Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Opossum]

And Pyra is certainly not the character that is going to most offend the average conservative parent.

I...think you're vastly underestimating the average conservative parent.

 

[-crump-]

Apart of me wants to keep it only japanese.

But apart of me wants to believe western characters was kept out so it could be a big deal this time around

I mean, we already have Diddy Kong, who was created by a Western studio. Obviously, he’s a huge outlier, but there is a tiny bit of precedence there.

As far as the topic of Pyra goes... I’m gonna be honest, I find her design incredibly off putting. For me, there’s a difference between “attractive female character” and “blatant pandering”, and Pyra (as well as other character designs from XC2) cross that line way too far imo.

 

[mario123007]

I think every time I post a moveset, it gets buried in this overdone Mythra Pyra censorship discussion. I understand the concerns, but it's coming up constantly now. We get it, Pyra is skimpy. They might need to lengthen her shorts or something. She will still be the same character no matter what happens, it isn't the end of the world.

Yeah, I don't think I was the one who started it though... Since personally I don't really care if she gets tweaks if she is in Smash Bros Switch. I just think using Smash 4 censorship and consider Smash Bros Switch will do the same thing may sound legit, but looking how nearly all Nintendo Switch games aren't getting unnecessary censored, just made me doubt about it.

I personally couldn't be happier if she got into Smash unchanged, but if Tharja's outfit was too risque, I can imagine Pyra will need just a little bit more covering her up. Not to mention female Corrin's outfit getting censored as well just for showing some thigh.

I already said it, Tharja wasn't even the final build, and we know she's there because of Ernst leak.
Cortina though, fair point but that's after the rating is set stone.
And yeah, broken record me I know, but unlike Wii U/3DS,Nintendo Switch games (and Nintendo games to some degree aren't getting unnecessary censorship, or Nintendo intentionally tone down their game's rating)

But hey if Pyra is too skimpy, then I guess other Blades like KOS-MOS, Zenobia, Newt, Brighid, Praxis, Dahlia, Kora. .
And even Electra, Adenine, Pandoria, Azami, and Theory are getting tweaks if they are in Smash whether being a part of Rex’s Blade or trophy... Or assist trophy...
Perhaps safe bets are Dagas, Godfrey, Agate, Aegeon, Perceval, Boreas,

That makes me coming up a good Idea.. .. Wouldn't it be awesome if Core Crystals are new assist items like Pokéballs and assist trophy? Mostly you will get different common blades but chances are you might get rare Blades to help you, just like in the game. I can go even further, the can actually use that characters blade weapon, and the Blade won't disappear until either the character releases the Blade or gets KOed.

 

[Starcutter]

I...think you're vastly underestimating the average conservative parent.

I remember seeing a review on Amazon for Pokken that apparently a mother won't let their child play the game because Blaziken's crotch feathers resembled a ****.

So if that's enough, I'm sure a half-naked teenager will be fiiiiiiine.

 

[Opossum]

I remember seeing a review on Amazon for Pokken that apparently a mother won't let their child play the game because Blaziken's crotch feathers resembled a ****.

So if that's enough, I'm sure a half-naked teenager will be fiiiiiiine.

Well I mean Blaziken IS a literal ****, after all.

 

[Pakky]

Why is Goku seen as likely now in all these videos?

When did he stop being a manga character?

 

[Deleted member]

If I wasn't before, consider me sold on on the character~

View attachment 139107

Well great.... now I want Labo guy in Smash for Switch. Make him top tier so I can main him.

I drew up a Mipha moveset as she's my most wanted character that I consider "Realistic"

MIPHA, ZORA CHAMPION

Spoiler

View attachment 139114​

The Zora Champion from Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild brings her skills to Smash Bros for the Nintendo Switch. Mipha fights with her Lightscale Trident and also bears Water themed abilities, as well as her signature ability, Mipha's Grace. While mostly known for her healing, thanks to being under the training of Seggin, Mipha's spearmanship is considered largely unrivalled.

Some of Mipha's attacks have sweetspots/sourspots, but the zones for each are much more prominent than that of Marth, as the entire trident head is bladed.

In regards to size, weight, and speed, Mipha is a short character, as seen in Breath of the Wild, standing a full head shorter than Zelda. She is very lightweight, falling into the "featherweight" category of KuroganeHammer's weight chart, as she doesn't wear really any armor and has a very slender body. However to compliment her small size and low weight, she is extremely quick, nimble, and graceful in her movements.

Jab: A two-hit jab. Mipha first strikes with the pommel of her trident, and then follows up with a thrust from the tip of the trident.

Forward Tilt: Mipha quickly thrusts forward with her trident. Slightly longer tange than jab's second hit.

Down Tilt: Mipha sweeps the feet of her opponents with her trident

Up Tilt: Mipha take an overhead swing, starting from her front side moving to her back side.

Dash Attack: Mipha kicks up a small wave, surfing forward and leading with her trident.

Neutral Air: Mipha twirls her trident around each side hitting enemies around her

Fair: Mipha takes two quick jabs forward with her trident

Back Air: Mipha winds up and takes a heavy poke behind her. Has a little bit of start up.

Up Air: Mipha flips, kicking above her

Down Air: Mipha flips and swings her trident below her in an arc. Has some startup, but also has a meteor smash on the trident's sweetspot.

Forward Smash: A two hit smash attack, second hit being optional like Link's. Mipha gives a short-range, heavy thrust which has minimal knockback and does high damage, and a good amount of hit stun. Second hit, Mipha swings the trident horizontally to knock opponents away.

Up Smash: Mipha thrusts above her, also catching opponents immediately in front of her. Hard to land, but is extremely rewarding.

Down Smash: Mipha quickly thrusts in front and the feet, and then behind. Low knockback, but very quick.

Neutral Special: Wave- Mipha swings her trident fron the ground up, kicking up a wave of water that travels a moderate distance at a slow pace.

Up Special: Waterfall Swim- Mipha creates and swims up a waterfall, as is seen in Champions Ballad cutscene. Other Zoras have this ability, and Link can also do it when he wears the Zora Armor in BotW.

Side Special: Skewer- Mipha thrusts her spear a short distance in front of her. This ability is a command grab, and allows Mipha to throw her opponent either forward or behind her and attempt to follow up. If Mipha attempts to use this ability again within one second and it lands, it will just do small damage and not grab again, just like Smash 4 grab mechanics. *If you have ever played For Honor, the Gladiator hero has an ability like this if you want to see what it would generally look like.

Down Special: Mipha's Grace- A chargeable ability that heals Mipha, similarly to Wii Fit Trainer's deep breathing. The move temporarily makes Mipha harder to knock back as well.

Grab: Mipha holds her trident behind her with one hand, and grabs the oppoenent with the free hand.

Forward throw: Mipha fiercly jabs the opponent with the pommel of her trident.

Up Throw: Mipha uses her trident to loft the opponent upward.

Down Throw: Mipha sticks her trident into her opponent and forces them into the ground in one quick motion.

Final Smash: Divine Beasts- The other Champions make an appearance with their Divine Beasts, and Mipha appears on Va Ruta. All four shoot their red beam at the stage, causing high damage an knockback to those caught in the blast.

EDIT: Added Size, Weight, and Speed rough estimates.

EDIT2: Added the aerials that I somehow overlooked.

Good move-set! I think we need a trident aquatic character in Smash Brothers now.

I personally couldn't be happier if she got into Smash unchanged

You and I are friends. I really do not want Pyra changed, but she is going to get changed either way.

If Tharja's outfit was too risque, I can imagine Pyra will need just a little bit more covering her up. Not to mention female Corrin's outfit getting censored as well just for showing some thigh.

This was an unedited shot of the cutscene where Rex meets Pyra. Not even an hour into the game and she practically looks naked from the hips-down.

Spoiler

Usually that kind of thing doesn't show up until the 20-hour mark! Nyuck nyuck nyuck!

I think the censorship will not be that bad. Make her armor longer probably to expose less skin, and make her shorts long so her crack is not too exposed. If they did not censor him, than a dream come true.

 

[mario123007]

As far as the topic of Pyra goes... I’m gonna be honest, I find her design incredibly off putting. For me, there’s a difference between “attractive female character” and “blatant pandering”, and Pyra (as well as other character designs from XC2) cross that line way too far for me.

Well, you're not wrong when it comes, and I'd that's your opinion I have no comment.
But on the other hand, you might really need to check the initial plot of XC2, because you just might look at their designs way too overboard. Not to mention XC2 is a JRPG and T rated game, so... That is that.
Then again, don't use your personal off-putting on Pyra and wishes she gets tweaked...

I...think you're vastly underestimating the average conservative parent.

Maybe, but more often than not, we should for the best.
Conservative parents won't benefit the gaming community as a whole...so it is best to against their view on gaming... In my opinion.

 

[Starcutter]

Why is Goku seen as likely now in all these videos?

When did he stop being a manga character?

When people played FighterZ and had fun or something.

Idk.


(But FighterZ is a ton of fun, I can't fault them there)

 

[Pakky]

Also, why do all these people making these videos ignore Springman in favor of every other ARMS character?

 

[ErenJager]

Why is Goku seen as likely now in all these videos?

When did he stop being a manga character?

Dragon Ball Fighterz changed the opinions of the world.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Why is Goku seen as likely now in all these videos?

When did he stop being a manga character?

I honestly think it started as a meme, but when the age group that actively makes YouTube videos featuring Smash predictions heard it, they get taken over by "muh childhood" and don't know the criteria to be considered for the game. Basically it's a mixture of being uninformed and dumb nostalgia.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I personally couldn't be happier if she got into Smash unchanged, but if Tharja's outfit was too risque, I can imagine Pyra will need just a little bit more covering her up. Not to mention female Corrin's outfit getting censored as well just for showing some thigh.

That image alone pretty much warrants censoring for Pyra.

 

[Deleted member]

Why is Goku seen as likely now in all these videos?

When did he stop being a manga character?

I think part of it has to do with Namco possibly returning to develop Smash for Switch and them having the Dragon Ball game license (as seen with games like Xenoverse and DBFZ). That, and some people don't know Sakurai's stance on non-video game characters.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Maybe, but more often than not, we should for the best.
Conservative parents won't benefit the gaming community as a whole...so it is best to against their view on gaming... In my opinion.

Ugh I'm finally giving my two-cents on this.

By doing that you're alienating many children from the game. Parents are going to make the final decision, and parents who DON'T care about Pyra being covered up will buy the game for their kids regardless. I think that from a marketing standpoint, it'd be a mistake. Slightly upsetting someone because Pyra is slightly less skimpy is going to hurt sales significantly less than leaving her uncovered and making more conservative parents unwilling to buy the game for their kids.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I...think you're vastly underestimating the average conservative parent.

Most parents should try to at least have some understanding of what their kids are doing, to some extent. Idk if ZSS, Bayonetta and such would be worse or better than Pyra though in terms of being too uhh revealing i suppose.

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

Ugh I'm finally giving my two-cents on this.

By doing that you're alienating many children from the game. Parents are going to make the final decision, and parents who DON'T care about Pyra being covered up will buy the game for their kids regardless. I think that from a marketing standpoint, it'd be a mistake. Slightly upsetting someone because Pyra is slightly less skimpy is going to hurt sales significantly less than leaving her uncovered and making more conservative parents unwilling to buy the game for their kids.

This introduces another problem though. Where's the line exactly?

I don't exactly think conservative parent were happy with Bayonetta being in smash. Regardless of how many changes were made to Bayonetta, she is still a sexual character. If she was added back into smash 5 then what happens?

And like that one user said, a parent wouldn't let their child play pokken because of Blaziken so clearly their standards are kinda ridiculous.

 

[mario123007]

Also, why do all these people making these videos ignore Springman in favor of every other ARMS character?

Maybe, people are just tired of main character being the game.
And there are other interesting fighters than just Spring Man.

That image alone pretty much warrants censoring for Pyra.

Nope, not at all, even if it personally disturbs you, if Smash Bros Switch still maintain that characters don't should their back regardless of direction.
Then again, I can see some tweaks on her back, but not a huge unnecessary censoring.

Ugh I'm finally giving my two-cents on this.

By doing that you're alienating many children from the game. Parents are going to make the final decision, and parents who DON'T care about Pyra being covered up will buy the game for their kids regardless. I think that from a marketing standpoint, it'd be a mistake. Slightly upsetting someone because Pyra is slightly less skimpy is going to hurt sales significantly less than leaving her uncovered and making more conservative parents unwilling to buy the game for their kids.

Sorry if I sound a bit of edgy... But it is the gamers like us who have our own choice of picking games are the majority that buys Smash Bros Switch the most. Not to mention the Switch user base age average is mostly gamers that are between 19-34.
And yeah, remember there is official stat of that here:

This isn't like Wii U where a few people own the console, and not 3DS where yes, a lot of kids own that system.
So, I personally think you give children way too many credit when it comes to hurting sales.
So, just say you personally don't like Pyra's design... But even that isn't a strong argument that she should get a huge censored, minor, hey I agree though.

Edit: okay I need to stop... Like really... Because this discussion is like getting into a bad loop hole, and that's not good.

 

[Pakky]

Every passing day Steve feels more likely though

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

This introduces another problem though. Where's the line exactly?

I don't exactly think conservative parent were happy with Bayonetta being in smash. Regardless of how many changes were made to Bayonetta, she is still a sexual character. If she was added back into smash 5 then what happens?

And like that one user said, a parent wouldn't let their child play pokken because of Blaziken so clearly their standards are kinda ridiculous.

Yeah, standards are ridiculous, but you can at least save some sales with a little censorship. And Bayonetta was DLC, so parents did not have to buy her. You could play the entire game without Bayonetta ever appearing.

EDIT: And trust me, I'm the child of a VERY conservative mother. A little bit of censorship can go a LONG way.

 

[-crump-]

Most parents should try to at least have some understanding of what their kids are doing, to some extent. Idk if ZSS, Bayonetta and such would be worse or better than Pyra though in terms of being too uhh revealing i suppose.

Bayo is about as risqué as they get. If I was a parent who didn’t know a whole lot about video games, I would probably be a little bit concerned if I saw my child playing the new video game I bought them and there was a British, gun-toting dominatrix on screen beating up Green Mario and Sammy the Hedgehead

..And even if I was up to date on all the characters and the games they were from, I probably wouldn’t want my fictional young child playing as Bayo or an uncensored Pyra. I realize you can’t protect them forever from sexualized media, but at the same time I can see where some modest parents are coming from.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Bayonetta is a bit more censored if I recall from her games than in smash so if I had a 5 year old I'd let them play smash but even then I would question if I would let them play Bayonetta at that young age. If they were like 10-13 maybe I'd let them depending if I thought they were mature enough.

 

[Mr. Mumbles]

That is probably why they want Sans and not the playable character. It is the player character that chooses between violence and pacifism, which would be a pretty hard mechanic to put in a fighting game, as you said. Sans would not be limited by this.

Not to say I want or expect an Undertale character though.

All this Undertale speculation, and no love for Undyne? Granted she's not as known as Sans or Papyrus, but she is the most prone to voilence, and she could do some cool spear attacks.

Idk though. I guess it depends on which characters are the most popular in Japan because if Undertale were repped that'd be why.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

This isn't like Wii U where a few people own the console, and not 3DS where yes, a lot of kids own that system.
So, I personally think you give children way too many credit when it comes to hurting sales.
So, just say you personally don't like Pyra's design... But even that isn't a strong argument that she should get a huge censored, minor, hey I agree though.

You're putting words in my mouth lol. I'm trying to find a compromise for strict parents so everyone can play the damn game because I don't want to alienate the poor children who have parents like mine. Never once did I state my personal feelings towards her design, because those aren't important for this discussion.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Most parents should try to at least have some understanding of what their kids are doing, to some extent. Idk if ZSS, Bayonetta and such would be worse or better than Pyra though in terms of being too uhh revealing i suppose.

"Should" and "will" are two very different things


As for Bayonetta, the nice thing was that she was DLC. I remember quite a few people not being allowed to buy her as DLC because of her parents according to stories on here or reddit.

 

[Deleted member]

That is probably why they want Sans and not the playable character. It is the player character that chooses between violence and pacifism, which would be a pretty hard mechanic to put in a fighting game, as you said. Sans would not be limited by this.

Not to say I want or expect an Undertale character though.

That and Sans is arguably the face of the game at this point.

Much like people want Solaire of Astora more than the Chosen Undead when it comes to Dark Souls.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Can this damn censorship discussion end now? There's a million other things to talk about, and this has been rehashed like 6 times in the last week. This discussion is making me want to have a list of banned topics for this thread, which is something I never thought I'd want.

Can we talk about everyone's favorite pokemon and how they'd be cool as a Pokeball or something?

 

[ErenJager]

Pyra has thong armor.

Tharja smash trophy.

Thongs are always deal breakers boys.

 

[Deleted member]

You're putting words in my mouth lol. I'm trying to find a compromise for strict parents so everyone can play the damn game because I don't want to alienate the poor children who have parents like mine. Never once did I state my personal feelings towards her design, because those aren't important for this discussion.

Just ignore him. He get really bad when it comes to this subject.

 

[Opossum]

Honestly I find the viewpoint that Pyra being censored would somehow ruin her to be more questionable than anything else...

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

You're putting words in my mouth lol. I'm trying to find a compromise for strict parents so everyone can play the damn game because I don't want to alienate the poor children who have parents like mine. Never once did I state my personal feelings towards her design, because those aren't important for this discussion.

Please. Please stop. Everyone, literally everyone but him is on your side here.

 

[Opossum]

Can this damn censorship discussion end now? There's a million other things to talk about, and this has been rehashed like 6 times in the last week. This discussion is making me want to have a list of banned topics for this thread, which is something I never thought I'd want.

Can we talk about everyone's favorite pokemon and how they'd be cool as a Pokeball or something?

Klefki would use Fairy Lock, and any opponent standing on the stage gets an ethereal lock over them, preventing them from jumping for a limited time.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Nope, not at all, even if it personally disturbs you, if Smash Bros Switch still maintain that characters don't should their back regardless of direction.
Then again, I can see some tweaks on her back, but not a huge unnecessary censoring.

I get that you don't want any censoring to occur, but there's a bigger picture that has to be kept in mind. I don't want to argue about this matter any further, so I'll just state that if Smash Switch wants an E10+ rating, and Pyra is in the game, then her wardrobe will have to be adjusted so that less skin is exposed.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Can this damn censorship discussion end now? There's a million other things to talk about, and this has been rehashed like 6 times in the last week. This discussion is making me want to have a list of banned topics for this thread, which is something I never thought I'd want.

Can we talk about everyone's favorite pokemon and how they'd be cool as a Pokeball or something?

"We're banning discussion on Ridley, whether Captain Toad can jump, and Pyra"

*1 week later*

"we''re closing down the site because no one is talking anymore"




As for a random point of discussion because I have literally nothing else. Have we ever had a character that floats significantly above the platform when standing? Rosalina and Bowser Jr float a little, but just above the ground. Do you think any character that would be forced to float higher because of a smaller size would be a problem? Or do you think they would have an inaccurate hitbox just hanging under them?

 

[?????????????]

Can this damn censorship discussion end now? There's a million other things to talk about, and this has been rehashed like 6 times in the last week. This discussion is making me want to have a list of banned topics for this thread, which is something I never thought I'd want.

Can we talk about everyone's favorite pokemon and how they'd be cool as a Pokeball or something?

My favorite Pokemon is Sceptile. I think it would be a straightforward striker Pokeball Pokemon, like an aggressive Assist Trophy. It would rush to and track down opponents, combo hitting them with Leaf Blades.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Can we talk about everyone's favorite pokemon and how they'd be cool as a Pokeball or something?

I think it'd be cool for some Ultra Beasts to make it in as Poke Ball summons, assuming they don't make it in as playable.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Please. Please stop. Everyone, literally everyone but him is on your side here.

Regardless of who is on which side, the conversation about it hasn't stopped for a week and I'd like it to disappear. There's no more to discuss about it and -someone- needs to make him get that.

 

[mario123007]

And trust me, I'm the child of a VERY conservative mother. A little bit of censorship can go a LONG way.

I from Asia so, I have conservative parents lol, and especially my father.. .

You're putting words in my mouth lol. I'm trying to find a compromise for strict parents so everyone can play the damn game because I don't want to alienate the poor children who have parents like mine. Never once did I state my personal feelings towards her design, because those aren't important for this discussion.

If you think that way then, look that's not my intention I was putting up others who have that mindset (not gonna say who they are)
You're situation and reason is very legit, no doubt about it, but you have to think objectively sometimes. And yes, I actually should too, so that's why I said this discussion should stop because both sides are being too objective ...

Just ignore him. He get really bad when it comes to this subject.

Ignoring someone who has contrary opinion isn't a good way to settle this in my opinion.
Also I'm bad at this eh? Explain.

Honestly I find the viewpoint that Pyra being censored would somehow ruin her to be more questionable than anything else...

I... Hey, you are kind of right...
*insert thinking emoji*

I get that you don't want any censoring to occur, but there's a bigger picture that has to be kept in mind. I don't want to argue about this matter any further, so I'll just state that if Smash Switch wants an E10+ rating, and Pyra is in the game, then her wardrobe will have to be adjusted so that less skin is exposed.

I just wanna say the same thing like you just said to you, look at a bigger picture... Censoring is not always necessary.

 

[Opossum]

"We're banning discussion on Ridley, whether Captain Toad can jump, and Pyra"

*1 week later*

"we''re closing down the site because no one is talking anymore"




As for a random point of discussion because I have literally nothing else. Have we ever had a character that floats significantly above the platform when standing? Rosalina and Bowser Jr float a little, but just above the ground. Do you think any character that would be forced to float higher because of a smaller size would be a problem? Or do you think they would have an inaccurate hitbox just hanging under them?

Inaccurate hitboxes from enemy down tilts and the like might pose an issue, as Sakurai said he doesn't like deceptive hit boxes.

...Ignore Marth's Melee grab and Snake's tilts, please.

 

[Gestahl]

It would be nice if you could decide which pokemons should be in the pokeballs or/and the rate of them. Same with the trophys. Or what do you think? Maybe already discussed.