Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Luminario]

The Nindies event in Tuesday think we'll see Obolets, Tunic, Shovel Knight: King of Cards. Not sure of any indie characters for Smash though!

There's also the Switch physical release for Shantae Half Genie Hero, alongside the Pirate's Curse port. I don't think it's the best time for any Smash news though, these Nindies need their spotlight.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Smash isn't going to be at the Nindie event. It monopolizes the spotlight even when in a normal Direct, they're not going to subject low-profile indies to the attention vacuum that is Smash. :/

I do hope we get Tunic at the event though, that game looks beautiful~

I dunno about that necessarily. People are craving information now and Nintendo has such limited time before the game releases. I get that it would draw attention from the focus of the Direct, but I can't say it's impossible Nintendo takes this opportunity to at least tease a little something. I went through and looked to see how many Direct opportunities come before the game's latest possible release, and we're really only looking at E3 + maybe 2 Directs. While I'm not necessarily expecting something at the Nindies Showcase, but I also think it's possible they take every opportunity they have leading up to release day.

 

[FanCWaiter]

Well him, Baby Luma (the cream colored one that helps Mario), and Lubba at least

I LOVE LUBBA!

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Agreed

That isn't good enough for Luma to be their own character. It'd be like having Popo and Nana separated. That's a no-no.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Agreed

Why are you contradicting your own point?

Getting some very mixed messages here

 

[N3ON]

I dunno about that necessarily. People are craving information now and Nintendo has such limited time before the game releases. I get that it would draw attention from the focus of the Direct, but I can't say it's impossible Nintendo takes this opportunity to at least tease a little something. I went through and looked to see how many Direct opportunities come before the game's latest possible release, and we're really only looking at E3 + maybe 2 Directs. While I'm not necessarily expecting something at the Nindies Showcase, I also think it's possible they take every opportunity they have leading up to release day.

Well alright, good luck. I wouldn't get your hopes up.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Well alright, good luck. I wouldn't get your hopes up.

As I said in that post, I'm not expecting anything. Just saying not to rule out the possibility.

 

[N3ON]

As I said in that post, I'm not expecting anything. Just saying not to rule out the possibility.

I'm going to rule it out, you needn't do the same. To me Smash is opposite of what Nintendo is trying to achieve with the Nindies directs.

Should I be wrong, I'll be very happy.

 

[FunAtParties]

Why are you contradicting your own point?

Getting some very mixed messages here

They never really said all Lumas have personality. They could've easily meant that if you had read the Rosalina storybook thing that there was at least one Luma that wasn't generic, which someone said outright, and they agreed with.

 

[FanCWaiter]

Why are you contradicting your own point?

Getting some very mixed messages here

Sorry googled some stats. Changed my mind. But I wasn’t contradicting myself. I just agreed with the fact that most lumas are generic. Can’t argue with that

They never really said all Lumas have personality. They could've easily meant that if you had read the Rosalina storybook thing that there was at least one Luma that wasn't generic, which someone said outright, and they agreed with.

Thank you

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

The only Luma with any form of character is Polari.

And yet still, the moment you mentioned that Luma I was like "Polari who?" That much character it has.

Also, getting rid of the Rosaluma combo because there are people unwilling to get better at the matchup is a terrible reason to downgrade a character that drastically.

 

[FunAtParties]

Thank you

No problem bruh. Just for future reference try and avoid double posting. I think it's against the rules around here

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Thank you

Wanting Luma to be their own character is dumb. Like, really dumb.

 

[Chandeelure]

No problem bruh. Just for future reference try and avoid double posting. I think it's against the rules around here

It's too late, he is dead now.

 

[Radical Bones]

84 days, 15 hours, 22 minutes until E3 begins.

We can do it people.

We can make it until New Smash's full reveal.

 

[Senselessbreak]

It's too late, he is dead now.

What happened to post merging? Why isn't it enabled?

 

[N3ON]

Took three mods passing through the thread before the posts were merged.

Someone hasn't had their coffee today.

 

[FanCWaiter]

No problem bruh. Just for future reference try and avoid double posting. I think it's against the rules around here

Thanks for the tip. I’m a newb.

 

[ColietheGoalie]

Question - why does the number of games a series has matter?

Because it’s tied to representation a little (whether people like it or not). By that I mean that series like Mario/DK/Yoshi/Wario, Fire Emblem, Pokemon, etc have tons of games that are very popular, so it makes sense when those series get lots of reps.

Something like Ice Climbers or Arms, that have one game that was moderately successful, it doesn’t really make sense to pull multiple characters from it.

I mean, it only makes sense. More games means more recognition and more characters to pull from. Smash is about celebrating Nintendo/gaming, so representation is a thing that they consider.

 

[PLATINUM7]

The only Luma with any form of character is Polari.

What about Lubba?

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

What about Lubba?

Okay so there's 3 Lumas.

There's more actual character Toads for goodness sake.

Captain Toad
Toadette
Toadsworth
That Blue Toad with glasses

 

[IronTed]

Okay so there's 3 Lumas.

There's more actual character Toads for goodness sake.

Captain Toad
Toadette
Toadsworth
That Blue Toad with glasses

Do you mean Toadbert?

 

[Senselessbreak]

So if the game comes out by November, that gives us around 40 weeks to reveal characters. If Smash 4 had 58 characters, I imagine this games roster will be 70-75 in size. We officially have Inklings, Mario and Link revealed. So this means we should start getting 2 reveals per week til release.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Okay so there's 3 Lumas.

There's more actual character Toads for goodness sake.

Captain Toad
Toadette
Toadsworth
That Blue Toad with glasses

By Blue Toad with glasses do you mean Toadbert form the Mario and Luigi games or Hint Toad from the Toad Brigade?

EDIT: Or even Russ T. from Paper Mario?

 

[ErenJager]

Is there any niches in gaming left that can be fulfilled with a rep?

Example;
Duck Hunt; Light Gun
Pac-Man: Arcade
Ryu: Fighting genre
etc, etc.

 

[Senselessbreak]

Is there any niches in gaming left that can be fulfilled with a rep?

Example;
Duck Hunt; Light Gun
Pac-Man: Arcade
Ryu: Fighting genre
etc, etc.

Diskun for the Famicom disc system

 

[splat]

I feel like people that take these polls vote on trends that Sakurai has had. For example, Mario, Pokemon and FE get new reps for their newest games. We get 1-2 classic retro characters. 2-3 reps from newer titles or series. 2-3 third party reps.

Not aimed at you per se, but these trends tend to be made up by the fans and have little basis in what gets added.

Let's take a look at the Mario series representation:
64: +2 = 2
Melee: +3 = 5
Brawl: +0,-1 = 4
Smash 4: +3 = 7

The series is so capricious it isn't even funny.
Even if we'd look at reps from new games as you suggested, it doesn't stack up. The Melee additions were not from the newest games (well, they were - but not in the way you seem to mean). In Brawl, we could've gotten new characters from Sunshine: Bowser Jr., Shadow Mario or even Toadsworth - but we didn't. Only Rosalina and Luma was fairly new when they were included: but even they lagged almost two main series games behind.

Or Pokémon:
64: +2 = 2
Melee: +2 = 4
Brawl: +4,-2 = 6
Smash 4 (projected): 8
Smash 4: +1,-2 = 5 (6 after DLC)

Well, this pattern of +2 netto per game was broken. Granted, Pokémon does tend to include at least one character from the latest games (though even more from older games).

Or Fire Emblem:
Melee: +2 = 2
Brawl: +1,-1 = 2
Smash 4 (projected): 2
Smash 4: +2 = 4 (6 after DLC)

Again, pattern of 2 total was broken. We only have two points of data between games, yet the entire boards seem certain we'll see a character removed in order to promote a new game - which fits only one of these.

During Smash 4's development, people were certain we'd get a fourth Star Fox rep (Fox in 64, Falco in Melee, Wolf in Brawl, so surely we'd get Krystal in Smash 4) - yet a character was removed from the roster instead.

If there's anything we should be looking at, it's things we don't really expect: things that break these trends. Wii Fit Trainer, Villager, Duck Hunt, Rosalina & Luma and Mii Fighters (Miis were expected, but three movesets?) are good indications of this in Smash 4. Or Zero Suit Samus, Pokémon Trainer and ROB in Brawl. Or Zelda/Sheik, Ice Climbers, Mr. Game & Watch and even our favorite masochist Pichu in Melee. Many of these aren't considered the WTF character, but do make you go 'huh, hadn't thought of that'.

Were they expected? No. Does their inclusion make sense? In a way, yes.

The rosters many of us make are - simply put - just too safe, based on these imaginary trends. Rather than listing the characters we feel are from series that would logically make sense to get a new rep, we should approach new characters by looking at what new thing they would do. Characters like the Toy-con Robo and Tibby feel very 'Sakurai' to me, while I feel many of my personal favorites (Dixie, Captain Toad, Waddle Dee) will not make it for this reason: because these guys are usually from familiar series, they just don't have that 'new' groove that Smash newcomers these days seem to need.

I feel like this is also the reason why we saw so much third party characters as DLC - and I'm 'afraid' this will only continue in the Smash 4 character selection process.

(And when it comes to choosing our third party characters, we tend to look at what is popular here rather than looking at Japan. We don't even have threads for Jibanyan and Slime!)

/rant

 

[T-Hell]

Man, I almost wish they didn't reveal Smash at the Direct, now the wait until E3 is gonna be almost unbearable lmao.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Is there any niches in gaming left that can be fulfilled with a rep?

Example;
Duck Hunt; Light Gun
Pac-Man: Arcade
Ryu: Fighting genre
etc, etc.

We could get the guy from DOOM to represent the first-person shooter niche.

 

[WiFi]

I want there to be a game mode in which the player has three stocks, but for each stock lost they change to a different character on their team, much like Dragon Ball Fighter Z. Just a thought. It would be a game mode, like time or stock.

Edit: Anybody think Chibi-Robo is a possible character?

 

[TheLastJinjo]

If Super Smash Bros Switch had 2 stages for almost every universe like Melee.

Super Mario

• New Donk City
• Bowser Land
• Mario Galaxy
• Mario Circuit
• Luigi's Mansion 2
• Prism Island
• Super Mario Land 2
• Super Mario Maker
• Dr. Mario

The Legend of Zelda

• Temple of Time
• Windfall Island

Donkey Kong

• Mangrove Cove
• Windmill Hills
• 75m

F-Zero

• Mute City
• Big Blue

EarthBound/Mother

• Magicant
• Saturn Valley

Yoshi

• Yoshi's Island
• Yoshi's Cookie
• Yoshi 2018

Kirby

• Fine Feilds
• Resolution Road

Star Fox

• Corneria
• Titania

Fire Emblem

• Coliseum

Game & Watch

• Game & Watch Gallery

Kid Icarus

• Overworld
• Underworld

Wario

• WarioWare Inc.
• Wario's Castle

Pikmin

• Valley of Repose
• Twilight River

Animal Crossing

• Town & City
• Tortimer Island

Wii Fit

• Wii Fit Studio

Punch-Out!!

• Boxing Ring

Splatoon

• Urchin Underpass

Rhythm Heaven

• Rhythm Heaven

Puzzle League/Panel De Pon

• Popples

Famicom

• Gyromite
• Excitebike Stadium
• Icicle Mountain
• Pinball
• Balloon Fight
• Wrecking Crew
• Duck Hunt Feilds
• Murasame Castle
• Famicom Detective Club

Sonic The Hedgehog

• City Heights
• Studiopolis

Mega Man

• Wily Castle

Pac-Man

• Namco Museum

Street Fighter

• Suzaku Castle

Final Fantasy

• Midgar
• Gold Saucer

Bayonetta

• Umbra Clock Tower
• Fimbulventr

Bomberman

• Bomberman HQ

Castlevania

• Dracula's Castle

 

[ErenJager]

Diskun for the Famicom disc system

I just started reading a wiki page about him after you replied that, tell me something, how much do you think this is worth?

"Nintendo once held a Famicom Grand Prix: F-1 Race contest in which the players with the highest scores would receive a Super Mario Bros.Game & Watch game in a Diskun shaped container."

I want it.

Is there a support thread for this character? If so is there a proposed moveset? I'd be interested to see what people came up with.

 

[Deathcarter]

I want there to be a game mode in which the player has three stocks, but for each stock lost they change to a different character on their team, much like Dragon Ball Fighter Z. Just a thought. It would be a game mode, like time or stock.

Edit: Anybody think Chibi-Robo is a possible character?

I remember something like that being in Smash Tour but not something you could do in regular VS play for some inane reason. Pray they make it its own mode this time.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Man, I almost wish they didn't reveal Smash at the Direct, now the wait until E3 is gonna be almost unbearable lmao.

It's only a few months away.

It's not like when SSB4 was first announced and we waited 2 years before seeing a trailer.

 

[ErenJager]

We could get the guy from DOOM to represent the first-person shooter niche.

ain't no thang like an inklang.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

ain't no thang like an inklang.

That's 3rd person

 

[PLATINUM7]

ain't no thang like an inklang.

"First-person"

Would have been better if you mentioned Samus since Metroid Prime is first person.

 

[Freduardo]

On wanting Luma as a character:

I mean, I’m down for it if it’s like Servbot in Marvel Vs Capcom 2. A joke character that shouldn’t be expected to win that you only play as because of skill gaps.

This also should take no dev time as it’s literally just taking the one from rosalina. maybe you add a B and a B down. But you probably don’t add a B, you just ditch the puppet recall mechanic.

 

[PLATINUM7]

On wanting Luma as a character:

I mean, I’m down for it if it’s like Servbot in Marvel Vs Capcom 2. A joke character that shouldn’t be expected to win that you only play as because of skill gaps.

This also should take no dev time as it’s literally just taking the one from rosalina.

So Pichu.

 

[Freduardo]

So Pichu.

Yeah, pretty much. In fact adding solo Luma adds argument for Pichu and Solo Climber for more variety in handicapped characters.