Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Paperchampion23]

just to be sure there is this so call leak... but i say its a 99.98% fake View attachment 173256
View attachment 173257
View attachment 173258
only question is who is the purple character underneth kingKrool ?
https://twitter.com/bakufu1867/status/1056609533970276352?ref_src=twsrc^tfw and here is the link.

Lmao you REALIZE that that is a horrible knockoff of the real one right? It has Smashified renders and not nearly as good lol.

Unless you know that and are saying this leak is fake, then I agree lol

 

[Deleted member]

Aside from the fact that Waluigi's in there, I believe that most, if not all, of the new characters in that banner are the Smashified renders or generic artwork (like Maxwell from Scribblenauts, who's on the far left and next to Dr. Mario). The purple character is Shantae's Smashified render.

What makes the Grinch leak so controversial is that these character images haven't been seen before.

Where's Waluigi?

 

[Chaotix12345]

just to be sure there is this so call leak... but i say its a 99.98% fake View attachment 173256
View attachment 173257
View attachment 173258
only question is who is the purple character underneth kingKrool ?
https://twitter.com/bakufu1867/status/1056609533970276352?ref_src=twsrc^tfw and here is the link.

Banjo is straight up the Smashified artwork (for real this time), so I'm guessing that this was made in jest because of the Grinch leak. (Or someone REALLY didn't care to fool anyone.)

 

[Sigran101]

Mystic is claiming that Isaac, Ken, and Chorus Kids are likely playable, but one of the other banner characters is actually an assist trophy...
Also, he privated his Twitter

Did he change his stance on Geno? Last I read Mystic thought he was in too.

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

Mystic is claiming that Isaac, Ken, and Chorus Kids are likely playable, but one of the other banner characters is actually an assist trophy...
Also, he privated his Twitter

Good god if Shadow is still an Assist Trophy after all this time there will be hell to pay.

just to be sure there is this so call leak... but i say its a 99.98% fake View attachment 173256
View attachment 173257
View attachment 173258
only question is who is the purple character underneth kingKrool ?
https://twitter.com/bakufu1867/status/1056609533970276352?ref_src=twsrc^tfw and here is the link.

Seems this was unsurprisingly debunked already but you can clearly see Smashified Banjo-Kazooie on the left there lol. Into the trash.

 

[sdpdude9]

Also, it's possible that blank background was made in-house by the publishing company (using content aware filters) for the purposes of the set-up instructions because they didn't have one, which explains the inconsistencies that can't be explained away (see @Skyblade12's post on the Isaac thread).

More people should be talking about this. This badly damages the biggest point against the leak, which is the background inconsistencies. I feel like you have to stretching at this point to be confident it is fake.

 

[KingofKoopas]

apparently its smashified’s shantae render
View attachment 173259

SO if a Shantae Render comes to your restaurant and its not that one... It's Real.

 

[Tako Tuesday]

Not smash related, but thought I'd share
https://twitter.com/NintendoVS/status/1056878313808060417?s=20
New Splatoon special lookin fine

 

[The DanMan051]

Mainly Crash and Spyro, natch. Those are the big two contenders.

They're not Sony characters, though; they always had 3rd party owners and only happened to be exclusive to the PS1 during their debuts.

 

[IMainKingKRool]

Is that Chef Boyardee underneath Ganondorf? Must be a fake one then.

lmfao how did i miss that

 

[Pazzo.]

Look, my dude, it takes a bit of time to write some of this stuff haha
Besides what each article goes through, we don't get paid and a lot of the people involved have lives outside of SmashBoards journalism so sometimes things don't go up immediately.

Sincerely, someone who was heavily part of the item conversation when it was brought up.

Also good morning.

Look, my dude, it takes a bit of time to write some of this stuff haha
Besides what each article goes through, we don't get paid and a lot of the people involved have lives outside of SmashBoards journalism so sometimes things don't go up immediately.

Sincerely, someone who was heavily part of the item conversation when it was brought up.

Also good morning.

Don't worry about it. I used to write for "The Week in Review" back in the Pic of the Day times. If I had a dollar for every late article, I'd be able to buy a lot of rootbeer.

And a good morning to you.

 

[Waluigi is not getting in]

Leak review said the leak is real and that he's been told some things himself.

If its been brought up already oh the **** well, I'm a handful of minutes from going to class.

 

[Senselessbreak]

just to be sure there is this so call leak... but i say its a 99.98% fake only question is who is the purple character underneth kingKrool ?
https://twitter.com/bakufu1867/status/1056609533970276352?ref_src=twsrc^tfw and here is the link.

this isnt a leak but a recreation of the leak in attempt to show that the background doesnt change when snapping a photo of it. Also it shows how easy it is to pull off

 

[CannonStreak]

Not smash related, but thought I'd share
https://twitter.com/NintendoVS/status/1056878313808060417?s=20
New Splatoon special lookin fine

That should have been a weapon used by Inkling in Smash Ultimate, provided that the weapon existed before Ultimate was revealed.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I feel like that obviously fake leak everyone is hammering atm might have been done for demonstrative purposes rather than actually trying to fool us, hence why the setup is identical.

 

[Pakky]

After this week I think there's no more characters left of the blog.

Cuz what there are only like 4 left, right?

 

[Chrollo.]

A "half convincing leak" that was going to get addressed by Ubisoft themselves.

He's also a professional graphics designer, which makes him a perfect fit for analyzing visual leaks; and with how many people come to him asking for his take on every single one, it makes sense that he'd address ones that are catching on. Hence the Grinch leak, where he's been giving his own analysis and thoughts (though lessened a lot the past couple days due to people like you attacking/dismissing him as some nobody with an ego).

It’s because it spreaded it like wildfire. But in hindsight the leak wasn’t that convincing at all lol. The fact that the Rayman had literally no announcer was the biggest red flag. It’s a fake leak that’s a product of its time, but it has aged very badly.

And I’m not even dismissing Omni, I’m just saying he can act pretentious as **** towards these things. I appreciate his input and all and his credentials are legit but acting like he can’t be an asshole is kind of dumb.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

They're not Sony characters, though; they always had 3rd party owners and only happened to be exclusive to the PS1 during their debuts.

That is true. Thing is, beyond them we got just Lara, Dante, Sora and maybe Heihachi and a MK character (most of those aren't strictly Sony characters, but you get the picture). Everybody else is more or less dead.

 

[CallMeKnux]

Call me stubborn, call me in denial, but the whole thing with Mystic hasn't changed my opinion, I still think the banner is real and we're getting all 7 characters. Absolutely no clue what's gonna happen to Incineroar tho. I feel bad for his fans.

 

[shaggypatriot12]

Finally some really fun high level Snake gameplay! Honestly this has me more excited than the leak rn since we’re pretty much just waiting for official word at this point: enjoy!

https://youtu.be/vzDRkYLFw3c

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

this isnt a leak but a recreation of the leak in attempt to show that the background doesnt change when snapping a photo of it. Also it shows how easy it is to pull off

Not exactly, they slipped all the new characters into empty spots. Grinch leak actually moves pre-existing characters to new places they weren't in before while revealing unseen bits like Greninja's tongue and Roy's foot.

 

[Pyra]

insiders think it's real
insiders think it's fake
i'm gonna take SmashBoards
and toss it in a lake

 

[TheBlue10]

Haven't been on since yesterday so I don't know if anyone has seen this, but.

A Nintendo emplyee was spotted at the London Comic-Con in the Nintendo booth to carry a Grinch poster. I don't think it's more evidence pointing to the leak being real, but just thought it was funny.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Did he change his stance on Geno? Last I read Mystic thought he was in too.

He's currently unsure of him...

 

[Chrollo.]

Call me stubborn, call me in denial, but the whole thing with Mystic hasn't changed my opinion, I still think the banner is real and we're getting all 7 characters. Absolutely no clue what's gonna happen to Incineroar tho. I feel bad for his fans.

Incineroar will be a tag team fighter with Shadow

 

[Curious Villager]

Gotta admit, I don't understand The Pokemon Company's timeline right now.

Like gen 8 is coming out next year, and so that means usually that around Feb-March we will start to see trailers, specifically the first starters. Does the anime normally go up into the next gen release? Because I feel like things like that, as well as Incineroar would be lost in excitement for the new gen.

I mean after all, the goal of marketing one of their characters would be to sell the game it's from and that's a hard sell when they are also advertising their next upcoming game. It's totally possible, but i think it would be silly of The Pokemon Company. Incineroar definitly feels like a base or bust kind of character *shrug*

If I recall correctly, Greninja didn't really get marketed until around the end of gen 6. If they still have plans for Incineroar for next year such as a major boost in prominence in the anime because Ash's Torracat evolved into Incineroar and plays a major role and gets an ability that they will include in the next games, then I can kinda see it being DLC for next year too in order to tie in to that. But that's really the only reason I can see it being DLC. Otherwise, it would make more sense for a gen 8 Pokemon to be DLC for next year in order to help hype up gen 8 and whatnot.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

After this week I think there's no more characters left of the blog.

Cuz what there are only like 4 left, right?

Both the blog AND FlintOfMother3 (who's drawing the Inktober stuff I found) are running out of characters. When that happens, it'll be chaos.

 

[Kuon]

I wouldn’t call Omni an insider. He’s just some random dude that got clout off of one half convincing fake leak and now thinks he’s the be all end all of all fake leaks. He has no inside information whatsoever he just hates the possibility of being wrong.

As for anybody attacking Papagenos that’s just ridiculous. If you feel that he’s wrong then contact him yourself and share info. He doesn’t need to be harassed.

And I’m surprised it took Verge this long to completely flip ****

Yeah, I'm really starting to dislike Vergeben, not because of the Grinch leak, but because of his language and how rude he can be in his posts. There's no need for him to act like that. And I have nothing against Omni, but he sounds like he's a bit smug and maybe a little cocky too (maybe). PapaGenos is still great though. He's one of the only people with "inside info" that has been level-headed this whole time and hasn't flipped.

 

[Mellowy Yellow]

He's currently unsure of him...

Oh JOY, time to have my dreams crushed again by reliable source people

 

[Paperchampion23]

Also, it's possible that blank background was made in-house by the publishing company (using content aware filters) for the purposes of the set-up instructions because they didn't have one, which explains the inconsistencies that can't be explained away (see @Skyblade12's post on the Isaac thread).

Yes, the anime usually goes all the way up to the next gen.

I think that ship has already sailed for putting a character in to promote the game they're from (it'd have to be a Gen VIII Pokémon, but it's too early for that).

Putting in a character as DLC to promote their grand entrance in the anime as the main character's ringer, though, that makes sense. (This is actually somewhat similar to the inclusion of Greninja in Smash 4, and the choice to have Charizard on his own, though those two things probably happened because of Sakurai, not the other way around.)

That post in the Isaac thread was amazing. I'm gonna quote it here because it needs to be read by any pro-fake person:

So, I've been thinking about the Grinch leak for a while, and I'd like to break down and analyze some of it.

First, though, I would like to cut down on some of the flaws of the pro-Grinch argument:


We don't know that this is true. There is, as yet, no confirmation that this company contracts with either Bandai-Namco or Universal Studios, let alone both. While the company he worked for a year ago did contract with Bandai-Namco, the one he currently works for may or may not. Also, this argument fails to consider that Bandai-Namco would not be handling publicity, Nintendo would, since they are the publisher.



Now, as we get to the rest of it, we need to approach the leak logically. Following Occam's Razor, let's simplify things as much as possible. What must be faked in order to pull of this leak?

The answer is actually ridiculously simple. The only thing that needs to be faked is the Super Smash Bros. Ultimate material. Everything else can be genuine. The leak could actually have been created by someone who works for a publicity company and makes these sorts of promotional materials. The material for The Grinch could all be genuine, as could his work history with the company. As the meme says "anyone can make a fake leak". Even a publicist. There does not need to be any identity theft or identity fraud for this to be faked. Not even the Snapchat aspect of it was necessarily faked. It could have been something that he sent a friend via Snapchat, never meaning for it to go further and his name to be revealed (though that would mean all of this was created to fool one or two people, which does seem rather farfetched).


The only things that needed to be faked were the actual Super Smash Bros. Ultimate materials. So, let's look at them for a second.

View attachment 172845

This is the image that has received the most attention, specifically the multi panel image in the middle. This image, apparently depicting a version of the Battlefield background used in the Mural but with the characters removed, has been reviewed in detail by a number of artists and digital arts enthusiasts, most notably ArtsyOmni, whose video on the subject can be found here.

I, however, am not an enthusiast or expert in digital art manipulation, nor of artistic techniques or analysis. So I will leave that to those who are.

Instead, I will focus on other, less analyzed aspects of the leaked materials, which I do have experience with.


Beneath the "LOL" emoji is what appears to be a set of display instructions for a circular hanging display. The display would contain the mural, wrapped into a circle (taking advantage of the fact that the mural's edges merge seamlessly), and suspended from four lines that converge at a single hanging point. This makes it clear that this is a display to be hung from the ceiling, and that the mural image would go on the outside of it.

Now, here is where things get interesting. It has been pointed out by some that the Mural image on this hanging display is not properly scaled, and that the mural would not fit on the display as shown. Whomever has made such an argument is an individual whom I can only assume has never had to set up a retail display, or at least, never actually looked at the instructions for doing so. Because, as someone who has set up dozens, and reviewed the instructions for probably hundreds over the course of seven years work in retail, I can assure you that the instructions for those displays are NEVER properly scaled. Or properly clipped. Or properly angled. Or properly sized. Or properly representative of the space you actually HAVE on a display to put the items they're telling you will fit there. Or-

Ahem. Apologies. Anyway, the point is, the instruction pages that come with display materials are designed to show you how to assemble them, how to display them, and what to put where. They are never artistically accurate. Literally, NEVER. The only ones I have seen which are accurate in terms of visuals are ones which are simply pictures taken of already assembled displays (which are inferior for the purposes of showing how to assemble such displays to the simple line drawings with cutouts).

The reasoning for the art being off is actually very simple: It's nothing but a placeholder, and its only purpose is to convey to you what side should face out, or to help confirm which piece you're looking for. Frequently (though not always), if the item being displayed is a book, magazine, or game (anything with a definitive "front") the picture will be skipped entirely, and instead replaced with a simple display of the title in block text. The images which do show up are usually minimal effort. Low quality images, taken from a camera, badly shoved into place, and then clipped to fit the block lines. Sometimes they will be perspective shifted to match the angle of the display. Sometimes not. Sometimes they'll be perspective shifted to NOT match at all (which can be really infuriating to see from someone with mild OCD about clean displays).

Scrolling down, we then see the three panel display. It has been said that these are for a light box display, and that would explain the low quality and color shifting of the art. I do not disagree or argue the point that a light box display would need to be altered in such a way. From personal experience, it would, though I cannot say what the result would be. However, I would argue that the image in question is simply too small to be used effectively for such a purpose. The light box displays I've worked with in the past are frequently quite large, and this one is roughly the size of a single sheet of paper for a three panel display. No. In actuality, this is another page of display instructions. While it is probably display instructions for such a light box, its purpose is merely to highlight which panel goes in which part of the display, to assure that the panels are in order and properly displayed.

And before you ask, the answer is yes. Such instructions do indeed assume that you are a moron who cannot tell which parts of a continuous display image go where just from looking at them.

Below that, we have further block diagrams, including some empty boxes which could be filled with instructions, more photos, or information specific to a particular store or outlet as this material is distributed.

So this entire image is actually a picture of display instructions for promotional material, rather than promotional material itself. It is likely a picture of a picture of promotional items, both taken with poor cameras, and neither intended to be professional quality.

View attachment 172856

This image, on the other hand, which I have yet to see be artistically analyzed at all, is itself promotional material.

It's a packaged display of a circular item. It appears to be a wristband, due to both the size and the taper at the end. You can also see a faint outline of those same hanging instructions in this image, above the wristband, that looks as though it's being shown through a blank sheet of paper. The wristband appears very professionally produced, with properly scaled images placed correctly on the wristband.




So, after reviewing these images, the only conclusion I can come to is that this is 100% genuine. Artistic anomalies in the instructions are expected. In fact, I would be honestly shocked if they were not there. This gentleman's role in the company likely includes either review of materials, or assembly of the instructions themselves. The images used were likely taken by a worker at this company (if not the gentleman in question), on a low quality camera, and jumbled and edited into place to fit the lines and serve their bare purpose of being a placeholder (they were almost assuredly NOT provided by Nintendo). Any artistic analysis of those pieces is utterly irrelevant to the validity of the leak.

@papagenos @Billybae10K - This might be something you guys would want to review.

This should solve most issues with the background. He even gives points to the fake side but still comes to conclusion that it's real for obvious reasons if you read it

 

[DutchPichu]

I'm so scared the leak is fake and the Chorus Kids will never get their chance again... they will never be DLC. Never. ever. So if they are not base... I have a feeling this may be the last Smash game in a long time.

 

[Heartz♥]

just to be sure there is this so call leak... but i say its a 99.98% fake View attachment 173256
View attachment 173257
View attachment 173258
only question is who is the purple character underneth kingKrool ?
https://twitter.com/bakufu1867/status/1056609533970276352?ref_src=twsrc^tfw and here is the link.

It's blurry so it's probably real.

 

[CrunchyCHEEZIT]

I feel like that obviously fake leak everyone is hammering atm might have been done for demonstrative purposes rather than actually trying to fool us, hence why the setup is identical.

what is it trying to demonstrate? that anyone can edit an image, print it out on a strip and take a blurry picture of it? because, I mean, thats true but it would've been more of a "oh yeah" point if he didn't use existing renders, unlike the actual image everyone is talking about lmao

 

[Electrick_EEL]

Just woke up. What is going on?

 

[BrytonJ]

insiders think it's real
insiders think it's fake
i'm gonna take SmashBoards
and toss it in a lake

I don't want no more of smash bros life! Hey mom, I wanna go hooooome!

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

So here's a question. Let's say Incineroar gets revealed next and the banner is confirmed fake when the person who made it steps forward. Not everyone, but a few insiders think there could be a few characters on the banner who are actually in Smash.

Who would these characters be and why?

Ken duh...

Gotta say, I'm not even an Isaac fan (at most, I like how Robin plays so I'm hoping Isaac is simialr without tome limits and not nearly as slow) but that item leak from the Wendy's trailer made everything way more exciting. Like arguably he had stuff going for him, then the Grinch leak happened and then that! I'm definitely rooting for him.

(PS he's not in my predictions though because I created that before the Grinch leak dropped. I feel like that's cheating for me to change it now )

After this week I think there's no more characters left of the blog.

Cuz what there are only like 4 left, right?

There's like 13 or so left. Between them and possibly anywhere from 3-8 (lol) newcomers left we have plenty of enough characters for blog updates up until release.

 

[VGPhaze]

I'm all but certain that CHADondorf and the Grinch are unrelated, especially if the Grinch is real.

There were soooo many text based leaks. One of them was going to line up with the real one (or the super intricate fake one). A million monkeys with computers will eventually type the works of shakespear... And the complete smash ultimate roster. If some other text leak had written the same roster, with or without "cuts", we'd be having the same conversation about it anyway.

 

[Heracr055]

Is that Chef Boyardee underneath Ganondorf? Must be a fake one then.

Darn it, you made me want some canned ravioli now
I can put a serious dent in the big can

 

[Artorias]

I'm all but certain that CHADondorf and the Grinch are unrelated, especially if the Grinch is real.

There were soooo many text based leaks. One of them was going to line up with the real one (or the super intricate fake one). A million monkeys with computers will eventually type the works of shakespear... And the complete smash ultimate roster. If some other text leak had written the same roster, with or without "cuts", we'd be having the same conversation about it anyway.

Or consider this, in the case it's true:
-Guy with knowledge of the final roster actually does a text post of the roster
-A different guy that didnt' even know about this other guy existance leaks the mural, both leaks being completely unrelated

 

[Tako Tuesday]

Finally some really fun high level Snake gameplay! Honestly this has me more excited than the leak rn since we’re pretty much just waiting for official word at this point: enjoy!

https://youtu.be/vzDRkYLFw3c

Snake sure is looking S O L I D