Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[drag0nscythe]

In the art? or in amazon being ****in stupid enough to leak the final roster number..

Nintendo has a track record now. Fe warriors and now this. Oh boy. Nintendo really needs to pay attention to this from now on.

 

[Nap_]

Also, for people saying that Spirit isn't a deconfirmation, I'm at my third watch of the direct and This is what I can take out of it



Then people called about Characters like K.Rool or Wii Fit trainers having Spirit meaning it's not a deconfirmation however, after more viewing...

It is not the playable Characters themselves

King K. Rool's in his pirate outfit, And smash made the clear distinction between the two-
Ridley is Meta Ridley.
And Palutena is Psuedo Palutena.

And Wii Fit trainer isn't the spirit of the Characters. But the spirit of the Yoga Pose. Just like Smash 4's trophy


Because think about it. It makes no sense to have spirit of the Playable Characters when the whole point of the spirit mode/ Adventure mode is having the spirit CONTROLLING the playable Characters/taking over them.


Take this as you will. But it's all I can find so far after watching it three times.

Yeah... In the base game still makes sense. But DLC characters are outside the game, they are not... Er... Canon. They will differe in some ways as they did in Smash 4 (no customs for example). There's a lot of spirits, probably more than Brawl stickers or 4 trophies, then who left if we deconfirm every character here? It's a problem.
'Yoga pose' is still Wii Fit trainer. Who can see this as a different fighter? And Dixie evolves to... Dixie with Kiddy. Weird.
But my main point is that DLC can exist outside the base game without a problem. Even the ones that are ATs (without trophies LOL) still got a very little chance.

But DLC is probably already decided anyway.

 

[Blargg888]

I had a weird idea for a newcomer, and i'm mad it'll never happen.

The character, or characters were a Goomba, a Koopa, and a Shy Guy, who were collectively known as Bowser's Minions on the CSS.
They were kinda like Olimar and the Pikmin where they all functioned together and used each other for attacks. They would summon other minions for specials too, like Bullet Bill for the side special, and Lakitu for the up special, and Thwomp for the down special. The final smash was basically summoning every single Mario enemy to swarm the characters on screen. The concept is to represent Mario's enemies, and the idea is that they got sick of being stomped on so now they're gonna stomp you.

This is what I think about when I should be working.

Y'know, suddenly this idea of yours sounds a lot more plausible.

I still I have my doubts it'd happen, but I'm sure P. Plant would love to have some of his fellow minions with him.

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

ELMA D L -

Ahem.

How about just using it for the Splatoon Characters?

How about #GiveElmaAChance 4 DLC.

 

[Luigi The President]

You know in the movies where a father looks into his sons eyes and though he loves his son so much all he can see is his dead mom

That's gonna be me with Piranha Plant and I'm gonna see Paper Mario and Geno in his nonexistent eyes

 

[Spatman]

DLC Predictions?
I don't expect any first parties tbh.

Since now it's clear Vergeben knows (almost) all:
Banjo & Kazooye/Steve
A SE character
2 Nintendo characters
The last one can be either a nintendo character or a third party

 

[Will]

Here are my predictions:

1. Steve
2. Mach Rider
3. Fulgore
4. The Cheetahmen
5. Goku

And nothing you can say will change my mind.

 

[Zinith]

The Mushroom Kindom U stage likely still has him as a stage hazard.

Sorry bud.

They can always pull an Alfonzo and just replace him with Kammy or someone...

Or they can just retcon things and just say that the stage hazard is just a generic Magikoopa...

Straw-pulling, but healthy straw-pulling...

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Piranha plant... well if you wanted to leak proof your game, what better way than to actually put in a troll character?

No wonder the leakers were so all over the place. Well played Sakurai.

Also, glad that Putrid Piranha returns from the good Paper Mario games. That makes it the best character by default.

 

[FCZHornet]

Let’s get:

Geno
Banjo Kazooie
Dante
Elma
Bandanna Dee

 

[Kuon]

If Piranha Plant can get in, then I’m gonna rally for Goomba, Shy Guy, Boo, and Koopa Troopa. I’m also going for Slime and Chocobo (if Square Enix is generous). I’m also hoping just maybe Sora at the VGAs if possible.

Yeah, King Boo seems like a much better choice than Piranha Plant

 

[KingofKoopas]

Nintendo has a track record now. Fe warriors and now this. Oh boy. Nintendo really needs to pay attention to this from now on.

In hindsight all you had to do to convince me of box theory was say five words
"Amazon is Headquartered in Seattle"
I'd have believed they WOULD be that stupid if i remembered what kind of company we were dealing with lol.. Btw its been a day and i feel ill can i remove the kebab yet

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Also, for people saying that Spirit isn't a deconfirmation, I'm at my third watch of the direct and This is what I can take out of it



Then people called about Characters like K.Rool or Wii Fit trainers having Spirit meaning it's not a deconfirmation however, after more viewing...

It is not the playable Characters themselves

King K. Rool's in his pirate outfit, And smash made the clear distinction between the two-
Ridley is Meta Ridley.
And Palutena is Psuedo Palutena.

And Wii Fit trainer isn't the spirit of the Characters. But the spirit of the Yoga Pose. Just like Smash 4's trophy


Because think about it. It makes no sense to have spirit of the Playable Characters when the whole point of the spirit mode/ Adventure mode is having the spirit CONTROLLING the playable Characters/taking over them.


Take this as you will. But it's all I can find so far after watching it three times.

Well... let's get started then.

https://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_spirits_(disambiguation) This page should be useful. Dixie Kong, Daroach, and Geno are all blown out of the way if this is the case. (among others)

 

[The DanMan051]

I legit expect Elma.

No spirit seen when we saw all of Xenoblade 2
No Xenoblade X music or whatever yet.

I'm feeling Elma.

A skell was shown:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/421441832900100097/507667298908372993/unknown.png

I can't really see the logic of Rex being a Mii Fighter costume yet Elma getting in as a DLC character, especially since Elma has no current future (with MS ruling out an X port right now due to it being resource-intensive and already working on their next title).

 

[Nekoo]

My question on Elma if she's in though is why is she of all characters DLC?

Like, Elma strikes me much more as base roster instead of DLC. They could've moved someone like K. Rool or Simon to DLC and it would make more sense in my opinion.

Honestly? I can feel Elma Being a case of
"We have X budget for main game. So i gotta make choices"

Like relegated to DLC out of lack of place and Sakurai wanting more fan service. I mean...

He seems to not give a **** for DLC with the Piranha Plant

 

[monadoboy]

From a speculative standpoint, it raises questions of where the line is drawn

There is no line. Speculation is meaningless

 

[drag0nscythe]

In hindsight all you had to do to convince me of box theory was say five words
"Amazon is Headquartered in Seattle"
I'd have believed they WOULD be that stupid if i remembered what kind of company we were dealing with lol.. Btw its been a day and i feel ill can i remove the kebab yet

Go for it.

 

[Noipoi]

Y'know, suddenly this idea of yours sounds a lot more plausible.

I still I have my doubts it'd happen, but I'm sure P. Plant would love to have some of his fellow minions with him.

I knew it, Sakurai sends me brain waves while I sleep.

 

[UberMadman]

Y'all please just let Geno rest

It's done. He's over. People fought for over a decade now it's time to just let him rest.
No more debating. No more of that. He's not gonna be DLC, you know in your heart.

Just let my boy rest.

I'm not resting until the final DLC character drops. Then I'll wait until the next Smash game, and resume the campaigning there. He may not make it in, but I'm sure as hell going to give him all my support until then.

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

Why are we so insistent on "deconfirming" characters this speculation period? As I've said before, I totally see how assist trophies and final smashes have logic to them, but people have been trying to use all sorts of theories and fan rules to deconfirm characters as well.

Music theory was the biggest offender of this. It was originally used to try and speculate who the newcomers would be, but so many people latched on to it trying to use it to deconfirm characters. Now it's spirits. There's no reason I see that a character can't be both a spirit and a fighter. We already have characters who are both. So what if it's "technically Meta Ridley"? That's still Ridley, and he even has a Meta Ridley alt.

And people will split hairs to do it to. "Mewtwo's trophy didn't count because he was a veteran", "music theory still applies because Dark Samus was just an echo". If you want to say "I think this character is less likely to be DLC" that's one thing, but it seems a bit presumptuous to assume that they have totally zero chance now. Even assist trophy characters I feel have a chance at getting revived if we get a round 2 of DLC, even if it's unlikely.

On that note, I'm going to continue supporting Shadow. They can use Sonic as a base and no longer have to worry about crunching him in as an Echo, and disabling him would not result in any loss as the Timer item is there for those who like his effects.

It's not over yet. I don't expect a single promotion for this season, but if it does well and Nintendo asks Sakurai for another one, we have a chance. All we can do is continue being vocal about our support.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Let’s talk dlc predictions

Steve is probably a lock now based on Vergeben as matter of fact verge just doubled the Minecraft content hope he finds out about the other 4

Other possibles

Sora/geno - one or the other sadly sora has the advantage with kingdom hearts 3

Heihachi - costume not yet revealed

Banjo and kazooie - ballot pick

Lloyd - another costume not yet reveal

Bandana dee - the piranha plant really shut down pretty much nearly endless arguements against characters badana dee has the biggest points

Rythmn heaven rep - I just can’t see this not happening since it packages music and a stage

Not much more i can think off

 

[lordvaati]

Every Person who believed the Grinch Leak after the Direct

 

[Just a random scrub]

Well, time for some direct thoughts, I guess...

That direct..... it was..... i guess kinda.... okay, I cant be positive. That direct was pure trash. Absolute horse****. I waited months for THIS? I want the 40 minutes of my life I spent watching that back.

Ken, while he was basically a lock, and thus wasn't surprising, was still about the only bright spot for me; after all, I like playing Ryu, and I like Ken, and it's nice to see Ryu share this adventure with his training buddy/friendly rival. Better yet, he really feels like Ken; you can tell Sakurai knows his Street Fighter.

Everything else was ****. Incineroar was one of the last people I ever would have wanted in Smash (but not to the point where I'd skip out on the game for him, and for what it's worth, Sakurai definitely nailed his wrestler 'tude), Spirits mode sucks and just appears to be Smash Tour 2.0 (I WAS JOKING WHEN I SAID "Watch this be Smash Tour 2.0", you know), and the Assist Trophy section..... good ****ing god. After ALL that waiting, Shadow and Isaac were still just ****ing assists. That's not the part that really bummed me out, it's the fact that they, along with many other fan favorites that got snubbed, were held off for this ****ing long, giving their fans so much ****ing hope, only to have it ripped apart from their ****ing hands right at the ****ing endgame AND destroying their chances of being DLC. There's literally no ****ing reason they couldn't have been shown off in the earlier directs; that would have been infinitely less crushing, but noo, they had to do the **** move. THAT'S how you build hype, get ****** hopeful for their most wanted, then waiting til the end to go "lol, they ain't playable and they won't be DLC, yeet yeet." I feel especially bad for Skull Kid supporters; they didn't even get the dignity of having their character get deconfirmed as part of the Assist Trophy presentation; Skull Kid's deconfirmation was just casually dumped to the website as if it didn't ****ing matter. Magor douche move.

All that on it's own wouldn't have made me hate this game, and I'd still have probably played it and loved it. But then I moved on to the worst part of the Direct; the DLC section. I was still pretty bummed that none of my top 5 were in, and I was holding out some hope..... and then I saw Piranha Plant. Then I saw his splash screen. I didn't pay much attention to the rest of his reveal. I was mostly just standing there, slack-jawed, trying to comprehend what the hell just happened. When I finally got my thoughts back, I just thought, "Really. REALLY. REALLY. Are you ****ing kidding me? ARE YOU ****ING SERIOUS RIGHT NOW?" THIS is our first DLC character? A basic mook from a Mario game, not even an actually important one like Goomba or Koopa, just one random Mario enemies out of dozens? REALLY! REALLY?! Is this some joke? Because it's not funny in the slightest. Instead of literally anybody else, they devoted resources to a character that literally nobody voted for. What a joke. What a ****ing joke. Say what you will about any of the fan favs that got shafted, but at least, y'know, they're not dime a dozen mooks and are actually important to the games they're in. This is the only character in Smash history that I felt was legitimately a waste of a slot, as I can't come up with a single justification for his inclusion.

My absoulte most wanted ever, Waluigi, was deemed unworthy thrice, but a ****ing Piranha Plant, just one of many, many basic enemies, is apparently perfectly worthy for Smash. So in other words, a Piranha Plant is a more worthy inclusion for Smash than Waluigi or literally any of the fan favorites that got snubbed. A Piranha Plant was apparently better than any of my most wanted, and was more deserving of valuable resources and dev time in a time when slots are so limited. That just hurts on a personal level. *sniff*

All in all, this direct felt like the ultimate middle finger to me. Is that petty? I know that's petty, but that's just how it felt. I learned, apparently NONE of my favorite characters actually matter. So anyways, I am legitimately gonna cancel my preorder. I get Ultimate will still probably be a great game, but it just won't be one for me. I wish I could still enjoy it, but I won't be able to take my mind off the fact that a ****ING PIRANHA PLANT can be playable but Waluigi can't.

EDIT: Unless they forgot to reveal them, it seems Home Run Contest, Events, All Star Modes, and a few other modes won't be coming back, which also sucks.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Go for it.

Hit it tupac

 

[Untouch]

lol if this wasnt recorded a while ago i'd say this was a direct reference to all the speculation

 

[Luigi The President]

Let’s talk dlc predictions

Steve is probably a lock now based on Vergeben as matter of fact verge just doubled the Minecraft content hope he finds out about the other 4

Other possibles

Sora/geno - one or the other sadly sora has the advantage with kingdom hearts 3

Heihachi - costume not yet revealed

Banjo and kazooie - ballot pick

Lloyd - another costume not yet reveal

Bandana dee - the piranha plant really shut down pretty much nearly endless arguements against characters badana dee has the biggest points

Rythmn heaven rep - I just can’t see this not happening since it packages music and a stage

Not much more i can think off

"Steve's a lock now"

We just saw Spirits, where characters can still be represented
The Minecraft content just being a Steve/Creeper Spirit is NOT a stretch

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Well, time for some direct thoughts, I guess...

That direct..... it was..... i guess kinda.... okay, I cant be positive. That direct was pure trash. Absolute horse****. I waited months for THIS? I want the 40 minutes of my life I spent watching that back.

Ken, while he was basically a lock, and thus wasn't surprising, was still about the only bright spot for me; after all, I like playing Ryu, and I like Ken, and it's nice to see Ryu share this adventure with his training buddy/friendly rival. Better yet, he really feels like Ken; you can tell Sakurai knows his Street Fighter.

Everything else was ****. Incineroar was one of the last people I ever would have wanted in Smash (but not to the point where I'd skip out on the game for him, and for what it's worth, Sakurai definitely nailed his wrestler 'tude), Spirits mode sucks and just appears to be Smash Tour 2.0 (I WAS JOKING WHEN I SAID "Watch this be Smash Tour 2.0", you know), and the Assist Trophy section..... good ****ing god. After ALL that waiting, Shadow and Isaac were still just ****ing assists. That's not the part that really bummed me out, it's the fact that they, along with many other fan favorites that got snubbed, were held off for this ****ing long, giving their fans so much ****ing hope, only to have it ripped apart from their ****ing hands right at the ****ing endgame AND destroying their chances of being DLC. There's literally no ****ing reason they couldn't have been shown off in the earlier directs; that would have been infinitely less crushing, but noo, they had to do the **** move. THAT'S how you build hype, get ****** hopeful for their most wanted, then waiting til the end to go "lol, they ain't playable and they won't be DLC, yeet yeet." I feel especially bad for Skull Kid supporters; they didn't even get the dignity of having their character get deconfirmed as part of the Assist Trophy presentation; Skull Kid's deconfirmation was just casually dumped to the website as if it didn't ****ing matter. Magor douche move.

All that on it's own wouldn't have made me hate this game, and I'd still have probably played it and loved it. But then I moved on to the worst part of the Direct; the DLC section. I was still pretty bummed that none of my top 5 were in, and I was holding out some hope..... and then I saw Piranha Plant. Then I saw his splash screen. I didn't pay much attention to the rest of his reveal. I was mostly just standing there, slack-jawed, trying to comprehend what the hell just happened. When I finally got my thoughts back, I just thought, "Really. REALLY. REALLY. Are you ****ing kidding me? ARE YOU ****ING SERIOUS RIGHT NOW?" THIS is our first DLC character? A basic mook from a Mario game, not even an actually important one like Goomba or Koopa, just one random Mario enemies out of dozens? Is this some joke? Because it's not funny in the slightest. Instead of literally anybody else, they devoted resources to a character that literally nobody voted for. What a joke. What a ****ing joke. Say what you will about any of the fan favs that got shafted, but at least, y'know, they're not dime a dozen mooks and are actually important to the games they're in. This is the only character in Smash history that I felt was legitimately a waste of a slot, as I can't come up with a single justification for his inclusion.

My absoulte most wanted ever, Waluigi, was deemed unworthy thrice, but a ****ing Piranha Plant, just one of many, many basic enemies, is apparently perfectly worthy for Smash. So in other words, a Piranha Plant is a more worthy inclusion for Smash than Waluigi or literally any of the fan favorites that got snubbed. A Piranha Plant was apparently better than any of my most wanted. That just hurts on a personal level. *sniff*

All in all, this direct felt like the ultimate middle finger to me. Is that petty? I know that's petty, but that's just how it felt. So anyways, I am legitametly gonna cancel my preorder. I get Ultimate will still probably be a great game, but it just won't be one for me. I wish I could still enjoy it, but I won't be able to take my mind off the fact that a ****ING PIRANHA PLANT can be playable but Waluigi can't.

Hey man in the end its Sakurai's game. He can do what he wants and we should be grateful he gave us fan favorites like K. Rool and Ridley because if he didn't want to he wouldn't had.

Also there's still DLC you know.

 

[Shroob]

Ya'll are sleeping on World 1-1 Goomba.


Name a more iconic Nintendo enemy, I'll wait.

 

[Will]

What if the biggest plot twist is that Omni did a leak again and he was slowly revealing the process of the Grinch shenanigans as he used the cutting out characters as an "example".

 

[Mellowy Yellow]

Y'all please just let Geno rest

It's done. He's over. People fought for over a decade now it's time to just let him rest.
No more debating. No more of that. He's not gonna be DLC, you know in your heart.

Just let my boy rest.

No. We will never quit on him. We will never give up on him until the day arrives. I dont care what SE says, we won't quit.

Im sorry but i just dont wanna give up.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Yeah... In the base game still makes sense. But DLC characters are outside the game, they are not... Er... Canon. They will differe in some ways as they did in Smash 4 (no customs for example). There's a lot of spirits, probably more than Brawl stickers or 4 trophies, then who left if we deconfirm every character here? It's a problem.
'Yoga pose' is still Wii Fit trainer. Who can see this as a different fighter? And Dixie evolves to... Dixie with Kiddy. Weird.
But my main point is that DLC can exist outside the base game without a problem. Even the ones that are ATs (without trophies LOL) still got a very little chance.

But DLC is probably already decided anyway.

DLC is already decided.

DLC characters were decided before the main roster cutoff though.

"We decided on which fighters to include when we started planning."

The five characters are already decided on. It's why characters like Rex and Spring Man didn't make it, because DLC was already decided.

Fan demand could come into play with a potential Season 2, but for now the only thing we can do is wait and see who makes the cut.

This is pretty intense lol.

I've used this post like 6 times today lol.

 

[UberMadman]

On that note, I'm going to continue supporting Shadow. They can use Sonic as a base and no longer have to worry about crunching him in as an Echo, and disabling him would not result in any loss as the Timer item is there for those who like his effects.

It's not over yet. I don't expect a single promotion for this season, but if it does well and Nintendo asks Sakurai for another one, we have a chance. All we can do is continue being vocal about our support.

This is also a good point; until I see Sakurai say "I'm not going to promote Assist Trophies for DLC," I'm not done supporting Shadow either. Hell, Knuckles would be amazing too. I highly doubt he's going to promote any of them to playable, but it's not technically confirmed that he won't.

 

[StarLight42]

After this direct...yeah. I think you guys need to give up on Geno. He's not happening.

Sakurai just deconfirmed Isaac, Skull Kid, Shadow, Spring Man, and Rex all in one direct, while confirming a ****ing Piranha Plant.

It's safe to say all the hype from the K. Rool direct has vanished.

 

[Iridium]

What's Kirby-Piranha Plant gonna look like, folks?

As in, what do you think will happen to Kirby's face? Or will a plant be added on top of his head instead.

 

[Green_Pikmin*]

Actually...did we get anything for that gun model Sakurai bought that thing for? Doesn't look to have been used for anything far as I can tell

Elma as DLC perhaps?

 

[Admiral Pit]

I guess it's time I bring my input.

-I don't care for Ken, so yea, sorry.
-I did say I'd accept Incineroar, and his display and moveset, as well as his posing is brilliant! I'd gladly be willing to try him out.
-All this on Spirits has me curious, and wonder what unique abilities from those things will be there.
-Seeing some characters I really am not fond of not getting in does make me positive. It sounds petty, but actually it's just not only cutting down them terrible leaks, but there's just other reasons I can't say.
-I have no ill will towards the plant. There's always that one strange character in Smash. From G&W in melee to ROB in Brawl to WFT in s4, and now we have this plant. So yea, no hatred here... (unless it actually becomes a broken top tier, but it doesn't look like the case).
-World of Light already interests me. I will do what I can to rescue Pit ASAP.

Positive overall, though sitting through the talk about online and such was kinda boring. The ending was definitely intense though.

Considering DLC is to happen with a few characters being on the way. my only interest and hope belongs to Medusa and Monster Hunter since Phosphora's placement as AT is a sealed fate.

 

[Luigi The President]

No. We will never quit on him. We will never give up on him until the day arrives. I dont care what SE says, we won't quit.

Im sorry but i just dont wanna give up.

As a Geno megafan it's time to give up
Call me a cynic but you're just gonna get your heart broken

 

[Michael the Spikester]

At this point I'm thinking the Square Enix Disney rep is Sora to commemorate Kingdom Hearts III. I expect he'll be announced at the Game Awards or Banjo-Kazooie in response to their 20th Anniversary, perhaps maybe even both.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Well... let's get started then.

https://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_spirits_(disambiguation) This page should be useful. Dixie Kong, Daroach, and Geno are all blown out of the way if this is the case. (among others)

Don't forget Magolor, a popular Japanese pick.

We should really call today Bloody Thursday, because this was a real massacre.

 

[KingofKoopas]

This is also a good point; until I see Sakurai say "I'm not going to promote Assist Trophies for DLC," I'm not done supporting Shadow either. Hell, Knuckles would be amazing too. I highly doubt he's going to promote any of them to playable, but it's not technically confirmed that he won't.

That is a good attitude to have, Besides whos to say he cant just replace them with new assist trophies!