. They'll definitely need to condense or remix it, since it's a really long song.
 
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Jubileus57

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Ok, I just had a thought. I'm half expecting a serious story mode like in Brawl for smash switch, and I just thought how the smash 4 characters could be integrated.

I can't imagine Wii Fit Trainer in any serious story cutscene without chuckling a bit.
Picture that: the Wii Fit Trainer having a flexibility contest with Bayonetta :awesome:

EDIT: Oh dear I didn't realize my post was this late.
 
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Superyoshiom

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Guys, how would you feel if we got Tabuu as a character for Smash 4. I was on the roster thread and this idea came to me. He'd have to be resized, but given that he has a humanoid build he could work. Think about it, we could have a potential story mode where he makes his appearance as a boss again, and beating him this time would unlock him as a character.
 
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Superyoshiom

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Superyoshiom
I really like this roster (I'd go with the Paper Mario version instead of Captain Toad).

My only (personal) gripe with it is Rayman, which is one of the very few characters I actively want out. I loathe his design too much ^^'
While I don't think Rayman will be in the game, consider that if he's in we'll have a much smaller chance of potentially having the Rabbids be a third-party character.
 

Jubileus57

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 3, 2013
Messages
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Lorraine, France
While I don't think Rayman will be in the game, consider that if he's in we'll have a much smaller chance of potentially having the Rabbids be a third-party character.
The biggest flaw in your argumentation is that I'd much rather have Rabbids that Rayman :awesome: (especially Rabbid Peach, as one can see on the roster I posted a few days ago) Don't kill me please
 
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Superyoshiom

Smash Master
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Superyoshiom
The biggest flaw in your argumentation is that I'd much rather have Rabbids that Rayman :awesome: (especially Rabbid Peach, as one can see on the roster I posted a few days ago) Don't kill me please
The rabbids in Mario X Rabbids were infamously more tolerable than the standard variety, but I can't see them adding in the rabbids as they were from that game. They'd probably add the basic rabbid and have them be palette swaps.
 

Jubileus57

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 3, 2013
Messages
579
Location
Lorraine, France
The rabbids in Mario X Rabbids were infamously more tolerable than the standard variety, but I can't see them adding in the rabbids as they were from that game. They'd probably add the basic rabbid and have them be palette swaps.
I guess it would depend on when the Mario + Rabbids game started development. Besides I am not sure the Rabbids were popiular enough in Japan at the time the roster was decided (though the crossover apparently sells rather well, contrary to Rayman).

Anyway only time (and Sakurai) will tell.
 

SuperMii3D

Mii-Based Fighter
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Waiting for the Switch 2
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Holy moly, I did not expect this Daisy Moveset write up to take me many days, but it did in the name of research and technicality. Gonna spoiler it for obvious reasons.
Princess Daisy
Flower_Flurry.gif

Overview – A technical character in most sports games she appears in and an overall theme with flowers. Super athletic with a tomboyish attitude. Instead of wearing her typical dress, she will have her athlete's uniform on. Her move set will reflect upon these qualities.

Daisy is a fast character who can quickly deal a lot of damage. She has excellent recovery and can jump high but suffers from being killed very quickly, as she is one of the lightest characters in the game. She can combo well but can also easily get comboed herself since she is a fast faller. Her main draw is her unique ability to give her opponents flowers on their heads. Many of her attacks can do so, so she builds up damage quickly. To balance this quick damage output, she has trouble landing attacks that can successfully kill opponents. Her only reliable kill throw will kill at around 125% for average weight characters. Her Up Smash and Side Smash are her only other non-grab kill moves, so the rest of her move set will revolve around quickly racking up damage and setting up her opponents for a quick kill. She can also gimp quite easily as she has excellent off-stage play and some meteor attacks.


Basic Attacks

Princess Punch [Jab 1]: A basic royal punch that can connect with every tilt.

High Kick [Jab 2]: Daisy swiftly brings her leg out in an upward motion.

Fists of Frustration [Rapid Jab]: A barrage of punches that almost looks like flailing.

Ball Spike [Jab Release]: Daisy slams her fists on her opponent as if they were a volleyball. A sweet spot hit will meteor the opponent.

Ribbon Swing [Forward Tilt]: Daisy swings her Dancer’s Ribbon right out in front of her in a downwards motion. The Ribbon acts as a barrier destroying small projectiles. (Mario and Sonic at the Olympics)

Leg Sweep [Down Tilt]: Daisy sticks her leg out in front of her and tries to trip anyone in front of her. If struck with the final frames of her foot’s hit box, the opponent will have guaranteed trip.

Ribbon Dance [Up Tilt]: Daisy pulls out a Dancer’s Ribbon and quickly swings it above her. It covers her from above, but her sides are exposed. (Mario and Sonic at the Olympics)

Home Run Slide [Dash Attack]: Daisy slides on her back, very similar to the way Mario does. The very last frames of the attack do the most damage. (Mario Sluggers)

Aerial Attacks

Flower Shot [Neutral Air]: Daisy extends her arms out and her upper body is surrounded with flower petals for a multi-hit attack. Her legs and her head are exposed. (Mario Hoops 3 on 3)

Rhythmic Club [Forward Air]: Daisy stretches her arm out and spins a small Rhythmic Club. It has multiple hits, dealing some moderate damage. (Mario and Sonic at the Olympics)

Trick Pose [Back Air]: Daisy strikes a pose as seen in Mario Kart 8. Her arm and leg stick behind her, both of which deal damage. She also raises her other hand above her head, which also does damage. (Mario Kart 8)

Cheerleader [Up Air]: Daisy puts on a pair of pom-poms and shakes them above her twice. The second hit is stronger than the first. (Mario Sports Mix)

Skater’s Spin [Down Air]: Daisy performs a quick ice skater spin. The attack performs multiple hits and has a meteor effect on the last hit of the sweet spot [The tip of her feet]. (Mario and Sonic at the Winter Olympics)

Smash Attacks

Side Smash: Very similar to Peach, Daisy has a rotation of 3 items; a baseball bat [Long reach and most powerful, destroys projectiles], a Tennis Racket [Low damage, decent knockback, reflects projectiles], and Lip’s Stick (No knockback, average damage, stuns with stun lasting longer if charged more and opponent has high damage. No protection from projectiles] Rotation is always Bat, Racket, Lip Stick. Her Bat is her second most reliable kill move with the Racket being the third.

Koopa UpperKut [Up Smash]: A quick and powerful uppercut performed on Bowser in Mario Party 3. Her strongest attack and most reliable kill move, this punch will kill light opponents at 80% and heavier opponents at 120%. Its hitbox is only on her hand and will miss most opponents who crouch or are too small. Daisy begins to crouch as the attack is charged, which gives her a better chance at landing the attack. (Mario Party 3)

Piranha Plant Summon [Down Smash]: Daisy holds her arms in front of her face as she charges. The non-charged Down Smash will summon two small Piranha Plants (One on each side of her) that will only bite once. A charged Down Smash will summon two Piranha Plants half the size of Daisy that will bite twice. A fully charged Down Smash will cause Piranha Plants the height of Daisy to appear and bite 3 times. The move deals a load of damage but has horrible knockback. The last bite deals the most damage.

Special Attacks

Nipper Spore [Neutral Special]: Daisy pitches out a Nipper Spore, an enemy from Yoshi’s Island that floats down slowly. An opponent who touches a Nipper Spore will cause a flower to bloom on their head. Unlike in Yoshi’s Island, once the Nipper Spore hits the ground, it disappears. If the B button is held, Daisy can hold her pitching pose and aim the Nipper Spore in a series of 3 directions – Straight forward, diagonal or straight up. She can also face the other direction while holding her pitch. Only 2 Nipper Spores can be present at any time. (Yoshi’s Island)

Garden Slide [Side Special]: Daisy seemingly gets ready to run an athletic race. Holding the B button will allow her to keep this pose for a bit, with flowers swirling around her. Once the B button is released, she goes into a slide on her stomach with her hands held out in front of her. The longer the B button is held, the farther she slides. Getting caught by the slide puts the opponent into harsh hit stun. She leaves a trail of flowers behind her that last for about 2 seconds; contact with these flowers will leave a flower on the opponent’s head. (Mario Power Tennis)

Daisy Torpedo [Side Special in Air]: Daisy strikes a pose in the air and, with the B button held, charges, with flowers swirling around her. Once the B button is released, she launches herself in a vertical trajectory head first in whichever way she’s facing; this move is seemingly familiar, who did she learn it from?? She leaves a trail of flowers behind her, but unlike the grounded counterpart, the flowers only last half a second. These flowers will also leave a flower on an opponent’s head. On top of that, if she comes into contact with an opponent, she’ll immediately stop moving instead of continuously hitting them. The Daisy Torpedo will also have a small chance of bursting. The Burst version will always go farther and faster regardless of how charged the attack was. The Flower trail will not occur from the Burst, but anyone too close when the burst occurs will get a Flower on their head. Hitting a wall during a burst Daisy Torpedo will cause her crown to get lodged in the wall, causing her a few moments to recover her crown before she can get back into the fray.

Floaty Fluff [Up Special]: Daisy pulls out a Floaty Fluff Flower from Super Mario Galaxy 1. Like Peach’s Parasol, this attack will bring her diagonally upward in the direction she’s facing. Once the attack has reached has peaked, the flower will bloom and let Daisy slowly descent. The flower has one hit box, which is at the tip of the flower before it unfolds. This one hit box has decent knockback but won’t ever kill and gives any hit opponents a flower on their head. The flower is granted wind boxes to the sides of and above it once it opens. The flower has 3 petals which drift off fairly quickly. Once all 3 petals are gone, Daisy is sent into special fall. She can cancel the flower by pressing down on the control stick or performing an aerial attack, which also sends her into special fall. The flower can also be destroyed by opponent’s attacks, which will also send Daisy into special fall. (Super Mario Galaxy)

Crystal Smash [Down Special]: Daisy performs her Crystal Smash from Super Mario Strikers. She slams a fist on the ground and yellow crystals appear from the ground on both sides of her. These crystals deal damage and stun anyone who touches them, allowing Daisy to quickly follow up with a grab or a smash attack. The move has much longer end lag if no one gets hurt. In the air, she’ll quickly come straight down and slam the floor to perform the same move. (Super Mario Strikers)

Grabs

Magic Vine [Tether]: These classic vines from Super Mario Bros aid Daisy in grabbing her opponents from a distance. If she misses the vine will slump to the floor, and she’ll irritably pull it back to her in one swift, angry motion, which takes her some time to recover from. She can use this vine to grab the ledge from a distance. On her way back up, you can hear the vine climbing noises from Super Mario Bros.

Piranha Chomp [Pummel]: The vine transforms into a Piranha Plant and begins furiously biting the opponent. The pummel leaves a flower on the opponent’s head.

Cherry Bomb [Forward Throw]: Daisy slightly tosses her opponent in front of her and then gives them a hard kick. Kills at the edge of some stages at a high percent.

Drop Kick [Back Throw]: Daisy tosses her opponent behind her and gives them a nasty drop kick. More powerful than a Cherry Bomb but has more end lag.

Dice Destroyer [Up Throw]: Daisy tosses her opponent upwards which keeps them suspended in the air for a moment. She then punches them upwards. This move sends opponents straight up, useful for knocking them into Nipper Spores above you. Kills at a high percent when close to the top blast zone. (Mario Party)

Ground Pound [Down Throw]: Daisy grounds her opponent, quickly jumps over them and performs the famous Ground Pound. Her most reliable kill throw, this move finishes off average weight opponents at around 125%.

Final Smash

Garden Frenzy: A wooden picket fence sprouts from the ground on both sides of Daisy. Anyone caught within the fence will be wrapped in a growing vine that deals massive damage. Once the move is over, any unlucky victims to have been caught in it will also be asleep.

Taunts

Plant Party [Side Taunt]: Produces one of many plants; Flower, Piranha Plant, Floaty Fluff, Nipper Spore or Magic Vine. The Flower gets put away quickly, the Piranha Plants chomps around a bit before disappearing, the Floaty Fluff flies off, the Nipper Spore is dropped, and the Magic Vine grows straight up infinitely. This taunt can be cancelled at any time by shielding or dodging.

Cheerful Greeter [Up Taunt]: Signature “Hi, I’m Daisy!” is stated. Waves and winks at the screen.

Passionate Planter [Down Taunt]: Daisy gets on one knee and plants a small flower. The flower can come in a variety of colors: white, orange, yellow, red, blue. The flowers will disappear once Daisy has been KO’ed or the flowers comes in contact with fire. Up to 5 flowers can be planted. No effect on gameplay.
Again, this took me some time! Lemme know what you guys think so far.
 
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Gestahl

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 12, 2018
Messages
45
How about Ridley and K. Rool. Both large male reptiles with claws. Skins?
It would save a lot of devtime indeed, I give you that, but if I know my Sakurai right, he and I both are hairguys than clawguys. Remember the Movie with Jim Carrey, Liar Liar. The stepdads claw is not equal original dads claws so I think you have a flawed argument.
 

WeirdChillFever

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
6,498
Location
Somewhere Out There
Holy moly, I did not expect this Daisy Moveset write up to take me many days, but it did in the name of research and technicality. Gonna spoiler it for obvious reasons.
Princess Daisy
View attachment 140328
Overview – A technical character in most sports games she appears in and an overall theme with flowers. Super athletic with a tomboyish attitude. Instead of wearing her typical dress, she will have her athlete's uniform on. Her move set will reflect upon these qualities.

Daisy is a fast character who can quickly deal a lot of damage. She has excellent recovery and can jump high but suffers from being killed very quickly, as she is one of the lightest characters in the game. She can combo well but can also easily get comboed herself since she is a fast faller. Her main draw is her unique ability to give her opponents flowers on their heads. Many of her attacks can do so, so she builds up damage quickly. To balance this quick damage output, she has trouble landing attacks that can successfully kill opponents. Her only reliable kill throw will kill at around 150% for average weight characters. Her Up Smash and Side Smash are her only other non-grab kill moves, so the rest of her move set will revolve around quickly racking up damage and setting up her opponents for a quick kill. She can also gimp quite easily as she has excellent off-stage play and some meteor attacks.


Basic Attacks

Princess Punch [Jab 1]: A basic royal punch that can connect with every tilt.

High Kick [Jab 2]: Daisy swiftly brings her leg out in an upward motion.

Fists of Frustration [Rapid Jab]: A barrage of punches that almost looks like flailing.

Ball Spike [Jab Release]: Daisy slams her fists on her opponent as if they were a volleyball. A sweet spot hit will meteor the opponent.

Ribbon Swing [Forward Tilt]: Daisy swings her Dancer’s Ribbon right out in front of her in a downwards motion. The Ribbon acts as a barrier destroying small projectiles. (Mario and Sonic at the Olympics)

Leg Sweep [Down Tilt]: Daisy sticks her leg out in front of her and tries to trip anyone in front of her. If struck with the final frames of her foot’s hit box, the opponent will have guaranteed trip.

Ribbon Dance [Up Tilt]: Daisy pulls out a Dancer’s Ribbon and quickly swings it above her. It covers her from above, but her sides are exposed. (Mario and Sonic at the Olympics)

Home Run Slide [Dash Attack]: Daisy slides on her back, very similar to the way Mario does. The very last frames of the attack do the most damage. (Mario Sluggers)

Aerial Attacks

Flower Shot [Neutral Air]: Daisy extends her arms out and her upper body is surrounded with flower petals for a multi-hit attack. Her legs and her head are exposed. (Mario Hoops 3 on 3)

Rhythmic Club [Forward Air]: Daisy stretches her arm out and spins a small Rhythmic Club. It has multiple hits, dealing some moderate damage. (Mario and Sonic at the Olympics)

Trick Pose [Back Air]: Daisy strikes a pose as seen in Mario Kart 8. Her arm and leg stick behind her, both of which deal damage. She also raises her other hand above her head, which also does damage. (Mario Kart 8)

Cheerleader [Up Air]: Daisy puts on a pair of pom-poms and shakes them above her twice. The second hit is stronger than the first. (Mario Sports Mix)

Skater’s Spin [Down Air]: Daisy performs a quick ice skater spin. The attack performs multiple hits and has a meteor effect on the last hit of the sweet spot [The tip of her feet]. (Mario and Sonic at the Winter Olympics)

Smash Attacks

Side Smash: Very similar to Peach, Daisy has a rotation of 3 items; a baseball bat [Long reach and most powerful, destroys projectiles], a Tennis Racket [Low damage, decent knockback, reflects projectiles], and Lip’s Stick (No knockback, average damage, stuns with stun lasting longer if charged more and opponent has high damage. No protection from projectiles] Rotation is always Bat, Racket, Lip Stick. Her Bat is her second most reliable kill move with the Racket being the third.

Koopa UpperKut [Up Smash]: A quick and powerful uppercut performed on Bowser in Mario Party 3. Her strongest attack and most reliable kill move, this punch will kill light opponents at 80% and heavier opponents at 120%. Its hitbox is only on her hand and will miss most opponents who crouch or are too small. Daisy begins to crouch as the attack is charged, which gives her a better chance at landing the attack. (Mario Party 3)

Piranha Plant Summon [Down Smash]: Daisy holds her arms in front of her face as she charges. The non-charged Down Smash will summon two small Piranha Plants (One on each side of her) that will only bite once. A charged Down Smash will summon two Piranha Plants half the size of Daisy that will bite twice. A fully charged Down Smash will cause Piranha Plants the height of Daisy to appear and bite 3 times. The move deals a load of damage but has horrible knockback. The last bite deals the most damage.

Special Attacks

Nipper Spore [Neutral Special]: Daisy pitches out a Nipper Spore, an enemy from Yoshi’s Island that floats down slowly. An opponent who touches a Nipper Spore will cause a flower to bloom on their head. Unlike in Yoshi’s Island, once the Nipper Spore hits the ground, it disappears. If the B button is held, Daisy can hold her pitching pose and aim the Nipper Spore in a series of 3 directions – Straight forward, diagonal or straight up. She can also face the other direction while holding her pitch. Only 2 Nipper Spores can be present at any time. (Yoshi’s Island)

Garden Slide [Side Special]: Daisy seemingly gets ready to run an athletic race. Holding the B button will allow her to keep this pose for a bit, with flowers swirling around her. Once the B button is released, she goes into a slide on her stomach with her hands held out in front of her. The longer the B button is held, the farther she slides. Getting caught by the slide puts the opponent into harsh hit stun. She leaves a trail of flowers behind her that last for about 2 seconds; contact with these flowers will leave a flower on the opponent’s head. (Mario Power Tennis)

Daisy Torpedo [Side Special in Air]: Daisy strikes a pose in the air and, with the B button held, charges, with flowers swirling around her. Once the B button is released, she launches herself in a vertical trajectory head first in whichever way she’s facing; this move is seemingly familiar, who did she learn it from?? She leaves a trail of flowers behind her, but unlike the grounded counterpart, the flowers only last half a second. These flowers will also leave a flower on an opponent’s head. On top of that, if she comes into contact with an opponent, she’ll immediately stop moving instead of continuously hitting them. The Daisy Torpedo will also have a small chance of bursting. The Burst version will always go farther and faster regardless of how charged the attack was. The Flower trail will not occur from the Burst, but anyone too close when the burst occurs will get a Flower on their head. Hitting a wall during a burst Daisy Torpedo will cause her crown to get lodged in the wall, causing her a few moments to recover her crown before she can get back into the fray.

Floaty Fluff [Up Special]: Daisy pulls out a Floaty Fluff Flower from Super Mario Galaxy 1. Like Peach’s Parasol, this attack will bring her diagonally upward in the direction she’s facing. Once the attack has reached has peaked, the flower will bloom and let Daisy slowly descent. The flower has one hit box, which is at the tip of the flower before it unfolds. This one hit box has decent knockback but won’t ever kill and gives any hit opponents a flower on their head. The flower is granted wind boxes to the sides of and above it once it opens. The flower has 3 petals which drift off fairly quickly. Once all 3 petals are gone, Daisy is sent into special fall. She can cancel the flower by pressing down on the control stick or performing an aerial attack, which also sends her into special fall. The flower can also be destroyed by opponent’s attacks, which will also send Daisy into special fall. (Super Mario Galaxy)

Crystal Smash [Down Special]: Daisy performs her Crystal Smash from Super Mario Strikers. She slams a fist on the ground and yellow crystals appear from the ground on both sides of her. These crystals deal damage and stun anyone who touches them, allowing Daisy to quickly follow up with a grab or a smash attack. The move has much longer end lag if no one gets hurt. In the air, she’ll quickly come straight down and slam the floor to perform the same move. (Super Mario Strikers)

Grabs

Magic Vine [Tether]: These classic vines from Super Mario Bros aid Daisy in grabbing her opponents from a distance. If she misses the vine will slump to the floor, and she’ll irritably pull it back to her in one swift, angry motion, which takes her some time to recover from. She can use this vine to grab the ledge from a distance. On her way back up, you can hear the vine climbing noises from Super Mario Bros.

Piranha Chomp [Pummel]: The vine transforms into a Piranha Plant and begins furiously biting the opponent. The pummel leaves a flower on the opponent’s head.

Cherry Bomb [Forward Throw]: Daisy slightly tosses her opponent in front of her and then gives them a hard kick. Kills at the edge of some stages at a high percent.

Drop Kick [Back Throw]: Daisy tosses her opponent behind her and gives them a nasty drop kick. More powerful than a Cherry Bomb but has more end lag.

Dice Destroyer [Up Throw]: Daisy tosses her opponent upwards which keeps them suspended in the air for a moment. She then punches them upwards. This move sends opponents straight up, useful for knocking them into Nipper Spores above you. Kills at a high percent when close to the top blast zone. (Mario Party)

Ground Pound [Down Throw]: Daisy grounds her opponent, quickly jumps over them and performs the famous Ground Pound. Her most reliable kill throw, this move finishes off average weight opponents at around 125%.

Final Smash

Garden Frenzy: A wooden picket fence sprouts from the ground on both sides of Daisy. Anyone caught within the fence will be wrapped in a growing vine that deals massive damage. Once the move is over, any unlucky victims to have been caught in it will also be asleep.

Taunts

Plant Party [Side Taunt]: Produces one of many plants; Flower, Piranha Plant, Floaty Fluff, Nipper Spore or Magic Vine. The Flower gets put away quickly, the Piranha Plants chomps around a bit before disappearing, the Floaty Fluff flies off, the Nipper Spore is dropped, and the Magic Vine grows straight up infinitely. This taunt can be cancelled at any time by shielding or dodging.

Cheerful Greeter [Up Taunt]: Signature “Hi, I’m Daisy!” is stated. Waves and winks at the screen.

Passionate Planter [Down Taunt]: Daisy gets on one knee and plants a small flower. The flower can come in a variety of colors: white, orange, yellow, red, blue. The flowers will disappear once Daisy has been KO’ed or the flowers comes in contact with fire. Up to 5 flowers can be planted. No effect on gameplay.
Again, this took me some time! Lemme know what you guys think so far.
You should post this in the Daisy thread!
 
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