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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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The DanMan051

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I hate repeating myself.
The internet reaction itself is minuscule and polarized by nature; that's a fact that has been repeatedly established. Using internet reaction to argue something tends not to work very well. I know I'm stepping into a sarlaac viper's pit bringing this up, but if you only pay heed to vocal internet reaction the new Star Wars movies are the worst thing ever. Even though box office sales prove that it's demonstrably a vocal minority (who even then, keep going out to see them); hell, my own mom has watched them on Netflix and said she enjoyed them (a middle aged women enjoying Star Wars).

Saying "the vocal minority didn't like Corrin so clearly nobody did" ignores the large, fairly ambivalent silent majority.
 

MyDude213

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I have seen his Youtube videos and I doubt he's clever enough to pull this off, but, if true, I congratulate him on epic troll to end all trolls. I don't personally care about a single character in that banner, but I get how it would suck to have your hopes built up only to get let down. Still though, that would be some epic trolling skill. I think his only troll regarding the grinch leak os taking credit for it though.
And this kids is why don't get massively over hyped over leaks on the internet and just wait for daddy Sakurai or Nintendo to release info themselves. ;)
 

Diem

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On the whole I think this game's cast of newcomers is far more exciting than Smash 4's. I was excited for like, five of Smash 4's base-game newcomers. The rest were just "Oh, that's cool I guess." Mega Man was the biggest deal, but otherwise everything else was just okay.

Whereas Ultimate's characters are all really hype in one way or another. Either they're long-standing requests finally granted, or they're really unique and fun personalities.

But that's just me and my subjective tastes.
 

MangoTwist

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Maybe I'm just reading this wrong but:

Press release.
Ooh my bad. This is interesting.
It seems we will get 109 stages then, considering PP is not part of the fighter pass.

"Piranha Plant will also be available as paid DLC (separate from Fighters Pass content) at a later time." - buy section of smashbros.com
 

osby

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For those who got hyped with the idea of World of Light being a story mode, that's a source of devastation. Hopes built up, just to get pummeled.
Eh, I got over it quickly. I was secretly hoping for one but I knew SSE was the biggest source sink in the Smash history and was extremely unlikely to repeat.

Implied story and trailer is still cooler than what Melee and Smash For did.
 

CosmicQuark

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so was all that hype for k. rool and ridley just moot because the last direct wasn't the best thing in the world?
I was glad for the fans, but neither appealed to me personally. Never played Metroid, and as a kid I had Donkey Kong 64 but didn't have the expansion pak so I couldn't play it. Hadn't heard of either of them until this year.

There's an alternate timeline where I'm more hyped for King K Rool than Banjo & Kazooie. And another where Banjo & Kazooie are in. I was born in the worst timeline (for me)

I'll get over it.
 

Slavic

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So... what are everyone's overall final thoughts on the base roster?
And yes, Base... Not DLC
So no Piranha Plant
:ultinkling: 8/10 - a very obvious choice but still a fun one and really set the precedent for the creativity in movesets this time around,
:ultdaisy: 6/10 - never was a huge fan of Daisy though I'll probably play her over Peach anyways
:ultridley: 10/10 - uh a yes thank you
:ultsimon: 9/10 - simon's just such a cool guy to have in the game I'm so excited
:ultrichter: 5/10 - one of very few characters I didn't know when they were revealed but he's cool enough, I've got nothing against him
:ultchrom: 8/10 - ayyyy the fam's all here
:ultdarksamus: 10/10 - how can this game give me both Ridley and DS after 3 games of just Samus and not expect me to do a backflip
:ultkrool: 7/10 - I'm very glad he's in but at the same time I've never played a game he's in sooo
:ultisabelle: 8/10 - I always wanted a named AC character over an unnamed like Villager so Isabelle feels like the series finally has a proper character to me
7/10 - I don't really care about SF but I do know I like Ken more than Ryu so this is good for me
10/10 - INCINEROARMANIA, BROTHER

Overall? Piranha Plant/10, good game, can't wait til December
 
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KirbyWorshipper2465

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For those who got hyped with the idea of World of Light being a story mode, that's a source of devastation. Hopes built up, just to get pummeled.
I get the impression that a lot of people used monkey paw wishes, and wound up with various equivalent exchanges.

>want a successor to SSE
>get actual dialogue (which was probably expensive to use), but it's an excuse plot

>ask for more villains
>get Ridley and K. Rool, but end up with Piranha Plant on the Mario side

>ask for some veterans to be back
>everyone is here, but there's less newcomers than usual

The real dealbreaker for me would have been if there weren't any DLC announcements, so I got some excitement there.

Yeah, Square have been a bunch of ****s the last 5 years or so with pretty much EVERYTHING. They're slowly getting more hatred from me than ****ING EA at this point.
It's a strange time to be in, when goddamn Konami is more reasonable at allowing characters in Smash than SE. At this rate, the Dragon Quest fanbase in Japan will riot on the streets.
 
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Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

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Eh, I got over it quickly. I was secretly hoping for one but I knew SSE was the biggest source sink in the Smash history and was extremely unlikely to repeat.

Implied story and trailer is still cooler than what Melee and Smash For did.
I mean, like I said, it won't ruin the whole experience for me. I certainly wasn't expecting full-on SSE 2, but seeing that cutscene, only to be told, "Lol, more fun, no story", hurts. Like, they could just Project x Zone it and keep most of the interactions to dialogue and textboxes. They wouldn't have to have so many cutscenes. Like, why even bother with the voice acting if that cutscene is it!? Ya give the villain a name and whatnot, gah!

It wasn't asking for much that we could just see these characters react. It's like they're allergic to such an awesome factor. The game could've been ultimate outside of just the roster.
 

ReeseBalaski

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You know, yesterday, I wasn't too sold on Piranha Plant. But now, I'm kinda diggin' it. He's an adorable plant child.
 

Diem

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Eh, I got over it quickly. I was secretly hoping for one but I knew SSE was the biggest source sink in the Smash history and was extremely unlikely to repeat.

Implied story and trailer is still cooler than what Melee and Smash For did.
Something else to consider is that DLC characters wouldn't be included in a story mode if it were full of cutscenes like SSE. Hype characters like Geno, Banjo, and whoever else would be missing.

Which is part of the reason I was a little relieved about Smash 4 not having a story mode. While it would've been hype, it would've been missing Cloud, Bayonetta, Mewtwo, etc.

But the way the mode is being handled for Ultimate, it doesn't matter. The general idea is still the same. Just pick your character and just have a playthrough to go save the world.
 

The DanMan051

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So um, what did Sakurai need this for then?


Any guesses?
Inkling. They're the only character to walk around with and actively use a gun; the spacies only use it as their neutral special and in grab follow ups. Inkling's walking around and whipping people with it while also using it for multiple attacks; makes sense he'd grab something like this for his animation ref posing figures, because he probably didn't have anything like it before.

Also maybe partially because he's a nerd and bought a figure he personally thought was cool instead of going for a cheaper thing that would've been to scale.
 
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Nekoo

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Yeah, Square have been a bunch of ****s the last 5 years or so with pretty much EVERYTHING. They're slowly getting more hatred from me than ****ING EA at this point.
I dunno dude. They announced KH 3 and fixed FF XIV alongside making Nier Automata a reality, let cloud in smash and created Bravely default/ Octopath.

I think you're just biased that they are Against one thing you want
 
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Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

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I get the impression that a lot of people used monkey paw wishes, and wound up with various equivalent exchanges.

>want a successor to SEE
>get actual dialogue, but it's an excuse plot
Well fudge me, we didn't even get an excuse plot. Project x Zone 2 is an excuse plot, and a fun one. According to Sakurai, there is no such tier of plot. It's just up to our imagination mostly.
 
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Porygon2

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On the whole I think this game's cast of newcomers is far more exciting than Smash 4's. I was excited for like, five of Smash 4's base-game newcomers. The rest were just "Oh, that's cool I guess." Mega Man was the biggest deal, but otherwise everything else was just okay.

Whereas Ultimate's characters are all really hype in one way or another. Either they're long-standing requests finally granted, or they're really unique and fun personalities.

But that's just me and my subjective tastes.
The extra effort put toward animations really shows. Just look at Incineroar and Dark Samus, the fighters scream personality.
Do wish all of veterans had as much effort put into them as DK, though.
 

osby

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I mean, like I said, it won't ruin the whole experience for me. I certainly wasn't expecting full-on SSE 2, but seeing that cutscene, only to be told, "Lol, more fun, no story", hurts. Like, they could just Project x Zone it and keep most of the interactions to dialogue and textboxes. They wouldn't have to have so many cutscenes. Like, why even bother with the voice acting if that cutscene is it!? Ya give the villain a name and whatnot, gah!

It wasn't asking for much that we could just see these characters react. It's like they're allergic to such an awesome factor. The game could've been ultimate outside of just the roster.
Marth, Zelda and Pit got new voice lines, so it was easy for their voice actors to say a few lines.

Last bosses always have a name.

Project X Zone format wouldn't work well in Smash because you have a lot of characters that can't talk (including mainstays like Pikachu and Kirby) and it's still needs a lot of writing that director needs to watch over.
 
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Why didn't they hire Kylee Epp to sing the main theme? She would've done even better than whoever they did hire...
 

Cosmic77

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On the whole I think this game's cast of newcomers is far more exciting than Smash 4's. I was excited for like, five of Smash 4's base-game newcomers. The rest were just "Oh, that's cool I guess." Mega Man was the biggest deal, but otherwise everything else was just okay.

Whereas Ultimate's characters are all really hype in one way or another. Either they're long-standing requests finally granted, or they're really unique and fun personalities.

But that's just me and my subjective tastes.
Honestly, after Rosalina's reveal, I just stopped getting hyped with the newcomers (though I probably would've been excited for Greninja if Mewtwo already existed.) Didn't really care for anyone we got, I wouldn't find myself getting excited again until Mewtwo and Lucas.

Even though we only got six unique newcomers (excluding vets), four of them were in my most-wanted list. I don't know why or how, but somehow Ultimate's significantly smaller roster has gotten me far more excited than Smash 4's, and the latter had more than 20 newcomers. Not quite as exciting as Brawl's just yet, but it's getting there.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Yeah, I’m not sure they even knew what they were doing. I’m sure back in the day Brawl ATs were the coolest thing ever, but now they’ve just become a death certificate for peoples’ picks. I honestly think the ATs were handled really badly this time, leaving so many fan favourites to the end was probably done in good faith but came off as very obnoxious and ignorant.

Heck the fact that Assist Trophies outnumber Pokemon this time around just feels like overcompensation.
I mean some of them are genuinely hype to see. A lot of people, myself included wanted to see Black Knight as an Ike echo for example but seeing him in action was so goddamn cool just waltzing through everything
 

hazza5557

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One of the biggest things I love about ultimate is the new Final Smashes. I always hated the transformation final smashes eg Wario, Bowser, Little Mac, but I thought it was just me that didn’t like them. I always preferred fighters like Captain Falcon’s FS that had a cool cutscene and stuff. I was so happy when they announced they’d be removing the transformations. It was just so weird because I thought everyone else liked the transformations or didn’t have a problem with them.
 

KirbyWorshipper2465

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I just always liked surprise characters...
In any case, those two still are a beacon of hope for anyone that wants their favorites in, if they persevere and show enough vocal love and dedication. The lesson here is that you must not be quiet or subtle when backing a character, let your message be loud and clear, and keep momentum going for as long as it takes.

But don't let yourself be mean-spirited about it like some parts of the Waluigi fanbase.

One of the biggest things I love about ultimate is the new Final Smashes. I always hated the transformation final smashes eg Wario, Bowser, Little Mac, but I thought it was just me that didn’t like them. I always preferred fighters like Captain Falcon’s FS that had a cool cutscene and stuff. I was so happy when they announced they’d be removing the transformations. It was just so weird because I thought everyone else liked the transformations or didn’t have a problem with them.
Part of me is happy they didn't cut out Peach Blossom, didn't seem that slow to me anyways. Plus the illustrations Daisy has are cute, so Peach may get those too, assuredly.
 
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Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

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Something else to consider is that DLC characters wouldn't be included in a story mode if it were full of cutscenes like SSE. Hype characters like Geno, Banjo, and whoever else would be missing.
Not even close. There were plenty of fighters in the base roster who DID NOT show up in the CGI cutscene. That's a weak reason. Besides, even in Brawl, not everyone showed up initially. I'd be sad if Phoenix Wright wouldn't get to participate in the story mode because he's DLC, but not enough to snub the story potential that World of Light has.
 
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Cutie Gwen

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I dunno dude. They announced KH 3 and fixed FF XIV alongside making Nier Automata a reality, let cloud in smash and created Bravely default/ Octopath.

I think you're just biased that they are Against one thing you want
I mean tbf I learned that in Tekken 7, victory animations which involve attacking the loser get disabled if Noctis loses. Kinda like how Kratos wasn't allowed to look anything but pissed in MK9
 

osby

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Why didn't they hire Kylee Epp to sing the main theme? She would've done even better than whoever they did hire...
Literally who?

Not even close. There were plenty of fighters in the base roster who DID NOT show up in the CGI cutscene. That's a weak reason. Besides, even in Brawl, not everyone showed up initially. I'd be sad if Phoenix Wright wouldn't get to participate in the story mode because he's DLC, but not enough to snub the story potential that World of Light has.
It's a trailer, not a cutscene.
 

MysticKnives

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On the whole I think this game's cast of newcomers is far more exciting than Smash 4's. I was excited for like, five of Smash 4's base-game newcomers. The rest were just "Oh, that's cool I guess." Mega Man was the biggest deal, but otherwise everything else was just okay.

Whereas Ultimate's characters are all really hype in one way or another. Either they're long-standing requests finally granted, or they're really unique and fun personalities.

But that's just me and my subjective tastes.
It’s about even with 4’s for me. WFT and Pirahna Plant have been the best reveals for a long time now for me
 

Nekoo

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I mean tbf I learned that in Tekken 7, victory animations which involve attacking the loser get disabled if Noctis loses. Kinda like how Kratos wasn't allowed to look anything but pissed in MK9
Well yeah, but honestly that's like the least of the issue to make someone hate SE lmao
 

Raxxel

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Okay, thoughts on base roster?
:ultinkling: Solid 8/10, definitely deserves their spot and has a great moveset that reflects their games. Not gonna play them much probably though.
:ultdaisy: 7/10. Looks great, happy for her fans even if I don't think much of the character herself.
:ultridley: 10/10 holy ****. They nailed his vicious character, both in presentation and moveset. And that side B, oh my god. Definitely maining.
:ultsimon: 9/10. Looks like a blast, definitely think I'll be playing him for fun a lot.
:ultrichter: 9/10. Same reasons as the previous Belmont. Really the Castlevania content in this game in general is rad.
:ultchrom: 6/10. Happy for his fans, but he's never been my cup of tea.
:ultdarksamus: 8/10. Wasn't actively asking for them, but man do they look cool. That's all I can say, honestly.
:ultkrool: 10/10 HOLY ****. My most wanted newcomer, and he looks amazing. I feel as if I can't say what hasn't been said, but his cartoony yet brutal nature are all captured so well within his moveset. THAT BACKBREAKER THOUGH. Instant main.
:ultisabelle: 6/10. She looks fun, glad AC got another rep. Probably will play her for fun from time to time.
:ultken: 8/10. Looks better than ever. Will likely play for fun, happy he's in. His close up final smash looks amazing too.
:ultincinceroar:6/10. Was initially very against him, mostly because I wanted Decidueye, but he grew on me enough for me to accept him. He doesn't look bad.
 
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Jovahexeon Joranvexeon

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Project X Zone format wouldn't work well in Smash because you have a lot of characters that can't talk (including mainstays like Pikachu and Kirby) and it's still needs a lot of writing that director needs to watch over.
You do know that there have been plenty of characters in the PxZ that can't speak and that hasn't stop them from still having fun interactions right?

Hell, mix that with SSE's ability for characters to interact without talking and it's easy.

Also, getting a director to helm that writing wouldn't be impossible. Again, it just reeks of Sakurai still being salty over SSE and youtube.
 

MyDude213

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About Geno: He's a third party, I'm not comfortable with linking his (lack of) inclusion with what Sakurai personally thinks about him.

About FE: Corrin wasn't even picked by Sakurai, so I also doubt he wants to pick another character from the series, especially now that we have Chrom.
Geno isn't a third party character, but Square Enix the company that owns him is a *third party company*. that actually means Geno is a second party character, sure he's owned by Square which is third party but the fact of the matter is that he only appeared in an *exclusive* Nintendo game. As in a game that only appeared on Nintendo hardware. Now if he or his game did come out on other non Nintendo platforms then ya sure, he would be a third party but he hasn't so he's actually a second party character. It's the same deal with Pokemon, Nintendo doesn't actually own any of the Pokemon in the Pokemon games but they have a deal of exclusivity with Game Freak for the games so they're considered second party characters. Geno is the same way just with a different company.
 
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